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This topic has moved here: Poll [25 votes]: Do you think the Prisoner is the Gravemind?
  • Poll [25 votes]: Do you think the Prisoner is the Gravemind?
Subject: Do you think the Prisoner is the Gravemind?

If you ever get any weird PMs from me, just ignore it.

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  • 07.25.2011 3:42 AM PDT

DIE MORE LIVE LESS

I doubt it

  • 07.25.2011 4:41 AM PDT

Posted by: Commander GX
Bungie.Match.com: Our Johnson knows what the ladies like.

Several events coincide that suggest they are the same, but I doubt it.

  • 07.25.2011 4:48 AM PDT

I'm 23, I have a house, dog, girlfriend, job and I have no interest in any fanboyism so if you're thinking about sending me a childish PM, don't be surprised when I don't call back.

Seems like the Gravemind to me, the only truly contradictory fact is that the Didact remembers looking at a giant monster resembling an insect rather than the giant plant we see in Halo 2.

  • 07.25.2011 5:02 AM PDT

Don't -blam!- with Kerser!

Doesn't it say it is the last precursor, and last time i checked the Flood did not have 3 meter long barbed tails.

  • 07.25.2011 5:08 AM PDT

Don't -blam!- with Kerser!

So your saying it escaped and somehow got infected and was used as the Gravemind, or are you saying that it is the gravemind already when the Didact communicates with it?

  • 07.25.2011 5:26 AM PDT

I wake up to find myself
After all these years
And where all the time has gone
Still seems so unclear

Personally, I think the Precursors' concepts of mental strength may override the Flood. So, the Timeless One could control the Flood as a Gravemind.

I think they make the parallels fairly obvious, but the Didact refused to call him part of the Flood.

  • 07.25.2011 5:33 AM PDT

Posted by: Dustin 6047
... Cp. Keyes was going to be the mind for the Gravemind on Installation 04.


We've been through this before, dear. A Gravemind isn't one distinct mind, it's a compound mind made up of all of the Flood victims that's reqached critical mass and assumed a personality of its own with the information of the hosts.

Imagine Skynet or Mass Effect 2's Legion: not one part of either of those systems is the 'starting point' - a Gravemind is the sum of its parts.

  • 07.25.2011 6:07 AM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Ageless Durandal
Personally, I think the Precursors' concepts of mental strength may override the Flood. So, the Timeless One could control the Flood as a Gravemind.

I think they make the parallels fairly obvious, but the Didact refused to call him part of the Flood.



And to back you up.

Posted by: Fact
Medicant bias went AWOL for 43 years talking to a highly intelligent alien- He is missing for roughly 40-50 years in cryptum*

Said life-form seduced Bias- bias goes rouge in cryptum

Medicant bias attacks the forerunners under this intelligence- he attacks the capital in cryptum


This is where the asterisk comes in, it wasn't until halo evolutions that the gravemind himself said that an AI once supported him which is where we draw the initial connections between the prisoner being the gravemind.

So lets look at the gravemind and prisoner.

Gravemind is a "timeless chorus"- the prisoner is the timeless one

Gravemind "I have listened, through rock and metal and time. Now I shall talk, and you shall listen." - The humans had always asked the prisoner questions about the universe. The prisoner was also found buried under ground then had its caged reinforced and then had a timebolt placed on it.

Gravemind- "Time... has taught me patience! But basking in new freedom..."- the prisoner was trapped in time thus has learned to be patient, he is also free once more

Gravemind-Defeat is simply the addition of time to a sentence I never deserved... but you imposed." - The prisoner was sentenced (duh) and beating the flood now only adds time to this (waiting to come back) humans have imposed this by fighting instead of joining.

  • 07.25.2011 7:18 AM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Dustin 6047

Posted by: Weylander
Posted by: Dustin 6047
... Cp. Keyes was going to be the mind for the Gravemind on Installation 04.


We've been through this before, dear. A Gravemind isn't one distinct mind, it's a compound mind made up of all of the Flood victims that's reqached critical mass and assumed a personality of its own with the information of the hosts.

Imagine Skynet or Mass Effect 2's Legion: not one part of either of those systems is the 'starting point' - a Gravemind is the sum of its parts.


You don't know that for sure. It doesn't say anywhere that it does or doesn't need one. But if the Prisoner turned into the Gravemind then what you're saying is wrong.

And why did you call me 'dear'? It makes me think of my grandma being a Halo fan....ewwww....weird....


Lander is correct, the only thing with the prisoner is that would have been the template for the gravemind to form, hence the "proto" graveminds looking and acting completely differant

  • 07.25.2011 7:27 AM PDT

"Defiant Reclaimer, he who will shatter the land and break the sky apart..."

I think it has to be the Gravemind, if it was just a 'standard' Precursor I believe Bear would have applied more detail and background to it. The way its left so ambiguous suggests that it could well tie into more than just Primordium and the final installment.

  • 07.25.2011 8:18 AM PDT

Vengeance only leads to an ongoing cycle of hatred.

Yes.

  • 07.25.2011 8:52 AM PDT


Posted by: Dustin 6047

Posted by: Weylander
Posted by: Dustin 6047
... Cp. Keyes was going to be the mind for the Gravemind on Installation 04.


We've been through this before, dear. A Gravemind isn't one distinct mind, it's a compound mind made up of all of the Flood victims that's reqached critical mass and assumed a personality of its own with the information of the hosts.

Imagine Skynet or Mass Effect 2's Legion: not one part of either of those systems is the 'starting point' - a Gravemind is the sum of its parts.


You don't know that for sure. It doesn't say anywhere that it does or doesn't need one. But if the Prisoner turned into the Gravemind then what you're saying is wrong.

And why did you call me 'dear'? It makes me think of my grandma being a Halo fan....ewwww....weird....


Actually, yes it does. The Gravemind is constantly referred to as a Compoound Mind, or Compound Intelligence, meaning he is the collective consciousness of all things.

However, that doesn't mean he isn't the Prisoner. Being a Transsentient, he has cognitive capabilities we can't comprehend. There is sufficient evidence to suggest--even say with 95% certainty--he his the Prisoner. His consciousness is the Gravemind while hew absorbs the knowledge and abilities of those he infects.

  • 07.25.2011 9:33 AM PDT

Adepto In Meus Campester
Posted by: ParagonRenegade
You were totally and absolutely correct in every way, I don't know why we were arguing, you're so amazing I should never have doubted you.

Evidence points to yes.

I don't want to jump the shark, however, as I can see Bear pulling a twist on us regarding the whole thing.

  • 07.25.2011 9:54 AM PDT

We kill that which we do not understand...and then promptly tea-bag it.

I thought the exact same thing. Especially when I read this part in Cryptum, "Somewhere in the humans' awakened memory lay our last hope of defeating the flood, which was even now ravaging world after world, system after system-more hideous by far than it had been a thousand years before. More sophisticated, more devious. More vital. And soon to acquire a new Master (the Prisoner possibly), if we did not act quickly-if we did not locate the lost installation and the former captive"(p.341-342). That can either be interpreted as the Flood is creating a new Gravemind, or it is near to its last living creator (the Prisoner). I will not rule out the possibility that after the Prisoner escaped, it may have fused with the Flood and served as its commanding intelligence, a foundation for the Graveminds to come. Otherwise, the Prisoner IS the last known Precursor.

[Edited on 07.25.2011 10:45 AM PDT]

  • 07.25.2011 10:44 AM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein

With the information currently given, I don't think it would be dumb to hypothesize the captive being the gravemind.

  • 07.26.2011 12:22 AM PDT