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Subject: Halo Glasslands Information from Sparkcast

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Sniffy66
Uh... have you listened to the podcast? Cause you might of missed the fact he speaks fluent sangheili, just he talks in a eccentric sort of way.

No. Frankie says that he speaks it fluently but nonetheless like a "well spoken child". Traviss says that they actually regard him as an idiot child. (15:40)

Posted by: Sniffy66
Secondly, I made no reference to his social class. Obviously he is not part of it. He is short and has a child like curiosity. Travis described him touching random things, inspecting everything, ect. You know. Like a child. Harm him and the elites will say "Dick move." since they say harming him is like beating up a child." Doesn't know any better and likely didn't mean to do anything wrong.

I did not say that you made reference to social class. Traviss said that, at 15:43. She says that he is so weak and below them in status that harming him would be considered cowardly. They also consider it surprising that a Human can speak at all, never mind like an idiot and think that he should be "culled for his own good".

Yes, nice and respectful here.

Posted by: Sniffy66
Also he's a huge hit on Sangheilios. As far as we know he's chill with the Sangheili.

So are pet dogs here on Earth.

Posted by: privet caboose
It sounds to me like you expect every single Elite to act the same. There are jackasses in Humanity, there are sure to be plenty in every species. Just because a couple of Elites are being dicks doesn't mean their entire race is.

I don't. I expect them to act differently, but for some reason they all seem to be despicably prideful and harbour irrational hatred for Humans. There are only 3 Elites ever mentioned who show regard for Humanity as sapient beings. The rest take pleasure in implicitly slandering and exterminating them.

And then this book does it, except that it is not one Elite, it is his entire society. For him to kill this man would be cowardly because he is so far below them in terms of social class and stature. Obviously his society has to hold this view in order for him to be seen as such.

I guess people should not really have put to much stock in Conversations from the Universe, myself included. It is only, what, 2 Elites having discussion? Nor N'tho 'Sroam's character profile.

Posted by: privet caboose
Not to start anything, but from what I've read it's like you expect every Elite to have the same views of honor and be some kind of saint.

That is quite ironic, because every Elite actually does hold the exact same views. They all appear to despise Humanity now, particularly in 343i's work, and their concept of honour is pretty universal in their culture.

[Edited on 07.29.2011 10:20 AM PDT]

  • 07.29.2011 10:19 AM PDT

Yeah, there was the two elites in the discussions of the universe bit, then Thel(Halo 3) and his Zealot friend in Cole Protocol.

I agree Anton... potraying ONI as evil and manipulative and all Elites don't give a -blam!- about humans(And even hate them to the core) is very odd and (IMO)stupid.

It goes smack against the previous and MAJOR canon statement about their society respecting those that impress, and can even beat them in combat.

  • 07.29.2011 11:11 AM PDT


Posted by: hotshot revan II

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: DonVinzone1
Sounds like this book is full of unlikable characters.

And Mendez suddenly hating Halsey? What? Why? Sure, both Halsey and he always had doubts about the program they were working on...but hate?

I dont know, this information doesn't make me jump around screaming and yelling how awesome this is going to be.
I'm looking out for Primordium...this one, well....maybe I'll give it benefit of doubt but its definatly not a day 1 buy for me.


Mendez always respected Halsey, yeah, the same way people respect Hitler for the political and military accomplishments he achieved. Doesn't mean we have to like him.

Time spent in the Dyson Sphere--basically seclusion--will inevitably lead to characters mulling things over with nothing else to do. This can stir up some deeply burried resentments and feelings that on a normal day never appear to exist.

But in short order, hotshot has it right: "Its called character devolopment."


This

@Don vin
If you actually look at ourselves in real life,then you see the same things happening in our own personal lifes .


I understand how it is the same in real life for minor conflicts and making big things out of nothing.

But what I don't understand, and think is highly unlikely, is how Mendez has no reason to hate Halsey. Irritations because they are all locked up in the DS: sure. I get that, and that is logical.
But why whould he hate the woman who he willingly helped for years? Because he was later on involved in S3 and saw things could be different (I wouldn't say better!)?
What could possibly trigger a sudden hate towards her? He (Mendez) already knows exactly what the Spartans went through. He knows what wrongs had been done. And he was totally fine with that before.

It seems to forced to me. Too much: "oh we need some internal struggle and we need to do something with the party inside the DS too"

If the rest of the book seemed to be really great I wouldn't really make a point out of this. But Traviss seems to make a sport out of making this book filled with characters that are immensely unlikable just for the sake of getting drama throughout. Every character thats new, for some reason has something against the established crew. And even within that crew everybody is all of the sudden not on speaking terms with each other.
Struggles: fine, but a book full of a-holes: no please!

And I'm afraid this is one of those inevitable things you get when a series is pushed beyond the conclusion it worked towards. The same stuff happened to Star Wars. Basically all the post-Empire stuff is boring and unneccecary. Which is also why I fear for Halo 4 a bit.

  • 07.29.2011 12:19 PM PDT

Don, my thoughts exactly about Mendez. He never seemed the guy to hold a grudge, and to me, would outright state his viewpoints. He if didn't like something, he said so.

So... if he truly disliked Halsey, wouldn't he had frankly and utterly said so to her face a LONG time ago?

  • 07.29.2011 12:28 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Don, my thoughts exactly about Mendez. He never seemed the guy to hold a grudge, and to me, would outright state his viewpoints. He if didn't like something, he said so.

So... if he truly disliked Halsey, wouldn't he had frankly and utterly said so to her face a LONG time ago?


he wouldn't have agreed or been so eager to train more spartans if this was the case.

Damn, i have never bickered about a halo book before it came out..

  • 07.29.2011 12:49 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Yeah, there was the two elites in the discussions of the universe bit, then Thel(Halo 3) and his Zealot friend in Cole Protocol.

This too. Scroll down to you get to N'tho 'Sroam's part.

Although perhaps we have been blowing it out of proportion. If we count them up we have 4 (Maybe 5, We do not know Thel's internal thoughts during the trilogy) who have shown respect towards Humanity. Is that enough Elites to judge that they do actually respect Humans? Certainly, most Elites we have encountered have shown hatred and disdain for Humanity. (Ripa 'Moramee, Isna 'Nosolee, Jora 'Konaree, Xytan, Orna 'Fulsamee. There are many.) However they were all particularly Zealous, and many of them were the rank of Zealot themselves, which should make it obvious why they would think that way. And I don't think that they would bother showing us examples of Elites questioning authority about Humanity if it didn't -blam!- mean anything, eh? Especially something as vague as Conversations from the Universe. And as you said DeaFaron, they are said to value rectitude and fortitude over martial prowess and strength, which is all that matters in any code of honour anyway.

It doesn't matter though, and this is the important part: Either way, this novel has shown that nothing has changed, things have gotten worse arguably (Because here is now no dogma to justify these beliefs anymore yet they remain, apparently for a race that is supposed to be intelligent enough to figure things out for themselves.) I have literally lost complete and utter interest in post Halo 3 now. It is essentially the same old, same old. I would not be surprised if the Sangheili find out about ONI meddling in their affairs and start fighting Humanity again. I'm calling it now.

  • 07.29.2011 12:59 PM PDT
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"Time was your ally human. But now it has abandoned you. The Forerunners....have returned. And this tomb... is now yours". - The Didact


Posted by: DonVinzone1

Posted by: hotshot revan II

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: DonVinzone1
Sounds like this book is full of unlikable characters.

And Mendez suddenly hating Halsey? What? Why? Sure, both Halsey and he always had doubts about the program they were working on...but hate?

I dont know, this information doesn't make me jump around screaming and yelling how awesome this is going to be.
I'm looking out for Primordium...this one, well....maybe I'll give it benefit of doubt but its definatly not a day 1 buy for me.


Mendez always respected Halsey, yeah, the same way people respect Hitler for the political and military accomplishments he achieved. Doesn't mean we have to like him.

Time spent in the Dyson Sphere--basically seclusion--will inevitably lead to characters mulling things over with nothing else to do. This can stir up some deeply burried resentments and feelings that on a normal day never appear to exist.

But in short order, hotshot has it right: "Its called character devolopment."


This

@Don vin
If you actually look at ourselves in real life,then you see the same things happening in our own personal lifes .


I understand how it is the same in real life for minor conflicts and making big things out of nothing.

But what I don't understand, and think is highly unlikely, is how Mendez has no reason to hate Halsey. Irritations because they are all locked up in the DS: sure. I get that, and that is logical.
But why whould he hate the woman who he willingly helped for years? Because he was later on involved in S3 and saw things could be different (I wouldn't say better!)?
What could possibly trigger a sudden hate towards her? He (Mendez) already knows exactly what the Spartans went through. He knows what wrongs had been done. And he was totally fine with that before.

It seems to forced to me. Too much: "oh we need some internal struggle and we need to do something with the party inside the DS too"

If the rest of the book seemed to be really great I wouldn't really make a point out of this. But Traviss seems to make a sport out of making this book filled with characters that are immensely unlikable just for the sake of getting drama throughout. Every character thats new, for some reason has something against the established crew. And even within that crew everybody is all of the sudden not on speaking terms with each other.
Struggles: fine, but a book full of a-holes: no please!

And I'm afraid this is one of those inevitable things you get when a series is pushed beyond the conclusion it worked towards. The same stuff happened to Star Wars. Basically all the post-Empire stuff is boring and unneccecary. Which is also why I fear for Halo 4 a bit.


No idea,which is why we should wait for the book itself so we can go into Mendez head to see his problems with Halsey.It's probably about that Spartan issue.

Maybe in the sphere he will have time to think about his life and think different about what he has done.Maybe he will start to regret those things,look at Keyes he wasn't happy with the program neither as he said in the Flood or Halsey admits herself that she is a monster but throws.It has already been hinted in ghosts of onyx and i'm sure this will escalate more,which is possible .

I understand that Parangosky hates Halsey,she seemed to hhave something about her in ghosts of onyx.No doubt that some washouts will be angry too as Halsey didn't even gave them the choice and sends them into a horrible life.If i were a washout,i would be furious too,my life is ruined...Soren felt about this too,it's not unlikely that those characters start to hate Halsey.

I'm actually excited for Chief's storyline because it's more similar to the Forerunner trilogy .

I don't understand why people got so mad about this.

Some of you cry like those who judge a game before they played it.

Chill out and wait before making conlusions and stop thinking as one dimensional persons.

  • 07.29.2011 1:54 PM PDT

Am I supposed to write something funny here?


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Yeah, there was the two elites in the discussions of the universe bit, then Thel(Halo 3) and his Zealot friend in Cole Protocol.

This too. Scroll down to you get to N'tho 'Sroam's part.

Although perhaps we have been blowing it out of proportion. If we count them up we have 4 (Maybe 5, We do not know Thel's internal thoughts during the trilogy) who have shown respect towards Humanity.
The page also has this:...is one of a growing number of human sympathizers amongst the Sangheili youth.So I'd say more than 4. But how much power (lots of) minors have?

  • 07.29.2011 1:56 PM PDT


Posted by: Gamer Whale

Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Yeah, there was the two elites in the discussions of the universe bit, then Thel(Halo 3) and his Zealot friend in Cole Protocol.

This too. Scroll down to you get to N'tho 'Sroam's part.

Although perhaps we have been blowing it out of proportion. If we count them up we have 4 (Maybe 5, We do not know Thel's internal thoughts during the trilogy) who have shown respect towards Humanity.
The page also has this:...is one of a growing number of human sympathizers amongst the Sangheili youth.So I'd say more than 4. But how much power (lots of) minors have?


I'd say a chunk. They are the next wave of leaders, and seeing how during the civil war MANY of the Elite big leaders got taken out...

  • 07.29.2011 2:33 PM PDT


Posted by: hotshot revan II

Posted by: DonVinzone1


Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: DonVinzone1
Sounds like this book is full of unlikable characters.

And Mendez suddenly hating Halsey? What? Why? Sure, both Halsey and he always had doubts about the program they were working on...but hate?

I dont know, this information doesn't make me jump around screaming and yelling how awesome this is going to be.
I'm looking out for Primordium...this one, well....maybe I'll give it benefit of doubt but its definatly not a day 1 buy for me.[/quote]

Mendez always respected Halsey, yeah, the same way people respect Hitler for the political and military accomplishments he achieved. Doesn't mean we have to like him.

Time spent in the Dyson Sphere--basically seclusion--will inevitably lead to characters mulling things over with nothing else to do. This can stir up some deeply burried resentments and feelings that on a normal day never appear to exist.

But in short order, hotshot has it right: "Its called character devolopment."


This

@Don vin
If you actually look at ourselves in real life,then you see the same things happening in our own personal lifes .


I understand how it is the same in real life for minor conflicts and making big things out of nothing.

But what I don't understand, and think is highly unlikely, is how Mendez has no reason to hate Halsey. Irritations because they are all locked up in the DS: sure. I get that, and that is logical.
But why whould he hate the woman who he willingly helped for years? Because he was later on involved in S3 and saw things could be different (I wouldn't say better!)?
What could possibly trigger a sudden hate towards her? He (Mendez) already knows exactly what the Spartans went through. He knows what wrongs had been done. And he was totally fine with that before.

It seems to forced to me. Too much: "oh we need some internal struggle and we need to do something with the party inside the DS too"

If the rest of the book seemed to be really great I wouldn't really make a point out of this. But Traviss seems to make a sport out of making this book filled with characters that are immensely unlikable just for the sake of getting drama throughout. Every character thats new, for some reason has something against the established crew. And even within that crew everybody is all of the sudden not on speaking terms with each other.
Struggles: fine, but a book full of a-holes: no please!

And I'm afraid this is one of those inevitable things you get when a series is pushed beyond the conclusion it worked towards. The same stuff happened to Star Wars. Basically all the post-Empire stuff is boring and unneccecary. Which is also why I fear for Halo 4 a bit.


No idea,which is why we should wait for the book itself so we can go into Mendez head to see his problems with Halsey.It's probably about that Spartan issue.

Maybe in the sphere he will have time to think about his life and think different about what he has done.Maybe he will start to regret those things,look at Keyes he wasn't happy with the program neither as he said in the Flood or Halsey admits herself that she is a monster but throws.It has already been hinted in ghosts of onyx and i'm sure this will escalate more,which is possible .

I understand that Parangosky hates Halsey,she seemed to hhave something about her in ghosts of onyx.No doubt that some washouts will be angry too as Halsey didn't even gave them the choice and sends them into a horrible life.If i were a washout,i would be furious too,my life is ruined...Soren felt about this too,it's not unlikely that those characters start to hate Halsey.

I'm actually excited for Chief's storyline because it's more similar to the Forerunner trilogy .

I don't understand why people got so mad about this.

Some of you cry like those who judge a game before they played it.

Chill out and wait before making conlusions and stop thinking as one dimensional persons.



I'd also like to know which book they read that details Mendez's thoughts to where he explicitly says even in his own mind "Halsey is awesome and I have no problem with what we're doing!"

  • 07.29.2011 2:50 PM PDT


Posted by: ROBERTO jh
I'd also like to know which book they read that details Mendez's thoughts to where he explicitly says even in his own mind "Halsey is awesome and I have no problem with what we're doing!"

I'd like to know when we said that.

And where it even HINTS at his displeasure at working alongside Halsey.

  • 07.29.2011 2:53 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: ROBERTO jh
I'd also like to know which book they read that details Mendez's thoughts to where he explicitly says even in his own mind "Halsey is awesome and I have no problem with what we're doing!"

I'd like to know when we said that.

And where it even HINTS at his displeasure at working alongside Halsey.


it never even hinted at it, they always got along

  • 07.29.2011 2:54 PM PDT


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: ROBERTO jh
I'd also like to know which book they read that details Mendez's thoughts to where he explicitly says even in his own mind "Halsey is awesome and I have no problem with what we're doing!"

I'd like to know when we said that.

And where it even HINTS at his displeasure at working alongside Halsey.


Implied. You've all been saying that Mendez showed no outward hatred of Halsey. Pardon me for saying, but no -blam!-! Of course he's not going to be outwardly loathing of the most dangerous human being in the universe. That'd be tantamount to suicide.

And its not like they were always in the same room with each other. Mendez did not work all too closely with Halsey. He was either training Black Ops SIIIs at Curahee or on Reach training the SIIs. For almost his entire time in the war he was either too busy to be bothered, getting shot at half-way across the galaxy, or erased from the records.

Any contact they did have was purely on a proffesional basis and we've never had a Point Of View chapter that detailed what Mendez's real thoughts were.

Anyone could want to kick their boss in the teeth, but if they want to keep their jobs--and in this case their lives--they're going to STFU or GTFO.

Especially a hardened career soldier who was conditioned to follow orders.

--------------

And for those saying "unnecessary drama" I can garuntee you, "drama" is not the correct word. Character analysiss is the proper term. In the Gears of War books, nobody is any less badass or any more badass in actions then they are in the game. Traviss simply gets into what makes the characters tick and plays off of that, creating truly remarkable character driven stories. Her writing is what character driven stories are about, they are not Soap Operas (I hate soap operas, so take it from me).

--------

And those citing her golden rule that she cannot be a fan of what she's writing, you misinterpreted it. She can have no prior affiliation with a franchise.

If Traviss was a fan of Star Wars from the beginning, straight out the gate at 1977, she would never have written the Republic Commando books because her personal experiences with how she sees Star Wars would taint the story. This does NOT mean she doesn't research the universe.

Her rule allows for a logical mind to psychologically devolop the characters how real humans with those personalities would devolop without any outside influences.

[Edited on 07.29.2011 3:13 PM PDT]

  • 07.29.2011 3:11 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: ROBERTO jh
I'd also like to know which book they read that details Mendez's thoughts to where he explicitly says even in his own mind "Halsey is awesome and I have no problem with what we're doing!"

I'd like to know when we said that.

And where it even HINTS at his displeasure at working alongside Halsey.


it never even hinted at it, they always got along
Which is why I think we should wait until we are able to read the book before being upset. I know that without speculation this forum is pointless, but I think that we should wait until the book comes out so we can get into Mendez's head a little bit and see his thoughts. Maybe everything will be detailed in a way that it all adds up. She cannot possibly dive into everything in the book, she was merely scratching the surface.

If when the book comes out Mendez's hate for Halsey seems to pop out of nowhere and the respect among Sangheili for humans disappears then I will agree with you guys that it is kind of dumb. However, there is no way we are receiving the proper information and contexts from the Sparkcast.

  • 07.29.2011 3:13 PM PDT

Hehehehehe...

LOL ROBERTO...


You come across that somebody not liking Halsey and saying it to her face = DEATH.

Guess -blam!- what? A chunk of ONI didn't like Halsey AT ALL. some of the openly.

You are heavily implying anybody who disliked Halsey openly died. This is incredibly false and where the hell do you get that idea?

  • 07.29.2011 3:22 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Hehehehehe...

LOL ROBERTO...


You come across that somebody not liking Halsey and saying it to her face = DEATH.

Guess -blam!- what? A chunk of ONI didn't like Halsey AT ALL. some of the openly.

You are heavily implying anybody who disliked Halsey openly died. This is incredibly false and where the hell do you get that idea?


yea that was a bad post rob, most of here journal is about how ONI was talking trash and trying to get around her.

Today is an off day for you or something?...

  • 07.29.2011 3:24 PM PDT


Posted by: me123456789
I never read any of the Halo books but if there going to start writing more about the Elites I may have to. I find the Sangheili fascinating for some reason.


I think we all know why.

*

Seems good. I'm looking forward to it.

  • 07.29.2011 3:31 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.

Wild Mass Guessing: ONI is keeping the Elites fractured so that they have to rely on humans. They keep this behind the scenes (obviously) and pin the damage they cause on the Brutes. The Elites asks us for help, not knowing we caused the problem, we help them and they help us in return. This way we keep the Elites focused on the Brutes, not us, and their reliance on us to help them makes them turning on us an unwise decision.

Opinion: While I like learning why the characters do the things they do, what makes them tick, I don't want that to be the primary focus. I don't want to see inside the machine, I want to see what controls it and what it can do. I don't want to be reading a psychiatrist's report in story form.

  • 07.29.2011 6:03 PM PDT
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I love the Halo Books . They're always very descriptive and gives a lot of details about the Halo Universe.

  • 07.30.2011 4:18 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

I actually agree with Rob.

I was the same way with Reach. You guys are already screaming blasphemy before you even read the book. If things ARE screwed up, complain after you've read the material and can understand everything.

So everyone should just chill until we have the books in our hands and can analyze the material.

  • 07.30.2011 5:29 PM PDT

Right now I'm not damning the book, I'm simply looking at what information is given and thinking off that.

With halo 4, it's lack of information.

With Glasslands, the little information doesn't sound good.

  • 07.30.2011 5:34 PM PDT

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