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  • Subject: Bungie dialogue on Halo reach still conflicts
Subject: Bungie dialogue on Halo reach still conflicts
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Xd00999
Actually there where only 4 corvettes harassing Reach (not counting the one you hijacked). There where 3 raids by multiple Spirit Dropships and 2 raids by unspecified ground forces. There where also a lot of UNSC forces in orbit going by the Hologram on the Bridge. By my count, there where 120 orbital assets above Reach (may have miscounted, there are a lot of dots).

Edit: Didn't see Grey's post above.


There are 6 if you include the one you hijack and the destroyed one.

And i doubt the dots are UNSC since the covenant ones are the same color.

If they were all UNSC then the UNSC is stupid for letting 5 ships slip under the radar

  • 07.04.2011 2:18 PM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: TheGreenAlloy
Watch the one on TotS. They say that nothing conflicts with the book.


I am the Queen of England. Yup, I said it but there's no proof of it. Apply this to what Bungie are saying. They can insist it fits with the book, but it really doesn't.


However both 343 and Bungie accept both things as canon, therefore unless 343 also is not telling the truth, the two must be able to connect.

  • 07.04.2011 2:19 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: StealthSlasher2
Highcom HQ,

Isn't that one based in the Olympic Tower in New Alexandria?

  • 07.04.2011 2:20 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
I see in one picture at least (picking at random) a yellow dot inside a red square.


Considering that the Corvette right next to it is the only one over solid ground other than the one at Sword Base well....I do believe that red square (it looks more like a star when viewing it in game) with a yellow dot...represents the Super Carrier.

Edit:


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: StealthSlasher2
Highcom HQ,

Isn't that one based in the Olympic Tower in New Alexandria?


Depends. Is Highcom HQ the same as Fleetcom HQ? I never really got the distinction all that much.

In any case if they are one in the same it would place NA very close to the Orbital Generators.

Edit 2:


Posted by: Xd00999
Actually there where only 4 corvettes harassing Reach (not counting the one you hijacked). There where 3 raids by multiple Spirit Dropships and 2 raids by unspecified ground forces. There where also a lot of UNSC forces in orbit going by the Hologram on the Bridge. By my count, there where 120 orbital assets above Reach (may have miscounted, there are a lot of dots).



I really do hope that large cluster of yellow dots isn't the tight defense cluster of SMACs and ships on the other side of planet that people love to say is there. Because looking at the map it looks like it's guarding absolutely nothing. Close to no markers at all to the small strip of land the yellow dots reside over, and the vital structures are established to be on the same continent where the majority of the Covenant forces are deploying to as well as the location of Castle base. Which, is important because it establishes that, that is where the Highland mountains are. The same mountain range that is home or close to home to a wide variety of UNSC assets...

[Edited on 07.04.2011 2:49 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 2:31 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: grey101

Posted by: Xd00999
Actually there where only 4 corvettes harassing Reach (not counting the one you hijacked). There where 3 raids by multiple Spirit Dropships and 2 raids by unspecified ground forces. There where also a lot of UNSC forces in orbit going by the Hologram on the Bridge. By my count, there where 120 orbital assets above Reach (may have miscounted, there are a lot of dots).

Edit: Didn't see Grey's post above.


There are 6 if you include the one you hijack and the destroyed one.

And i doubt the dots are UNSC since the covenant ones are the same color.

If they were all UNSC then the UNSC is stupid for letting 5 ships slip under the radar

I am only counting the ones present on the hologram.

I am guessing that the dots are UNSC because there are a lot of them, certainly the amount one would expect from Reach. I also noticed that the Covenant Corvettes and dropships are located away from large gatherings of dots.

The Supercarrier probably had the Corvettes doked inside it and deployed them once they arrived on Reach. I am also unsure that they are under the radar, once the UNSC launched the attack in ToTS the battle started to really heat up and their cover was blown. The Corvettes where probably an attempt to draw some UNSC assets away from the Supercarrier or just damage the UNSC while their attention is focused elsewhere.


Edit: There where two large clusters of dots on roughly either side of the planet with the one over the ocean being slightly smaller. It is possible they where defending some civilian or military structures along the coast. Or, they could just be stationed there as part of Reach's defense and have not yet mobilized to the threat on the other side of the planet.


[Edited on 07.04.2011 3:00 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 2:56 PM PDT

I could say we dont know every thing and we dont have the halo bible but all i can say is........ The super cruiser was brilliantly B-E-AUTIFUL!!! that and emille was the last noble spartan to die so thats why bungie said he was the last. just pointing out a common sense path.

  • 07.04.2011 3:10 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

These corvettes are far larger than the one that was able to go invis, not to mention the SC being in the system is a major flaw.
Invis doesn't account for them not being picked up on thermal

  • 07.04.2011 3:11 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: grey101
These corvettes are far larger than the one that was able to go invis, not to mention the SC being in the system is a major flaw.
Invis doesn't account for them not being picked up on thermal


Which corvette went invis in the first place?

  • 07.04.2011 3:13 PM PDT


Posted by: StealthSlasher2
I really do hope that large cluster of yellow dots isn't the tight defense cluster of SMACs and ships on the other side of planet that people love to say is there. Because looking at the map it looks like it's guarding absolutely nothing. Close to no markers at all to the small strip of land the yellow dots reside over, and the vital structures are established to be on the same continent where the majority of the Covenant forces are deploying to as well as the location of Castle base. Which, is important because it establishes that, that is where the Highland mountains are. The same mountain range that is home or close to home to a wide variety of UNSC assets...


*shrug* blame the book, not us. The book describes Reach's space defense as such.

  • 07.04.2011 3:24 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

A small corvette in TRoR above sigma

  • 07.04.2011 3:28 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: StealthSlasher2
I really do hope that large cluster of yellow dots isn't the tight defense cluster of SMACs and ships on the other side of planet that people love to say is there. Because looking at the map it looks like it's guarding absolutely nothing. Close to no markers at all to the small strip of land the yellow dots reside over, and the vital structures are established to be on the same continent where the majority of the Covenant forces are deploying to as well as the location of Castle base. Which, is important because it establishes that, that is where the Highland mountains are. The same mountain range that is home or close to home to a wide variety of UNSC assets...


*shrug* blame the book, not us. The book describes Reach's space defense as such.


There's a major difference between the importance of the defense perimeter being on the other side of the planet to defend vital points of the planet and having a defensive perimeter being on the other side of the planet over the middle of nowhere defending nothing.

The book depicts the main Covenant fleet being forced to run the gauntlet of SMACs, minefields, and UNSC ships to get its ground forces through relatively unnoticed in the thick of the fray. Instead the opposite happens in the game where the Covenant can apparently freely come and go over the nice juicy important bits of Reach from the get go, and even after the main fleets arrive. Meanwhile the UNSC's defenses are on the other side of the planet over nothing being completely and utterly useless.

Edit:


Posted by: grey101
A small corvette in TRoR above sigma


Ah, it wasn't referred to as a Corvette though. Just that the vessel was smaller than the Covenant equivalent of a Frigate, and small enough that the Iroquois can ram it and have her crew barely feel a thing on the bridge. I doubt that a Destroyer (which is only slighter longer than a Frigate) could ram a Corvette and not feel a thing. In any case I wouldn't really say that particular ship when invis. It basically ran "silent" so that the signature blue glow of Covenant vessels wouldn't be apparent. It still showed up when actively scanned for, and was physically visible so it was more akin to stealth bombers and submarines running silent. Unless of course that's what you originally meant :p

[Edited on 07.04.2011 3:40 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 3:33 PM PDT

Must ask. Where is New Alexandria? The fleet may have been over it.

Still, there is a difference in a defense perimeter and defense line. If the UNSC had a perimeter, they would have covered the entire planet. Instead, they had all their defenses (as described in the book) being on one side of the planet when the Covenant arrived on the 30th.

So, 'in reality' the covenant could have approached the other side of the planet and conquered Reach in the 2-3 hours the book gives due to the fact all the space defenses were on one side of the planet.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 3:41 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 3:40 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

If i remember correctly the book said they were semi mobile and moved into a defensive group above the planet after the covenant showed up.

unless that was changed in the new ones

  • 07.04.2011 3:42 PM PDT

Not here to really argue or debate, but I'd thought I'd point some new information I gleaned from the new Halo: The Essential Visual Guide.

First off, the SC, Long Night of Solace, was part of a fleet called Valiant Prudence. It also states this (pg 111 in book, empathisis mine):

"Despite its enormous size, the Solace was quite capable of masking itself and all of Valiant Prudence's presence to the vast majority of Reach."

'Masking' to me seems to be something more than simple cloaking, if you ask me, though unfortunately the book does not state how it did it.

Also, it stated that this ship arrived shortly after the battle of Sigma Octanus IV, though I forget how long it was between that battle ending and the battle of Reach starting....

[Edited on 07.04.2011 3:49 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 3:48 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Slaskia
Not here to really argue or debate, but I'd thought I'd point some new information I gleaned from the new Halo: The Essential Visual Guide.

First off, the SC, Long Night of Solace, was part of a fleet called Valiant Prudence. It also states this (pg 111 in book, empathisis mine):

"Despite its enormous size, the Solace was quite capable of masking itself and all of Valiant Prudence's presence to the vast majority of Reach."

'Masking' to me seems to be something more than simple cloaking, if you ask me, though unfortunately the book does not state how it did it.

Also, it stated that this ship arrived shortly after the battle of Sigma Octanus IV, though I forget how long it was between that battle ending and the battle of Reach starting....


It was only a few days and i hate the direction they took with this.

  • 07.04.2011 3:53 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: grey101
If i remember correctly the book said they were semi mobile and moved into a defensive group above the planet after the covenant showed up.

unless that was changed in the new ones


No mention of the SMACs themselves moving to counter the Covenant that appeared, however it was mentioned that Reach's homefleet as well as reinforcements moved into position at one rally point zulu to counter the Covenant fleet approaching that angle. Presumably they repositioned the SMACs as well in the event the Covenant did not approach from where they were originally positioned.

That said, the reason why they clustered in the first place and in the spot they did was in reaction to the Covenant's intention of going straight through to Reach. They had a good hour and a half to shift defenses given the time stamps from when the Autumn got the distress call to when they were in range to get visuals of both fleets forming up.


Posted by: Slaskia
Not here to really argue or debate, but I'd thought I'd point some new information I gleaned from the new Halo: The Essential Visual Guide.

First off, the SC, Long Night of Solace, was part of a fleet called Valiant Prudence. It also states this (pg 111 in book, empathisis mine):

"Despite its enormous size, the Solace was quite capable of masking itself and all of Valiant Prudence's presence to the vast majority of Reach."

'Masking' to me seems to be something more than simple cloaking, if you ask me, though unfortunately the book does not state how it did it.

Also, it stated that this ship arrived shortly after the battle of Sigma Octanus IV, though I forget how long it was between that battle ending and the battle of Reach starting....


Makes sense that they arrived near immediately after Sigma Octanus considering they had their forces dispersed over Reach a good two weeks before the UNSC battlegroup returned from it. Course it made the whole Iroquois plot point, pointless.

Does the visual guide mention what the fleet of Valiant Prudence was composed of other than the LNoS and Corvettes, And if there was a specific number of Corvettes and other vessels as well?

  • 07.04.2011 3:56 PM PDT


Posted by: StealthSlasher2

Does the visual guide mention what the fleet of Valiant Prudence was composed of other than the LNoS and Corvettes, And if there was a specific number of Corvettes and other vessels as well?


No, unfortunatelly. This particular book does not have any information on fleet sizes and what kind of ships were in said fleets. Maybe the other books coming out later this year will have that info.

  • 07.04.2011 4:00 PM PDT

"What do you hear?"
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Posted by: Slaskia
First off, the SC, Long Night of Solace, was part of a fleet called Valiant Prudence.


Interesting. Does it say anything else about the fleet? Like...maybe the rest of Valiant Prudence jumping in system on the 14th? Hell, does it go into detail about the fall of Reach?

Posted by: Slaskia
Also, it stated that this ship arrived shortly after the battle of Sigma Octanus IV, though I forget how long it was between that battle ending and the battle of Reach starting....


I think there's enough time for that to work. Battle of Sigma Octanus took place on the 17th through 18th and when you consider the distance...yeah. Been there since the 23rd, if not a little sooner.

  • 07.04.2011 4:01 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

This is stupid so stupid; so the covenant randomly figured out how to mask their detection into a system? that doesn't make sense because reach was the first time they ever encountered MAC stations. The covenant have no reason for this upgrade, i would understand if this was after they got intel but directly following the Iroquois throws all logic and covenant understanding out of the window.

  • 07.04.2011 4:10 PM PDT

Just checked the entry on Reach itself (pg 151)

Not much information in regards to the fall itself, but it implies that Valiant Prudence was an advanced scouting party with the full-fledged invasion fleet arriving on Aug 30, 2552. Here's the full quote:

However, in 2552, all of that changed. The Covenant arrived, at first with advanced scouting parties,but later wtih a full-fledged invasion fleet on August 30, 2552. By then, it was only a matter of days before the entire planet would be completely destroyed.

  • 07.04.2011 4:12 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

This is still stupid, they didn't send advanced scouting parties to harvest after the brutes or any other time they should have.

And seeing how 343 did this i am pissed they are trying to cover bungie's ass

  • 07.04.2011 4:14 PM PDT

"What do you hear?"
"Nothing but the rain."
"Then grab your gun and bring in the cat."
"Boom, boom, boom!"

Posted by: grey101
This is stupid so stupid; so the covenant randomly figured out how to mask their detection into a system?


Halsey mentions atmospheric anomalies, along with radar and slipspace monitoring glitches. So they were picked up as they entered the system and atmosphere but obviously with the "mask", Covenant were able to trick the systems.

That's my best guess at least.

  • 07.04.2011 4:17 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Slaskia
Just checked the entry on Reach itself (pg 151)

Not much information in regards to the fall itself, but it implies that Valiant Prudence was an advanced scouting party with the full-fledged invasion fleet arriving on Aug 30, 2552. Here's the full quote:

However, in 2552, all of that changed. The Covenant arrived, at first with advanced scouting parties,but later wtih a full-fledged invasion fleet on August 30, 2552. By then, it was only a matter of days before the entire planet would be completely destroyed.


Fascinating, so the force that arrived after LNoS was also another scouting fleet...

That's just embarrassing then for the UNSC to have basically lost the planet the second the LNoS's forces started popping up all over the ground like daisys

  • 07.04.2011 4:18 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

This is spontaneous story telling. Not good.

Next they will be telling us that the SMACs are permanently clustered above one hemisphere.

These explanations in that book are utterly useless. They solve nothing.

  • 07.04.2011 4:18 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: kit_103
Posted by: grey101
This is stupid so stupid; so the covenant randomly figured out how to mask their detection into a system?


Halsey mentions atmospheric anomalies, along with radar and slipspace monitoring glitches. So they were picked up as they entered the system and atmosphere but obviously with the "mask", Covenant were able to trick the systems.

That's my best guess at least.


This is just making the UNSC look stupid.

In the book they were able to detect something in slipspace systems away and the anomaly of the fleet arriving was recognized because the same thing happened at harvest.

So for the UNSC to brush that off is ignorant, the covenant wouldn't even do that. When you see something weird and ask your friend and they say that saw it too then it was not a mistake on your part.

When dozens of stations report "anomalies" then you should go back to drinking coffee.

  • 07.04.2011 4:22 PM PDT