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Subject: First Chapter of Glasslands in OXM.

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: ROBERTO jh
This is why I don't get why people dislike the Elites' continued faith towards the Forerunners. They have no reason to not worship them, for in the beginning they didn't believe in the Path to the Journey anyway, they only believed in the Forerunners' divinity. The Prophets lies, revelation of these lies yet their continued belief is not a matter of them being stubborn. They've simply reverted more to their old faiths, turning on the faith that was more or less forced upon them.

Um, belief is not a mattress. If your faith crumbles, you just cannot take up another one in its place as if it is a matter of choice. You need a reason to believe something, and it is not possible whilst there are lingering doubts about it. If your religion is smashed I cannot see how it is feasible to just adopt another. You would then have the knowledge of how well fabricated it was and how well mislead you were; you should now be more wary of such a thing. The Elites having the Great Journey revealed as a lie -regardless of who it is from, it is still supernatural like the belief in the Forerunners- should make them more skeptical of the belief in the Forerunner's divinity. It would be like the resurrection of Christ being disproved. It would not disprove God, but I think that it would set in motion a cascade of doubt that could only lead to apostasy. It would certainly topple Christianity in a heartbeat.

Oh but wait, factor in: The Flood, the Halo Array that wipes out all life in the galaxy, the Forerunners who lived in that galaxy when it was fired resulting in massive amounts of DEAD Forerunners, but they still believe that they are gods? Dead Gods don't exist, because they are dead.

[Edited on 09.11.2011 10:44 AM PDT]

  • 09.11.2011 10:42 AM PDT


Posted by: qirahs

But as everyone else is saying, I'm going to try to hold on until the novel is actually released. Hopefully ONI will be a big help to humanity as travis was putting it, as in, splintering the elite's, exploiting their post-covenant weaknesses (their long dependence on the san-shyuum for science and engineering, maintenance for ships etc.), making sure that they never become a threat to humanity again.


I seriously can't be the only person who sees ONI acting that was as stupidly bad.

Regardless if the Elites as a whole hate humans or are more neutral/respectful (we honestly don't know), ONI sneaking in and trying to splinter them/destroy their lifestyle is more likely in my view to unite the Elites, give them major drive to relearn the tech and attack humanity again.

  • 09.11.2011 10:57 AM PDT

I am Field Master Avu Med 'Telcam, Servant of the Abiding Truth, and I have many brothers.

A god who creates tools is still a god. It is not for us to impose qualifications upon the divine or presume to guess its intentions.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: qirahs

But as everyone else is saying, I'm going to try to hold on until the novel is actually released. Hopefully ONI will be a big help to humanity as travis was putting it, as in, splintering the elite's, exploiting their post-covenant weaknesses (their long dependence on the san-shyuum for science and engineering, maintenance for ships etc.), making sure that they never become a threat to humanity again.


I seriously can't be the only person who sees ONI acting that was as stupidly bad.

Regardless if the Elites as a whole hate humans or are more neutral/respectful (we honestly don't know), ONI sneaking in and trying to splinter them/destroy their lifestyle is more likely in my view to unite the Elites, give them major drive to relearn the tech and attack humanity again.
If they hold onto the belief that Forerunner technology should not be tampered with, they'll end up waging war on Humanity again anyway.

  • 09.11.2011 10:58 AM PDT


Posted by: matman25402

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: qirahs

But as everyone else is saying, I'm going to try to hold on until the novel is actually released. Hopefully ONI will be a big help to humanity as travis was putting it, as in, splintering the elite's, exploiting their post-covenant weaknesses (their long dependence on the san-shyuum for science and engineering, maintenance for ships etc.), making sure that they never become a threat to humanity again.


I seriously can't be the only person who sees ONI acting that was as stupidly bad.

Regardless if the Elites as a whole hate humans or are more neutral/respectful (we honestly don't know), ONI sneaking in and trying to splinter them/destroy their lifestyle is more likely in my view to unite the Elites, give them major drive to relearn the tech and attack humanity again.
If they hold onto the belief that Forerunner technology should not be tampered with, they'll end up waging war on Humanity again anyway.


Perhaps, but not as quickly as literally finding humans trying to ruin and keep their society off balance.

  • 09.11.2011 11:09 AM PDT


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: CavemanBCE
I don't think you guys are getting what anton is saying. Of course he doesn't think that instantly after the games, all the elites would readily abandon their faith. He's saying that seeing elites from this point of view for ten years is stale and one-dimensional. It's boring, and like the elite's religious fervor, it should be grown out of. The events of Halo 2 and Halo 3 are the beginning of the "transition" that someone else posted about. Now isn't the time to go back and heavily feature fundamentalist elites, it IS the time to show revolutionary thinkers. The sangheili need an Enlightenment, not a Great Awakening.

That said, this is only the first chapter, and to assume that a major focus of the novel is a heavily religious elite would be jumping ahead of ourselves a little. I entirely agree with anton though (as I usually do, it turns out), fundamentalism is getting stale.

Indeed. I feel as if we just went back to The Cole Protocol era with this. It feels as if it has went back the way instead of forward. I mean why the hell should we care what happens to any of these characters? I don't see people caring about WBC so why these guys?

I think I see how this is all going to end. The reason why ONI is attacking the Sangheili. I don't think there will be any changes within the Sangheili, I don't foresee any alliance, I don't see anything like that happening. I see it as Humanity mopping up the last bastions of Covenant civilization, Sangheili included.

Exhibit A:

In this first of a trilogy, bestselling author Karen Traviss takes readers and gamers through the chaos of the post-Halo 3 universe. With the Human-Covenant war over, the universe is in chaos. The enemy that gave humanity much-needed drive and unity has been defeated. Rising from the trauma of this long-fought, devastating conflict, the UNSC must now lay claim to the universe. But new dangers, both alien and human, may threaten any chance for lasting peace. Join a group of old soldiers and new heroes as they begin a mission to penetrate what was once the heart of the Covenant empire in a desperate attempt to stop old foes from rising again.
Optimism is overrated.


As I said in my earlier post here, the best way to show growth and an evolving society is by contrasts. Just because one character harkens back to older characters in some way does not mean that all of the main Elite characters we'll see are going to be depicted the same way. And just out of curiosity, have you read the sample chapter they published in OXM?

So just because some of them still believe the Forerunners to be gods and believe that the Great Journey exists that means nothing at all has changed about them? The society as a whole no longer have any motivations to wage a genocidal war against humans. Why would any faction within the UNSC then go and do something dumb like covertly attacking the Elites or whatever it is you theorize they're doing that would actually give the Elites a reason to fight Humanity again? Humanity is recovering from the Human-Covenant war as well as the Elites and they have a lot better things to do than to take actions that would inevitably lead to war with a race they have a tenuous alliance with.

And you do realize that description of the books is very vague, for all we know the "old foes" they need to stop are the Covenant Loyalists banding together again, the Flood beginning to make a reappearance, or even something from the days of the Forerunners that they've only recently found out about from information within Forerunner artifacts.

  • 09.11.2011 11:22 AM PDT

Plekpedia - The most epic site in the history of ever.

Not all of the Sangheili are fanatics.

Telcam is though.

A deal was trying to be made with 'Telcam, who says that he wants Thel Vadam KILLED, because unlike Telcam, Thel does not believe the religion at all.

Telcam went back to the old ways of Elite religion, whereas Thel and his followers have abolished it completely.

In a way, there is actually a Sangheili civil war happening.

[Edited on 09.11.2011 11:26 AM PDT]

  • 09.11.2011 11:23 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: OrderedComa
So just because some of them still believe the Forerunners to be gods and believe that the Great Journey exists that means nothing at all has changed about them? The society as a whole no longer have any motivations to wage a genocidal war against humans.

Matman/Xzan raised a point I never thought about. If the Sangheili still revere the Forerunners as holy, and their technology as holy (As reasonable corollary I should think), then any attempt by Humanity to reclaim its old empire and its inheritance will be met with hostility by the Sangheili who must still follow the ideal that they are the divinely favored. (Which flies in the face of what Halo 3 established)

Posted by: OrderedComa
Why would any faction within the UNSC then go and do something dumb like covertly attacking the Elites or whatever it is you theorize they're doing that would actually give the Elites a reason to fight Humanity again? Humanity is recovering from the Human-Covenant war as well as the Elites and they have a lot better things to do than to take actions that would inevitably lead to war with a race they have a tenuous alliance with.

I did not make it up. It is in the OXM passage. ONI is responsible for this civil war. They are keeping the Elites in a state of confusion, i.e. attacking their political structure.

Posted by: OrderedComa
And you do realize that description of the books is very vague,

Heart of the Covenant Empire. Whilst that on its own does not necessarily mean anything, we do know that ONI is attacking the Sangheili so the two do line up.

But I don't care anymore really. Everything I have heard wreaks of atavism. I won't be getting Glasslands or Halo 4. I'll finish with Greg Bear's novels. -blam!- the rest.

[Edited on 09.11.2011 11:49 AM PDT]

  • 09.11.2011 11:49 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Get out of the halo waypoint forums then. Out now anton.


I just read the peview and I find it amazing! I'm pretty inpressed and I can't wait to read it!

I wonder how that civil war is going to play out. I really like how when she tries to say that their god's are dead, the elite refrences Jesus.

Sydney being bombed... and Australia day, interesting.

Also, I really wonder what that mini-sentinel was. It's all so interesting in the Dyson sphere!

  • 09.11.2011 2:10 PM PDT

Can anybody here provide a link to this preview? i have scoured the internet and cant find anything :/

  • 09.11.2011 2:45 PM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

It's HALO THE 10th ANNIVERSARY

special OXM halo magazine. It's not online, it's magazine.

  • 09.11.2011 2:53 PM PDT


Posted by: DecepticonCobra
You know guys, it's only the first chapter of a much larger book. You can't really write it off yet. Otherwise, we just become the people who wrote off Legends because ti was Anime.


Ooh, talking out of both sides of our mouth are we?

  • 09.11.2011 6:35 PM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Why are people panicking? I read it and it's going to be an amazing read.

Is Anton out of halo yet?

  • 09.11.2011 8:34 PM PDT

Don't upset Achronos or you'll end up with a dog's head in a jar in your mailbox.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Soffish Is Still Missing! Do Not Eat!


Posted by: Spartan 100
Get out of the halo waypoint forums then. Out now anton.


I just read the peview and I find it amazing! I'm pretty inpressed and I can't wait to read it!

I wonder how that civil war is going to play out. I really like how when she tries to say that their god's are dead, the elite refrences Jesus.

Sydney being bombed... and Australia day, interesting.

Also, I really wonder what that mini-sentinel was. It's all so interesting in the Dyson sphere!

Now, that is interesting.
Can't wait to pick this book up, still need to get through cryptum though..

  • 09.11.2011 10:32 PM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Posted by: masterune
Posted by: Spartan 100
Get out of the halo waypoint forums then. Out now anton.


I just read the peview and I find it amazing! I'm pretty inpressed and I can't wait to read it!

I wonder how that civil war is going to play out. I really like how when she tries to say that their god's are dead, the elite refrences Jesus.

Sydney being bombed... and Australia day, interesting.

Also, I really wonder what that mini-sentinel was. It's all so interesting in the Dyson sphere!

Now, that is interesting.
Can't wait to pick this book up, still need to get through cryptum though..


Same as me. One of these days I'm going to order one of these books; either grasslands or cryptum, but I cant decide which one I should order/preorder.

Grasslands calls more my attention, since I love the Human-Covenant War era of Halo more than the Forerunners, but then again, I've heard a lot of good things about Cryptum, and I wouldint have to wait that long for it.

Ugh, decisions.

  • 09.12.2011 7:05 AM PDT

I don't have the magazine, but I'm just gonna have to buy the book and read it. LOL It sounds pretty good.

  • 09.12.2011 7:17 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Get all of them!
If you read cryptum, you'll have to re-read it sevral times.

  • 09.12.2011 8:49 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Just ignore Anton. Ignore pred too.

  • 09.12.2011 8:51 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

He never even read it.

  • 09.12.2011 9:05 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: anton1792
I won't be getting Glasslands or Halo 4. I'll finish with Greg Bear's novels. -blam!- the rest.


Seriously, Anton...

  • 09.12.2011 9:11 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

No, I am towing the line here. I am not going to do a Lord Snakie and drag this puerile confrontation on any further. Glasslands has nothing to do with me disliking the core premise of Halo 4, and my reasons are my own. Suffice to say, choosing to focus solely on the Master Chief was a death sentence to the new trilogy.

  • 09.12.2011 10:08 AM PDT

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