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Subject: Whats up with the UNSC Scorpion?

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The UNSC's MBT is inferior to all of today's 3rd Generation MBTs.

Compare the UNSC's M808B MBT to a modern day M1 Abrams.

The M1 Abrams is slightly better in almost every way. 506 years into the future and humanity can't even come up with a better MBT? I just don't get it...


[Edited on 08.14.2011 7:45 PM PDT]

  • 08.14.2011 7:44 PM PDT

*Facepalm*

Discussion has been done to death.

The scorpion is essentially a light MBT compared to today, and is frankly all that's needed by the UNSC at the time.

The grizzly is comparable to, or greater then the Abrams.

You must remember in those 500 years was a massive period of ZERO CONFLICT. When there was not weapons research, and all the funding/development was in colonization.

  • 08.14.2011 7:54 PM PDT

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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
*Facepalm*

Discussion has been done to death.

The scorpion is essentially a light MBT compared to today, and is frankly all that's needed by the UNSC at the time.

The grizzly is comparable to, or greater then the Abrams.

You must remember in those 500 years was a massive period of ZERO CONFLICT. When there was not weapons research, and all the funding/development was in colonization.

  • 08.14.2011 7:58 PM PDT
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I wouldn't say there's been no research canonically, because someone managed to make god-damn super people. Real reason, its a game, tanks that are fast, reload quickly, and are for all intents and purposes indestructible are not fun.

  • 08.14.2011 8:00 PM PDT

With zero conflict, it's reasonable to believe that the technology could have died with the generations.

Kind of like some nukes nowadays need retired scientists to come back from retirement to deactivate them.

Or the movie of how they had to send 3 old scientists to space to repair a satelite that no one else knew how to repair

  • 08.14.2011 8:01 PM PDT

I changed my account, this one will no longer be used.

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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
*Facepalm*

Discussion has been done to death.

I had no idea... I never go on this forum.
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
The scorpion is essentially a light MBT compared to today, and is frankly all that's needed by the UNSC at the time.

The grizzly is comparable to, or greater then the Abrams.

You must remember in those 500 years was a massive period of ZERO CONFLICT. When there was not weapons research, and all the funding/development was in colonization.

That makes sense. Thanks for clearing that up, I kept thinking about that while playing Halo: Reach today.

  • 08.14.2011 8:02 PM PDT


Posted by: Da Sargent
I wouldn't say there's been no research canonically, because someone managed to make god-damn super people. Real reason, its a game, tanks that are fast, reload quickly, and are for all intents and purposes indestructible are not fun.


Um, that research happened a number of years after the rebels started fighting.

To the OP, Understandable, Didn't mean to be rude with that line lol.

  • 08.14.2011 8:14 PM PDT

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Doesn't the scorpion reload a lot faster, require less crew and still have a pretty big explosion for 90mm? I think that's pretty good for a "light" MBT.

  • 08.14.2011 8:22 PM PDT

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The scorpion's armour could be VERY strong. It's easy to deploy, fast, maneuverable, fast reload, easy to build.

  • 08.14.2011 8:27 PM PDT

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Posted by: hello2k9
Doesn't the scorpion reload a lot faster, require less crew and still have a pretty big explosion for 90mm? I think that's pretty good for a "light" MBT.


You just need one person to man a Scorpion, so yeah, it is really efficient.

  • 08.14.2011 8:28 PM PDT

Wow...the people on this forum are not very bright...

I encourage you people to know what the -blam!- you're talking about before replying with bull--blam!- answers like "light main battle tank".

Only an idiot would try to claim a main battle tank can be a light tank. It's a MBT for reason.

Secondly, only a moron would classify a 66 ton tank as a light tank.

Thirdly, the Scorpion tank is quite frankly an ill-though out and poorly designed piece of crap. For God's sake, it was designed by a game developer who clearly had no idea what real tanks are like.

As to the OP, your grievances are legitimate. Unfortunately, like so many areas in the Halo universe, common sense and competence is severely lacking.

  • 08.14.2011 8:32 PM PDT
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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
*Facepalm*

Discussion has been done to death.

The scorpion is essentially a light MBT compared to today, and is frankly all that's needed by the UNSC at the time.

The grizzly is comparable to, or greater then the Abrams.

You must remember in those 500 years was a massive period of ZERO CONFLICT. When there was not weapons research, and all the funding/development was in colonization.


Someone didn't do research on MBT classification...

light tank isn't even a MBT (Main Battle Tank). Let me explain something about MBT. MBT is classified as Main Battle Tank where it is designed to be all purpose tank, with high firepower and well armored.

By the way, Scorpion is NOT light tank because of their weight. To classify the light tank, it has to be less than roughly 40-45 tons.

And it is fact that Abrams is vastly superior to the Scorpion, as it already stated in other Abrams vs thread.

  • 08.14.2011 8:36 PM PDT

It's a game, someone didn't know how to exactly design a tank at the drawing board, but there's only a few things that are a little off in my opinion, but I won't even get into it, like someone said, the other thead was enough. And in alot of ways, the Scorpion is superior to the Abrams. So what's the big deal?

  • 08.14.2011 8:41 PM PDT
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Then, may I ask what would you expect? A walking tripod?

The scorpions' design may also be more effective for transport, giving infantry mobile support on the go, seeing that wars in the future are not based solely on Earth.

  • 08.14.2011 8:47 PM PDT

The M808B is considered "light" by standard definitions but has served as the UNSC's main battle tank well before the Human-Covenant War.

That is the specific line I got "Light MBT" from. I'm talking firepower, not weight.

Just like you have light frigates, heavy frigates, why can't we say "That MBT is, in terms of firepower/armor (or both), light."

Either way, the Abrams was shown to be better, but not massively so. Regardless, I think you all are taking my wording way to seriously.

  • 08.14.2011 8:53 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

All I know it's still effective against Covenant vehicles.

  • 08.14.2011 8:54 PM PDT

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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
The M808B is considered "light" by standard definitions but has served as the UNSC's main battle tank well before the Human-Covenant War.

That is the specific line I got "Light MBT" from. I'm talking firepower, not weight.

Just like you have light frigates, heavy frigates, why can't we say "That MBT is, in terms of firepower/armor (or both), light."

Either way, the Abrams was shown to be better, but not massively so. Regardless, I think you all are taking my wording way to seriously.

No.

  • 08.14.2011 8:54 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra
All I know it's still effective against Covenant vehicles.


Uh what?

It takes two to three shots to drop wraith. As I recall, most of scorpions uses 90mm HE shells since it is cheap to mass produce and cost efficient. By the way, we knew that HE shells wouldn't do so well against heavily armored vehicles, even without reactive armor or depleted uranium meshes.

Sure, it is effective against ghosts and banshees. Sadly, if wraith's mortar hits a Scorpion, its done for. It's more like miss and hit game, actually.

  • 08.14.2011 8:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: raganok99
Uh what?

It takes two to three shots to drop wraith. As I recall, most of scorpions uses 90mm HE shells since it is cheap to mass produce and cost efficient. By the way, we knew that HE shells wouldn't do so well against heavily armored vehicles, even without reactive armor or depleted uranium meshes.

Sure, it is effective against ghosts and banshees. Sadly, if wraith's mortar hits a Scorpion, its done for. It's more like miss and hit game, actually.


Well, I wonder which would win:
A Tank, or an Artillery piece.

WHY did they create anti-tank weapons, I wonder.

  • 08.14.2011 9:02 PM PDT


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
All I know it's still effective against Covenant vehicles.


Exactly, it's not like there were other tanks out there(manufactured by other factions) to fight the Scorpion. I mean seriously, who's going to go to war with the UNSC? The UNSC is on every colony, nearly every outpost, so there's really no need to try and protect against other tanks. The Scorpion autoloads, it fires high velocity 90mm rounds that are effective against the Covenant, and seems to have great armor.

  • 08.14.2011 9:04 PM PDT


Posted by: MisterBraz

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
All I know it's still effective against Covenant vehicles.


Exactly, it's not like there were other tanks out there(manufactured by other factions) to fight the Scorpion. I mean seriously, who's going to go to war with the UNSC? The UNSC is on every colony, nearly every outpost, so there's really no need to try and protect against other tanks. The Scorpion autoloads, it fires high velocity 90mm rounds that are effective against the Covenant, and seems to have great armor.


Scorpion can be mounted with a 105mm cannon as well.

Then if you really have to punch a hole, grab a grizzly.

Also to the guy who responded to my last post "No" what?

  • 08.14.2011 9:05 PM PDT

Why are you looking here?

If everything was realistic then the covenant would've gon straight to glassing

  • 08.14.2011 9:06 PM PDT

XxXD3LuuX3 X luuC1d17YXxX

We have no knowledge of the weapons poweron the Scorpion, or it's armor strength, it weighs as much as an Abrams, but it has a smaller crew, it's armor is also a ceramic compound so it's lighter than the Abrams, we have no idea if the Abrams could even penetrate the Scorpions armor.


But, yes the Scorpion does seem badly designed.

Why didn't bungie just retcon it's wieght to 35 tons or so?
Then the airlifting capabilities would make since, as would the smaller gun. If anything is wrong with it, it was because of a lack of research on Bungies part. I mean they make games, not tanks for a living.

  • 08.14.2011 9:07 PM PDT

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/M512_Smooth_Bore_High_Velocity_Can non

90mm tungsten armor piercing ballistic capped round, while it does say on halo.wikia that armor piercing capabilite is sacraficed for more explosive filler, it still says its a high velocity gun.
Posted by: raganok99

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
All I know it's still effective against Covenant vehicles.


Uh what?

It takes two to three shots to drop wraith. As I recall, most of scorpions uses 90mm HE shells since it is cheap to mass produce and cost efficient. By the way, we knew that HE shells wouldn't do so well against heavily armored vehicles, even without reactive armor or depleted uranium meshes.

Sure, it is effective against ghosts and banshees. Sadly, if wraith's mortar hits a Scorpion, its done for. It's more like miss and hit game, actually.


[Edited on 08.14.2011 9:11 PM PDT]

  • 08.14.2011 9:10 PM PDT
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Posted by: Makko Mace
We have no knowledge of the weapons poweron the Scorpion, or it's armor strength, it weighs as much as an Abrams, but it has a smaller crew, it's armor is also a ceramic compound so it's lighter than the Abrams, we have no idea if the Abrams could even penetrate the Scorpions armor.


But, yes the Scorpion does seem badly designed.

Why didn't bungie just retcon it's wieght to 35 tons or so?
Then the airlifting capabilities would make since, as would the smaller gun. If anything is wrong with it, it was because of a lack of research on Bungies part. I mean they make games, not tanks for a living.


Sigh...

*facepalm*

Do I have to explain that Abrams uses 120mm AFSFSD rounds?

And, Abrams does use ceramic compound as well... and so? their weight is still similar with Scorpion. So it does not make that scorpion's ceramic compound to be magically lighter than Abrams.

Yes, it would be easier to retcon to change Scorpion's weights to make sense for tanks to be airlifted to the battle. Indeed, it is fault of Bungie for poorly researching. However, we can hope that 343i can fix this.

[Edited on 08.14.2011 9:22 PM PDT]

  • 08.14.2011 9:16 PM PDT

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