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  • Subject: Project: Balance (warning, very long)
Subject: Project: Balance (warning, very long)

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

And now, the balance system!

Keep in mind, these numbers hold very deep meaning. A weapon may be powerful, but will not be able to everything well.

M6C Magnum Sidearm (Magnum)
Changes: Faster Duel-wield Reload
Resistance: 2
Fatality: 3
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 5
Melee: 3
Alternate: Duel-Wield

This is generally a very balanced weapon for duel-wield and has no extreme attributes but, I would like to point out that I would significantly increase the reload speed while duel-wielding and while crouching, your accuracy increases. These rules apply to the SMG as well.

Plasma Pistol
Changes: Eliminate Homing Ability With Charge, more powerful regular shots
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 2
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 3
Efficiency: 4
Melee: 1
Alternate: Duel-Wield

The one thing on everyone's mind is if the homing ability of charges are taken out. Don't worry, I don't want that either. Other than that, you probably don't have anything else to say. However, I couldn't put it up here for balance purposes but regular shots will be about a 3, increasing their original power in Halo 2, not that anyone would use it on live.

M7/Caseless (SMG)
Changes: Faster Duel-Wield Reload
Resistance: 1
Fatality: 2
Distance: 2
Difficulty: 5
Efficiency: 5
Melee: 3
Alternate: Duel-Wield

Same ol' SMG. I don't think I would make any extreme changes other than the duel-wield reload speed and the accuracy while crouching.

Plasma Rifle
Changes: Faster Projectile Speed
Resistance: 3
Fatality: 1
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 3
Efficiency: 5
Melee: 3
Alternate: Duel-Wield

As all the Elites do it, using one plasma rifle must be more reliable. I suggest increasing the projectile speed, but that's all. I've found that this does massive damage already but needs to be more accurate. Increasing the projectile speed would do just that.

Brute Plasma Rifle
Changes: None
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 1
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 3
Efficiency: 3
Melee: 3
Alternate: Duel-Wield

So there's no confusion, I would not increase the projectile speed for the Brute version. It is already way powerful enough as it is now yet still balanced.

Needler
Changes: Stronger Homing Ability
Resistance: 1
Fatality: 5
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 3
Melee: 4
Alternate: Duel-Wield

Other then increasing the homing part about this weapon, I have no huge changes for this. The Plasma Pistol needs no homing and this needs more, interesting. Did you know, of all the weapons, this one is capable of the most damage? You'd never know it if you could actually get it to hit. If only a little, I suggest increasing the homing ability. Even though the stats say differently, an explosion of the needles would still kill instantly.

For the final touch, the charged melee attack on this gun would be awesome but not quite like the way Halo 1 did it. The character holds the gun straight down instead of sideways then lunges forward. The process would be slower then you might think. If the needles penetrate, your character then pulls the weapon out in an upward motion so the needles stick to the enemy. Of course, the catch to this is you take a little bit of damage from the explosion, but not much.

M90 (Shotgun)
Changes: Bigger, Louder, and Uncut!
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 3
Distance: 2
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 4

Alternate: Bullet Spread
Resistance: 4
Fatality: 3
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 4

Now, this version of the Shotty would be as balanced as it is awesome. It would almost feel and look like it makes a greater impact with slower, more powerful animations for each shot. Meaning slower shots, pumps, etc.

This is a rule that should have already been applied to the Shotgun we have now. When you shoot your gun and instantly melee to finish your enemy off, your gun still needs to be pumped. This applies to reload or anything you can do to cut off 'pumping your gun' (I cannot say that without my mind drifting to something completely off-subject, and out-of-place). It applies to anything other then weapon switching since you bring your gun out pumping it.

You may notice only a very subtle difference between primary and secondary fire according to the statistics, but it won't feel like it when you use it. When close enough, you can pretty much blow your enemies away with primary. Secondary, not so much but still good.

Energy Sword
Changes: Eliminate Lunges, Increase Regular Melee Damage, Battery Powered in MP
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 1
Distance: 1
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 5
Melee: 5
Alternate: Duel-Wield

The dreaded lunges would be taken out and replaced with an instant kill up close. Duel-Melee (mentioned above) can also be used but would require you hit both swings. Course if you're duel-wielding, you probably already did some damage. Last but not least part of the balance, it would be battery powered in multiplayer. Since the battery would only degenerate if you kill someone, the Efficiency of this weapon goes straight to maximum.

This would make the sword much more difficult then before. If you're not duel-wielding, the sword moves with the movements you make with the right joystick. Swinging in the opposite direction your sword is on your hud will cause you to actually swing faster. Constantly do this and you may be less accurate and look like you're going berserk, but that's what you get for more swings.

Pressing B will make you do a jab attack. In order to do it accurately, you must keep the sword in the center of the screen using the right joystick.

Using charged melee (mentioned above) causes your character to do a large swing you can use all around you with the left joystick along with the attack. For example, do this while moving the left joystick down, and your character would spin around to hit someone behind him. This can be done left and right as well.

BR55 (Battle Rifle)
Changes: Slower Reload, Decreased Power
Resistance: 2
Fatality: 4
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 4
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 2

Alternate: Burst-Fire Mode
Resistance: 3
Fatality: 4
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 4
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 2

What I am suggesting, is a significant decrease in this weapons power on all levels, including damage and accuracy. Give each single bullet about the same power and accuracy as a magnum. Keep in mind this weapon is a rifle. It will still live up when it comes to delivering headshots, but will have a much tougher time taking down shields then before.

Burst-Fire Mode changes a single shot fire weapon, to the rifle we remember. Standard multiplayer Battle Rifles will start in single shot fire mode, which is better for longer range battles. In comparison to the magnum and burst-fire mode, the magnum will be able to shoot faster but this will shoot slightly more accurately.

Carbine
Changes: Decreased Power
Resistance: 3
Fatality: 4
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 3
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 2

Alternate: Plasma Charge
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 1
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 4
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 2

The same goes for this. Less power and accuracy but not quite as much. In this balance, the Carbine may be an even better choice then the Battle Rifle but shots are harder to make. Though the Carbine was more powerful in Halo 2, it wasn't as easy to use as the Battle Rifle since it didn't have an accurate burst.

This Plasma Charge is just like what we have in Halo 2, but it comes at a very steep price. The weapon takes two seconds to charge, uses an entire magazine and when it overheats from the shot, you must hold the gun in your hand, unable to switch to your secondary weapon. You can, however, throw grenades and melee when your overheated. Overall, this weapon is very easy to use only because it comes with full homing priviligies.

S2 AM (Sniper Rifle)
Changes: Remove 'No-scope' Crosshair
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 5
Distance: 5
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 1
Alternate: Nightvision

Though it may have seemed balanced enough at first glance in Halo 2, through gameplay shows that this could use a little equilization. As it goes for every weapon, a little degrade with auto-aim is all it needs.

Nightvision is self explanatory and we've seen this used in Halo 1 so I don't feel much need to explain in detail what it is. It allows you to see in the dark but can be too bright in some situations.

Beam Rifle
Changes: Remove 'No-scope' Crosshair
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 5
Distance: 5
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 1
Alternate: Jackal Vision

As it was in Halo 2, desiding between the Sniper and the Beam Rifle would all be determined by preference. The Sniper could get four shots in quick but required you to reload at least every four shots as well. The Beam Rifle can keep the shots coming for the consentrated player that doesn't panic in firefights.

This weapons alternate is implemented to help jackals target enemies easier but can also be used for you as well. While using it, everything in your scope would appears blue, but once there's an animate object appears in your scope, it's shown in white.

  • 03.18.2006 8:18 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Brute Shot
Changes: Larger Blast Radius
Resistance: 4
Fatality: 4
Distance: 2
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 5

Alternate: Plasma Grenade Launcher
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 3
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 5

The new Brute Shot would return just like you remember it, but with a few adjustments. Each grenade is charged with explosive red plasma. Though for the balance this wouldn't increase its power, it would make it shoot larger projectiles making it slightly easier to hit your target. Plus, the shots will explode on contact, making a larger blast radius

It would also come equipped with a Plasma Grenade Launcher. All this would do, is make your grenade more accurate. Yet, only one grenade at a time can be loaded at a time.

Sentinel Beam
Changes: Power Change
Resistance: 3
Fatality: 3
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 3
Melee: 3

Alternate: Power Change
Damage: 4
Fatality: 3
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 2
Melee: 3

Power Change will change the type of lazer the Sentinel Beam shoots. The primary lazer color is yellow and doesn't overheat as quickly but won't do as much damage. The secondary, blue lazer is for more accurate, professional players. As you might expect, it does more damage but overheats faster. Because it overheats so quickly, even pros might want to stick with the primary lazer.

M41 SSR MAV/AW (Rocket Launcher)
Changes:
Resistance: 3
Fatality: 5
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 2
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 4
Alternate: Lock-On

This weapon of all of them I have the most trouble desiding how to balance. I came to this conclusion. It would be a hard to master weapon unlike it's previous versions. Taking down shields won't be as easy as it used to. A direct hit would still kill instantly but indirect hits would do much less damage. An indirect hit includes anything that doesn't hit you directly even if its right under your feet. Shields would be able to take one indirect hit and they would drop to about half power depending on how hard they're hit. Once they're down however, it only takes one more indirect hit to finish them off.

About the lock-on feature. How about if each vehicle comes equipped with some sort of lock-on warning, just like the military. In other words, they will be able to know if the rocket is coming and if they're lucky, they can get out in time or even dodge it if they're in a Banshee using flips. Thereby, adding another gameplay element that keeps weighty elements in balance. About the other vehicles, they're on their own. I guess they should be in the right place at the right time or get out before their vehicle blows up. On a final note, lock on is used by holding Y instead of holding down right trigger. I know that's common sense since Alternate is Y but I had to make sure you got that.

Fuel Rod Cannon
Changes: Battery Powered, charged weapon
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 5
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 3

Alternate: Fuel Rod Launcher
Resistance: 5
Fatality: 5
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 1
Efficiency: 1
Melee: 3

Of all the weapons, this one may be the most difficult to use. This one would be capable of one hit kills but it would be very hard to get. Instead of a magazine fed weapon, it would be battery charged and each shot would be required to charge but there is a catch. Charge it for too long and the shot would burst out. Each shot would be required to charge at the scene of the action making it a very, very hard weapon to use, but extremely powerful. I'd say it would take about 1.5 seconds to charge it, but hold it for 5 seconds and the shot would burst out.

The Fuel Rod Launcher uses the same incredible power and launches grenade-like fuel rods. These grenades are just like plasma grenades, only stickies are not nearly as powerful as these. But, with awesome power, comes balance. It must also be charged like the primary fire.

M9 HE-DP (Frag Grenade)
Changes: Slower Arming Time, Longer Fuse, Much Larger Blast Radius
Resi: 3
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 3
Lethal: 5
Efficient: 2

Implying the rule 'nothing appears out of no where,' you can't just have an armed grenade ready to throw in your hand all of a sudden. Each time you use a grenade, it requires you to pull the string of the grenade off your suit, move your arm back ready to throw, and then finally throw. All this shouldn't happen in the blink of an eye especially in a this type of shooter.

If you remember Halo 1, grenade explosions were massive compared to Halo 2. Decreasing their power was an act of balance, but now I think we should go for the larger explosions since arming time would be slower.

Plasma Grenade
Changes: Slower Arming Time, Much Longer Fuse, Larger Blast Radius
Damage: 5
Distance: 4
Difficulty: 1
Lethal: 3
Efficient: 2

Same rules apply, only as usual, each weapon is different to the next one. The grenade can be armed with on hand which is a little faster. The fuse on this one, as it was in Halo 1, is a little longer then the Frag Grenade. Although it would have a larger blast radius, it won't be quite a big as the Frag Grenade.


Returning Weapons:

M6B (Pistol)
Changes: No scope, inability to deliver headshots
Damage: 4
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 3
Lethal: 1
Efficient: 3
Melee: 4
Alternate: Duel-Wield

This is my version of the old pistol. It would look the same except it's black and would act more like a plasma weapon, damage wise.

This weapon only has 6 shots per magazine and they're easy shots to make, only they must all hit their target if they're to take down a person's shields. That may be the catch to it but it can duel-wielded so the player desides what to do from there. A magnum and this may be a deadly combo. For coolness while in duel-wield, the pistol would be slanted toward the center of the screen but not quite completely sideways. Just slanted enough for the Chief to use it accurately. In the long run, it doesn't change the gameplay much but it'd look cool.

MA5B (Assault Rifle)
Changes: More power!
Damage: 3
Distance: 3
Difficulty: 5
Lethal: 2
Efficient: 2
Melee: 3
Alternate: Frag Grenade Launcher

The Assault Rifle has returned, but it won't be like an SMG. This one would be used for longer distance fights then that. The damage on this one would be massive, but it would have some trouble with shield, so basically, not much changes other then its brute power. Fortunately, it will come equipped with a Frag Grenade Launcher. Hold Y (standard) to load a frag grenade and once you're ready, let her rip. This would launch your grenade farther and faster, but not stronger then if you just threw one. Only one grenade can be loaded at a time but that's all you'll need.

  • 03.18.2006 8:18 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Other ideas:

These are other ideas that didn't associate with balance, but were either too cool not to put in here, or helped the gameplay somehow.

Carriable Active Camoflauge and Overshield:
Oh yes, you heard me right. Instead of having powerups that can only be triggered by walking through them, a powerup spawn has two little grenade-like powerups that can be accessed by holding D-Pad Up and pressing either Left Trigger for Active Camoflauge or Right Trigger for Overshield. This would make your character take out the powerup as if it were a grenade. When your character presses the button to activate it, he then holds it close to his chest to gain the effect.

When your character uses the powerup, an orb like the ones we see inside the walk-through versions, appears covering your hand. Once your character holds it close, your screen will either blur like it does for camo, or flash like it does for overshields. The powerup fuses into your suit and the outer shell of the powerup disappears.

There is a catch though. The hand powerups are not as strong as the walk-through powerups but they can be combined together. The camoflauge is transparant but can be easily visible to those paying attention. Think of these like Halo 2's version in terms of visibility. Once two or more are combined together though, they create a stronger, harder to see camo.

The hand-overshield can only charge up one bar by itself meaning red on the meter, but use another one and it will charge to full overshield.

Disappearing HUD:
For machinima creators, when pressing D-Pad Down, your character will put the weapon down at ease, instead of just looking like you are when people look at you while on your screen, you're still holding it up. Not only that, but your crosshair fades out with it. After three seconds, your entire HUD fades out making fullscreen machinima more convenient to the ameteur creator. This would apply to every weapon, including things like the rocket launcher, only that will go on your back, of course.

Four little ammo saving ideas:
Every paragraph from here on to the next topic will alternate between an idea and an example to make sense of it. The example will always be the sniper.

Why not have the ability to hold any two weapons or combinations regardless of if they're the same or not? The advantage to this would be you get more ammo for the same gun. The catch is that's all you'll be able to carry. More options to the player can only help the game, not hurt it.

You will have two snipers, one you're holding and one in secondary. Your maximum capacity of extra ammo is now 40 extra rounds not to mention the rounds in the guns. You pick up a different weapon, and you'll only have 20 extra rounds. The rest of it, drops with the sniper you just dropped.

Many-a-bullet has been wasted because of this. When you pick up ammo, not the gun, you only take what you need to get up to full. The rest of it disappears into thin air.

Each ammo clip has 12 rounds in it. If you have 19 rounds of extra ammo and you pick up an ammo clip, the other 11 rounds disappear. How about every time you have less then the maximum capacity (20 rounds), you take the entire clip and nothing less. Meaning, if your in the right situation, you will be capable of carrying 31 extra rounds if you take a clip when you have 19 rounds. If you have two snipers and pick up a clip when you already have 39 rounds, you'll be able to carry 51 extra rounds. Total, in the guns and the maximum supply you can carry, equals 59 rounds. Look out Elites!

One thing I've noticed other games do is when you shoot, you can pick up extra ammo to replace what you've just shot without reloading. That's another thing that should be implemented to save ammo and time.

You've just made three shots and there's a sniper on the ground next to you. All you have to do is reload and you can take three shots of extra ammo from that gun, but you don't have time for that! You have to get the hell out of there because your shields are down and there's a grenade flying toward your position!

When a weapon is dropped and has loads of extra ammo, they are dropped separately from the gun.

If the dropped sniper has 12 shots or less, everything stays in the gun. Anything higher than that makes clips that must be picked up separately. Example, if you had 13 shots when you dropped your gun, you will be dropping a fully loaded Sniper (4 loaded and 8 extra) and a clip with one bullet in it.

Switching Sides:
Press D-Pad Down to make each weapon switch to the other hand. This process would be slow because your character would not only be switching guns to the other side. They would also be putting their extra ammo on the other side as well. When you do this, your crosshair would still disappear if you hold down the button, the HUD would still disappear after three seconds, and your weapons would stay down too. Only, when you bring your weapons back up, they would be switched around.


That's a wrap, "pheu". I hope you liked it. I'm still open for critisism though. And Bungie? Good luck, the world is watching.

  • 03.18.2006 8:19 AM PDT
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I agree with everything you said. Seriously.

Also, the black button being used to drop a weapon works smoothly--that way (like in the Halo 2 demo) you could have two small-arms in reserve. Also, the weakened melees are a nice touch.

I also like making the needler stronger and balancing the plasma pistol.

Great ideas.

  • 03.18.2006 8:33 AM PDT
Subject: Project: Balance (warning, very long)

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Project: Balance

edit: Well isn't this something? My thread is now the most popular thread on the entire website! You wannna hear something really messed up? I don't even agree with many of the ideas I've made here. Since this thread, I've made 2 more updated versions that I think you should devote your attention to, not this. Here's the links:

Version 2
Latest Version but you must join Popular Fusion first to read it

I'll leave the original version up just for... whatever but you really shouldn't waste your time reading it. Join Popular Fusion and read the new version.




Table of Contents:

Associated Balance Ideas
Attribute Descriptions:
Model of Comparison
Weapon Balance
Returning Weapons
Other Ideas


Associated Balance Ideas:

These are the ideas that must be mentioned before you read to understand some of the other things I mention in the main project.

Supply Visability:
Halo 2 improved on the ability to see exactly what type of shielding a person had by adding the animations for dead shields, recharging shields, and overshields but it's now time to implement supply visability. Everything you keep on you including your secondary weapon, ammo for each weapon, and grenades would be visible.

Supply Dropping:
When a person is killed, only the things in their hands are separated from their body. Extra ammo, grenades, and secondary weapons stay attached to the body. For a person to get the grenades and ammo, they must walk through the body. Just hold X to get the secondary weapon. Hold Y for the left hand weapon in secondary. (more on that later)

Example: If a sniper is dropped when the person dies, the gun can hold 4 rounds and 8 extra. Any extra ammo after that is attached to the body. If a person is trying to arm a grenade when they die, that grenade will either blow up later if it was armed, or drop to the ground free.

Full Weapon Switch Animation:
This is a natural balance element, fixing the dubbed 'noob combo', 'sword hiding', and any other cheap stategies that are impossible to predict by hiding and preparing the other weapon in sedondary. Instead of your hands disappearing off screen and coming back holding a new weapon, your character literally places the weapon on his back, or to his sides depending on the weapon. Having the ability to switch between weapons incredibly quickly was a balance issue in itself, let alone, it was just too unrealistic, even for a video game like this.

Movement in Scope:
While in scope, your character would strafe slower then if he wasn't in scope. As always, more realism and balance apply.

No Auto-Aim, Not Tracking:
An idea like this can only be explained in an example. When you aim a Battle Rifle at someone, you may notice when they move, your suit seems to follow them without you doing anything to follow them. This is not auto-aim and it should stay. Auto-aim is when you shoot a burst round at an enemy somewhat distant and somehow, all the bullets land in the head of their target. This is unrealistic, even for a Spartan. This is what needs to be taken out

Head Tracking:
Head Tracking is the tracking that stays locked onto an enemy's head while you're shooting. Though this is vital to a console game like Halo, I feel the tracking is still too sensitive.

Duel-Reload:
Instead of slowing down Duel-Wield reload so significantly, I see no reason for balance purposes to do that, so why not take it out? Although, bringing your weapon down will still take time, waiting three seconds after gun is reloaded is not nessisary. That three seconds is what I want taken out.

Secondary Duel-Wield:
Instead of pressing Y to drop your gun, you press Black. Black isn't used when you're duel-wielding anyway. This way, you can hold both guns in secondary by pressing Y. To further this idea, your HUD would display the duel-wielded, alternate weapon next to the grenades or ammo of the duel-wielded weapon you're already holding depending on what you have at the time. Some of you may already be getting ideas as you read this as I did. Can you say quadruple-wielding? This will either be space for more ammo or another deadly combo. Maybe keep duel-wielded needlers as backup for unexpected situations or keep even more ammo for the quickly depleting supply of magnum ammunition.

Secondary Duel-Wield Recovery
To bring up a secondary weapon and duel-wield it with a weapon you're already holding, hold Y and press D-Pad left for your left gun or D-Pad right for your right gun. This will take your secondary weapon from either your left hand or right and put it in your current left hand. For this to work, your primary gun must be obviously duel-wieldable. To many times have I tryed to duel-wield a plasma pistol while holding a magnum in my left hand expecting the magnum to fall to the ground but instead, it goes into my secondary slot because I don't have a secondary weapon. Why would you want a magnum in your right hand and a plasma pistol in your left? It's faster to drop your duel-wield, reload, and pick up your duel-wield then it is to reload holding two weapons. Why would you want this if duel-reload is going to be faster? It would still be a way to recover a weapon in secondary and combine it with other weapons.

Duel-Melee:
While Duel-Wielding, you can press B and not drop your duel-wield and instead, melee. All melee hits will be 2/3 their original power but would be able to hit one after the other in one successful movement but you won't be able to just keep hitting non-stop.

Charged Melee:
Double-tap B to deliver a devastating melee attack that kills instantly. This attack is different depend on the weapon and the character. For most weapons, each character does this attack like this. A Spartan leans back to put momentum into the attack, then lunges forward with the bud of the weapon in front. An Elite jumps into the air with the gun above his head and attempts to hit the enemy's head. (Note: this is the same attack we see Elite AI use)

Alternate Fire: For alternate fire, hold Y. Alternate fire is also the way to duel-wield so alternate fire only applies to any weapon that cannot be duel-wielded. What the alternate fire does depends on the weapon.

Attribute Descriptions:

All weapons are given a score from 1 to 5 for all attributes. Each weapon must have an average of 3 among these stats, meaning 18 if you add it up. You may not understand this now, but you will once you see this in action. Now for the attributes I'll be balancing. Please read this carefully so there's no confusion:

Resistance: How well this weapon fares against enemy shielding. This does not mean how much every shot does or does it have anything to do with shieldless foes.

Fatality: How deadly this weapon is once the shields are down. It can also mean how close you have to be to deliver a headshot effectively, and efficiently.

Distance: The distance a weapon can be used effectively, not how far you can shoot with it.

Difficulty: How accurate, predictable, and on-queue this weapon can be.

Efficiency: How long and often you'll be reloading or overheating with this weapon.

Melee: How difficult and deadly melee with this weapon is. Difficult, meaning how much time is taken per each attack. The old sniper is a good example.


Model of Comparison:


I've made a scale to compare other weapons to, just so you can see where I'm going with all this. As you can see, 1 is the worst and 5 is the best. 1=hardest, 5=easiest, 1=close range, 5=long range, you get the picture. The actual weapon descriptions are after this:

Resistance:
1: SMG
2: Magnum
3: Plasma Rifle
4: Brute Shot
5: Sniper Rifle

Fatality:
1: Plasma Rifle
2: SMG
3: Magnum
4: Battle Rifle
5: Sniper Rifle

Distance:
1: Sword
2: SMG
3: Magnum
4: Battle Rifle
5: Sniper Rifle

Difficulty:
1: Sniper Rifle
2: Shotgun
3: Carbine
4: Battle Rifle
5: SMG

Efficiency:
1: Sniper Rifle
2: Shotgun
3: Needler
4: Plasma Pistol
5: Plasma Rifle

Melee:
1: Plasma Pistol
2: Battle Rifle
3: SMG
4: Rocket Launcher
5: Sword

[Edited on 5/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 8:17 AM PDT

Wow, that was long. Very impressive though. I like it.

I enjoy the use of all of the buttons. I feel sometimes my other fingers are left out and it's too simple to learn the controls. This should prove interesting.

  • 03.18.2006 8:51 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
I agree with everything you said. Seriously.

Also, the black button being used to drop a weapon works smoothly--that way (like in the Halo 2 demo) you could have two small-arms in reserve. Also, the weakened melees are a nice touch.

I also like making the needler stronger and balancing the plasma pistol.

Great ideas.


That was the idea. Being able to duel-wield and still be able to do everything without having to juggle your weapons to do it.

Many of these ideas/changes influence the game so much. Like I said, they redefine the game. With less focus on rifles and headshots, the game becomes something completely different.

One thing I'd like to point out. You notice how Bungie had to alter a lot of damages in the auto-update? I noticed many people instantly meleeing when they got to close-quarters instead of keeping on shooting. The update made it fair to those who have reflexes but there's a reason why they did that. And do you know what that is kids? That's right, unbalance!

I believe I have single handedly written up a more balanced system yet still fun then Halo 2 was. Then again, I don't make games, so who am I to say what works and what doesn't. This is Bungie's game, not mine. Remember kids, stay in school, and always question authority, even if you have no right to.
:)

  • 03.18.2006 9:35 AM PDT
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let bungie do there work i dont want halo 3 or 4 or 5 completly diff. from the first 2
ok!!!
U DONT WORK THERE
if they have made 2 really good sellin games, they probobly wont make the next in the series that much diff.

  • 03.18.2006 10:04 AM PDT
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Good ideas

  • 03.18.2006 10:11 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Sorry Grunts-killer, I thought I just said the exact opposite of that and that I was entitled to my opinion. I never told them how to do their job, I was just saying what would be nice. So far, out of all the places I've posted this, I still haven't gotten a intelligent response that was negative about the project on a whole. What that would probably say is "but I like MLG, why do you have to take it away from me?", which is illegal to talk about on the forums anyway.

Edit: I wasn't talking to myself. I was having an intelligent conversation with a member till we got on the subject of h2:ce. That turned into advertising. Just skip the next few posts and I'll make sure next time to quote people more often.

[Edited on 3/19/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:13 AM PDT
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If you want an example of balance, see h2:ce. Perfect.

I don't agree with several things... why decrease the power of the battle rifle? If anything, auto-aim just needs to be toned down, like every other weapon.

You can never have full balance with dual-wielding... either you have too weak of a gun, or too powerful of a gun. Balance means that every weapon stands an equal chance against every other weapon. 1 = 1. Now, if you add 'half-guns' like the smg in, it's gonna be .5 = 1. Sure, you could go pick up another, but it takes time, and within that time you're completely vulnerable to anybody who managed to spawn near a two-handed gun. Why not pick up a two-handed gun in the first place?

That's the problem with starting with smg's. It turns the game into a weapon-whoring frenzy when coupled with the weapon spawn system. Whoever spawns near the 'good' weapon will dominate everyone else until a) they run out of ammo, or b) a random grenade takes them out, and the next person picks up the weapon and resumes the ownage.

  • 03.18.2006 10:15 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

The point is not to make it fully balanced. It is to make it more balanced. Fully balanced is boring and unentertaining. This should do it.

and 2: Name that weapon with this system

[Edited on 3/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:18 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

If anything, auto-aim just needs to be toned down, like every other weapon.

And if you had read the whole thing, you would know that I did say that.

  • 03.18.2006 10:22 AM PDT
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I still believe h2:ce is the most balanced, fun version of Halo 2 ever created. The people that worked on this really payed attention to details... even changing things like:

-90 degree fov
-effectiveness of grenades flipping vehicles
-slight run speed increase (at first i wasn't a fan of this, but when I actually played it, it was amazing)
-changed HUD (to the e3 multiplayer version)

I highly recommend it.

[Edited on 3/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:25 AM PDT
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Posted by: bansheeownz
If anything, auto-aim just needs to be toned down, like every other weapon.

And if you had read the whole thing, you would know that I did say that.


...you also suggested decreasing overall power of the gun, if I'm not mistaken. Something like 'the ability of taking down shields' being lowered.

[edit] What I am suggesting, is a significant decrease in this weapons power on all levels, including damage and accuracy. Give each single bullet about the same power and accuracy as a magnum. Keep in mind this weapon is a rifle. It will still live up when it comes to delivering headshots, but will have a much tougher time taking down shields then before.

[Edited on 3/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:26 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

I am only one man, and I have never see h2:ce, sounds great. However, I do believe my implementation is quite effective.

p.s: where can 1 read about this h2:ce?

  • 03.18.2006 10:28 AM PDT
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There is a link in my signature.

I'm sorry we have different views, but atleast we both agree that balance is a good thing. :)

  • 03.18.2006 10:30 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

That sounds spectacular, however it doesn't have what makes Halo 2 great. Duel-wielding, it's contagious. I mean seriously, it's on the front cover of the game! It seems my project is still a draft. However, what if there was a way to make duel-wielding more stategic?

Did you ever notice, for every weapon that cannot be duel-wielded has some other neat feature? I suppose that's just an excuse, but overall, the duel-wields would not be powerful enough to be 'whored'. I think there should be enough all around to make a spawning from anywhere almost near, well, fair. The weakening of the BR does just that.

Example: Who would win, 2SMG vs. BR, Distance: 3. With this balance, it's anybody's guess.

Faster running ability? Why didn't I put that in? I thought about it but never did. You're a slug in Halo 2.

  • 03.18.2006 10:44 AM PDT
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Nah, in h2:ce you don't really miss dual-wielding at all... all the weapons are amazingly well done.

I see your point though.

  • 03.18.2006 10:50 AM PDT
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The Marty Army

Ah, look at the lonely people...

Speedier needler, like in the e3 beta video.

I don't fully understand what you meant by the carbine's overcharge. Personally, I think the Carbine should also have the 3-round burst option, as well.

I also think the plasma pistol should return to it's original overcharge state, the "plasma missile" as I like to think of it.

I think the Halo: CE pistol should come back, in it's original form, but much weaker. Not the 3-headshot kill, but more of an 6-8 headshot kill.

Other than that, though, I totally agree.

[Edited on 3/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:51 AM PDT

If you want to see the MC die, play Legendary. If you want to see MC finish the fight, play Halo 3. If you want to see MC finish the fight by dieing, why did you waste six years when you could have done it yourself right now?

☼►Popular Fusion - Doing anything, everything, and then some.◄☼

Posted by: WhiteRaven119
Speedier needler, like in the e3 beta video.

I don't fully understand what you meant by the carbine's overcharge. Personally, I think the Carbine should also have the 3-round burst option, as well.

I also think the plasma pistol should return to it's original overcharge state, the "plasma missile" as I like to think of it.

I think the Halo: CE pistol should come back, in it's original form, but much weaker. Not the 3-headshot kill, but more of an 6-8 headshot kill.

Other than that, though, I totally agree.


Are you suggesting increasing the projectile speed of the PP too? Other then that, the PP shot faster too. I don't know about that. The PR has to be more powerful in some way then the PP. It is after all a higher ranking weapon.

It's the Halo 2 charge on a rifle but takes a long time.

[Edited on 3/18/2006]

  • 03.18.2006 10:58 AM PDT
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The Marty Army

Ah, look at the lonely people...

Ah, I see.

No, the PP, I meant up the power of the regular shot just a little bit, and return the overcharge to what it was in Halo 1.

  • 03.18.2006 11:02 AM PDT
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PK 11 I PMed you some questions regarding H2 CE, I really wanna know some more info before I play it. :)

  • 03.18.2006 11:04 AM PDT
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The Marty Army

Ah, look at the lonely people...

H2 CE is confusing to set up. I've been wanting to do it on my old Xbox (I've got a 360 now), but I'm too confused as to even how to put it on my 'box.

  • 03.18.2006 11:05 AM PDT
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Posted by: grunts_killer
let bungie do there work i dont want halo 3 or 4 or 5 completly diff. from the first 2
ok!!!
U DONT WORK THERE
if they have made 2 really good sellin games, they probobly wont make the next in the series that much diff.

So? He has amazing ideas.

  • 03.18.2006 11:33 AM PDT