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Subject: Greg bear

Hello to you all please allow me to say this is not a bear bash (pun intended) but my view on the course cryptum seems to take at least from my view. now having said that i have only read the book once so please correct me if anything i say is wrong or you belive i have said opposite to your opinion.

we hae been given 2? canonical accounts of the forerunners one that they were a noble pacifistic race that belived in upholding truth justice and the mantle a race that ruled with compassion and understanding and left other species to create there own fate only stepping in to resolve mass wars or as such that endagered the species I.E geneocide/disasters.

then account no.2) gregs version.

seemingly the blanks have been left unfilled from cortana's view of the forerunners whcih greg goes in to fill by making the forerunners a seemingly power hungry race.(killing of the precursors so they can hold the mantle) as well as coming across as rather xenophobic towards most if not all other species that they share th galaxy with. some even seem to hold less techologically advanced specie's as below them meaning they've pretty much forgotten that even they didn't start off as god's but made there way to the top through trial and error.

whats your preffered view canonical or not mine is the first one as it's a step away from the normal view that any race advanced enough to be where the forerunners were on the tier only got there through domination and spilt blood absolute power doesn't have to corrupt absolutly.

i know greg has the backing of 343 etc but it seems strange to make at first a peaceful race into xenophobic rulers .

please forgive any grammical/punctual/spelling mistakes and share your view i may not respond as its rather late in the u.k and i have work tommorrow. peace be with you all.

  • 07.20.2011 4:33 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

We only got this noble race thing form speculation and most of that comes from the closing days of the Forerunner-Flood War. Bear's novels deal with the Forerunners before and during the war. I know it sounds awful, but all races have skeletons in their closets.

We've never known the full picture of the Forerunners.

  • 07.20.2011 4:35 PM PDT

"It will not be we who reach Alpha Centauri, and the other nearby stars, it will be a species very like us, but with more of our strengths and fewer of our weaknesses, more confident, far-seeing, capable, and prudent. For all our failings, despite our limitations and fallibilities, we humans are capable of greatness."-Carl Sagan


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
We've never known the full picture of the Forerunners.


And I hope there are some small mysteries after this trilogy ends.

  • 07.20.2011 4:37 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: I Nebula I

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
We've never known the full picture of the Forerunners.


And I hope there are some small mysteries after this trilogy ends.


Halo 4, 5, and 6.

  • 07.20.2011 4:38 PM PDT

Oh hey there

Posted by: petarded2
It's a metaphor for the 07s' lack of identity. too old to be newfa­g, yet too new to be oldfa­g, we wander b.net in search of a home, forever trying to be something we are not.

Like coma said that first view that we've had for most of our time with Halo was based on a lot of speculation about the Forerunner, mostly by Cortana and Halsey, with not many facts to back it up.

  • 07.20.2011 4:39 PM PDT

"It will not be we who reach Alpha Centauri, and the other nearby stars, it will be a species very like us, but with more of our strengths and fewer of our weaknesses, more confident, far-seeing, capable, and prudent. For all our failings, despite our limitations and fallibilities, we humans are capable of greatness."-Carl Sagan


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: I Nebula I

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
We've never known the full picture of the Forerunners.


And I hope there are some small mysteries after this trilogy ends.


Halo 4, 5, and 6.


Yes, I want them to be explained in the new trilogy.

  • 07.20.2011 4:39 PM PDT

Personally it didn't seem like he made them a hatefull, xenophobic race. It seems more like he made them with flaws. The forerunners are still just living organisms. Technologically advanced than all others, but still organisms with flaws. Besides it didn't destroy their peaceful nature. Cryptum stated that it is rare for the forerunners to partake in any military action. Their beef with humanity was justified. De-evolution however wasn't of course, but hey, Forerunners aren't the greatest people to piss off. Are you forgetting that the forerunners have been helping and protecting races all throughout the galaxy for thousands of years before Faber?

  • 07.20.2011 4:40 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

can i get a link to those accounts? because from what i understand that is what everybody thought based off the fact they died activating halo. it was never said they lived every second in nobility.

We don't know what really happened with the forerunners and precursors.


The main reason everybody is "disappointed" because we were all around 7 years old and made up assumptions ourselves.

  • 07.20.2011 4:42 PM PDT

thank you for your reply and i agree with you it's just that it feels like a some what missed oppertuintiy toshow that not all people/races of power or ruler ship have to be evil, racsit, etc that once in a while a race can indeed advance mature and become gaurdians of life through understanding compassion and guidance not war twisted idels/morals/etc im hoping gregs going to turn this into a story of advancment/maturity through changing views.

  • 07.20.2011 4:42 PM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

The forerunner story - the story of my people - has been told many times, with greater and greater idealization, until I scarecely recognized it.

  • 07.20.2011 4:45 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: sameron
thank you for your reply and i agree with you it's just that it feels like a some what missed oppertuintiy toshow that not all people/races of power or ruler ship have to be evil, racsit, etc that once in a while a race can indeed advance mature and become gaurdians of life through understanding compassion and guidance not war twisted idels/morals/etc im hoping gregs going to turn this into a story of advancment/maturity through changing views.


I'm sorry, but that is an impossibility. They do make the ultimate sacrifice, but now that we know the Forerunners are still around, doesn't make it quite the ultimate sacrifice anymore.

  • 07.20.2011 4:45 PM PDT


Posted by: sameron
thank you for your reply and i agree with you it's just that it feels like a some what missed oppertuintiy toshow that not all people/races of power or ruler ship have to be evil, racsit, etc that once in a while a race can indeed advance mature and become gaurdians of life through understanding compassion and guidance not war twisted idels/morals/etc im hoping gregs going to turn this into a story of advancment/maturity through changing views.
This is what Primordium and the third novel are going to do I believe. The forerunners now have realized the severity of the flood. This is where their nobility, sacrifice, and bravery comes in.

  • 07.20.2011 4:45 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: sameron
thank you for your reply and i agree with you it's just that it feels like a some what missed oppertuintiy toshow that not all people/races of power or ruler ship have to be evil, racsit, etc that once in a while a race can indeed advance mature and become gaurdians of life through understanding compassion and guidance not war twisted idels/morals/etc im hoping gregs going to turn this into a story of advancment/maturity through changing views.


I find this story to be far more "human" there are too many races in sc-fi that are already like this and honestly there aren't many races like the forerunners (that i know of).

And they might turn around after this epic failure and ass whooping they got.

  • 07.20.2011 4:46 PM PDT

maybe i should have clarified for yo grey what others would have assumed. i didnt particulary mean they were a race that was entirely nobloe every person as well as every race im assumin there are others of course all have there own flaws but think when your species takes/over/inherits the galaxy. you tend to mature pretty fast especially with the technology to back up your new role. and what i personnally meant was we have god know's how many past rullers/dictators etc etc that advanced to powerful positions through conquest/slaughter/racism and it seems they missed the oppertunity to give us a rare eample of a race that did things a different way they rule through justice peace equality and hope. sure its the sugar coated version but hell it's my preference and perhaps a unique one.

  • 07.20.2011 4:50 PM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Maybe there is more to the flood than we expected? Or maybe the flood is but a parcel of the evil? But did any one even read what I wrote...

  • 07.20.2011 4:52 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

C'mon though, what is so noble about saving some of your own species, but killing off every other species in the galaxy? They didn't even bother to use the Shield World's or the Ark for the lesser races..

[Edited on 07.20.2011 4:55 PM PDT]

  • 07.20.2011 4:55 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: sameron
maybe i should have clarified for yo grey what others would have assumed. i didnt particulary mean they were a race that was entirely nobloe every person as well as every race im assumin there are others of course all have there own flaws but think when your species takes/over/inherits the galaxy. you tend to mature pretty fast especially with the technology to back up your new role. and what i personnally meant was we have god know's how many past rullers/dictators etc etc that advanced to powerful positions through conquest/slaughter/racism and it seems they missed the oppertunity to give us a rare eample of a race that did things a different way they rule through justice peace equality and hope. sure its the sugar coated version but hell it's my preference and perhaps a unique one.



This whole "mantle" was not even been explained more or less do we know what it really is.

Like i said majority hell all of this comes from people making assumptions. The forerunners remember "inheriting the mantle" but they don't remember fighting the precursors? that doesn't add up, along with the fact the mantle is clearly flawed and bent since they didn't follow it when they de-evolved the humans. It is ludicrous to think that any philosophy can be properly maintained over eons let alone one from an alien race.

  • 07.20.2011 4:55 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
C'mon though, what is so noble about saving some of your own species, but killing off every other species in the galaxy? They didn't even bother to use the Shield World's or the Ark for the lesser races..


They did (correction) the librarian built the ark to save anything she could, the other forerunners didn't give a damn

[Edited on 07.20.2011 4:57 PM PDT]

  • 07.20.2011 4:56 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: grey101

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
C'mon though, what is so noble about saving some of your own species, but killing off every other species in the galaxy? They didn't even bother to use the Shield World's or the Ark for the lesser races..


They did (correction) the librarian built the ark to save anything she could, the other forerunners didn't give a damn

Well, I guess we have ONE saint. I thought she died on Earth though near Mt. Kilimanjaro.

  • 07.20.2011 4:58 PM PDT

To spartan 100 i did im sorry to have stepped over it. no offence was meant its just that with cortana knowing a pretty large chunk of there history then it seems odd she'd add idealization dont you think? and also if anyone would like my x bo live address please ask i still regularly play ODST halo 3 and reach off topic i know but almost everyone i know has moved on to BLOPS!

[Edited on 07.20.2011 5:01 PM PDT]

  • 07.20.2011 4:58 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: sameron
i did im sorry to have stepped over it. no offence was meant its just that with cortana knowing a pretty large chunk of there history then it seems odd she'd add idealization dont you think? and also if anyone would like my x bo live address please ask i still regularly play ODST halo 3 and reach off topic i know but almost everyone i know has moved on to BLOPS!

Not sure she knew their entire history, she even admits as much.

"I can only guess some of this, fill in the gaps."

  • 07.20.2011 5:00 PM PDT

true but why would she add any idealization to it and other then the covenant who else has idealised the forerunner and unless he's still alive how does the didact/born know others have idealised them?...drum roll!

  • 07.20.2011 5:04 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: sameron
true but why would she add any idealization to it and other then the covenant who else has idealised the forerunner and unless he's still alive how does the didact/born know others have idealised them?...drum roll!

Forerunners have been around for thousands upon thousands of years before the events of Crpytum. It could just be a diary he made toward the end of the war. Besides, I doubt he's alive seeing as he activated one of the Halo rings.

  • 07.20.2011 5:06 PM PDT

Oh hey there

Posted by: petarded2
It's a metaphor for the 07s' lack of identity. too old to be newfa­g, yet too new to be oldfa­g, we wander b.net in search of a home, forever trying to be something we are not.

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: grey101

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
C'mon though, what is so noble about saving some of your own species, but killing off every other species in the galaxy? They didn't even bother to use the Shield World's or the Ark for the lesser races..


They did (correction) the librarian built the ark to save anything she could, the other forerunners didn't give a damn

Well, I guess we have ONE saint. I thought she died on Earth though near Mt. Kilimanjaro.
Well Bear hasn't told the whole story yet. I'm sure by the end of the end of the series his story will line up pretty well with the Terminals. At least I hope so.

Posted by : Spartan 100
The forerunner story - the story of my people - has been told many times, with greater and greater idealization, until I scarecely recognized it.
Great quote from Cryptum that can help explain some inconsistencies.

[Edited on 07.20.2011 5:10 PM PDT]

  • 07.20.2011 5:09 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: sameron
true but why would she add any idealization to it and other then the covenant who else has idealised the forerunner and unless he's still alive how does the didact/born know others have idealised them?...drum roll!

Forerunners have been around for thousands upon thousands of years before the events of Crpytum. It could just be a diary he made toward the end of the war. Besides, I doubt he's alive seeing as he activated one of the Halo rings.


I am up for him doing another brevet mutation with a young forerunner. the reason i say this is because at the end of legends we see a forerunner put its armor away; that bugs me.


not to mention it would be emotionally powerful to have the didact appear in someway in the next trilogy.

  • 07.20.2011 5:09 PM PDT

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