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Subject: Halo: Reach is ONI propaganda

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Most of us here in the Universe Forum have heard this in passing, but I'm not to sure we've had a dedicated thread discussing this. The more I examine Reach, particularly the Legendary Edition's bonus content, I'm starting to buy the theory. Don't get me wrong, until stated otherwise I'll accept Reach as canon, but going with the propaganda theory, I think it'd be a much better method of storytelling on Bungie's part, it'd be a fresh concept for Halo.

Anyone else want to put a word in?

  • 06.23.2011 8:44 PM PDT
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By sharp and flame; a friend of a friend.

Yes.

  • 06.23.2011 8:51 PM PDT

ONI report maybe, but I don't get the 'propaganda to boost morale LONG after the war ended' bit.

  • 06.23.2011 9:05 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

All I know is that they aren't above falsifying events if the "Believe" Diorama is to be believed, Sunrise Over New Mombasa in the HGN also shows they covered up the true casualties of the war.

  • 06.23.2011 9:06 PM PDT

Well, the believe ads are non-canon I've heard.

If this was during the war, sure I might by that, but many, many years after? Seens extremely odd. Especially taking in the letter, which was between two ONI members wasn't it?

[Edited on 06.23.2011 9:22 PM PDT]

  • 06.23.2011 9:15 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Well, the believe ads are non-canon I've heard.

If this was during the war, sure I might by that, but many, many years after? Seens extremely odd. Especially taking in the letter, which was between two ONI members wasn't it?

It may be many years after the war, but much like the legend of the Spartans, hope is a valuable commodity. Make the citizens look at the events on Reach look much more hard fought than losing in such a short timeframe, BAM, instant patriotism.

  • 06.23.2011 9:36 PM PDT
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In a forum filled mostly with stupidity and repetition, it's theories like this that make it worth the searching. Thread saved.

  • 06.23.2011 11:38 PM PDT

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Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Well, the believe ads are non-canon I've heard.

If this was during the war, sure I might by that, but many, many years after? Seens extremely odd. Especially taking in the letter, which was between two ONI members wasn't it?

It may be many years after the war, but much like the legend of the Spartans, hope is a valuable commodity. Make the citizens look at the events on Reach look much more hard fought than losing in such a short timeframe, BAM, instant patriotism.


To be honest I don't believe Halo:Reach to be an example of some sort of post war propoganda or dramatization of historical events, and if it turned out to be so I'd consider it a hell of a cop out way to recton things on the level of DC having Superboy punch a wall strong enough that it made a new dimension to validate and justify changes. Well maybe not as much. Anyways I do recognize that the theory could work.

Way I see it though it doesn't necessarily have to be ONI based propoganda. Could just be the attempts of a retired military person (or average joe with access to the right source material/hell sufficient material could be declassified by this point) to piece together what had happened from actual recovered footage (the cutscene parts that are shown to be from the perspective of a survallence camera) mixed in with fictionalized events.

The end result would be Halo:Reach being the equivalent of the "Desert Fox" movie that featured Rommel's exploits or "Patton"...Then again those tried to be as accurate as possible. Maybe more like the pearl harbor movie with Ben Afflick and Matt Damen or 2008's "The Red Baron" which took a hell of a lot of liberties when making a movie about the legendary Richthofen. Yes...that would be a more apt comparison....

  • 06.23.2011 11:52 PM PDT

I actually think Halo 4 and everything after it is ONI propaganda.

  • 06.24.2011 1:14 AM PDT

I like the theory, but its really hard to back that one up.

It makes sense like if it was a story.
Like the whole "sneak attack" where they landed enough troops to destroy the Visigrad(sp) relay. It makes it look like "Oh we were unprepared." Apposed to Reach being on full alert. (even though Reach did get surprised zerg rushed in the book.)

I REALLY hate to quote 'flippen' call of duty but "History is written by the victors."

  • 06.24.2011 2:37 AM PDT

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Been there, thought of that:
Posted by: Orphius_Rex
With the Limited and Legendary editions of Reach, there was a piece of paper which says:

You are now in possession of the most complete and accurate account that anyone has been able to assemble of SPECWAR/GroupTHREE/NOBLE's actions during the final weeks before the Covenant glassed Reach.

I suspect your interest in all of this has something to do with your involvement in Operation WHITE GLOVE. Coincidentally, Halsey made multiple inquiries about NOBLE just as everything started going all to hell. She's the one loose end that may never be wrapped up satisfactorily - no body, no closure. In any event, I secured the next best thing for you. Section 0 has had it for some time - so there's that - but I think you'll find enough intel in here for your purposes.

-W



Who is W?
And this does leave a bit of wiggle room with the story, as it says
"The most complete and accurate account that anyone has been able to assemble of SPECWAR/GroupTHREE/NOBLE's actions during the final weeks before the Covenant glassed Reach."
Therefore, the events depicted in the game can be classified as unreliable intel, subject to human bias because they are the "most accurate" anyone has been able to produce. This does not necessarily mean they are the correct series of events that took place. They could have been exaggerated greatly by ONI for propaganda purposes. For example ONI would have increased the size of the Supercarrier so that when they blew it up, it showed civilians and military that the Covenant can be beaten, no matter how big their ships are.

This also means that ONI would have edited out the less interesting parts, or parts that showed the UNSC loosing badly, and edited in parts such as the PoA being on Reach and then taking off, because they (ONI) thought that a single Longsword was not exciting enough to boost the troops' morale. This opens up the idea that ONI skewed the dates of the entire conflict, so as to make it look like the UNSC can hold out against the Covenant, albeit not indefinitely. Again, this would be morale boosting.

This means that the Pillar of Autumn is not on Reach, and the Cortana Fragment was picked up by Keyes, albeit in a Longsword, and the interactive disc (Halo: Reach game disc) has been edited by ONI to improve the storyline, to make it more epic, if you will.

Noble Team's involvements in the conflict could also have been manipulated for storyline purposes, such as the Long Night of Solace action. It may have just been shot by an ODP, but this was changed to make the protagonists seem more involved int the defence of Reach. This implies that Jorge died in a less heroic way, such as being assassinated by an Elite or he was blown up by a Wraith tank.

ONI could have changed the details of Noble Team's deaths, so as to make the story more tragic, which leads me to the possibility that Noble Six never died, as his actions in "Lone Wolf" are falsified for the purposes of a good war movie. The reason I say they were falsified is because there were no living UNSC soldiers or civilians in the area, and the whole area was glassed anyway, erasing any recordings the helmet cameras might have made. Therefore, Six may still be alive, and floating through space in a Pelican, or on another Human colony.

The part of the letter I quoted be interpreted as:
"We (ONI) had a cursory look round Reach at the end of the war, found this Journal, and made up most of the rest of what's on the interactive disc (Reach game disc) to suit our needs, and show how Noble team sacrificed themselves to defend Reach."


I hate to say it but Bungie covered themselves pretty well with this one letter. Essentially this letter could make the whole Halo:Reach plot irrelevant, and there is actually another story, yet to be told.

Orphius.


[Edited on 06.24.2011 2:46 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2011 2:45 AM PDT

Am I supposed to write something funny here?

If it really were ONI propaganda, why would they tell people that they knew about covenant weeks before the main invasion and didn't start evacuating?

  • 06.24.2011 5:38 AM PDT

Many gave their lives so that we could live on. I intend to honor them by remembering them. Remember Cyborg. Remember John. Remember Noble.

It's not propaganda, it's just that the story and the hidden meaning is so awesome that the Soul likes it.

Damn, delivering Cortana? Sacrificing myself in order to help Chief kick ass on Halo?

That's badass.

  • 06.24.2011 5:49 AM PDT

If you can read this, that means I'm not a Shaolin monk...

yet.

I've supported this for a very long time, now.

  • 06.24.2011 5:58 AM PDT

Im not buying it.

Did you look at the red sticker on the limited edition? it says someting like 'EYES ONLY ON PAIN OF HORRIBLE TORTURE AND DEATH. WE MEAN IT'

Why would oni classify a propaganda piece so that it could never be seen by anyone?

Not to mention reach sucks as a propaganda piece, i dont know if anyone noticed the many terrible things that happened, all of noble team died (spartans never die!), new alexandria got totally glassed and millions killed, the fleet got eviscerated and they lost the planet anyway.

If i was back on earth watching that as a propaganda account of what happened to reach, id still be thinking 'yep, we all gunna die'

  • 06.24.2011 6:48 AM PDT

Don't worry, you're still your mom's favorite Bnet member.

I'VE BEEN SAYING THIS FOR MONTHS. You're welcome. Plus, you took away my opportunity to make a huge ass thread on the subject. :(

[Edited on 06.24.2011 7:07 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2011 7:04 AM PDT

Wouldn't TFoR definitive Edition, being newer canon, negate Halo Reach?

If so, I guess the ONI propaganda idea could ultimately be right in a sense that H:R would not have any other reason to exist.

  • 06.24.2011 7:15 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.


Posted by: ThePredkiller2
I actually think Halo 4 and everything after it is ONI propaganda.


Er... how is that? This is a totally new story, the difference is is that we already knew just about everything about Reach.

  • 06.24.2011 8:42 AM PDT
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Posted by: Fatal Factor
Im not buying it.

Did you look at the red sticker on the limited edition? it says someting like 'EYES ONLY ON PAIN OF HORRIBLE TORTURE AND DEATH. WE MEAN IT'

Why would oni classify a propaganda piece so that it could never be seen by anyone?

Not to mention reach sucks as a propaganda piece, i dont know if anyone noticed the many terrible things that happened, all of noble team died (spartans never die!), new alexandria got totally glassed and millions killed, the fleet got eviscerated and they lost the planet anyway.

If i was back on earth watching that as a propaganda account of what happened to reach, id still be thinking 'yep, we all gunna die'

Because, according to the older canon, Reach fell within a day. If they extended the battle to a month, then it shows humanity can hold out against the seemingly invincible Covenant fleet (who would finally be struck a crushing religious and political blow at the Battle of Installation 04).

[Edited on 06.24.2011 10:18 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2011 8:51 AM PDT

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This interpretation has seemed painfully obvious to me ever since I held in my hands that object which self-identified as an actual ONI data artifact and included a notice that asserted I was in "possession of the most complete and accurate account that anyone has been able to assemble of SPECWAR/GroupTHREE/NOBLE's actions". I fully support this canonical interpretation because it follows from the implied nature of the Collector's edition and also makes much easier the process of determining the true canonical parts.

Technically, the entire thing is by definition canonical, but only as this propaganda/otherwise internal artifact. It cannot be said that since it is a true and real depiction of another depiction (another depiction that is not guaranteed by any means of accuracy; rather, the other parts of canon hint towards ONI's dishonesty) it is therefore some perfect rendition of the true canonical events. It is only an attempt to manifest the content of a certain ONI artifact - a content that is never guaranteed to parallel that of real events in the True Halo Canon. The object itself (an ONI data artifact) is the only thing being directly and literally represented.

[Edited on 06.24.2011 9:52 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2011 9:48 AM PDT

It's an interesting theory...but I don't really think it's the truth or really works. I'd say I'm in the same boat as StealthSlasher2 to me it would be a horribly lazy cop-out of a retcon.

Plus there are some pretty big details in Reach that wouldn't make sense for it to be ONI propaganda and some details that leave some pretty big holes in it if you ask me. Like for instance, as one other person listed, it shows all of Noble Team being killed, that would undermine other ONI propaganda stating that Spartans never die and only go MIA. Jorge and Six are the only ones who can truly be marked that and possibly Jun. And not to mention all of the actual on-screen seeing of civilians being actively butchered by the Brutes and that transport ship being shot down and lost with all hands. That wouldn't be very good to put in a propaganda piece, it would be almost counter-intuitive to what they want. True they might show some to set the Covenant in a negative light and make Noble Team appear more heroic, but I don't think it would have been shown or done to the extent it was in Exodus if Reach were merely a bunch baseless propaganda.

And there's the whole thing about the significance of Reach falling, a great deal of people would know the true length of the battle. If it did last only a few hours and then ONI turned around and said that the Covenant had had a presence on the planet for approximately a month and fighting had gone on for two weeks, someone, possibly many people, would be brave enough to call ONI's bluff and then ONI would lose a lot of credibility in peoples' eyes. Also, the time at which the two ONI agents were corresponding with each other was set several decades after the war (I can't remember the actual date), there would no longer be a need to publicize outright lies to keep the public's morale up for a losing war.

I'm a little more open to the idea of Halo: Reach having some things made more dramatic by ONI tampering or some information being completely or slightly inaccurate. It would leave a bit of wiggle room to retcon some things since the game appears to have been an in Haloverse creation. However I don't think Bungie would have released information bridging the slight inconsistencies between Reach and TFoR if they had intended for Reach to be nothing more than a load of hooey and meaningless propaganda nonsense. Those are my thoughts anyway...this should be a fun thread, I hope we can get a lot of discussion in here.

  • 06.24.2011 9:49 AM PDT


Posted by: ROBERTO jh
Wouldn't TFoR definitive Edition, being newer canon, negate Halo Reach?

If so, I guess the ONI propaganda idea could ultimately be right in a sense that H:R would not have any other reason to exist.


Why would a newer book make a game negated? I never heard that bit of the canon rule.

  • 06.24.2011 10:16 AM PDT

"The measure of a man is what he does with power"-Plato

One huge hole in this theory.

Halsey's journal.

Unless that is a 'prop' from Oni....

But I doubt it.

  • 06.24.2011 10:23 AM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: II Cipher
One huge hole in this theory.

Halsey's journal.

Unless that is a 'prop' from Oni....

But I doubt it.

As do I, but since it backs up most of events in Reach, I don't see why they wouldn't include it after they've looked at it.

  • 06.24.2011 10:42 AM PDT

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