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Subject: Can anybody tell me what this covenant vehicle is?

Im txgrim4 (Grim, Grimmy, Grimsta), i have been playing xboxlive for 9 years, evr since day 1 of Halo:CE til now. I love H2, that and Halo 1 are my favs. Im a Halologist when it comes to the Bungie/Halo Universe. Ive also played Marathon Series, ONI, and Myth Series. I live in Texas, Play Football, and cant wait for Halo 4!


Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: LEGEND ST
I wouldn't confirm the last Precursor yet. There is still one more book in the Forerunner Saga that could lead to a resolution with him. But he is still a possibility, yes.


The Prisoner becomes the Gravemind.


What do you mean when you say that AJW. The prisoner becomes the gravemind

  • 08.08.2011 12:01 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: txgrim4z

Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: LEGEND ST
I wouldn't confirm the last Precursor yet. There is still one more book in the Forerunner Saga that could lead to a resolution with him. But he is still a possibility, yes.


The Prisoner becomes the Gravemind.


What do you mean when you say that AJW. The prisoner becomes the gravemind


I don't understand how hard that is to comprehend.


" the prisoner gets infected and turns into the gravemind".

A 14 year old could get that.

  • 08.08.2011 12:03 PM PDT

Im txgrim4 (Grim, Grimmy, Grimsta), i have been playing xboxlive for 9 years, evr since day 1 of Halo:CE til now. I love H2, that and Halo 1 are my favs. Im a Halologist when it comes to the Bungie/Halo Universe. Ive also played Marathon Series, ONI, and Myth Series. I live in Texas, Play Football, and cant wait for Halo 4!


Posted by: grey101

Posted by: txgrim4z

Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: LEGEND ST
I wouldn't confirm the last Precursor yet. There is still one more book in the Forerunner Saga that could lead to a resolution with him. But he is still a possibility, yes.


The Prisoner becomes the Gravemind.


What do you mean when you say that AJW. The prisoner becomes the gravemind


I don't understand how hard that is to comprehend.


" the prisoner gets infected and turns into the gravemind".

A 14 year old could get that.


Here goes gey101 again, with his attitude, i think im the best tone

Whatever grey, I didnt understand what he meant at first, i thought there was some kind of meaning to it. Now drop the subject

  • 08.08.2011 12:05 PM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: txgrim4z
Posted by: ajw34307
Posted by: LEGEND ST
I wouldn't confirm the last Precursor yet. There is still one more book in the Forerunner Saga that could lead to a resolution with him. But he is still a possibility, yes.


The Prisoner becomes the Gravemind.


What do you mean when you say that AJW. The prisoner becomes the gravemind


I believe he will merge with the Flood eventually to become what we know as the Gravemind. The evidence of them being the same entity is all there:

The Terminals state that Mendicant Bias conversed with the Gravemind for 43 years before forcing itself into Rampancy, defecting to the Flood and betraying the Forerunners. I find it to be far beyond coincidence that the test-firing of Installation 05 at Charum Hakkor - and thus the release of the Prisoner - occurred at the same time and they conversed also for 43 years.

Gravemind states in Human Weakeness that he has consumed many AIs but spared one who joined him, referring to Mendicant Bias.

Primordium's description states that humans call the Prisoner "The Primordial", this is the same name Major John Smith uses to describe the Flood in The Mona Lisa.

The Prisoner is known as "the Timeless One", Gravemind describes himself as a "timeless chorus".

Gravemind states he has "listened - through rock and metal and time", the Prisoner listened to the humans and San'Shyuum at Charum Hakkor in his prison for a very long time.

The last words of the Gravemind is "resignation is my virtue; like water I ebb, and flow. Defeat is simply the addition of time to a sentence I never deserved... but you imposed." The latter part is referring to imprisonment, a sentence he never deserved. The PRISONER of Charum Hakkor, locked away for unknown reasons.

Mendicant Bias was the original Monitor of Installation 05 (his serial number was 05-032), the Prisoner stowed away on the Installation he stole - the same Halo we discover the Gravemind on 100,000 years later.

"Child of my enemy, why have you come?" - Everyone seemed to think this referred to the humans and Forerunners being related, but it makes so much more sense to mean Ancient Humanity who fought the Flood before the Forerunners.

  • 08.08.2011 12:06 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: txgrim4z

Posted by: LEGEND ST
I wouldn't confirm the last Precursor yet. There is still one more book in the Forerunner Saga that could lead to a resolution with him. But he is still a possibility, yes.[/quote]

The Prisoner becomes the Gravemind.[/quote]

What do you mean when you say that AJW. The prisoner becomes the gravemind[/quote]

I don't understand how hard that is to comprehend.


" the prisoner gets infected and turns into the gravemind".

A 14 year old could get that.


Here goes gey101 again, with his attitude, i think im the best tone

Whatever grey, I didnt understand what he meant at first, i thought there was some kind of meaning to it. Now drop the subject


what possible meaning could there be out of that?

It is no different than saying "Sky is blue".

and the tone was "sarcastic, de-grading" this time.

  • 08.08.2011 12:07 PM PDT

Im txgrim4 (Grim, Grimmy, Grimsta), i have been playing xboxlive for 9 years, evr since day 1 of Halo:CE til now. I love H2, that and Halo 1 are my favs. Im a Halologist when it comes to the Bungie/Halo Universe. Ive also played Marathon Series, ONI, and Myth Series. I live in Texas, Play Football, and cant wait for Halo 4!

Oh, ok i get it. Thanks AJ

  • 08.08.2011 12:08 PM PDT

Im txgrim4 (Grim, Grimmy, Grimsta), i have been playing xboxlive for 9 years, evr since day 1 of Halo:CE til now. I love H2, that and Halo 1 are my favs. Im a Halologist when it comes to the Bungie/Halo Universe. Ive also played Marathon Series, ONI, and Myth Series. I live in Texas, Play Football, and cant wait for Halo 4!

Well grey apparently there is based off AJ's response, thank you very much

always looking for someone to mess with and make them feel stupid for the Qs they ask

[Edited on 08.08.2011 12:10 PM PDT]

  • 08.08.2011 12:10 PM PDT

"Were it so easy..."

It is speculated the Precursor becomes the Gravemind. But still somewhat unconfirmed.

Rather than to say he IS the Gravemind, would make more sense that what we know about Graveminds now (They are the culmination of the minds absorbed by the flood that take form after enough biomass has been collected), and combine it with what we know about the Precursor, that he is EXTREMELY ancient, and likely the most powerful, knowledgeable mind in the universe as-per his release.

What this would mean together, is that the Gravemind isn't the same being as the Precursor, but that the Flood defeats the precursor, and he becomes the most prominent mind in the Flood's being.

There is one issue with the connection between Mendicant Bias and Installation 05. Mendicant likely didn't control 05, if you remember, mendicant could only control 5 of the Halo rings, while the Forerunners maintained control of exactly 7 (The amount that existed in the galaxy at the start of Halo CE). Though I suppose the 6th ring Bias tried to control, but "couldn't" could easily have been 05, and Bias could have purposely been delivering the Ring to them.

  • 08.08.2011 12:18 PM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307
Er... how does The Return even hint that Elites will be in Halo 4?

The Shipmaster sees a human camp with only one alive, he sees images of humans uncovering various Forerunner artefacts on the floor and takes the human back to his ship where he is going to "interrogate" him.

Okay, so how will this Shipmaster suddenly know to go beyond the Orion Arm to the Legendary Planet, meet up with the Chief and have a happy tea party with the Forerunners? Ah yes, he can't.

If anything, The Return leads into Glasslands.

That speech at the end says, to me, that there is a possibility of, at least, a Squad of Elites showing up down the line. Try thinking about what being on the path of Forerunner technology could lead to. They could find anything, which could transport them to the Legendary Planet, or any other location 'Chief encounters. With his clear determination to speak with the Forerunners, himself, it's not difficult to understand the possibility of the Shipmaster, and his allies, winding up in the trilogy. Post Halo 3, Elites are still very much devoted to them, and this devotion and desperation for a purpose is quite significant.

Posted by: ajw34307UNSC cannot turn up either. They can only appear if John gets back to UNSC controlled space by the end of Halo 4, otherwise they can have nothing to do with the story.
As I said, I have no opinion on the UNSC. I'll admit, it doesn't look good for them, but I'm not going to completely dismiss them; no matter how many times people scream 'NO'.

  • 08.08.2011 12:24 PM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: LEGEND ST
It is speculated the Precursor becomes the Gravemind. But still somewhat unconfirmed.

Rather than to say he IS the Gravemind, would make more sense that what we know about Graveminds now (They are the culmination of the minds absorbed by the flood that take form after enough biomass has been collected), and combine it with what we know about the Precursor, that he is EXTREMELY ancient, and likely the most powerful, knowledgeable mind in the universe as-per his release.

What this would mean together, is that the Gravemind isn't the same being as the Precursor, but that the Flood defeats the precursor, and he becomes the most prominent mind in the Flood's being.


We have never seen a fully formed Gravemind beyond the one in the trilogy. The others (Halo Wars and Halo CE) were just Proto-Graveminds, and they were just massive blobs with no defined appearance.

In Human Weakness, the Gravemind states he speaks in trochaic heptameter by choice because he has absorbed the minds of poets from thousands of other races. He states in Halo 3 that he has destroyed "fleets of thousands", and "consumed a galaxy of flesh, and mind, and bone".

None of this would make sense if he wasn't the Prisoner, since the first time he's released that we see is at the end of Halo 2 where he hitches aboard In Amber Clad and goes to High Charity. None of his dialogue would make sense if he was a recently formed entity, stuff like "I am a monument to all your sins" would make no sense at all. But apply his dialogue to the actions of the Prisoner and it makes perfect sense.

There is one issue with the connection between Mendicant Bias and Installation 05. Mendicant likely didn't control 05, if you remember, mendicant could only control 5 of the Halo rings, while the Forerunners maintained control of exactly 7 (The amount that existed in the galaxy at the start of Halo CE). Though I suppose the 6th ring Bias tried to control, but "couldn't" could easily have been 05, and Bias could have purposely been delivering the Ring to them.

Mendicant was given control of Installation 05 to oversee the testing of the Flood - his serial number is 05-032. This would be the Ring he stole originally, fired at Charum Hakkor and had the Prisoner stow away on.

  • 08.08.2011 12:28 PM PDT

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