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Subject: Why didn't the Covenant take prisoners?
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Posted by: Sigma617
I could forgive the use of prisoners in all events depicted except for the Prisoners of High Charity.

I cannot fathom why the Covenant would keep them alive (seemingly) for so long. What informational purpose do they serve?

They don't:

it's implied at the beginning of the game that heretics are fed to Kig-Yar.

  • 09.14.2011 3:40 AM PDT

They take humans to activate the rings when they need too.
Look at the ending of halo 3.

  • 09.14.2011 4:27 AM PDT


Posted by: Sigma617
I could forgive the use of prisoners in all events depicted except for the Prisoners of High Charity.

I cannot fathom why the Covenant would keep them alive (seemingly) for so long. What informational purpose do they serve?


Those were marines captured at Delta Halo, they weren't guys captured earlier in the war or anything, that's not the impression I got from it at least. They'd be kept alive as long as they were useful and had information the Covenant could force out of them, obviously the usefulness of those marines had not yet expired. Even if you are trying to commit genocide and exterminate every single member of your enemies' race or species you'd still want to capture some and force information from them at least on occasion.

Posted by: Anton1792
Also, Elites take prisoners, or rather stray solitary survivors, for sport and execution purposes.


Where on earth did you get that idea? That's almost the exact opposite of how the Elites are portrayed. Taking prisoners for the express purpose of sport is something the Brutes would do, not the Elites. They may not be perfect, but they most definitely aren't sadistic monsters that get their jollies from eviscerating people.

  • 09.14.2011 12:06 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: OrderedComa
Posted by: anton1792
Also, Elites take prisoners, or rather stray solitary survivors, for sport and execution purposes.

Where on earth did you get that idea? That's almost the exact opposite of how the Elites are portrayed. Taking prisoners for the express purpose of sport is something the Brutes would do, not the Elites. They may not be perfect, but they most definitely aren't sadistic monsters that get their jollies from eviscerating people.

First Strike, Page 114 (Old)/Page 142 (New)
"They found the caverns," Fred told Kelly. "Looks like they're going to dig them out."

But again...why? Why not just blast them from orbit? The Covenant didn't typically take prisoners - except the occasional straggler to execute for sport.

Fall of Reach, Page 184
"We've scouted the residential section." There was a pause. "No survivors...just like Draco Three. We're too late."

He understood. They'd seen it before. The Covenant didn't take prisoners. On Draco III, they had watched via satellite linkup as Human survivors were herded together and ripped apart by ravenous Grunts and Jackals. By the time the Spartans had gotten there, there was no one left to rescue.

(The underlined segment suggests that a similar occurrence has happened on SOIV in order for him to have seen "it" before)

Kholo...

[Edited on 09.14.2011 12:50 PM PDT]

  • 09.14.2011 12:49 PM PDT
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Anton, all you did was prove that the Covenant Jackals, grunts, and brutes do it for sport. The prior post was saying how Elites don't do it. Jackals kill for fun, and they will eat people. Grunts probably do it for fun, but I doubt they eat the people. Brutes do it for fun, and mostly to eat them.

Elites have never been shown to hunt people for sport.

  • 09.14.2011 5:34 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: superiorarsenal
Anton, all you did was prove that the Covenant Jackals, grunts, and brutes do it for sport. The prior post was saying how Elites don't do it. Jackals kill for fun, and they will eat people. Grunts probably do it for fun, but I doubt they eat the people. Brutes do it for fun, and mostly to eat them.

Elites have never been shown to hunt people for sport.

One does not have to partake in something to derive enjoyment from it though. They were probably watching. Afterall, they are the ones in charge, they call the shots. If there was anything like that to be orchestrated: The gathering and huddling of lots of survivors together and then getting Grunts and Jackals into a starving frenzy, then they most likely called for it.

  • 09.14.2011 5:40 PM PDT
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It actually seems like the Jackals and Grunts do it themselves. After the battle they just scavage around without any real direction. And Elite look down upon Grunts and Jackals. They are semi-disgusted just being around them, so getting enjoyment from watching them seems a little out of character.

  • 09.14.2011 5:48 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: superiorarsenal
It actually seems like the Jackals and Grunts do it themselves. After the battle they just scavage around without any real direction. And Elite look down upon Grunts and Jackals. They are semi-disgusted just being around them, so getting enjoyment from watching them seems a little out of character.

I donno, the Draco III thing sounded a bit too planned to be without direction.

The out of Universe explanation is that this was before the Elites were characterized. The Draco III thing was from TFoR, which was way back at the start of everything Halo. In Universe then, we could say that it was the Brutes who called for this. But that is us saying it though.

  • 09.14.2011 5:54 PM PDT
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  • 09.14.2011 5:57 PM PDT

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Posted by: zash208
Humans are impure. They needed to be cleansed.

  • 09.14.2011 5:57 PM PDT

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Posted by: OrderedComa
If the games are any indication then the Covenant take prisoners all the time, who can say how long they survive being imprisoned, but I think they're taken captive quite often, especially when Forerunner Relics are involved in the matter.
I think the people in the books saying that the Covenant take prisoners are probably either misinformed or just assume that the Covenant butcher everybody because nobody ever comes back from being captured.
ANd when they served their purpose, they are excuted. Energy Sword to the neck, indeed.

  • 09.14.2011 6:05 PM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.

They did in very select cases. I remember once instance where a human captive was used to try to talk some marines out of fighting, as well as the whole Johnson thing. Oh and of course that whole prisoner fiasco in CE.

[Edited on 09.14.2011 6:06 PM PDT]

  • 09.14.2011 6:06 PM PDT


Posted by: GhostLink2401
As indicated above, the Covies took prisoners more often than we give them credit for.

Anders to activate the Shield World Armada
Miranda to Activate Installation 05
Johnson to activate the Ark
Prisoners on Truth and Reconciliation
Prisoners in High Charity
I guess you can count Guilty Spark, to shake him down for intel.


You forgot the very first known instance. Captain Jacob Keyes and the other Marines/ODST's aboard the Truth and Reconciliation.

  • 09.14.2011 6:28 PM PDT
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SC = Supreme Commander/Supreme Canadian.

De Facto leader of the military of the APE (Allied Planets Empire).

Coup = Admiral Asskicker, ZPM hive ship


Posted by: GhostLink2401
As indicated above, the Covies took prisoners more often than we give them credit for.

Anders to activate the Shield World Armada
Miranda to Activate Installation 05
Johnson to activate the Ark
Prisoners on Truth and Reconciliation
Prisoners in High Charity
I guess you can count Guilty Spark, to shake him down for intel.

Hostages/ POWs make sense in an all-out total war scenario. Although, if I were in the UNSC, I'd recommend that all soldiers be given cyanide pills in order to keep themselves from being used to activate Forerunner tech. Kinda makes sense to me.


I dunno, if I was captured, I'd activate the Forerunner tech... then use it to bust free. Or just 'tell' the tech to self-destruct.

  • 09.14.2011 6:52 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.

Except Humans don't know how it works, they do it all on instinct and possible help from geas. They could make the stuff self destruct but they wouldn't know how to do it.

  • 09.14.2011 7:13 PM PDT


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: OrderedComa
Posted by: anton1792
Also, Elites take prisoners, or rather stray solitary survivors, for sport and execution purposes.

Where on earth did you get that idea? That's almost the exact opposite of how the Elites are portrayed. Taking prisoners for the express purpose of sport is something the Brutes would do, not the Elites. They may not be perfect, but they most definitely aren't sadistic monsters that get their jollies from eviscerating people.

First Strike, Page 114 (Old)/Page 142 (New)
"They found the caverns," Fred told Kelly. "Looks like they're going to dig them out."

But again...why? Why not just blast them from orbit? The Covenant didn't typically take prisoners - except the occasional straggler to execute for sport.

Fall of Reach, Page 184
"We've scouted the residential section." There was a pause. "No survivors...just like Draco Three. We're too late."

He understood. They'd seen it before. The Covenant didn't take prisoners. On Draco III, they had watched via satellite linkup as Human survivors were herded together and ripped apart by ravenous Grunts and Jackals. By the time the Spartans had gotten there, there was no one left to rescue.

(The underlined segment suggests that a similar occurrence has happened on SOIV in order for him to have seen "it" before)

Kholo...


Ok, for the first quote, it has been shown throughout the games that the belief that the Covenant doesn't take prisoners is misinformed at best. Plus it even says that "the Covenant didn't typically take prisoners" emphasis added to the typically, that shows that it's not unheard of for them to take prisoners, but it's not usually the norm.

And the second quote, that is talking specifically about Grunts and Jackals who would rip enemies apart on occasion, not the Elites' style though, and knowing them they probably wouldn't knowingly let their troops act like that. If those Covies mentioned even had a higher ranking species present with them then it would most likely have been a pack of Brutes. So what if he said he's seen it before? No survivors being found doesn't mean that everybody is rounded up and then thrown to the whims of the Grunts and Jackals, again, not the Elite's style, and if they round up people to have them killed, they'll just have them executed, either by gun or by sword.

  • 09.19.2011 2:23 PM PDT

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It's obvious the covenent just want humans to die I guess.

  • 09.19.2011 2:36 PM PDT
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It's only camping if I build a fire, otherwise it's just waiting.

From reading "...Harvest" it sounded to me like they used a very common reason for genocide, hiding the truth. The cohesiveness of the Convenant races (particularly the nearly enslaved ones) balanced on the notion that the Profits and the higher races were the "chosen" races. To allow the fact out that a far less advanced race (humanity) is actually more important to the Forerunners than the Profits' race would be considered blasphemus by those in power but undeniably true to the remaining races in the Covenant itself and would lead to civil war.

Which, btw, it did.

  • 09.20.2011 2:42 AM PDT
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Banned just for calling someone retarded? lolBnet mods
Duardo = retard

So you think Reach is an actual Halo game, huh? LOL
Jesus! There's a BoB in ma Falcon!

The Prophets knew the Humans were related to the Forerunners somehow and if the rest of the Covenant found out then it would shake the foundation of their religion and the Covenant, thats why the Prophets ordered Humanities extermination.

  • 09.24.2011 11:15 PM PDT

Death to rank junkies.

The did take human prisoners, like Keyes and Johnson.

I'm more curious as to why the Brutes took Councillor an Hunter prisoners in the level The Great Journey.

  • 09.25.2011 1:12 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: OrderedComa
Ok, for the first quote, it has been shown throughout the games that the belief that the Covenant doesn't take prisoners is misinformed at best. Plus it even says that "the Covenant didn't typically take prisoners" emphasis added to the typically, that shows that it's not unheard of for them to take prisoners, but it's not usually the norm.

I know. It was the part "except the occasional straggler to execute for sport." that I was trying to get at, in support of what I initially said: "Also, Elites take prisoners, or rather stray solitary survivors, for sport and execution purposes."

Posted by: OrderedComa
And the second quote, that is talking specifically about Grunts and Jackals who would rip enemies apart on occasion, not the Elites' style though, and knowing them they probably wouldn't knowingly let their troops act like that. If those Covies mentioned even had a higher ranking species present with them then it would most likely have been a pack of Brutes.

We know that the Elites are the military commanders of the Covenant, therefore it is actually most likely that it was them who condoned it. You are right in that it does reflect on the Grunts and Jackals, but it also reflects on what sort of leadership made it possible who obviously watched it if they went to such lengths.

Posted by: OrderedComa
So what if he said he's seen it before? No survivors being found doesn't mean that everybody is rounded up and then thrown to the whims of the Grunts and Jackals, again, not the Elite's style, and if they round up people to have them killed, they'll just have them executed, either by gun or by sword.

"We've scouted the residential section." There was a pause. "No survivors...just like Draco Three. We're too late."

He understood. They'd seen it before.

What did he understand? What has he seen before in order for him to understand what has happened now? The Draco III incident, which points to a similar occurring on SOIV as well in the residential sector.

  • 09.25.2011 8:23 AM PDT

Gamer nerd with a girlfriend! EAT THAT BIATCH!!! :P

The covenant believe that the human race is an imperfection on the earth, a disease, if you will. They don't even like touching them, let alone letting them live. That's why most of the time they kill all humans on site, unless there's some forerunner technology they need to operate, which is the only time they ever take prisoners.

  • 09.26.2011 1:55 AM PDT

Posted by Anton1792
I know. It was the part "except the occasional straggler to execute for sport." that I was trying to get at, in support of what I initially said: "Also, Elites take prisoners, or rather stray solitary survivors, for sport and execution purposes."


I don't believe I was disputing whether they executed people or not. I'm disputing the motive you're proscribing to it. I don't it has anything to do with sport at all, from all we've learned about the Elites and their culture executing people for sport doesn't really seem to be in their style.

We know that the Elites are the military commanders of the Covenant, therefore it is actually most likely that it was them who condoned it. You are right in that it does reflect on the Grunts and Jackals, but it also reflects on what sort of leadership made it possible who obviously watched it if they went to such lengths.

Brutes leads troops too you know, not that often, but they have and do command small forces. And everything we've seen from the depiction of the Elites does not support the assumption that they throw those they capture to the Grunts and Jackals or have others rip their enemies apart for -blam!-s and giggles.

What did he understand? What has he seen before in order for him to understand what has happened now? The Draco III incident, which points to a similar occurring on SOIV as well in the residential sector.

All that says is they've seen civilians killed by the Covenant before, it doesn't say how they killed them. Whoever Chief is talking to says "no survivors" just like there being no survivors from Draco 3. Chief is the one assuming that it happened like what they saw there. That doesn't mean that is the case though.

  • 09.30.2011 7:30 PM PDT

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