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This topic has moved here: Subject: Halo Cryptum sucks
  • Subject: Halo Cryptum sucks
Subject: Halo Cryptum sucks

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: ThePredkiller2
I loathed Cryptum, it completely goes against everything Bungie intended Halo to be. The Forerunners were supposed to be, what their name is, our Forerunners. Bungie intended Humanity to be the ancient evolutionary cousins of the Forerunners, not a completely different species. Its utterly ridiculous.


You're talking nonsense.

Bungie never gave us anything solid about the Forerunners. We had the Terminals and a few vague mentions of their endeavours, we had no insight in terms of their culture, purpose and what-not.

No, humanity was never supposed to be the "evolutionary cousins" of the Forerunners, that was never even hinted at - in fact, the Terminals flat out denies that humans and Forerunners are related to each other anyway.

It's like you're making shyte up to try to hate the novel. Bear was given the Story Bible, the document Bungie created so that he didn't deviate from established canonical information. You're either too blind or too stupid to understand that simple concept.

[Edited on 09.09.2011 7:40 AM PDT]

  • 09.09.2011 7:37 AM PDT

Halo Cryptum is awesome. It goes into extreme detail on their suits and tech while explaining their caste system. I can't wait for Greg Bear's next book. Also the forerunners can remain a mystery if you want you just don't have to read the book.

  • 09.09.2011 2:40 PM PDT


Posted by: KoO 101
Hating Cryptum because it "removes the mystery" of the Forerunners has to be the worst reason for hating it I've seen yet.

If you don't like Greg Bear's style of writing, fine, you don't like Cryptum. If for some reason you think it breaks canon because your canon was previously based on assumptions, fine, nitpick all you want; we all still know what the canon really is. But to say it's bad because it adds a backstory and helps explain the Terminals, where the Flood came from, how the Halo rings came to be, etc.? What a joke.

At least be man enough to admit that you really didn't like it because the words were too big for you to understand.


I loled these kids will never learn. As AJW34307 said it was already planned out in bungie's story bible most likely. I mean why would you leave out canon such as that? I thought it was an excellent book and anyone who didn't like it because it had forerunners, which it is called the FORERUNNER TRILOGY, then don't read no one forced you to do it.

[Edited on 09.09.2011 2:49 PM PDT]

  • 09.09.2011 2:49 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.

We don't know what is in the Bible. Bungie could have overwritten anything or added anything and we would be none the wiser. The Bible is obviously not constant as shown by the fact there were retcons, this means that the Forerunner's identity may not have been planned out from the start and Bungie may have added it in later.

On a side note, the Forerunners don't need to be revealed in the way Cryptum did. Yes, they played a big part in the universe but that doesn't mean we have to show them. For example: the Old Ones, Slann, and Necrons have been directly or indirectly responsible for everything in the Warhammer 40k universe and we still no next to nothing about them (slightly justified for the Slann, they seemed to have been replaced by the Old Ones in canon).

  • 09.09.2011 2:57 PM PDT
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SC = Supreme Commander/Supreme Canadian.

De Facto leader of the military of the APE (Allied Planets Empire).

Coup = Admiral Asskicker, ZPM hive ship

OP is mad that the Forerunners are technologically powerful now.

  • 09.09.2011 3:09 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter

Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.

[Edited on 09.09.2011 5:36 PM PDT]

  • 09.09.2011 5:33 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.

  • 09.09.2011 5:43 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.

  • 09.09.2011 5:49 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.


The Human-Covenant War is over. 343 is moving the story forward. That is what happens in stories, they move on. And the Precursors have been a huge mystery ever since we got a mention of them in the Halo 3 Beastirum.

You can't keep everything a mystery forever. Or would you rather the story stagnate?

[Edited on 09.09.2011 5:51 PM PDT]

  • 09.09.2011 5:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: ForeverAlone000
Why?
Because the forerunners are supposed to be a mystery in the Halo universe. Now we know too much... no mystery no fun!

Look at this -blam!-

I prefer them to be unknown thank you


At least we don't know much about the Precursors.....

  • 09.09.2011 5:58 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Jesus, the fact this community's whining because we are getting answers to questions we've asked for years is pathetic.

  • 09.09.2011 6:00 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Jesus, the fact this community's whining because we are getting answers to questions we've asked for years is pathetic.

Just because we ask does not mean they should answer.

  • 09.09.2011 6:18 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Jesus, the fact this community's whining because we are getting answers to questions we've asked for years is pathetic.

Just because we ask does not mean they should answer.


And may I ask why revelations about the Forerunners shouldn't be touched upon? What makes them so taboo?

  • 09.09.2011 6:22 PM PDT


Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.


I agree somewhat. It's an insult when somebody says the Forerunners and Precursors are part of a much better and larger story when they have not been the main focus for this whole time whatsoever within the primary media of Halo.
Larger story my ass. Think about if I were to write a fanfiction based on the wildlife that live on Halo. Then I say that it's part of a "much larger story!". Because that's basically what's happening.
This is why the Halo opinion among developers and the community is skewed: Everything is disjointed. The games tell the story of the Covenant and the Flood primarily, while some books are talking about something completely different.

It's not really to say that I think the Forerunners should have remained mysterious for too long, but the way they're going about explaining them is half-assed and messy. So unless Halo 4 is able to give me the necessary details in order to understand the plot, my opinion will not change.

I do have to commend Bungie for trying to keep it consistent and simple.

Games shouldn't play off of books because it will only lead to general confusion among not only the busy gamer, but to the general public.

Do the users on this forum really expect a gamer to have to buy a damn novel to understand the back story to a video game? If 343 isn't able to set their story straight through the media which they're projecting it in, then that's just incapability on their part.

I sound like Yahtzee, god. It's almost as much of an insult when that crap-spewing Bungie employee in a ViDoc said that "Campaign prepares an amazing story...! But Multiplayer's your meat."


[Edited on 09.09.2011 6:42 PM PDT]

  • 09.09.2011 6:37 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter


Posted by: BlueRuby2k10

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.


I agree somewhat. It's an insult when somebody says the Forerunners and Precursors are part of a much better and larger story when they have not been the main focus for this whole time whatsoever within the primary media of Halo.
Larger story my ass. Think about if I were to write a fanfiction based on the wildlife that live on Halo. Then I say that it's part of a "much larger story!". Because that's basically what's happening.
This is why the Halo opinion among developers and the community is skewed: Everything is disjointed. The games tell the story of the Covenant and the Flood primarily, while some books are talking about something completely different.

It's not really to say that I think the Forerunners should have remained mysterious for too long, but the way they're going about explaining them is half-assed and messy. So unless Halo 4 is able to give me the necessary details in order to understand the plot, my opinion will not change.

I do have to commend Bungie for trying to keep it consistent and simple.

Games shouldn't play off of books because it will only lead to general confusion among not only the busy gamer, but to the general public.

Do the users on this forum really expect a gamer to have to buy a damn novel to understand the back story to a video game? If 343 isn't able to set their story straight through the media which they're projecting it in, then that's just incapability on their part.

I sound like Yahtzee, god. It's almost as much of an insult when that crap-spewing Bungie employee in a ViDoc said that "Campaign prepares an amazing story...! But Multiplayer's your meat."


I appreciate your consideration and your balanced approach.

I just believe that believe that the entirety of Halo up to Reach was made with the ending of the MC and Cortana to have an open ended finish to a great story. This saga lasted 9 years. And OK i guess 343 could continue using this universe to make more games for this franchise.

BUT don't crowbar in a ton of caveats and additions that now force us to disregard the cannon we have been spoon fed and loved for a DECADE(that spanned the entire length of the franchise).

  • 09.09.2011 6:49 PM PDT

Wow. Thought this thread was dead. Glad to see I'm not the only one less than thrilled with 343's rewriting of the Halo Canon with the mess that's called Cryptum. Just because some of us don't like the book and 343's/MS's new direction for the series does not make us trolls and it's childish to say so just because you don't agree with that opinion. Halo is Bungie's story, regardless of whatever rewrites, recons, and directions MS takes the series to use it as a cash cow. I wouldn't have minded as much had 343 stuck closer to Bungie's story and just fleshed it out more, but with Cryptum they made so many changes that it's not even Halo anymore. And for those of you saying that Cryptum doesn't violate any previous canon, I'd like to know what you're smoking because it's gotta be some pretty powerful stuff.

  • 09.09.2011 6:54 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
BUT don't crowbar in a ton of caveats and additions that now force us to disregard the cannon we have been spoon fed and loved for a DECADE(that spanned the entire length of the franchise).


When you tell me what canon we now have to disregard maybe you'll have some credibility.

  • 09.09.2011 6:54 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.


The Human-Covenant War is over. 343 is moving the story forward. That is what happens in stories, they move on. And the Precursors have been a huge mystery ever since we got a mention of them in the Halo 3 Beastirum.

You can't keep everything a mystery forever. Or would you rather the story stagnate?


I'd rather story's end. Story archs finish, just like at the end of Halo 3.

Do these story's need to be updated with sequels?

romeo and juliet 2.
the odyssey 2: The Trojans came back.
The greatER Gatsby.
Of mice and 2 men.

Halo doesnt compare but i am just trying to make a point that MC's story is finished, or atleast should be. I just dont want all of his story to be screwed this way and that way now.

  • 09.09.2011 6:54 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: Old Salty27
And for those of you saying that Cryptum doesn't violate any previous canon, I'd like to know what you're smoking because it's gotta be some pretty powerful stuff.


Then don't be vague, explain what was ruined.

  • 09.09.2011 6:55 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
I'd rather story's end. Story archs finish, just like at the end of Halo 3.

Do these story's need to be updated with sequels?

romeo and juliet 2.
the odyssey 2: The Trojans came back.
The greatER Gatsby.
Of mice and 2 men.

Halo doesnt compare but i am just trying to make a point that MC's story is finished, or atleast should be. I just dont want all of his story to be screwed this way and that way now.


...

So 343 shedding some light on the Forerunner's ruins John's story. You really aren't elaborating on just what is being ruined.

  • 09.09.2011 6:56 PM PDT


Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
Totally agree. Story's have ends.

Forerunner's were meant at the outset as a mystery. This is the same bs starwars crap we have been putting up with for a decade. Just RUIN the entire story.

Cryptum just changes the whole FREAKING story out of nowhere, slaps us in the face and tells us were stupid and the last 5 games, 5+ books, and ten years of being fans didn't count because apparently "none of that was important, because its really all about this story that were just not gonna crowbar into the universe"

Reach was the last real Halo game. Whether from the story side or the dev side.


What do you mean it changes the story? It doesn't...at all.


You mean the point where the covie human war isnt the entire the main conflict of halo? or where that war is now "not a big deal", or how the forerunner are second fiddle in mystery to the precursors and just a number of other random and wholly new parts thrown in.


The Human-Covenant War is over. 343 is moving the story forward. That is what happens in stories, they move on. And the Precursors have been a huge mystery ever since we got a mention of them in the Halo 3 Beastirum.

You can't keep everything a mystery forever. Or would you rather the story stagnate?


I'd rather story's end. Story archs finish, just like at the end of Halo 3.

Do these story's need to be updated with sequels?

romeo and juliet 2.
the odyssey 2: The Trojans came back.
The greatER Gatsby.
Of mice and 2 men.

Halo doesnt compare but i am just trying to make a point that MC's story is finished, or atleast should be. I just dont want all of his story to be screwed this way and that way now.


To be fair, Halo 4 had to happen eventually because of the Legendary ending.

  • 09.09.2011 6:58 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
the odyssey 2: The Trojans came back.


The Aeneid

  • 09.09.2011 7:00 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter




im dont want to be the jerk who is wholly unagreeable, but that open ending thing is a writing device. It lets you create your own ending, makes you constantly wonder. it Stays with you more than "he went to earth and was happy his whole life". Plenty of novels end like the ending to H3.

  • 09.09.2011 7:05 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Jesus, the fact this community's whining because we are getting answers to questions we've asked for years is pathetic.

Just because we ask does not mean they should answer.


And may I ask why revelations about the Forerunners shouldn't be touched upon? What makes them so taboo?

I don't know what parts of the story you should definitely ignore, but to me the inclusion of the Humans and Prophets seemed just like a cheap hook designed to help us connect the story to current events. They served no large purpose that couldn't have been filled with another, separate, Forerunner faction.
They are taboo because Halo was built around their mystery. We never knew who they were, what they looked like or what they did and that allowed our imaginations to run wild. In away, what we thought ourselves was better than any author could write. By stripping away the mystery that was such a central part of the story for so long you would expectedly get people who don't like the removal of one of the core tenets of the story.

  • 09.09.2011 7:06 PM PDT

The Few, The True, The crew

remember ChiFighter= k+eye+fighter


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
Posted by: j7holdfastjack7
the odyssey 2: The Trojans came back.


The Aeneid


as in the Roman version of the Odyssey? the exact same story but as a Trojan and not a greek?

  • 09.09.2011 7:06 PM PDT