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This topic has moved here: Subject: Nuke the flood?
  • Subject: Nuke the flood?
Subject: Nuke the flood?
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Posted by: squirrel dude
*sigh*

I was going to try and defend The Flood's actions, but this -blam!- has to stop.

However, nuking isn't the answer because private groups do exist, so the attacks won't stop. Also, it's better to attack forums on this site than ones on others. Mess with your family, not with the neighbors.

Besides, can you honestly tell me that the Reach forum looks any different when it's being "attacked" that it does most of the time?
Ok maybe nuking it is a little harsh but what other alternatives are there? Putting it on probation?

Actually that could work.

And yeah, the Reach forum pretty much looks the same, (in fact if the flood threads were on-topic the forum wouldn't even be being "attacked", it would just have some new users)but that really doesn't excuse the whole "Attacking" thing.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:17 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:14 PM PDT

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
Goat was famous. Irie was infamous. Gh0st was FaMaS.


Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
I never even go to the flood. The Reach forum is way more fun.
If you never go to The Flood, how can you make the comparison?
I tried going there a couple times but I come to Halo's designer's website discuss Halo.

  • 07.04.2011 5:16 PM PDT

I am a Floodian

Posted by: SkyFighta65
Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
I never even go to the flood. The Reach forum is way more fun.
If you never go to The Flood, how can you make the comparison?
I tried going there a couple times but I come to Halo's designer's website discuss Halo.
Everyone feels that way initially. It's not like anyone came here because of The Flood, most migrate there later, and then can't escape the void of awesome that The Flood can be.

  • 07.04.2011 5:19 PM PDT

Posted by: MURDUR 587
Posted by: Salazar14
I disagree with nuking the flood. They may be a nuisance sometimes, but other times they can have good conversations. And I looked through the Flood and didn't see any threads about attacking the Reach forum. I know they have their share of rebellious users, but that can be easily taken care of. If anything, the flood is just a safer, easier to manage version of /b/. They don't do anything too crazy and when they do, they're punished for it.

Bungie.net is a community and shutting down such a large portion of the community is a bad idea.
Are you really using "It's like /b/" in defense to the flood?

If anything that is a point against it.

Anyway the problem with the flood is that you can ban the users starting the rukus, but that doesn't stop the rukus, that just subdues it for a while, then the flood attacks something else.

No, I'm not saying that's a good thing at all! The users have fun doing what they do and if it doesn't break any rules, then let them be! /b/ has created their own form of culture that has spread through the internet. You can't stop popular stuff like that. Obviously the Flood has been influenced by this type of culture, but isn't anywhere near what /b/ or what the rest of 4chan is like at all!

And if they continue, then you continue to ban them. Not everyone will follow the rules. This isn't some Utopian website. The moderators have a job for a reason.

And the behavior that you linked isn't acceptable and should be dealt with. At least it's pretty safe trolling, but it should still be gotten rid of.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:21 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:20 PM PDT

Would you please link the thread coordinating these "attacks" because no one can seem to find them but you.

  • 07.04.2011 5:22 PM PDT

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
Goat was famous. Irie was infamous. Gh0st was FaMaS.


Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
I never even go to the flood. The Reach forum is way more fun.
If you never go to The Flood, how can you make the comparison?
I tried going there a couple times but I come to Halo's designer's website discuss Halo.
Everyone feels that way initially. It's not like anyone came here because of The Flood, most migrate there later, and then can't escape the void of awesome that The Flood can be.
I also save my off topic discussion for private groups.

  • 07.04.2011 5:22 PM PDT

Posted by: A Bit Of Zero
This thread would have appealed to me more if it was written with crayons.
Posted by: King Dutchy
I broke one of the cords for my X11s because I couldn't get past the final American course in Doritos Crash Course.

For every bad egg in the flood, there's a good egg too (they just don't tend to post as much!).
Lots of good stuff has happened there, a recent example. $25,000 dollars awarded to Heather's camp with help from the Flood, that's got to be worth a few trolls here and there.
I have to say I have gained a fair bit of knowledge from that forum, interesting news or just some good music.
At the end of the day, the only thing dumber than a troll is someone who replies to them.

  • 07.04.2011 5:23 PM PDT

I am a Floodian

Posted by: SkyFighta65
Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
Posted by: squirrel dude
Posted by: SkyFighta65
I never even go to the flood. The Reach forum is way more fun.
If you never go to The Flood, how can you make the comparison?
I tried going there a couple times but I come to Halo's designer's website discuss Halo.
Everyone feels that way initially. It's not like anyone came here because of The Flood, most migrate there later, and then can't escape the void of awesome that The Flood can be.
I also save my off topic discussion for private groups.
Well that's your (poor) choice to make, how you spend your time.

  • 07.04.2011 5:24 PM PDT

The beta is super awesome. RogueAssassin27 is now the person who got my Totodile's nickname. Hoo-hah! Relevant.inb4lock

My short answer: No. There's no need. Sure we may bs (are we even?) attacking other forums, but so what? Whatever we post there will e quickly washed down by endless "y u ban me???" threads.

  • 07.04.2011 5:26 PM PDT
  • gamertag: iBIind
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Whoo.

Posted by: Salazar14
No, I'm not saying that's a good thing at all! The users have fun doing what they do and if it doesn't break any rules, then let them be! /b/ has created their own form of culture that has spread through the internet. You can't stop popular stuff like that. Obviously the Flood has been influenced by this type of culture, but isn't anywhere near what /b/ or what the rest of 4chan is like at all!

And if they continue, then you continue to ban them. Not everyone will follow the rules. This isn't some Utopian website. The moderators have a job for a reason.

And the behavior that you linked isn't acceptable and should be dealt with. At least it's pretty safe trolling, but it should still be gotten rid of.
I suppose it is mainly the users, but dammit they're doing this kinda stuff in the name of the flood!

When groups attack the forums it's not that bad, and whenever they do the group actually gets deleted for causing too much rukus, you know seasoned veterans? That is actually a group formed by the creators of a previous trolling group that Achronos threatened to delete multiple times.

Not to say that SV doesn't troll now, just saying that flood like behaviour usually gets warned and if it persists gets punished, and the amount of attacks the flood has been responcible for if it was a group it would have been deleted by now.
Posted by: SkilPhil
For every bad egg in the flood, there's a good egg too (they just don't tend to post as much!).
Lots of good stuff has happened there, a recent example. $25,000 dollars awarded to Heather's camp with help from the Flood, that's got to be worth a few trolls here and there.
I have to say I have gained a fair bit of knowledge from that forum, interesting news or just some good music.
At the end of the day, the only thing dumber than a troll is someone who replies to them.

It is true that the flood can do good things, but it never actually does, Heather's camp is the only example I can think of that is "good".

The rest of the stuff are just "cool" or ... yeah well cool.

Only other thing I can think of is Kitchen 8, and I'm not even sure if the flood actually did something there or what.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:32 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:27 PM PDT

Without me, it's just "Aweso".

Posted by: Oa Beast292
The Flood is one of three places that still have civilized conversations and debates on this site (Granted its not always great but it is the off topic forum, give it some credit). Nuking it would just cause mass destruction.


While it is all too rare to see anything bearing any semblance to intelligent conversation in the flood, I agree that getting rid of it could cause problems, in that without an off-topic forum, numerous inappropriate topics will pop up in other forums. However, that is not to say I am against the removal of the Flood, I am just against any future lack of an off-topic forum.

The main problem we have right now is that the Flood forum has created its own separate identity from the rest of the site, and for some reason, those who frequent it have some sort of ill-founded pride. It is this "Pride" which drives most of the stupidity and ludicrous actions emanating from the forum. Many of them forget that these forums were built for fans of Bungie and their games, not for angsty teens who wish to impress strangers over the internet.

So yes, nuke the Flood. However, a new forum should be installed in its place, for two primary reasons:

a) With the loss of Halo related topics following Bungie's turning control over to 343, it wouldn't be surprising to see a form of migration from the now obsolete Reach forums to the Off-topic forum. The Flood has demonstrated time and time again its collective distaste for those who frequent the other Halo-related forums, and it would not be surprising if a dichotomy emerged between those migrating in, and those already established within the forum.

b) In the future, we can assume that with Bungie Aerospace, Bungie.net as a whole will become important to the financial success of those Indie developers making use of Aerospace, presumably through gaining feedback from the forums, as well as numerous other means. Now, if the Flood continues its current streak of spamming/attacking its co-existant forums, imagine what effect that would have on the entirety of Aerospace.

It would be much better if we were to start with a blank slate. Eliminate the "Flood" (Which also makes sense concerning the departure of Halo's influence), and replace it with a new Off-topic forum. Enforce stricter policies on any form of spamming or inter-forum attacks, as well as most topics (e.g. Politics) for the first few weeks in order to make sure that the remnants of the Flood's less-then-savory past tendencies wither away, and then ease up.

Alternatively, just split up the Flood in order to compensate for the now obsolete forums in the wake of Halo's departure. Have a "General Gaming" forum, which could contain discussion of Halo and other games, therefore containing the number of Halo threads which would still linger on, as well as pleasing those who still see Bungie.net for what it is: a video game site. Then just add another forum for everything else, but with a new name (i.e. Not "Flood").

  • 07.04.2011 5:31 PM PDT

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
Goat was famous. Irie was infamous. Gh0st was FaMaS.

It doesn't bother me, therefore anyone that has a problem with it needs to adapt and stop complaining.

Am I doing it right?

  • 07.04.2011 5:33 PM PDT

If this is the state of my art, then I secede.

I don't like The Flood or the Reach Forum. So really, I could care less either way.

  • 07.04.2011 5:34 PM PDT


Posted by: mike120593
The main problem we have right now is that the Flood forum has created its own separate identity from the rest of the site, and for some reason, those who frequent it have some sort of ill-founded pride. It is this "Pride" which drives most of the stupidity and ludicrous actions emanating from the forum. Many of them forget that these forums were built for fans of Bungie and their games, not for angsty teens who wish to impress strangers over the internet.


I totally agree with this, but the problem is, the people who are the idiots (angsty teens) tend to post more and therefore tend to be the poster child of the Flood when I would say 70% of the Flood can actually have a convo but that 30% always needs to ruin it or give it a bad name, almost like with the US and rednecks.

  • 07.04.2011 5:35 PM PDT
  • gamertag: iBIind
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Whoo.

Posted by: mike120593
Actually that was going to be one my suggestions, remove it, wait a while and replace.

In fact I made that suggestion months ago when I thought the flood was getting a name change so it should get nuked, wait a while, then reinstated under a new name.

(It was getting a new name because of Bungie not being the Halo guys anymore)

The other suggestions are a flood "Probation" and a temporary nuking every time they do something bad, without any indication whether the nuke will end/when it will or whether it won't end at all.

Posted by: SkyFighta65
It doesn't bother me, therefore anyone that has a problem with it needs to adapt and stop complaining.

Am I doing it right?


In case I didn't say this already I'm not against nuking the Reach forum as well. >.>

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:38 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:37 PM PDT

Posted by: A Bit Of Zero
This thread would have appealed to me more if it was written with crayons.
Posted by: King Dutchy
I broke one of the cords for my X11s because I couldn't get past the final American course in Doritos Crash Course.

Posted by: MURDUR 587
It is true that the flood can do good things, but it never actually does, Heather's camp is the only example I can think of that is "good".

The rest of the stuff are just "cool" or ... yeah well cool.

True, but if you look at the other forums on Bungie.net, they haven't done anything either (except maybe the community forum), they're just "cool" from time to time too.

  • 07.04.2011 5:39 PM PDT

GT/Steam: Squiggy888
I try my best to block out the screams
But they're haunting me in my dreams
Please, break my shackles, I want it to stop

Posted by: Covy Killer
Sergeant Explosion and The Quiet Day in London.

Not all of us are bad, I post mainly in the flood, but I don't attack other places.

I think the people doing the attacks should be banned.

  • 07.04.2011 5:39 PM PDT
  • gamertag: iBIind
  • user homepage:

Whoo.

Posted by: SkilPhil
True, but if you look at the other forums on Bungie.net, they haven't done anything either (except maybe the community forum), they're just "cool" from time to time too.

But they don't cause problems, which is their advantage.

  • 07.04.2011 5:41 PM PDT

I am a Floodian

Posted by: mike120593
Posted by: Oa Beast292
The Flood is one of three places that still have civilized conversations and debates on this site (Granted its not always great but it is the off topic forum, give it some credit). Nuking it would just cause mass destruction.


While it is all too rare to see anything bearing any semblance to intelligent conversation in the flood, I agree that getting rid of it could cause problems, in that without an off-topic forum, numerous inappropriate topics will pop up in other forums. However, that is not to say I am against the removal of the Flood, I am just against any future lack of an off-topic forum.
I don't have any significant problem with what you're saying up to here, except the part about removing The Flood because I love The Flood (side note, I AM TOTALLY UNBIASED *wink wink*).

The main problem we have right now is that the Flood forum has created its own separate identity from the rest of the site, and for some reason, those who frequent it have some sort of ill-founded pride. It is this "Pride" which drives most of the stupidity and ludicrous actions emanating from the forum. Many of them forget that these forums were built for fans of Bungie and their games, not for angsty teens who wish to impress strangers over the internet. I wouldn't say created it's own identity, as much as one formed. To the bolded part: That's pretty much the internet, in a nutshell. Everyone thinks they're awesome, and act dumb because of it. How many civilized conversations do you have on Xbox Live? None. It's all just angsty teens who wish to impress strangers over the internet.

So yes, nuke the Flood. However, a new forum should be installed in its placeSo for all practical purposes, you're just removing the name. Clearly this will have the desired effect. Everyone can see how much the Halo 2 forum calmed down once people stopped calling it New Mombassa, and how down to earth The Community forum became once it was no longer called The Septagon. Btw, neither of those things happened. Changing the name doesn't change who visits the forum.

for two primary reasons:

a) With the loss of Halo related topics following Bungie's turning control over to 343, it wouldn't be surprising to see a form of migration from the now obsolete Reach forums to the Off-topic forum. The Flood has demonstrated time and time again its collective distaste for those who frequent the other Halo-related forums, and it would not be surprising if a dichotomy emerged between those migrating in, and those already established within the forum.
And yet, everyone who moved in from Halo 1, PC, 2 and 3 all seem to have emigrated just fine.

b) In the future, we can assume that with Bungie Aerospace, Bungie.net as a whole will become important to the financial success of those Indie developers making use of Aerospace, presumably through gaining feedback from the forums, as well as numerous other means. Now, if the Flood continues its current streak of spamming/attacking its co-existant forums, imagine what effect that would have on the entirety of Aerospace.The behavior is a problem, but like I said, changing the name of the town doesn't change the people who live there.

It would be much better if we were to start with a blank slate. Eliminate the "Flood" (Which also makes sense concerning the departure of Halo's influence), and replace it with a new Off-topic forum. Enforce stricter policies on any form of spamming or inter-forum attacks, as well as most topics (e.g. Politics) for the first few weeks in order to make sure that the remnants of the Flood's less-then-savory past tendencies wither away, and then ease up.Enforcing stricter rules has been tried. It doesn't change the problem of private groups, alts and all the other ways to get around the rules for those determined to do so. It was enforced for a year, and eventually the old habits come back, what would a few weeks change?


Alternatively, just split up the Flood in order to compensate for the now obsolete forums in the wake of Halo's departure. Have a "General Gaming" forum, which could contain discussion of Halo and other games, therefore containing the number of Halo threads which would still linger on, as well as pleasing those who still see Bungie.net for what it is: a video game site. Then just add another forum for everything else, but with a new name (i.e. Not "Flood").
This is an interesting idea, but I think I'm just against it because I see The Flood more as a community than an Off-Topic forum.

  • 07.04.2011 5:42 PM PDT

Without me, it's just "Aweso".


Posted by: Oa Beast292
I would say 70% of the Flood can actually have a convo but that 30% always needs to ruin it or give it a bad name, almost like with the US and rednecks.

Which is why we need to get rid of the "Name" altogether, since we've found that it's impossible for a forum such as the flood to make a "Good Name" or anything even close for itself, we just need to make sure that they know that they are a Bungie forum, not an independent entity. So many of them are delusional in thinking that the Flood should strive to become something like the group, Anonymous. Right now, they are under the jurisdiction of Bungie, and any stupid actions they might take would reflect badly on Bungie itself, meaning that unlike Anonymous, the Flood has to answer to someone, which I don't think they've realized. A simple reminder like renaming it the "Bungie.net Off Topic Forum" would make a big difference in my opinion.

EDIT: I believe this post could also be applied as a response to Squirrel Dude's post. Rather than just getting rid of the name, we need to get rid of the concept that the Flood is a separate community from the rest of this site, and if we can consolidate everyone into the "Bungie.net Community", things would go along much smoother than if we are divided along forum lines. If you want your own personal community, private groups are only a few clicks away, and there are plenty of tother forums out there.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:47 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:43 PM PDT


Posted by: MURDUR 587
I suppose it is mainly the users, but dammit they're doing this kinda stuff in the name of the flood!

When groups attack the forums it's not that bad, and whenever they do the group actually gets deleted for causing too much rukus, you know seasoned veterans? That is actually a group formed by the creators of a previous trolling group that Achronos threatened to delete multiple times.

Not to say that SV doesn't troll now, just saying that flood like behaviour usually gets warned and if it persists gets punished, and the amount of attacks the flood has been responcible for if it was a group it would have been deleted by now.

I'm not sure about SV, but I know that the New Flood had gotten that threat many times (since I was a member during it's on site group). However, the threats against the New Flood were extremely justified. We went too far back then and I'm surprised we weren't completely punished for it.

But back to the topic, since the Flood is such a huge community, not everyone has a say in what happens. It's not like a good user can just click "Leave Group" to wipe their hands clean of the Flood's interaction with other forums.

When the Flood does a raid, it's usually very harmless and is dealt with easily. Again, I'm going back to the /b/ comparison. The Flood could be a lot worse and we're lucky the moderators keep it as controlled as it is.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:44 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:43 PM PDT
  • gamertag: iBIind
  • user homepage:

Whoo.

Posted by: squirrel dude
The behavior is a problem, but like I said, changing the name of the town doesn't change the people who live there.

Actually ...
In a blind taste test people prefer pepsi over coke, while when the labels are on people prefer coke and this is because people have a certain view of the brand.

The same thing could be applied to the flood, right now I see the flood as "The forum that attacks other forums" now that invisioning makes me more likely as a regular forum goer to be up for any attacks, while if it's name was changed to lets say just "The off-topic forum" I'd see it as a new forum for off-topic things and be more likely to be "not up" for other forum attacks.

Granted with the fact that the flood is also called the off-topic forum that name isn't advisiory but you get the point.

[Edited on 07.04.2011 5:51 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2011 5:50 PM PDT

Posted by: A Bit Of Zero
This thread would have appealed to me more if it was written with crayons.
Posted by: King Dutchy
I broke one of the cords for my X11s because I couldn't get past the final American course in Doritos Crash Course.

Posted by: MURDUR 587
Posted by: SkilPhil
True, but if you look at the other forums on Bungie.net, they haven't done anything either (except maybe the community forum), they're just "cool" from time to time too.

But they don't cause problems, which is their advantage.

Again true, I guess it all comes down to personal opinion on how much trolling annoys certain people, its a tricky one.
Personally I don't mind people that troll because I just find another thread, I don't see it as too much of an inconvenience.

  • 07.04.2011 5:50 PM PDT


Posted by: mike120593
A simple reminder like renaming it the "Bungie.net Off Topic Forum" would make a big difference in my opinion.


I feel like people would still call it the Flood regardless. Honestly, they aren't harming people as much as the OP is implying it. I say just let them stay there, they don't really come out and think about it, if it got renamed most of them would come here and tell Bungie to change it back.

So basically, leave it there, it doesn't really harm anyone.

  • 07.04.2011 5:51 PM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.


Posted by: MURDUR 587
Seriously, there's flood orchestrated Reach forum attacks going on right now.
[A random example]


Unless every single person who frequents The Flood was in on the attacks, you can't really justify removing it. Not even half a percent were involved. There's as many good members of The Flood as there are rotten. And the good ones are better than the bad ones are bad.

I used to be for Flood nuking mostly just because I didn't really care. Now I'm more on the "Let it be," side of things. There's nothing really wrong with the forum, so why disturb things?

  • 07.04.2011 5:52 PM PDT