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This topic has moved here: Subject: CQC- Spartans and Elites
  • Subject: CQC- Spartans and Elites
Subject: CQC- Spartans and Elites

Okay, I know there's been a ton of these kinds of threads, but I'm just interested in you opinion on which would be superior up close, hand-to-hand or CQC.

And I was curious on a couple things. Chief has taken on two Elites that I know of in the novels: In TFoR, a blue-armored Elite (Minor, I suppose) that was a meter taller than him, so he must've been exceptionally strong for an Elite, right? And MC barely came out on top because he locked his glove articulation, which means what basically? It said after this, that they were matched in strength, but MC came out on top by being more creative when they were in a deadlock fighting over the plasma pistol.
In First Strike, he takes on a black-armored Elite(Spec Ops?) armed with an energy sword, and MC was able to hold him off with a broken fusion reactor (no shield), no weapon, and dead-tired after fighting on Halo non-stop until he could be taken care of.

So I've kind of wondered: Which are superior? MC was able to match/neutralize two exceptional Elites in CQC, but I see most people on this forum favor Elites when it comes to CQC.

Also, say if this was an average-sized Elite Major, and MC was rested, and his armor was fully functional, who would win? Straight hand-to-hand, no weapons.

[Edited on 08.07.2011 9:43 PM PDT]

  • 08.07.2011 9:41 PM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.

I question the validity of that Elite being a full meter taller than Chief. Sesa Refumme(?) was the tallest Elite at 8'6" and that's still not a full meter taller.

Anyway, it would vary from Elite to Elite. Some would be better at CQC, stronger, more agile etc. Tonnes of variables.

[Edited on 08.07.2011 9:47 PM PDT]

  • 08.07.2011 9:46 PM PDT

XxXD3LuuX3 X luuC1d17YXxX

They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book) All right here it is:


"We have been betrayed by those we trusted most," thundered the Imperial Admiral and Regent Command of the Combined Fleet of Righteous Purpose, Xytan 'Jar Wattinree. He shook both fists as he spoke. "We have been betrayed by our Prophets."

The Sangheili stood over three and half meters tall and wore silver armor covered with the gold Forerunner glyphs of Sacred Mystery.


Ghosts of Onyx Page 239

[Edited on 08.07.2011 10:04 PM PDT]

  • 08.07.2011 9:57 PM PDT


Posted by: dahuterschuter
I question the validity of that Elite being a full meter taller than Chief. Sesa Refumme(?) was the tallest Elite at 8'6" and that's still not a full meter taller.

Anyway, it would vary from Elite to Elite. Some would be better at CQC, stronger, more agile etc. Tonnes of variables.


Damn, dunno how to cite, but bottom of page 313, last paragraph The Fall of Reach, the old version, not the new one they came out with.

  • 08.07.2011 10:03 PM PDT

XxXD3LuuX3 X luuC1d17YXxX

I think Elite varies more than human height, where a 6'6" human is oddly tall maybe an Elite has to be like 9 feet tall to be considered abnormal.

Also look at my above post where it says that an Elite is "over three and half meters tall"

[Edited on 08.07.2011 10:06 PM PDT]

  • 08.07.2011 10:05 PM PDT


Posted by: Makko Mace
I think Elite varies more than human height, where a 6'6" human is oddly tall maybe an Elite has to be like 9 feet tall to be considered abnormal.

Also look at my above post where it says that an Elite is "over three and half meters tall"


Okay, yeah, I agree. But it says in TFoR, that this Elite is a meter taller than John, so that means either 9' 6" or 10"(depending on whether it was referring to John with or without his armor), which is possible based on your citation.

  • 08.07.2011 10:09 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book)


Nylund has hinted that he uses platform boots and a headdress or that he modifies his hologram to make himself look bigger.

And well, the second encounter (Ascendant Justice) was John being tired, but he teamed up on the Elite with the help of Johnson, Polaski and Haverson.

  • 08.07.2011 10:10 PM PDT


Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book)


Nylund has hinted that he uses platform boots and a headdress or that he modifies his hologram to make himself look bigger.

And well, the second encounter (Ascendant Justice) was John being tired, but he teamed up on the Elite with the help of Johnson, Polaski and Haverson.


How do you cite? I swear it says 'a meter taller than John and wore blue armor similar to that on Covenant warships'.

Yeah, he did get help, but he was still able to match him in strength, and hold him off for a good while, after being buttass tired, unarmed, and without his energy shield.

  • 08.07.2011 10:15 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book)


Nylund has hinted that he uses platform boots and a headdress or that he modifies his hologram to make himself look bigger.

And well, the second encounter (Ascendant Justice) was John being tired, but he teamed up on the Elite with the help of Johnson, Polaski and Haverson.


How do you cite? I swear it says 'a meter taller than John and wore blue armor similar to that on Covenant warships'.

Yeah, he did get help, but he was still able to match him in strength, and hold him off for a good while, after being buttass tired, unarmed, and without his energy shield.



He was only able to momentarily stop the Elite, I remember him getting his arm injured by the Energy Sword and well, Johnson was the one that did most of the job, shooting at the Elite from behind with his Assault Rifle.

  • 08.07.2011 10:17 PM PDT


Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book)


Nylund has hinted that he uses platform boots and a headdress or that he modifies his hologram to make himself look bigger.

And well, the second encounter (Ascendant Justice) was John being tired, but he teamed up on the Elite with the help of Johnson, Polaski and Haverson.


How do you cite? I swear it says 'a meter taller than John and wore blue armor similar to that on Covenant warships'.

Yeah, he did get help, but he was still able to match him in strength, and hold him off for a good while, after being buttass tired, unarmed, and without his energy shield.



He was only able to momentarily stop the Elite, I remember him getting his arm injured by the Energy Sword and well, Johnson was the one that did most of the job, shooting at the Elite from behind with his Assault Rifle.


Eh, they tussled a good while, I'd re-read it. It was only at the very end the Elite almost killed him.

But let's turn the situation around. I'm sure if Master Chief was armed with an Energy Sword (hell, a machete), had shields, and was rested, and took on an unarmed Elite without his energy shield, who was exhausted, the outcome would be different ending in MC cutting down the Elite pretty quick. Even if there were Grunts and Jackals waiting to shoot the Chief, and the Elite was trying to steer him towards them.

  • 08.07.2011 10:23 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book)


Nylund has hinted that he uses platform boots and a headdress or that he modifies his hologram to make himself look bigger.

And well, the second encounter (Ascendant Justice) was John being tired, but he teamed up on the Elite with the help of Johnson, Polaski and Haverson.


How do you cite? I swear it says 'a meter taller than John and wore blue armor similar to that on Covenant warships'.

Yeah, he did get help, but he was still able to match him in strength, and hold him off for a good while, after being buttass tired, unarmed, and without his energy shield.



He was only able to momentarily stop the Elite, I remember him getting his arm injured by the Energy Sword and well, Johnson was the one that did most of the job, shooting at the Elite from behind with his Assault Rifle.


Eh, they tussled a good while, I'd re-read it. It was only at the very end the Elite almost killed him.

But let's turn the situation around. I'm sure if Master Chief was armed with an Energy Sword (hell, a machete), had shields, and was rested, and took on an unarmed Elite without his energy shield, who was exhausted, the outcome would be different ending in MC cutting down the Elite pretty quick. Even if there were Grunts and Jackals waiting to shoot the Chief, and the Elite was trying to steer him towards them.


Thel Lodamee was more than able to take him on even though he had been fully rested, actually, he beat him in an Energy Sword duel and was about to kill him, but the shipmaster used the gravity lift/well to pull him out.

  • 08.07.2011 10:35 PM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.


Posted by: Makko Mace
They are near equals, it varies with the individual.

Also, isn't the Elite head fleet commander or what ever in Ghosts of Onyx like 11 feet tall? (citation needed, hold on I'll get my book) All right here it is:


"We have been betrayed by those we trusted most," thundered the Imperial Admiral and Regent Command of the Combined Fleet of Righteous Purpose, Xytan 'Jar Wattinree. He shook both fists as he spoke. "We have been betrayed by our Prophets."

The Sangheili stood over three and half meters tall and wore silver armor covered with the gold Forerunner glyphs of Sacred Mystery.


Ghosts of Onyx Page 239

Yeah, but that's because of a head-dress and some platform shoes according to Nylund.

  • 08.07.2011 10:35 PM PDT


Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Thel Lodamee was more than able to take him on even though he had been fully rested, actually, he beat him in an Energy Sword duel and was about to kill him, but the shipmaster used the gravity lift/well to pull him out.


True, but that was a Thel, some of the best Elites ever. Like it was mentioned above, it varies for each Spartan or Elite.

  • 08.07.2011 10:42 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Thel Lodamee was more than able to take him on even though he had been fully rested, actually, he beat him in an Energy Sword duel and was about to kill him, but the shipmaster used the gravity lift/well to pull him out.


True, but that was a Thel, some of the best Elites ever. Like it was mentioned above, it varies for each Spartan or Elite.


Thel Lodamee is not The Arbiter, that's Thel Vadamee. Thel Lodamee was just a major domo, so, not one of the best Elites out there.

  • 08.07.2011 11:57 PM PDT

What people have to realise is that master chief is the main characterof the games. What do you think they're going to do, kill him off half way through the series. Which means no matter how big or skilled an elite is, chief will always come out on top

[Edited on 08.08.2011 12:06 AM PDT]

  • 08.08.2011 12:02 AM PDT

< Insert witty comment/joke here >

Benjamin!

I think it's pretty evident from the books that in close quarters, a general Elite is a match for a general Spartan, but as with all things, there are individuals that excell to a greater degree in this area. For instance, those who claim that clearly Elites are vastly superior because the Chief was nearly defeated by a lowly minor... who's to say that this minor wasn't exceptional and had only recently joined up in to the Covenant military or a multitude of other posibilities, hence his lower rank. Rank is not a direct correlation to skill in all cases, even with the Elite ranking system of kills.

  • 08.08.2011 2:54 AM PDT


Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Thel Lodamee was more than able to take him on even though he had been fully rested, actually, he beat him in an Energy Sword duel and was about to kill him, but the shipmaster used the gravity lift/well to pull him out.


True, but that was a Thel, some of the best Elites ever. Like it was mentioned above, it varies for each Spartan or Elite.


Thel Lodamee is not The Arbiter, that's Thel Vadamee. Thel Lodamee was just a major domo, so, not one of the best Elites out there.


Nevermind, that was Vadamee.

  • 08.08.2011 7:09 AM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

hand to hand- elite

CQC- spartan

  • 08.08.2011 7:14 AM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Depends on the level of experience and training.

But normally, an Elite would be able to beat a Spartan by brute force, but Spartan's are smarter in their way of fighting, which kind of keeps it odds.

  • 08.08.2011 7:53 AM PDT