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  • Subject: So 100 ships couldn't defeat a Supercarrier?
Subject: So 100 ships couldn't defeat a Supercarrier?

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: SC Matt Klassen
Okay, if the strongest Covenant ship is weak to mid-level megatons, then SG runs rampant over the Covenant. Do you Halo fans really want that?

I'm not getting into these debates anymore but that is a ridiculous argument. Stop appealing to the consequence of a belief, it is irrelevant.

  • 07.15.2011 6:44 PM PDT
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Considering you all claim to know about the Halo universe you're all having a pointless debate. The books had around 150+ ships and 20 ODP's defending Reach thats true... but correct me if i am wrong the Game Canon which is VERY diffrent from the book Canon is the official Canon correct? Thats what Bungie said anyway!

One thing i think you all forget is that in the Begining of "Tip Of The Spear" Auntie Dot says the Orbital Defences are Under Attack which leaves 6 Corvette's which are fast in comparison to other ships to wipe them otu with Methods like Boarding them and shooting them down Etc. So we can safely assume after the LNoS appears it leaves the atmosphere of Reach and safely -blam!-s them up... I mean its a super CARRIER and could easily wipe them out with a Salvo of Plasma before they could get a Shot off.

We then need to remember that auntie dot also says ALL ships are enroute back from Existing deployments... and that the first Battle Group would arrive within 48 hours. Assuming that battle group was the size of 100+ Ships you need to remember that the whole Covenant Fleet arrived. I'm straying offtopic anyways, Just remember that the Game Canon is diffrent to the book Canon and that that Many Ships were probably not Defending Reach.

I think this debate is pointless as Bungie has stated 100x over the Canon goes Game > Book, Mmmmmk.



Update: I quote a user on this Forum in this post aswell. "In Fall of Reach just a normal cruiser (not a battlecruiser, a normal cruiser, which is about a third the size and strength of a battlecruiser) withstood two nukes without its shields faltering. It also took two direct MAC rounds, which punched through it, but it still was fully functional. They had to detonate a nuke inside its own shields (amplifying the nuke 100x) to finally destroy it." That alone explains alot but then again i'm laughing at how stupid some of you actually are.

Game > Book

[Edited on 07.15.2011 7:06 PM PDT]

  • 07.15.2011 6:52 PM PDT

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TBENinjaTiger.
Go away.
Very far away.

  • 07.15.2011 7:28 PM PDT

But the thing is, in The Fall of Reach , there were a 100 ships DURING the events of August 30. Cortana detects about 300 Covenant Ships and Captain Keyes mentions that they are outnumbered 3-to-1.

What does this mean?

It means that the UNSC must've had MORE than 100 ships (Master Chief says that there are AT LEAST 100 ships in orbit AT ANY GIVEN TIME) which were lost against the LNoS.

However, on the OTHER hand, the events of Long Night of Solace takes place on August 13 . Dot says that 60% of the UNSC Fleet is en route ETA 48 hours . That means they should've gotten there at August 15. The 300-ish Covenant ships arrived at August 30.
Other than the fact that 100-ish ships CANNOT be 60% of the Fleet, another discrepancy is the arrival of the Fleet of Particular Justice . It supposedly arrived just after the destruction of the LNoS, and yet it took 17 days for the planet to fall: a discrepancy.

CONCLUSION: Reach is a horrible retcon. And the dialogues don't make sense (60% my ass). Stick with the book.

  • 07.15.2011 7:34 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: TBENinjaTiger
Considering you all claim to know about the Halo universe you're all having a pointless debate. The books had around 150+ ships and 20 ODP's defending Reach thats true... but correct me if i am wrong the Game Canon which is VERY diffrent from the book Canon is the official Canon correct? Thats what Bungie said anyway!

One thing i think you all forget is that in the Begining of "Tip Of The Spear" Auntie Dot says the Orbital Defences are Under Attack which leaves 6 Corvette's which are fast in comparison to other ships to wipe them otu with Methods like Boarding them and shooting them down Etc. So we can safely assume after the LNoS appears it leaves the atmosphere of Reach and safely -blam!-s them up... I mean its a super CARRIER and could easily wipe them out with a Salvo of Plasma before they could get a Shot off.

We then need to remember that auntie dot also says ALL ships are enroute back from Existing deployments... and that the first Battle Group would arrive within 48 hours. Assuming that battle group was the size of 100+ Ships you need to remember that the whole Covenant Fleet arrived. I'm straying offtopic anyways, Just remember that the Game Canon is diffrent to the book Canon and that that Many Ships were probably not Defending Reach.

I think this debate is pointless as Bungie has stated 100x over the Canon goes Game > Book, Mmmmmk.



Update: I quote a user on this Forum in this post aswell. "In Fall of Reach just a normal cruiser (not a battlecruiser, a normal cruiser, which is about a third the size and strength of a battlecruiser) withstood two nukes without its shields faltering. It also took two direct MAC rounds, which punched through it, but it still was fully functional. They had to detonate a nuke inside its own shields (amplifying the nuke 100x) to finally destroy it." That alone explains alot but then again i'm laughing at how stupid some of you actually are.

Game > Book



1. "game canon" and 'book canon" are and always will be the same. We just never had a game based off a book until reach in which it tried to be a perfect match and that didn't work out.

2. Yea but that directly contradicts the books then because non of the SMACs were randomly destroyed or damaged, so what ever was being attacked was pointless, and bungie claims the book and game fit perfectly so this isn't something to be talked about.

3.Huh and how old are you? Dot says 60 percent of the UNSC fleet is getting called to reach, we have no idea how many ships that is. but if the game and book are to match up that is only 50 ships ;/ And the canon is same in both games and books, this isn't starwars or something.
and 100 ships were at reach

4.bungie doesn't control halo and hasn't for like 2 and a half years now. whatever they said and there policies stopped mattering once reach came out. It is all 343 now

5. well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.

and i am laughing at how stupid you are

  • 07.15.2011 8:29 PM PDT

What did I miss? As far as I know the only things that would have a chance of taking out the supercarrier were an extremely powerful explosion, i.e. supernova, a nuke inside its shields (which they mentioned was tried and failed), and maybe the orbital defense platforms (which were down). All that is left is the fleet.

The size of the fleet at Reach was never mentioned, but I will try to estimate it. Assuming that the 60% of the UNSC fleet that Dot mentioned is the same fleet fleet that fought at the fall of Reach, then we can say 60% of the fleet was about 100 ships. Therefore the remaining 40% should be 67 or so ships. Considering that they are mainly frigates I don't think they would have had a chance.

  • 07.15.2011 8:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: otterboyz
The holotank on the Ardent Prayer shows that most of the Reach fleet is still intact, and the yellow dots number into the 120's, so what does that mean?


No it doesn't and we have been decoding that thing for about 2 weeks.

Posted by: the n00b pwner
What did I miss? As far as I know the only things that would have a chance of taking out the supercarrier were an extremely powerful explosion, i.e. supernova, a nuke inside its shields (which they mentioned was tried and failed), and maybe the orbital defense platforms (which were down). All that is left is the fleet.

The size of the fleet at Reach was never mentioned, but I will try to estimate it. Assuming that the 60% of the UNSC fleet that Dot mentioned is the same fleet fleet that fought at the fall of Reach, then we can say 60% of the fleet was about 100 ships. Therefore the remaining 40% should be 67 or so ships. Considering that they are mainly frigates I don't think they would have had a chance.


when was it said they tried to get a nuke in the shields? you are completely twisting the statement of "and all of nukes were wiped down with the ships that carried them" nothing is gained from that other than the ships with nukes were destroyed.

We can debate on ships taking it down but it is a fact the SMACs would, hence it trying to avoid them. and your math is off, 100 ships were already at reach it is the 50 that arrived out of the hundred said to be in the system.

The remaining 40 percent is the 60 ships that didn't fight the SC, so we don't know how large the total UNSC fleet is

[Edited on 07.15.2011 9:07 PM PDT]

  • 07.15.2011 9:02 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101

Posted by: otterboyz
The holotank on the Ardent Prayer shows that most of the Reach fleet is still intact, and the yellow dots number into the 120's, so what does that mean?


No it doesn't and we have been decoding that thing for about 2 weeks.


How can you be sure?

  • 07.15.2011 9:19 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: otterboyz

Posted by: grey101

Posted by: otterboyz
The holotank on the Ardent Prayer shows that most of the Reach fleet is still intact, and the yellow dots number into the 120's, so what does that mean?


No it doesn't and we have been decoding that thing for about 2 weeks.


How can you be sure?


because the SC was said to have destroyed ships if not the fleet at reach since 60 percent of the UNSC fleet is in bound.

so it wouldn't make sense for there still to be 100 ships at reach not to mention they are the same color as covie forces

  • 07.15.2011 9:26 PM PDT


Posted by: N00B5600
But the thing is, in The Fall of Reach , there were a 100 ships DURING the events of August 30. Cortana detects about 300 Covenant Ships and Captain Keyes mentions that they are outnumbered 3-to-1.

What does this mean?

It means that the UNSC must've had MORE than 100 ships (Master Chief says that there are AT LEAST 100 ships in orbit AT ANY GIVEN TIME) which were lost against the LNoS.

However, on the OTHER hand, the events of Long Night of Solace takes place on August 13 . Dot says that 60% of the UNSC Fleet is en route ETA 48 hours . That means they should've gotten there at August 15. The 300-ish Covenant ships arrived at August 30.
Other than the fact that 100-ish ships CANNOT be 60% of the Fleet, another discrepancy is the arrival of the Fleet of Particular Justice . It supposedly arrived just after the destruction of the LNoS, and yet it took 17 days for the planet to fall: a discrepancy.

CONCLUSION: Reach is a horrible retcon. And the dialogues don't make sense (60% my ass). Stick with the book.


We don't know how many ships were lost to the Solace. I don't think there is any evidence whatsoever to say that it completely and utterly destroyed Reach's Home Fleet. And actually the LNoS level takes place on the 14th.

You don't seem to realize that there would have been fighting going on in space between the UNSC and the Covenant the entire time between 14th and the 30th. UNSC ships would have been destroyed all throughout that time period and replaced at odd times by reinforcements, by the time the 30th roles around they would have had at least 100 ships, I don't think any specific number was given, but I seem to remember it being much closer to 150+.

And as for the Fleet of Particular Justice no, it did not arrive on the 14th, I believe that was the Fleet of Valiant Prudence, I could be wrong. However, I do know that the FoPJ did not arrive on the 14th, it still arrives in system on 30th just like in TFoR.

I suggest watching this video and the rest of its series. It will shed some light on the matter.

  • 07.15.2011 9:40 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101


because the SC was said to have destroyed ships if not the fleet at reach since 60 percent of the UNSC fleet is in bound.

so it wouldn't make sense for there still to be 100 ships at reach not to mention they are the same color as covie forces


But all other covenant forces have specific symbols to represent them and only once is it said that UNSC ships where destroyed, when Carter says that nukes are either out of system or went down with the ships that carried them. it's very vauge about how many ships when down

  • 07.15.2011 9:42 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101

Posted by: otterboyz
The holotank on the Ardent Prayer shows that most of the Reach fleet is still intact, and the yellow dots number into the 120's, so what does that mean?


No it doesn't and we have been decoding that thing for about 2 weeks.

Posted by: the n00b pwner
What did I miss? As far as I know the only things that would have a chance of taking out the supercarrier were an extremely powerful explosion, i.e. supernova, a nuke inside its shields (which they mentioned was tried and failed), and maybe the orbital defense platforms (which were down). All that is left is the fleet.

The size of the fleet at Reach was never mentioned, but I will try to estimate it. Assuming that the 60% of the UNSC fleet that Dot mentioned is the same fleet fleet that fought at the fall of Reach, then we can say 60% of the fleet was about 100 ships. Therefore the remaining 40% should be 67 or so ships. Considering that they are mainly frigates I don't think they would have had a chance.


when was it said they tried to get a nuke in the shields? you are completely twisting the statement of "and all of nukes were wiped down with the ships that carried them" nothing is gained from that other than the ships with nukes were destroyed.

We can debate on ships taking it down but it is a fact the SMACs would, hence it trying to avoid them. and your math is off, 100 ships were already at reach it is the 50 that arrived out of the hundred said to be in the system.

The remaining 40 percent is the 60 ships that didn't fight the SC, so we don't know how large the total UNSC fleet is

1. I don't have the game right in front of me, but either way nukes weren't an option.

2.Where does it say that there were 100 ships at Reach when the supercarrier was there? The Fall of Reach says there were 100 ships when the main fleet arrived. It makes sense that those hundred ships were the ships Antie Dot was talking about. They obviously weren't 60% of the entire UNSC fleet, but maybe they were 60% of the Reach defense fleet while the ships destroyed by the supercarrier were the other 40%.

  • 07.15.2011 9:48 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101
well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.
Wrong. Nowhere did it specify that it was a supercruiser. It specified that it was a cruiser type, nothing more.

And the MAC rounds actually went right through it, punching two holes through the entire ship. The nukes, though? They didn't even phase the shields.

The only way they destroyed it was when john slipped past the shields and planted a bomb, then escaped.

Show me the quote where it says that it was a supercruiser. Because that thing was being flown entierly by Kig-yar (jackals), and they are not commonly granted command over higher-class ships.

  • 07.15.2011 9:54 PM PDT


Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: N00B5600
But the thing is, in The Fall of Reach , there were a 100 ships DURING the events of August 30. Cortana detects about 300 Covenant Ships and Captain Keyes mentions that they are outnumbered 3-to-1.

What does this mean?

It means that the UNSC must've had MORE than 100 ships (Master Chief says that there are AT LEAST 100 ships in orbit AT ANY GIVEN TIME) which were lost against the LNoS.

However, on the OTHER hand, the events of Long Night of Solace takes place on August 13 . Dot says that 60% of the UNSC Fleet is en route ETA 48 hours . That means they should've gotten there at August 15. The 300-ish Covenant ships arrived at August 30.
Other than the fact that 100-ish ships CANNOT be 60% of the Fleet, another discrepancy is the arrival of the Fleet of Particular Justice . It supposedly arrived just after the destruction of the LNoS, and yet it took 17 days for the planet to fall: a discrepancy.

CONCLUSION: Reach is a horrible retcon. And the dialogues don't make sense (60% my ass). Stick with the book.


We don't know how many ships were lost to the Solace. I don't think there is any evidence whatsoever to say that it completely and utterly destroyed Reach's Home Fleet. And actually the LNoS level takes place on the 14th.

You don't seem to realize that there would have been fighting going on in space between the UNSC and the Covenant the entire time between 14th and the 30th. UNSC ships would have been destroyed all throughout that time period and replaced at odd times by reinforcements, by the time the 30th roles around they would have had at least 100 ships, I don't think any specific number was given, but I seem to remember it being much closer to 150+.

And as for the Fleet of Particular Justice no, it did not arrive on the 14th, I believe that was the Fleet of Valiant Prudence, I could be wrong. However, I do know that the FoPJ did not arrive on the 14th, it still arrives in system on 30th just like in TFoR.

I suggest watching this video and the rest of its series. It will shed some light on the matter.


No its was the FoPJ. I've never heard of the Fleet of Valiant Prudence before, though. But yeah, I guess I could be wrong though i stand by my opinion that 100 ships could not have possibly been 60% of the ENTIRE UNSC Fleet.

And also, I stand corrected on the date. August 14.

[Edited on 07.15.2011 11:18 PM PDT]

  • 07.15.2011 11:15 PM PDT

Battle Scenario: UNSC Fleet of 100 Estimated Ships Engages Covenant Assault Carrier Long Night Solace and at least 3-10 Covenant Corvettes.

Estimated UNSC Ship Rosters:
60 Frigates, 20 Corvettes, 19 Halcyon/Marathon Class Cruisers, 1 UNSC Supercarrier Trafalgar.

Covenant Ship Rosters:
3-10 Covenant Corvettes, 1 Assault Carrier


Battle: A few thousand miles away from the Assault Carrier.
UNSC Fleet lying in wait behind one of Reach's Moons.

If the UNSC were being smart, they would have 10-15 Frigates jump in and fight the Corvettes and possibly spread them thin enough for the Primary Assault force to jump in from behind one of Reach's moons.

The Trafalgar would still be hiding behind the Moon with 6 Frigates and 2 Cruisers. When, the primary assault force of 39 Frigates, 20 UNSC Corevettes, and 17 Cruisers arrives they would send the Corvettes flying in an full speed deploying stealth mines in a line that they will soon make the Assault fall into.

Assuming the Covenant Corvettes Are destroyed because of Concentrated fire from frigates and Cruisers, the LNOS will be dishing out it's full arsenal and would've taken out around 11 frigates and 9 Cruisers. As a distraction, the UNSC use a bluff radiation emission to make the Covenant Think a big nuke is a about to go off behind them, thus making the LNOS lurch forward at alarming speed in an effort to avoid the seemingly real explosion inadvertently leading them straight into the Nuclear Stealth Mines. Boda Bing Boda Boom.

I estimate that that Would've taken a fifth out the Covenant Shields, Since the LNOS is still recovering from 20 or so Nuclear blasts, this creates a very small window of time that allows 28 Frigates and 8 Cruisers too unleash an unending hellish menagerie of Missile pods at the Assault Carrier.

This , I assume, would weaken the ships shields to 15-20%.
Now, it's time for the Trafalgar to shine. It, 2 Cruisers, and 8 Frigates emerge from behind the Moon and simultaneously firing their MAC Guns at the exact same spot on the Assault Carrier. All the while, the primary assault force has taken heavy losses, and are still keeping them busy with Longswords, Pelicans, and Sabres. With fighters Numbering in the thousands, I assume the Assault Carrier couldn't handle the missile pods or fighters at the same time. The Carrier fires it's Super MAC half a second after it's support ships have fired at it's target location. After the first consecutive burst of over 4000 missiles and 10 MAC Rounds hitting the same spot, LNOS has lost it's shields, the Super MAC Round finally does it.

The Target Location was the Primary Energy Projector on the top side of the ship. This is linked to an extremely powerful power source, after being stuck by at least 2 or 3 MAC Rounds, and finally the Super MAC, this Power Source would have overloaded and exploded, severing the Ship and leaving utterly destroyed and salvageable.

UNSC Fleet Estimates:
30 Frigates, 10 Cruisers, and the Trafalgar.
Corvettes would have been lost due to Overwhelming fire from the LNOS.

Please tell me what you think of this scenario.

  • 07.16.2011 12:27 AM PDT


Posted by: ShadowSpy117
Battle Scenario: UNSC Fleet of 100 Estimated Ships Engages Covenant Assault Carrier Long Night Solace and at least 3-10 Covenant Corvettes.

Estimated UNSC Ship Rosters:
60 Frigates, 20 Corvettes, 19 Halcyon/Marathon Class Cruisers, 1 UNSC Supercarrier Trafalgar.

Covenant Ship Rosters:
3-10 Covenant Corvettes, 1 Assault Carrier


Battle: A few thousand miles away from the Assault Carrier.
UNSC Fleet lying in wait behind one of Reach's Moons.

If the UNSC were being smart, they would have 10-15 Frigates jump in and fight the Corvettes and possibly spread them thin enough for the Primary Assault force to jump in from behind one of Reach's moons.

The Trafalgar would still be hiding behind the Moon with 6 Frigates and 2 Cruisers. When, the primary assault force of 39 Frigates, 20 UNSC Corevettes, and 17 Cruisers arrives they would send the Corvettes flying in an full speed deploying stealth mines in a line that they will soon make the Assault fall into.

Assuming the Covenant Corvettes Are destroyed because of Concentrated fire from frigates and Cruisers, the LNOS will be dishing out it's full arsenal and would've taken out around 11 frigates and 9 Cruisers. As a distraction, the UNSC use a bluff radiation emission to make the Covenant Think a big nuke is a about to go off behind them, thus making the LNOS lurch forward at alarming speed in an effort to avoid the seemingly real explosion inadvertently leading them straight into the Nuclear Stealth Mines. Boda Bing Boda Boom.

I estimate that that Would've taken a fifth out the Covenant Shields, Since the LNOS is still recovering from 20 or so Nuclear blasts, this creates a very small window of time that allows 28 Frigates and 8 Cruisers too unleash an unending hellish menagerie of Missile pods at the Assault Carrier.

This , I assume, would weaken the ships shields to 15-20%.
Now, it's time for the Trafalgar to shine. It, 2 Cruisers, and 8 Frigates emerge from behind the Moon and simultaneously firing their MAC Guns at the exact same spot on the Assault Carrier. All the while, the primary assault force has taken heavy losses, and are still keeping them busy with Longswords, Pelicans, and Sabres. With fighters Numbering in the thousands, I assume the Assault Carrier couldn't handle the missile pods or fighters at the same time. The Carrier fires it's Super MAC half a second after it's support ships have fired at it's target location. After the first consecutive burst of over 4000 missiles and 10 MAC Rounds hitting the same spot, LNOS has lost it's shields, the Super MAC Round finally does it.

The Target Location was the Primary Energy Projector on the top side of the ship. This is linked to an extremely powerful power source, after being stuck by at least 2 or 3 MAC Rounds, and finally the Super MAC, this Power Source would have overloaded and exploded, severing the Ship and leaving utterly destroyed and salvageable.

UNSC Fleet Estimates:
30 Frigates, 10 Cruisers, and the Trafalgar.
Corvettes would have been lost due to Overwhelming fire from the LNOS.

Please tell me what you think of this scenario.


Firstly, its a Supercarrier not an Assault Carrier.

Secondly, the UNSC cannot navigate Slipspace that accurately. The novel, The Fall of Reach states that they either appear NEAR the intended jump point.... or a billion kilometers distant.

Thirdly... the aforementioned novel says that there were 100 ships DURING the battle on the 30th of August.... 16 days after Long Night of Solace was destroyed. This means that if there were casualties like this suffered, there wouldn't have been a 100 ships in orbit on the 30th, ruining the canon (hell, Reach already ruins the canon...)

Sorry if I sound like a dick.

NOW on a positive note...

Trafalgar was one of the few UNSC Supercarriers (DO NOT confuse with Covenant Supercarrier). While not as...indestructible....as Halcyon-class cruisers, still could take a tremendous amount of damage. What does this mean? Trafalgar could've pwned the Corvettes easy and still deal a decent amount of damage to the Long Night of Solace... by itself.

[Edited on 07.16.2011 1:29 AM PDT]

  • 07.16.2011 1:18 AM PDT

I find a few problems with your battle scenario.

It's a SuperCarrier.

One plasma morter could destroy any common unsc ships, while several shots are required to take town covenant ships.

A supercarrier's shields would laugh in the face of a nuke, and they wouldn't even bother to attempt and avoid it.

  • 07.16.2011 1:41 AM PDT
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Posted by: Kalawaki

Posted by: grey101
well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.
Wrong. Nowhere did it specify that it was a supercruiser. It specified that it was a cruiser type, nothing more.

And the MAC rounds actually went right through it, punching two holes through the entire ship. The nukes, though? They didn't even phase the shields.

The only way they destroyed it was when john slipped past the shields and planted a bomb, then escaped.

Show me the quote where it says that it was a supercruiser. Because that thing was being flown entierly by Kig-yar (jackals), and they are not commonly granted command over higher-class ships.


Wrong again, buddy. FS did state that it was super-cruiser.

Again, you're wrong again. Nukes DOES HAVE EFFECT ON THE SHIELDS! Don't you realize that using scenario from Ghosts of Onyx's move with nuclear mines over Onyx, killing 12 ships and crippling four? And It was calculated that most of COVENANT SHIELDS cannot withstand repeated hits of 30 megaton of TNT!

  • 07.16.2011 4:13 AM PDT

Oh why does everyone ignore my posts? :(
BACK on-topic:
Posted by: grey101
well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.[/quote]Wrong. Nowhere did it specify that it was a supercruiser. It specified that it was a cruiser type, nothing more.

And the MAC rounds actually went right through it, punching two holes through the entire ship. The nukes, though? They didn't even phase the shields.

The only way they destroyed it was when john slipped past the shields and planted a bomb, then escaped.

Show me the quote where it says that it was a supercruiser. Because that thing was being flown entierly by Kig-yar (jackals), and they are not commonly granted command over higher-class ships.


That is the ship from SECTION II of the book ("BOOT") Chapters 12-13.
The Supercruiser is the ship from SECTION V ("Reach") In Chapter 36, pg 320 starting from line 4 onto the supercruiser's destruction on pg 324, line 12.

  • 07.16.2011 4:50 AM PDT

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Posted by: N00B5600
Oh why does everyone ignore my posts? :(
BACK on-topic:
Posted by: grey101
well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.[/quote]Wrong. Nowhere did it specify that it was a supercruiser. It specified that it was a cruiser type, nothing more.

And the MAC rounds actually went right through it, punching two holes through the entire ship. The nukes, though? They didn't even phase the shields.

The only way they destroyed it was when john slipped past the shields and planted a bomb, then escaped.

Show me the quote where it says that it was a supercruiser. Because that thing was being flown entierly by Kig-yar (jackals), and they are not commonly granted command over higher-class ships.


That is the ship from SECTION II of the book ("BOOT") Chapters 12-13.
The Supercruiser is the ship from SECTION V ("Reach") In Chapter 36, pg 320 starting from line 4 onto the supercruiser's destruction on pg 324, line 12.


Where was the so-called 'super crusier's' class as a super cruiser even stated during that section in the Fall of Reach. The only thing remotely relating to class of ship is that it's the size of roughly three UNSC cruisers if not slightly more than that.

  • 07.16.2011 5:00 AM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Kalawaki

Posted by: grey101
well you and whoever you are quoting are just trying to make up facts to support your side because it was asupercruiser. and it is standard for several MAC rounds needed for the shields to pop the same as bullets to shields so i don't know why you are saying that like it is suppose to have merit.
Wrong. Nowhere did it specify that it was a supercruiser. It specified that it was a cruiser type, nothing more.

And the MAC rounds actually went right through it, punching two holes through the entire ship. The nukes, though? They didn't even phase the shields.

The only way they destroyed it was when john slipped past the shields and planted a bomb, then escaped.

Show me the quote where it says that it was a supercruiser. Because that thing was being flown entierly by Kig-yar (jackals), and they are not commonly granted command over higher-class ships.


we have seen several cruisers before in the novel and we also saw cruisers in GoO. none were large as the one in TFoR hence it being labeled a supercrusier keyes himself said it was a titan.

Nukes never broke shields save for NOVA bombs, that doesn't make them useless against the hull of the ship (which i have been talking about)

Huh? the ship YOU are talking about was when the commonwealth was fighting a small ship.

I am talking about when the PoA fought the sniper ship during reach. you have been getting involved in something you didn't even understand.

  • 07.16.2011 7:07 AM PDT


Posted by: N00B5600

Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: N00B5600
But the thing is, in The Fall of Reach , there were a 100 ships DURING the events of August 30. Cortana detects about 300 Covenant Ships and Captain Keyes mentions that they are outnumbered 3-to-1.

What does this mean?

It means that the UNSC must've had MORE than 100 ships (Master Chief says that there are AT LEAST 100 ships in orbit AT ANY GIVEN TIME) which were lost against the LNoS.

However, on the OTHER hand, the events of Long Night of Solace takes place on August 13 . Dot says that 60% of the UNSC Fleet is en route ETA 48 hours . That means they should've gotten there at August 15. The 300-ish Covenant ships arrived at August 30.
Other than the fact that 100-ish ships CANNOT be 60% of the Fleet, another discrepancy is the arrival of the Fleet of Particular Justice . It supposedly arrived just after the destruction of the LNoS, and yet it took 17 days for the planet to fall: a discrepancy.

CONCLUSION: Reach is a horrible retcon. And the dialogues don't make sense (60% my ass). Stick with the book.


We don't know how many ships were lost to the Solace. I don't think there is any evidence whatsoever to say that it completely and utterly destroyed Reach's Home Fleet. And actually the LNoS level takes place on the 14th.

You don't seem to realize that there would have been fighting going on in space between the UNSC and the Covenant the entire time between 14th and the 30th. UNSC ships would have been destroyed all throughout that time period and replaced at odd times by reinforcements, by the time the 30th roles around they would have had at least 100 ships, I don't think any specific number was given, but I seem to remember it being much closer to 150+.

And as for the Fleet of Particular Justice no, it did not arrive on the 14th, I believe that was the Fleet of Valiant Prudence, I could be wrong. However, I do know that the FoPJ did not arrive on the 14th, it still arrives in system on 30th just like in TFoR.

I suggest watching this video and the rest of its series. It will shed some light on the matter.


No its was the FoPJ. I've never heard of the Fleet of Valiant Prudence before, though. But yeah, I guess I could be wrong though i stand by my opinion that 100 ships could not have possibly been 60% of the ENTIRE UNSC Fleet.

And also, I stand corrected on the date. August 14.


The ships arriving after the LNoS demise may have been part of the FoPJ, like I said, I don't really know what ships made up Valiant Prudence. To be honest, I hadn't heard of it before a few days ago either, the guy who mentioned it said it was brought up in a visual guide or something like that.

And you are right, 100+ ships would not be 60% of the UNSC fleet, but the whole time up to the 30th there would have been losses due to battling the Covenant ships. Their numbers would have been either brought down to close to a hundred and then significant reinforcements arrive too late to take part in the battle, or the UNSC suffered significant losses and then reinforcements trickling in up to the 30th brought them back up to the strength in the book. And in any case I think the numbers for the UNSC ships present at the battle in the book would probably be in need of a retcon since Reach's reinforcements were summoned far earlier than they were in the book.

  • 07.16.2011 8:50 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

The ships of valiant prudence are SDV-class heavy corvettes and a CSO-class supercarrier. It's 28960 meters in length and the beam is of 11447 meters.
The shipmster is Rho 'Barutamee.

Most of humanity was unaware of the Covenant's presence on Reach until August 30, 2552.

  • 07.16.2011 9:09 AM PDT

Size Comparison

Its huge. Human ships are tiny. They just did not have the firepower left to kill it.

  • 07.16.2011 9:17 AM PDT