Bungie Universe
This topic has moved here: Subject: I really enjoyed the ViDoc, but the last part made me certain...
  • Subject: I really enjoyed the ViDoc, but the last part made me certain...
Subject: I really enjoyed the ViDoc, but the last part made me certain...

"I'm afraid of the man I'll become if I lay my life down for the people I don't even care for"

I agree :)

And Halo 2 was the best Halo for me. Funny how they thought it a failure

  • 08.05.2011 1:52 PM PDT

"On the seventh day, god did not rest, but rather he created 64 player multiplayer!"

Agree with the OP completely. There is a part somewhere just passed the halfway point of the ViDoc I think, where Shiek Wang says how with Reach, it could be a stand-alone game, it didn't have to match up with the other games like Halo 1, 2 and 3 did. That sort of indicated to me where part of the canon problems happened...treating Reach as a stand-alone game that wasn't bound by any already established content...wrong move.

  • 08.05.2011 1:54 PM PDT

Posted by: ev1l tr1t0n
Halo 2 (which could hardly be called a failure).

If it got delayed once or twice, and if it had many things cut, it probably counted as a failure to them. It's obviously only a failure to them if it doesn't come up to their own expectations, which is probably a good mentality in the long run.

  • 08.05.2011 1:57 PM PDT
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The End

‘The conscious is cancerous if allowed to linger’

"Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there."

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Halo 3 should have been the final Halo. MC's storyline was finished and locked in. One last offshoot with ODST, then cool.

But Reach really shouldnt exist. It doesnt fit. Bungie really wouldnt have made it in a perfect world. Just contractually obligated to make another triple A Halo title. So since they had too make it. They decided to make it new and itch those creative spots that have been begging to let loose. So it doesnt fit with the other Halo's because its the one that shouldnt be there.

Also Halo 4 has already ruined Halo for me just by the mere fact that it exists. Halo 3 finished it. I understand MS is a company that needs to make money, but its exploitation to stretch this franchise farther. There is just NO WHERE to go with Halo.
Good post.

Halo 3, while not entirely devoid of flaws, seems like the perfect ending point for the franchise. Bungie had concluded their story arc (if we ignore Halo 3's legendary ending, which left things open for microsoft to continue) and they had set about streamlining all of Halo's gameplay elements through their experience with Halo 2 (a game they were right to criticise).

E3 2008 was a disappointing year for me as a fan. Bungie, seemingly freed from the shackles of Microsoft, announced not one but two new Halo titles. The Vidoc provides some insight as to why this was the case, through explaining Microsoft had been promised two more Halo games [by Harold Ryan]. I can only speculate that there was an undisclosed agreement between Microsoft and Bungie, which was necessary to secure their separation in 2007.

Lacking in optimism and cynical as I am, it was difficult to get excited about either of Bungie's new titles. It seemed like a moment of regression; the ending words of CE lived on nearly a decade later "Halo... it's finished" "No, we're just getting started". I suppose my disappointment was intermingled with sympathy. Halo had been done, and it had been done well. Yet Bungie was set to endure further development hell in a universe where they had already pushed their creative flexibility.

That said, I ended up pleasantly surprised with ODST and Reach. Both games brought something new to what was already a very well defined franchise. As j7holdfastjack7 aptly put it, here was a company trying to "itch those creative spots", rather than one happy to sit on former success by reproducing near identical products year after year.

So yes, it is very very good that Bungie are no longer developing Halo games. However in saying this I do not question Bungie's competence as a developer (they're always learning and developing), instead I say it as a fan that wants to see a Bungie unhampered by the baggage of a fleshed out universe and finally free to express its full creative might with something completely new.

[Edited on 08.08.2011 3:29 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 2:16 PM PDT

I wouldn't mind them blowing canon to the wind with Reach If they actually improved on it.

But they didn't.

Also: If I could go back in time, I'd give bungie 2 more years for Halo 2. I feel so much would be different/better, than halo 3 and later games would be that much better and perhaps different as a result. I feel a lot of ideas bungie had story wise are missing...I want to see those ideas.

[Edited on 08.05.2011 2:27 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 2:24 PM PDT

Silver

I wouldn't call Reach a failure. There is an average of 100-150K players per day. If it was a failure then there would be severely less players than that,sure it didn't have as much as Halo 3 and Halo 2 did,but at least 100K+ is still in there. It proves that Reach is popular as the other Halo titles. I mean,sure it breaks canon. But it allowed them to use there 'Creative itch' to develop and flesh out the universe a little more.

I'm also glad to see Bungie leave their baby behind. The franchise would only have left them in hate towards their own game if they had to make more Halo titles. I am looking forward to the Destiny universe Bungie have planned for the forthcoming time.

Whether you think I deserve a troll for this,honest post on what I think of Bungie on Reach

[Edited on 08.05.2011 2:37 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 2:31 PM PDT

Halo Reach is a bad game
1. Multiplayer took skill away from high ranks.
2. Campaign was ok but the characters were way to shallow.
3. It's graphics didnt feel like a halo I grew up on halo 2 (still the best with halo ce as runner up) the graphics just didnt feel right on reach i liked Halo ce, halo 2, halo 3, and halo 3 ODST graphics a lot more.
4. The only reason why i like it is because the company that brought me into gaming made it.
Halo 4 is going to be a -Blam-ing joke.

  • 08.05.2011 2:42 PM PDT

Always up for a good time.


Posted by: ev1l tr1t0n
...that it's a really good thing Bungie is no longer developing Halo games. Don't get me wrong, I love Bungie, I can't wait for their next game and on paper Reach is the ultimate Halo game. In practice, however, it is not.

I'm not going to delve into it since countless people have already beat the problems to death in the Reach and Optimatch forums, but these issues with several of the core elements of the game kept it from being the ultimate Halo game it was on paper. And... in the ViDoc, it seemed like Bungie completely ignored that. All they did was repeatedly praise Reach like it was a last sales pitch. No admission of failure, which seems odd considering the admission of failure with Halo 2 (which could hardly be called a failure).

It bothers me that Bungie is so blind to Reach's faults, so that's why I'm happy Bungie is no longer working on Halo. A fresh set of developers is exactly what Halo needed. Thank you, Bungie, for creating such an amazing universe that I have invested thousands of hours into, both in game and out and thank you for handing it off to a team of Halo fans.

They are not blind to its flaws, if you remember in previous statements that not everyone in their own company was completely sold on every aspect and change that was made. The video was not to address the problems in the game but to look back and since that was their latest game they probably did not want to bash it to death and remember only its flaws.

Their message was that it was their last Halo game. They needed to feel some sort of completion and in my opinion they did that. I played the game thinking that this was what Halo is suppose to feel like. It left me feel a sense of fulfillment after I was done playing it.

  • 08.05.2011 2:46 PM PDT

Unkown forger. Fear my laser face.
Hit me up

It was just another way to promote the selling of reach.
people do still buy it

  • 08.05.2011 2:48 PM PDT

Silver


Posted by: I POWN U 666
Halo Reach is a bad game
1. Multiplayer took skill away from high ranks.
2. Campaign was ok but the characters were way to shallow.
3. It's graphics didnt feel like a halo I grew up on halo 2 (still the best with halo ce as runner up) the graphics just didnt feel right on reach i liked Halo ce, halo 2, halo 3, and halo 3 ODST graphics a lot more.
4. The only reason why i like it is because the company that brought me into gaming made it.
Halo 4 is going to be a -Blam-ing joke.


1.Bungie's Trueskill development stopped several methods of unfair gameplay;i.e Deranking. You also got paired up with smilarly skilled players,and unless you were having a brutally suckish day online,you usually end up with similar results at endgame.

2. Characters were too shallow? They weren't exactly meant to be happy-loving hippies. This was Reach,the key military planet of the UNSC's armada. Their characters were designed to be human,vunerable people. Not invincible super-soldiers like the MC. Sure,we didn't get much personalisation to like them,but it showed us that Spartan's aren't invincible. The only one who seemed Human to me was Jorge,the SII.

3. Graphics didn't feel like a Halo? The Bungie team could have easily used the Halo 3 engine and do nothing. But as I said before,this was Reach,a dark time for Humans in the Halo universe. The only way to show the loss and the beauty of Reach was the overhaul of the graphics,making things much darker and grittier than before,but still keeping it perfectly beautiful.

4. Just because the company made it,doesn't mean you have to buy it. Hell,I like Bioware for Dragon Age.But that doesn't mean I'm going to buy Mass Effect. You didn't have to buy Reach if you didn't want to.

The mantle of Halo has been left in very good hands. I can trust Frank O'Connor and the rest of 343i to make a brilliant trilogy for MC in Halo.


[Edited on 08.05.2011 2:54 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 2:53 PM PDT

O hai

Anybody else think Reach was a form of testing ground for Bungie's next game?

  • 08.05.2011 2:55 PM PDT

"It will not be we who reach Alpha Centauri, and the other nearby stars, it will be a species very like us, but with more of our strengths and fewer of our weaknesses, more confident, far-seeing, capable, and prudent. For all our failings, despite our limitations and fallibilities, we humans are capable of greatness."-Carl Sagan


Posted by: OniLink147

Posted by: About 9 Grunts
I like the quote where they said we've learned from Halo Reach and Halo 3 ODST. It gives me hope that their future games won't end up like that. But I agree OP, it did seem a little too sales pitchy to me.

ODST easily has the best Halo campaign. -_- Why would you not want more of that?


Halo 2 and ODST are very close when it comes to the quality of campaign.

ODST kicked all kinds of ass.

  • 08.05.2011 3:02 PM PDT


Posted by: Silver Sol Los
I wouldn't call Reach a failure. There is an average of 100-150K players per day. If it was a failure then there would be severely less players than that,sure it didn't have as much as Halo 3 and Halo 2 did,but at least 100K+ is still in there. It proves that Reach is popular as the other Halo titles. I mean,sure it breaks canon. But it allowed them to use there 'Creative itch' to develop and flesh out the universe a little more.

I'm also glad to see Bungie leave their baby behind. The franchise would only have left them in hate towards their own game if they had to make more Halo titles. I am looking forward to the Destiny universe Bungie have planned for the forthcoming time.

Whether you think I deserve a troll for this,honest post on what I think of Bungie on Reach


Um, the online counter here actually places today's 24 pop at 700,024 players, not 100k.

  • 08.05.2011 3:03 PM PDT

Silver


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Silver Sol Los
I wouldn't call Reach a failure. There is an average of 100-150K players per day. If it was a failure then there would be severely less players than that,sure it didn't have as much as Halo 3 and Halo 2 did,but at least 100K+ is still in there. It proves that Reach is popular as the other Halo titles. I mean,sure it breaks canon. But it allowed them to use there 'Creative itch' to develop and flesh out the universe a little more.

I'm also glad to see Bungie leave their baby behind. The franchise would only have left them in hate towards their own game if they had to make more Halo titles. I am looking forward to the Destiny universe Bungie have planned for the forthcoming time.

Whether you think I deserve a troll for this,honest post on what I think of Bungie on Reach


Um, the online counter here actually places today's 24 pop at 700,024 players, not 100k.


The Bungie counters aren't exactly the most accurate. That just shows who have signed into Reach over the past 24 hours. that could be just multiple people signing off and signing on in the same day X amount of times.

[Edited on 08.05.2011 3:07 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 3:06 PM PDT

I miss Halo. Maybe Halo 4 will change that.

Edit: Lol nope


Posted by: Silver Sol Los
The Bungie counters aren't exactly the most accurate. That just shows who have signed into Reach over the past 24 hours. that could be just multiple people signing off and signing on in the same day X amount of times.


Implying all counters that monitor the amount of players going on and off games don't do that.

  • 08.05.2011 3:25 PM PDT

Online ID: GriffGraff15


Posted by: Silver Sol Los

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Silver Sol Los
I wouldn't call Reach a failure. There is an average of 100-150K players per day. If it was a failure then there would be severely less players than that,sure it didn't have as much as Halo 3 and Halo 2 did,but at least 100K+ is still in there. It proves that Reach is popular as the other Halo titles. I mean,sure it breaks canon. But it allowed them to use there 'Creative itch' to develop and flesh out the universe a little more.

I'm also glad to see Bungie leave their baby behind. The franchise would only have left them in hate towards their own game if they had to make more Halo titles. I am looking forward to the Destiny universe Bungie have planned for the forthcoming time.

Whether you think I deserve a troll for this,honest post on what I think of Bungie on Reach


Um, the online counter here actually places today's 24 pop at 700,024 players, not 100k.


The Bungie counters aren't exactly the most accurate. That just shows who have signed into Reach over the past 24 hours. that could be just multiple people signing off and signing on in the same day X amount of times.

The Reach counter only counts the players who are actually in a matchmkaing game, not the lobbies or searching for a game or playing custom games/firefight.

The Halo 3 one counted how many players had played at least one game of anytime in 24 hours.

[Edited on 08.05.2011 3:25 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 3:25 PM PDT

The ingame reach counter does. The site one counts those in menu, in games(not matchmaking).

  • 08.05.2011 3:30 PM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins

it may have been a failure to you, but in the eyes of bungie it was their greatest triumph. They make the games that they want to play, and that is what they did.

  • 08.05.2011 3:48 PM PDT

Daniel P. Sacui, Owner MMGTV.org

I never post on these forums unless it's a good thread with people reflecting as a whole and as a community that was fostered by Bungie. This ViDoc wasn't for us. It wasn't to tease, it was to reflect. Everything in it are personal reflections that took a company and turned it into a family. In my eyes, Bungie was completely honest and nailed every note.

Most of what I read in this thread is constructive and respectable. People being honest about how they feel about the series as a whole, and individually. Reach? Yeah. It's BLAM-ing BLAM HALO GAME BLAM!, but in many of our eyes, including mine, is not. Halo 2 will forever be theeeeee Halo game.

But our opinions don't matter because this was Bungie's game. Everything they've wanted to do, but couldn't was put into here, and all the depression and distraught throughout their adventure was put into Reach. This is their baby, and I think we can all respect how they feel on the series.

  • 08.05.2011 3:53 PM PDT

nvm

[Edited on 08.05.2011 4:00 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2011 3:59 PM PDT

Quod Erat Demonstrandum.

If you're interested in Halo's music, check this out.

Posted by: x Foman123 x
Speaking of chuckles, let's all lol at IonicPaul, who makes friends with bugs to make up for his lack of human contact.

Posted by: xXSACUIXx

Hey look: Someone who doesn't personally like Reach but who can respect it and Bungie as a whole.

  • 08.05.2011 4:07 PM PDT
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The fact is, most of the complainers are genuinely just part of the "vocal minority". Just because you whine audibly about reach that dosn't mean that your opinion is fact, or ever will be. For every person who is on this forum complaining, there will be plenty more enjoying the game for what it is.

  • 08.05.2011 4:10 PM PDT

You were not there from Day 1

  • 08.05.2011 4:23 PM PDT

Posted by: Captianize
I Like Whale Genitals.

I think Halo3 is the best, Reach is the 2nd.
Why is halo3 better? I just think it is, it just gives me that sort of "feeling".
Reach is AMAZING!
The only bad things about it, is it's population, and the stubbornness of the people to get used to some new features.
Sure, armor abilities are a bit "strange" and AA can just make you get that "anger", but it's something you have to get used to.
Once used to it, you won't even notice it anymore.

tl;dr?
I think Reach is an awesome game, but Halo 3 still is the king for me.

  • 08.05.2011 5:06 PM PDT
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Posted by: MrBojangles136
I like dick


Posted by: TAHK0

Posted by: longhorn10

You seem to be mistaking how Bungie percieves failure. H2 was a failure because of the disaster of its development process, the toll it took on the team, and the growing pains it forced. The game fell short of where the wanted it to be and hoped it would be. Halo: Reach's success was in the process and their delivery of a product they were satisfied with. As they said, they make games they like to play.


I completely agree with this, Sir! I send high fives in your general direction.


I'm glad Halo's future isn't in your or anyone else sharing this view hand's.

  • 08.05.2011 5:12 PM PDT