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  • Subject: Bungie.net & Zen Buddhism
Subject: Bungie.net & Zen Buddhism

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~

(Insanely long read, please bear with me)

Have you guys noticed what I have about the Community lately?

It has acquired an almost Zen-like peacefulness.

Since 343i took over everything Halo, most of the biggest whiners who cried bitter tears of rage and abject hatred because "insert Halo game here" didn't live up to their personal expectations, have left/are leaving.

They are migrating over to 343i's forums. The real fans of Bungie, the core of this Community, is going back to it's quasi-normal state of cynical, sarcastic realism.

lol

I still will always believe that this community is/will be the true Halo fans. All of the little kids who have no idea of what Halo is, the journey it has taken, are evacuating over to 343i's forums. That just leaves more room in the Forums for the people who have always been here, who will always be here, true and loyal fans of one of the greatest game companies ever founded. The same company that created one of the greatest game universes ever imagined.

I say this, and realize that I have only been a member of B.net since December 2010, but as with so many other things, all is not as it seems. I was here when Halo 2 was getting ready to drop. I witnessed the aneurism-inducing rage (and the rushing river of tears of anguish that followed after it) over Halo 3's BR/AR thread. I saw the "THIZ G@M3 SUXS!!! WHY DID U CRE@T3 TIHS CR@P BUNGIE?!?!?!?" threads when ODST dropped. The whiners have come and gone with each game. They arrive to voice their displeasure that the game isn't exactly what they had thought it would be, and b*tched that games should be given a Title Update every time they found the tiniest flaw. In reality, they b*tched because they just sucked at the game.

Then, after 5-6 months, they would leave the forums as they ever so slowly realized that they were the minority. Then the next Halo game would drop, and the cycle would start anew.

Reach was/is no different. Reach is a great Halo game. It has its flaws, but what game doesn't? It is the culmination of 10 years of perfecting an entire genre, and there is hardly a better game out there, much less a better FPS. The haters returned in that same classic, predictable cycle as they always have, but now they are slowly filtering themselves out as more and more of them move to 343. The cycle continues as it always has. All is serene.

I have seen it because I have been a member since 2004 off and on, mostly reading thread posts. I finally created a set account (linked my GT) in 2006. Then in end of 2008/beginning 2009 I became homeless. I fought and battled my way back to having a life, money, job and reason to live, and when I came back to the community in 2010, I couldn't remember my B.net info, my GT, or my Live ID. I had lost all of that history except for my memory of how great this Community is. I would love to have my Halo 2 stats back, as well as the nameplate, but I know it won't happen. I don't need it to because I have the memory of it all safely locked away in my psyche. Now, I am back in the Community that I have loved so much for so many years. While again, I'd love to have my tenure on this site back, I don't need it as I see that it is just the way it was when I lost everything.

Perfect.

But now the Forums, this Community of gamers (both Hardcore and Casual), is returning to it's core. As I have said, the people who created an account for no other reason than to b*tch and moan just to gain attention, or to troll us whilst supporting another game, are now 343's problem.

At least if I could access their Forums, I suspect that this is what I would find. I can pull up the site, but when I click on the Forums it doesn't work. For almost a week now. lol But I am confident in what I would find there in terms of thread content.

But through all of this, this Community has remained, at its core, the same.

And now as with so many game cycles in the past, the haters who hate for the sake of hating, are leaving. The Forums aren't all of the way there yet, but things are moving that way at a good, steady pace.

Peace and quasi-intelligent thread topics are returning.

Like Zen Buddhism, all is becoming One again. One whole Community, united in the love of the greatest of games and an unflinching expectation of quality that always gets delivered on.

Now the Community waits (not patiently, but excitedly all the same) for info on the new IP. Already the "crack the secrets" threads are flooding the Forums in that same way that all of us love. It is this dedication, effort, and fanaticism that makes Bungie love to torture us, but reward us with the juiciest morsels of info when they do release them. Sure this Community argues like siblings do, but that is a sign of mutual respect in the intellects of the individuals that populate these Forums. The people who have been here since the beginning. The same people who joined later, but have the same love and respect for great games that the ones from the beginning have. We are a living and breathing Community, and we will not be bested by the irrational hatred of those who join just for trolling.

This Community is becoming whole again, and all of the "false" fans who joined just to give Bungie grief and to thinly veil their support of other competing games are almost gone.

It is what it is, we deal with it, we move on. But we, the Core B.net community, will endure. We will be here when the new IP is announced, one small bit of info at a time. We will be here to witness the drop of the next great game universe. And we will be the ones to drive it well into the stars, and beyond.

All is returning to the way it should be, the way it always has been.

Our sense of Zen is returning, all is One again.



See you Star Side.

Celer. Silens. Mortalis.

  • 08.06.2011 7:22 AM PDT

Just enjoy the damn game!
Who cares about BR vs AR

Good post. Its the truth as well.

I kinda feel I need to say something more to try and compare to your post...

  • 08.06.2011 7:25 AM PDT


Posted by: NME Overlord
Good post. Its the truth as well.

I kinda feel I need to say something more to try and compare to your post...

Couldn't have said it better myself.

  • 08.06.2011 7:28 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~

It's a subject that I think gets over-looked when an individuals attention is focused more on the haters here now. If you look back over history, every time that a new Halo dropped, the Forums and the Community were flooded with new members.

Most of those new members did nothing but cry tears of bitter anguish that the newest game didn't match their expectations to the letter. But then 4-8 months later, they would be nigh gone and the stragglers would be leaving as well. Then the Community would be back to normal.

It is as it always has been. We as a Community just endured another wave in the "hatred onslaught", and we emerged victorious. It could almost be metaphorically likened to a Firefight match. lol

  • 08.06.2011 7:34 AM PDT

Just enjoy the damn game!
Who cares about BR vs AR

I just wish I had created a username when I first checked the forum out in 2004. I would have seen all those times properly, instead of just checking my rank.

  • 08.06.2011 7:37 AM PDT


Posted by: Uriel S167
It's a subject that I think gets over-looked when an individuals attention is focused more on the haters here now. If you look back over history, every time that a new Halo dropped, the Forums and the Community were flooded with new members.

Most of those new members did nothing but cry tears of bitter anguish that the newest game didn't match their expectations to the letter. But then 4-8 months later, they would be nigh gone and the stragglers would be leaving as well. Then the Community would be back to normal.

It is as it always has been. We as a Community just endured another wave in the "hatred onslaught", and we emerged victorious. It could almost be metaphorically likened to a Firefight match. lol

So the next wave isn't for a couple years then?

  • 08.06.2011 7:38 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~


Posted by: Bronx Bomber

Posted by: Uriel S167
It's a subject that I think gets over-looked when an individuals attention is focused more on the haters here now. If you look back over history, every time that a new Halo dropped, the Forums and the Community were flooded with new members.

Most of those new members did nothing but cry tears of bitter anguish that the newest game didn't match their expectations to the letter. But then 4-8 months later, they would be nigh gone and the stragglers would be leaving as well. Then the Community would be back to normal.

It is as it always has been. We as a Community just endured another wave in the "hatred onslaught", and we emerged victorious. It could almost be metaphorically likened to a Firefight match. lol

So the next wave isn't for a couple years then?


I bet we'll get a small taste, a tease, at E3 2012. But I wouldn't personally expect to hear more (or really anything of significance) until late 2012.

We know how Bungie works. lol They'll take the time to get it all but perfect before they give us the opportunity to play in a beta/see actual gameplay.

And I would expect nothing less from them.

I've become spoiled by Bungie. lol I expect retardedly high quality in my games (in both the genre's [FPS's & RPG's]that I actually play). I'm a Hardcore gamer, even though I only play 2 genre's, I spend almost as much time gaming as I do at work. lol

Bunige and Bethesda Softworks have spoiled me with the quality of their work.

;-D

  • 08.06.2011 7:45 AM PDT

You Clicked my More button

WHO SAID YOU COULD CLICK ON MY MORE BUTTON!

Dammn right.

  • 08.06.2011 7:52 AM PDT

117

This really is a great thread... I agree with you 100%. I too was growing tired of the Reach Haters. However, I have to say ive noticed this too, the forums are much more peaceful nowadays.

  • 08.06.2011 7:55 AM PDT

We're the Flintstones kids, ten million strong and growing...

Glass Galaxies - a theme for bungie.net

Per audacia ad astra. Halo Reach | Destiny

Of your entire post, there is one part that I find myself strongly disagreeing with:
Posted by: Uriel S167
They arrive to voice their displeasure that the game isn't exactly what they had thought it would be, and b*tched that games should be given a Title Update every time they found the tiniest flaw. In reality, they b*tched because they just sucked at the game.

I find that the people who complain about tiny flaws seem to typically be more skilled than those who don't care at all. Yes it sucks that people complain, but when someone has a problem with something, I think it's good that they speak out about it.

I understand what you mean though, the unhelpful whiny complaints which serve purely as a means of expressing rage without providing any constructive criticism, I definitely won't miss those.

  • 08.06.2011 7:55 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~


Posted by: Zoidberg25
Of your entire post, there is one part that I find myself strongly disagreeing with:
Posted by: Uriel S167
They arrive to voice their displeasure that the game isn't exactly what they had thought it would be, and b*tched that games should be given a Title Update every time they found the tiniest flaw. In reality, they b*tched because they just sucked at the game.

I find that the people who complain about tiny flaws seem to typically be more skilled than those who don't care at all. Yes it sucks that people complain, but when someone has a problem with something, I think it's good that they speak out about it.

I understand what you mean though, the unhelpful whiny complaints which serve purely as a means of expressing rage without providing any constructive criticism, I definitely won't miss those.


The most annoying part is that these same whiners would argue that their opinion = fact. How vain is that?

They would also give no examples of how or what makes something a fact. If there is no proof of it happening, then logic assumes that it did not happen.

I see where you are coming from, many of the more hardcore players would naturally have their attention drawn to a small flaw, but that is because they are paying that much more attention.

But most of the "hatred posts" were simply nit-picking just to get attention and to trash parts of the game that really had nothing wrong with them. They either were incapable of adapting to the minor change to "insert game mechanic here" from Halo 2 & 3, or they just sucked so badly at the game, that this was the only way they could vent it out.

I laughed at the futility of such posts more often than I got annoyed at them, but after a while, they did get very annoying indeed.

  • 08.06.2011 8:10 AM PDT

δόξει τις ἀμαθεῖ σοφὰ λέγων οὐκ εὖ φρονεῖν.

Euripides, Bacchae. 480.


Posted by: Uriel S167

The whiners have come and gone with each game. They arrive to voice their displeasure that the game isn't exactly what they had thought it would be, and b*tched that games should be given a Title Update every time they found the tiniest flaw. In reality, they b*tched because they just sucked at the game.

Then, after 5-6 months, they would leave the forums as they ever so slowly realized that they were the minority. Then the next Halo game would drop, and the cycle would start anew.

Reach was/is no different. Reach is a great Halo game. It has its flaws, but what game doesn't? It is the culmination of 10 years of perfecting an entire genre, and there is hardly a better game out there, much less a better FPS. The haters returned in that same classic, predictable cycle as they always have, but now they are slowly filtering themselves out as more and more of them move to 343. The cycle continues as it always has. All is serene.

This Community is becoming whole again, and all of the "false" fans who joined just to give Bungie grief and to thinly veil their support of other competing games are almost gone.


The trouble with this post is that it makes thinking all of the Halo games are brilliant a criterion for being a "true fan" of Bungie. Not criticising the games Bungie releases doesn't make you a "true fan"-it makes you a sycophant, and not at all helpful.

Reach was a steaming pile of mediocrity, and this isn't remotely difficult to justify. Are you sure that I'm saying this because I'm trolling, joined to troll, am not familiar with the Halo series, am a "whiner", etc., or might it be because I'm just applying the same standards to Reach as I'd apply to any other video game?

[Edited on 08.06.2011 8:43 AM PDT]

  • 08.06.2011 8:41 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~


Posted by: Heliossoileh1

The trouble with this post is that it makes thinking all of the Halo games are brilliant a criterion for being a "true fan" of Bungie. Not criticising the games Bungie releases doesn't make you a "true fan"-it makes you a sycophant, and not at all helpful.


If you re-read my post, I'm not saying that that is a criterion at all. This is an op-ed piece, it is my opinion.

There are facts mentioned in it, but I am not claiming that my opinion of the Halo games is the only opinion. The facts of the matter are:

a) Many of the new members who joined after each subsequent game was announced/dropped into stores, did join just to troll Bungie and their loyal fans. Proof is more than evident in the surplus of low-quality ranting/hormone raging over the slightest disappointment of what they had perceived the games to be.

Don't get me wrong, many, many new members did join once the games dropped simply because that's when they had just discovered the games, Bungie, and the site. But while they are good and faithful people who actually contribute to a discussion, they were far outnumbered by the sheer amount of trolls who joined at the same time.

b) After a certain allotment of time, the trolls faded out and went away as their futile pre-teen ranting garnered them less and less attention. The proof of this is repeated in cyclic regularity every time a new Halo game dropped.

c) As far as "true" Halo fans go, if you hate a game (or series) that much, can you really call your self a fan of it? If you really applied the same criteria to every Halo game that you did to Reach, then you would have hated Halo 2 & 3 much more than Reach due to the limits of their technological inferiority. Bungie wasn't able to do as much with a game in each prior offering as much as the game that followed. Reach is the culmination/mastery of a full decade of tweaking the FPS genre into new, innovative areas.

Besides, my post is more geared towards true Bungie fans. I reference Halo more often simply because this series is where they really broke out and made their name.

And yes, after the butt-hurt, rage-quitting, delicious tear-shedding trolls leave the Forums; the Forums do get much more peaceful. That is fact as well. Look at the difference in the Forums lately. The proof speaks for me.

d) (If your limited alphabetical knowledge extends this far, I'm impressed) I said nothing about not criticizing Bungie games. I criticize them when I find something I don't agree with all of the time.

There is however, a vast difference between genuine criticism and the angst-filled ranting done by most of the haters who join just to troll Bungie and their fans. If you don't/can't realize that... then I can't help you, that's a tunnel-vision problem that only you can solve through a small journey of self-discovery.

Posted by: Heliossoileh1


Reach was a steaming pile of mediocrity, and this isn't remotely difficult to justify. Are you sure that I'm saying this because I'm trolling, joined to troll, am not familiar with the Halo series, am a "whiner", etc., or might it because I'm just applying the same standards to Reach as I'd apply to any other video game?


Again, as I said in my OP;

Your opinion =/= fact. If you think Reach is a big steaming pile, then that is your opinion.

You can try to prove that as fact, but you'll fail. The fact (read: truth) is that you are the minority here. Most of the Community is just as fine with Reach as they have been with any other Halo game.

The fact that the troll threads get more attention is simply because of their nature, and how vehemently they rant. But the truth is again, that there are more people who like Reach than there are people who dislike it. The number of threads in favor of Reach do outnumber the threads against it.

If you can't separate your opinion from fact... then that also is an area where I don't think anyone can help you. That is your issue to solve.

If I am a Sycophant, then so be it. Apparently you are the one who has the problem with it. I like it just fine, and no one else seems to mind.



[Edited on 08.06.2011 9:13 AM PDT]

  • 08.06.2011 9:07 AM PDT

Hello! I'm Bunie.net's resident medical student (hell i'm sure there are more but I'm the only one who openly declares it!) I love my emblem, and I am periodically active.
I have a Twitter

I agree, the community has become calm, one united community focused on their love for Bungie.

  • 08.06.2011 9:18 AM PDT

"The Septagon symbolizes all that is right in the multiplayer world. A few million men and women, bound by honor, Bungie, and celebratory crouching."

If zen buddhism means boring then yes, i'd agree with that view.

Yes things are calm and lovey dovey but there doesn't seem to be any real activity.

I actually prefered it when there was some proper banter.

  • 08.06.2011 9:30 AM PDT

Hello! I'm Bunie.net's resident medical student (hell i'm sure there are more but I'm the only one who openly declares it!) I love my emblem, and I am periodically active.
I have a Twitter


Posted by: StallionR
If zen buddhism means boring then yes, i'd agree with that view.

Yes things are calm and lovey dovey but there doesn't seem to be any real activity.

I actually prefered it when there was some proper banter.


There is still plenty of activity, and people are trying to fill the void at least (Looks at Bathroom Reading)

  • 08.06.2011 9:35 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~


Posted by: HeyBlade789
I agree, the community has become calm, one united community focused on their love for Bungie.


And this is what a developers community should be. I loves Bungie just as much as I love their creations.

If their new IP/game is anything close to their most recent FPS's (in terms of mechanics, story depth, and graphics, as well as community content. I don't want a carbon copy of Halo just in a new skin *coughcallofdutycough*), then I know I will be hopelessly addicted to the new universe as well.

But we gather here because we love Bungie. I personally don't join Forum Communities for games I dislike. We are gathered here to support Bungie, and to let them know how much we love their work.

That is the reason these Forums, and this Community, exist.

  • 08.06.2011 9:36 AM PDT

δόξει τις ἀμαθεῖ σοφὰ λέγων οὐκ εὖ φρονεῖν.

Euripides, Bacchae. 480.


Posted by: Uriel S167

If you re-read my post, I'm not saying that that is a criterion at all. This is an op-ed piece, it is my opinion.


It seems that you are saying that. I know that it's your opinion, fairly obviously.

Posted by: Uriel S167There are facts mentioned in it, but I am not claiming that my opinion of the Halo games is the only opinion. The facts of the matter are:

I didn't say that you were.

Posted by: Uriel S167
a) Many of the new members who joined after each subsequent game was announced/dropped into stores, did join just to troll Bungie and their loyal fans. Proof is more than evident in the surplus of low-quality ranting/hormone raging over the slightest disappointment of what they had perceived the games to be.

Don't get me wrong, many, many new members did join once the games dropped simply because that's when they had just discovered the games, Bungie, and the site. But while they are good and faithful people who actually contribute to a discussion, they were far outnumbered by the sheer amount of trolls who joined at the same time.


I don't doubt this.

Posted by: Uriel S167
b) After a certain allotment of time, the trolls faded out and went away as their futile pre-teen ranting garnered them less and less attention. The proof of this is repeated in cyclic regularity every time a new Halo game dropped.


Nor this. However, problems arise when "trolls" are defined as "people who criticise a Halo game".

Posted by: Uriel S167
c) As far as "true" Halo fans go, if you hate a game (or series) that much, can you really call your self a fan of it? If you really applied the same criteria to every Halo game that you did to Reach, then you would have hated Halo 2 & 3 much more than Reach due to the limits of their technological inferiority. Bungie wasn't able to do as much with a game in each prior offering as much as the game that followed. Reach is the culmination/mastery of a full decade of tweaking the FPS genre into new, innovative areas.


Reach and its predecessors are worlds apart-Halo 2 and 3 aren't Reach sans an improved engine, but are substantively different games, as every game in the series has been. Don't think that because a game is a sequel/comes later/utilises improved technology it is necessarily better-consider BioShock/BioShock 2 and Deus Ex/Deus Ex: Invisible War.


Posted by: Uriel S167
And yes, after the butt-hurt, rage-quitting, delicious tear-shedding trolls leave the Forums; the Forums do get much more peaceful. That is fact as well. Look at the difference in the Forums lately. The proof speaks for me.


I didn't disagree with this either.

Posted by: Uriel S167
d) (If your limited alphabetical knowledge extends this far, I'm impressed) I said nothing about not criticizing Bungie games. I criticize them when I find something I don't agree with all of the time.

There is however, a vast difference between genuine criticism and the angst-filled ranting done by most of the haters who join just to troll Bungie and their fans. If you don't/can't realize that... then I can't help you, that's a tunnel-vision problem that only you can solve through a small journey of self-discovery.


There's no need to be insulting. I recognise the difference between proper criticism and irrational hatred. I'm just not convinced that you do.


Posted by: Uriel S167
Again, as I said in my OP;

Your opinion =/= fact. If you think Reach is a big steaming pile, then that is your opinion.


I've never understood why people say this. Opinions are either right or wrong.

Posted by: Uriel S167
You can try to prove that as fact, but you'll fail. The fact (read: truth) is that you are the minority here. Most of the Community is just as fine with Reach as they have been with any other Halo game.

The fact that the troll threads get more attention is simply because of their nature, and how vehemently they rant. But the truth is again, that there are more people who like Reach than there are people who dislike it. The number of threads in favor of Reach do outnumber the threads against it.


A position's popularity is irrelevant to its validity. Saying that I'll "fail" is begging the question.

[Edited on 08.06.2011 9:52 AM PDT]

  • 08.06.2011 9:37 AM PDT

You make some good points. I hope that the future will bring the community closer like when the community started with the very first Bungie games and how many met each other thanks to Halo.

Oh, the nice days spent playing Halo in a split-screen while outside it was a sunny day.

  • 08.06.2011 9:51 AM PDT

Hello! I'm Bunie.net's resident medical student (hell i'm sure there are more but I'm the only one who openly declares it!) I love my emblem, and I am periodically active.
I have a Twitter


Posted by: Uriel S167

Posted by: HeyBlade789
I agree, the community has become calm, one united community focused on their love for Bungie.


And this is what a developers community should be. I loves Bungie just as much as I love their creations.

If their new IP/game is anything close to their most recent FPS's (in terms of mechanics, story depth, and graphics, as well as community content. I don't want a carbon copy of Halo just in a new skin *coughcallofdutycough*), then I know I will be hopelessly addicted to the new universe as well.

But we gather here because we love Bungie. I personally don't join Forum Communities for games I dislike. We are gathered here to support Bungie, and to let them know how much we love their work.

That is the reason these Forums, and this Community, exist.


Agreed, Bungie is famed for its community connections, and it will maintain them throughout the next project and further.

  • 08.06.2011 9:53 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
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I have two problems with Reach:

1. Maps that don't give both teams an equal chance at winning. I just don't understand how a professional studio fails to place power weapons so that both teams have an even chance of getting them. This first point is simply indisputable. Maps like Reflection and Sword Base are really bad. The large amount of frustration and anger that you have labeled as "whining" come because anyone with a brain can see that these maps are unfair and should never have been released.

2. Armor Lock. This point is a bit more subjective because those at lower skill levels haven't seen it abused and think it's completely fine.

Watching Bungie talk about how perfect Reach was made me disappointed. I don't understand how Sword Base was the culmination of 10 years of developing experience.

Nevertheless, I still love Bungie for what they have done right with Reach and previous Halo games. I just find it disconcerting that you may have grouped people that were providing constructive criticisms to Bungie and Reach as "whiners"

  • 08.06.2011 9:58 AM PDT

// Chapter
// My PC


2/15/12: Francisco Porras, I'll miss you. Rest in Peace.

Great thread. I couldn't have said it better myself. Like you I've been here longer than my account will show(around 2005). Anyways, I can't wait until we get some info to speculate on, like the silhouettes of Reach.

  • 08.06.2011 10:19 AM PDT

Great DAY

I agree with you. I haven't seen a complainer in a while now.

  • 08.06.2011 10:31 AM PDT

117


Posted by: Nostrebluc NC
I agree with you. I haven't seen a complainer in a while now.

Me too, its been great

  • 08.06.2011 11:29 AM PDT

~ Life is Killing Me. ~

~ I hate, therefore I am. ~


Posted by: Negative 9
I have two problems with Reach:

1. Maps that don't give both teams an equal chance at winning. I just don't understand how a professional studio fails to place power weapons so that both teams have an even chance of getting them. This first point is simply indisputable. Maps like Reflection and Sword Base are really bad. The large amount of frustration and anger that you have labeled as "whining" come because anyone with a brain can see that these maps are unfair and should never have been released.


But see, like I told another poster, there is a difference between whining and a legitimate concern. I agree that each map has the one or two "power points". If you control those, you can theoretically control the game.

The whiners I am writing of are the ones that say; "The other team was camping in the snipey hole on sword base across from the lift room! No matter how many times I ran blindly in there, the just kept mowing me down! This is broken Bungie!!! I need to be able to charge at my entrenched enemies who have seized a strategic point without dying so that I can have that camping spot!! RAWRRRRRR"

I agree that it sucks, but no map is perfect. There will always be a strategic spot to entrench in that will be almost impossible to dislodge someone from. It is the nature of a combat game. The example you gave above, isn't whining in my opinion. It is a legitimate concern. Myself and others may disagree about being unfair, but that is part of the fun. Can your team hold a position while the opposing team tries to take it from you?




Posted by: Negative 9
2. Armor Lock. This point is a bit more subjective because those at lower skill levels haven't seen it abused and think it's completely fine.

Watching Bungie talk about how perfect Reach was made me disappointed. I don't understand how Sword Base was the culmination of 10 years of developing experience.

Nevertheless, I still love Bungie for what they have done right with Reach and previous Halo games. I just find it disconcerting that you may have grouped people that were providing constructive criticisms to Bungie and Reach as "whiners"


The Armor Lock discussion/argument is always going to be subjective. There is nothing but opinion about it. I have heard over 1000 arguments about how its unfair, but I have also heard just as many about how easy it is to defeat someone with Armor Lock. That's just a healthy discussion topic.

And nowhere in any of my posts did I group everyone together who finds flaw in a game as "whiners". In fact, several times now I have argued against it. Including twice in this thread now.

Nowhere have I ever read or seen a ViDoc where Bungie says that Reach is perfect. Many people complain that Bungie isn't doing anything, but are once monthly or even more frequent Playlist Updates not enough?

If Bungie had issued a Patch or Title Update every time someone found a flaw, or fixed everything that anyone ever complained about, then the game would be such a conglomeration of competing coding and incompatible "fix requests" that it would have been utterly unplayable.

They made updates and fixes as best they could, but they had to keep the balance of the game in mind.

Besides, if one team has the Yellow Lift room on Sword Base locked down, why rush in there? Wouldn't it be better to toss in a bunch of grenades and go for an Overkill or Killtacular? Why use the lift to get in there to just get massacred or run in through the door to the same fate? This is what explosives are for. lol

There are solutions to every problem. That's not whining, that's what discussion is for.

[Edited on 08.06.2011 11:39 AM PDT]

  • 08.06.2011 11:36 AM PDT