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Subject: Problem with the Halo Array

Generalizations.
Helping idiots hate other idiots since people have existed.

I was thinking about exactly how the Halo Array kills every sentient being in the universe. According to pages 170-174 of the Halo Encyclopedia,

When activated, the Halo rings would wipe out all sentient life within three radii of the Milky Way's Galactic center, by sending out radiation, targeting certain cells in the nervous system, which includes, but is not limited to, neurons, by harmonizing all neurological frequencies.

This means that our nervous systems get fried, which also prevents the flood from using our bodies.

However, there are major flaws in this mechanism.

The 7 Halo arrays' firing range is supposed to encompass the entire Milky Way galaxy, which is 100,000 Light Years in diameter. Each ring has a range of 25,000 light years.

-Gamma Rays (radiation) travel at the speed of light. That means it would take at least 25,000 years to kill everything in the galaxy, but the Forerunners supposedly did it in an instant.
-Also, that much Gamma radiation would boil away atmospheres and leave planets incapable of supporting life. But the planets were unaffected and species were returned to their home planets from the Ark.
-In addition, the amount of Gamma Rays we'd be talking about would be unimaginable. To encompass the entire galaxy, you would need the energy equivalent to, well, something we can't even imagine. Like more than a quadrillion nukes times 10 to the 1000th power. (Not exact, obviously, but you get the idea.)

How in the heck could the Forerunners use radiation to kill sentient life with the above problems?

  • 10.16.2011 1:34 PM PDT

I actually was a apart of a similar thread maybe a few weeks ago... maybe

We ended up that Gamma radiation was impossible for the "radiation" used by the halo arrays.

It was suggested at some point that the radiation could have taken a countless number of small slip stream jumps to across the galaxy so fast.

It was also suggested it attacked the souls of sentient creatures by using some type of energy to vibrate them apart, as they did with the precursor structures in Cryptum. The structures were supposedly made of the essence of the universe, something similar to the soul in a physical form. The neurons would be one such representation of this. In Cryptum they mentioned that the halos had to be tuned to destroy certain things, it couldn't just be fired. In theory this meant that tuning it effected only certain things and not others. i.e.: creatures instead of planets.

Another theory yet would be that it affected space time in a way so that the creatures would just stop existing.

There are about as many theories I'm sure as there are sentient life forms in the universe, so in the end you have to kinda make it up on your own.


  • 10.16.2011 1:50 PM PDT

Generalizations.
Helping idiots hate other idiots since people have existed.


Posted by: ExoditeDRider
I actually was a apart of a similar thread maybe a few weeks ago... maybe

We ended up that Gamma radiation was impossible for the "radiation" used by the halo arrays.

It was suggested at some point that the radiation could have taken a countless number of small slip stream jumps to across the galaxy so fast.


As for now, that's the only semi-plausible theory.
Maybe they could individually target planets with low dose Gamma Radiation, if they could somehow transport the Gamma Radiation through millions of slip-space portals to said planets.
That would take a lot less energy, a lot less time, and might leave planets habitable.

However, I don't think that Electromagnetic Radiation (Light, including Gamma rays) can even travel through slip-space. Or can it?

[Edited on 10.16.2011 1:58 PM PDT]

  • 10.16.2011 1:58 PM PDT

I am alpha, i am omega.

I am the last of the primes.

Fail, halo arrays did not use gamma, They used nuerual pulses.

They are the forerunners, they are way way way more advanced then us, hell they made the covies and the unsc look like cave men.

  • 10.16.2011 2:01 PM PDT

Generalizations.
Helping idiots hate other idiots since people have existed.


Posted by: ferrrari
Fail, halo arrays did not use gamma, They used nuerual pulses.

They are the forerunners, they are way way way more advanced then us, hell they made the covies and the unsc look like cave men.


...No
They Halo arrays TARGETS our neural impulses.

We have a delicate balance of neural impulses in our bodies. The Halo Array is supposed to upset that balance, causing us to drop dead.

The question is, "What CAUSES that imbalance?"
---------
Also, the laws of physics still apply to highly advanced civilizations, even the Forerunners can't break the laws of physics.

[Edited on 10.16.2011 2:10 PM PDT]

  • 10.16.2011 2:05 PM PDT

This was also discussed. There is no light in slip space BUT scans can be taken with probes, hoping in and out. They did it with sigma Octavius IV and they did it with Reach. It's how they knew that a fleet was coming at all. They weren't ready of course, but it's the only reason MC and the PoA didn't continue with their mission.

So it makes sense that EMR can travel through it to a point. And to our knowledge gamma is a very powerful form of radiation but there could be forms we have yet to name or reproduce or discover.

  • 10.16.2011 2:10 PM PDT


Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr


---------
Also, the laws of physics still apply to highly advanced civilizations, even the Forerunners can't break the laws of physics.


HAHA it's funny you say this cause they can't break the laws, but they can certainly ... Bend them. It says in Cryptum that they can move whole solar systems, or create black holes. They do it without breaking any rules but they can certainly find ways around them.

  • 10.16.2011 2:12 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

  • 10.16.2011 2:19 PM PDT


Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr


When activated, the Halo rings would wipe out all sentient life within three radii of the Milky Way's Galactic center, by sending out radiation, targeting certain cells in the nervous system, which includes, but is not limited to, neurons, by harmonizing all neurological frequencies.



There is more to Halo then simple radiation.

  • 10.16.2011 2:30 PM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.

  • 10.16.2011 2:33 PM PDT

Cave Johnson here, we're done!

PS: If you are reading this comment while imagining my voice, don't panic. That's just a side effect of the testing.


Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.


The find in CERN would like to disagree.

source:
Neutrinos Faster Than Light

  • 10.16.2011 2:44 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Xd00999
Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.

Slipspace?

@ tiny: I would not put too much faith in the CERN results just yet. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Confirmation is needed first.

[Edited on 10.16.2011 2:51 PM PDT]

  • 10.16.2011 2:44 PM PDT


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Xd00999
Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.

Slipspace?

@ tiny: I would not put too much faith in the CERN results just yet. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Confirmation is needed first.


One thing they're actually saying happened with that experiment is the neutrinos warped space and time because they had so much energy therefore getting there faster then the photons. BUT that's another can of worms

  • 10.16.2011 3:14 PM PDT

Cave Johnson here, we're done!

PS: If you are reading this comment while imagining my voice, don't panic. That's just a side effect of the testing.


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Xd00999
Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.

Slipspace?

@ tiny: I would not put too much faith in the CERN results just yet. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Confirmation is needed first.


I definitely agree with you, but the possibility remains.

The whole basis of this thread is on the laws of physics, but even then our understanding of the laws of physics isn't complete, and it may never be.

Trying to say it's physically impossible isn't 100% correct, I mean we can call out someone since they don't have a rudimentary understanding of physics, but who's to say they are not right? Who's to say our understanding of physics is 100% correct with no flaws?

Hell scientific theories are based around the ideas of never being complete, always having new additions added on. In this case it soon might be that the speed of light may not be the limit.

[Edited on 10.16.2011 3:26 PM PDT]

  • 10.16.2011 3:20 PM PDT

"I'm afraid of the man I'll become if I lay my life down for the people I don't even care for"


Posted by: ExoditeDRider

Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr


---------
Also, the laws of physics still apply to highly advanced civilizations, even the Forerunners can't break the laws of physics.


HAHA it's funny you say this cause they can't break the laws, but they can certainly ... Bend them. It says in Cryptum that they can move whole solar systems, or create black holes. They do it without breaking any rules but they can certainly find ways around them.


Yeah, Black hole weapon > everything.

OT: I agree with Drider. They had their ways

  • 10.16.2011 5:58 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Noble Member

Unfortunately there is nothing amusing or witty here.

Obviously at the center of every Halo Array was a grenade from Halo: Reach.

That would be enough to get the job done.

  • 10.16.2011 6:06 PM PDT

Magic.

  • 10.16.2011 6:33 PM PDT


Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr
According to pages 170-174 of the Halo Encyclopedia,


There's your problem.

  • 10.17.2011 5:23 AM PDT


Posted by: Ryz
Obviously at the center of every Halo Array was a grenade from Halo: Reach.

That would be enough to get the job done.


Damn pineapples. The hell was Bungie thinking?

  • 10.17.2011 5:24 AM PDT

Didact's Reprisal -
Now is the time of our unworlding
One final effort is all that remains
And I am not afraid
We shall fulfill our promise
We fight for the grace of the Mantle
And this time none of you will be left behind

All I know is that it involves the "negation of neural physics." And that's from Cryptum, not an online source.

  • 10.17.2011 7:31 AM PDT

Don't -blam!- with Kerser!

Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr

Posted by: ferrrari
Fail, halo arrays did not use gamma, They used nuerual pulses.

They are the forerunners, they are way way way more advanced then us, hell they made the covies and the unsc look like cave men.


...No
They Halo arrays TARGETS our neural impulses.

We have a delicate balance of neural impulses in our bodies. The Halo Array is supposed to upset that balance, causing us to drop dead.

The question is, "What CAUSES that imbalance?"
---------
Also, the laws of physics still apply to highly advanced civilizations, even the Forerunners can't break the laws of physics.


Yeh, because bending space with matter (See First Strike), creating matter that causes things to go back in time (See First Strike), and making portals and teleporters (See Halo 3) are not breaking the laws of physics at all are they.

  • 10.17.2011 8:14 AM PDT

Don't -blam!- with Kerser!


Posted by: tinyohyeah

Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: anton1792
It is not gamma radiation. It is supermassive neutrinos.

Neutrinos are still bound by the laws of physics. They can't go faster than light.


The find in CERN would like to disagree.

source:
Neutrinos Faster Than Light


I'll just leave this here.

  • 10.17.2011 8:16 AM PDT


Posted by: Ruby of the Blue

Posted by: oaklandp8ntbalr
According to pages 170-174 of the Halo Encyclopedia,


There's your problem.


Must you take an opposite stand to everything listed in the books?

  • 10.17.2011 8:30 AM PDT

I dont see where it is stated that a Halo produces a gamma ray burst. The truth is, a Halo is a neutron bomb device, somehow accelerating the neutrinos to far superluminal speeds via forerunner magic whilst also avoiding the constraints of the inverse-square law (i suspect slipspace is involved), and as pointed out above this effect has recently been all but confirmed even though it should be impossible to our current understanding of physics (to the guy above who stated plainly that neutrinos cannot exceed lightspeed at all, you dun goofed)

The neutron flux is able to strip away the nervous systems of organic beings whilst leaving matter and structures intact. This is also infact a real effect.

"Considerable controversy arose in the U.S. and Western Europe, following a June 1977 Washington Post exposé describing U.S. government plans to purchase the bomb. The article focused on the fact that it was the first weapon specifically intended to kill humans with radiation.[16][17] Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory director Harold Brown and Soviet General Secretary Leonid Brezhnev both described the neutron bomb as a "capitalist bomb", because it was designed to destroy people while preserving property."

Gamma ray bursts are also real, and primarily produced by stupefyingly energetic events in the universe, such as supernovae, or merging neutron stars or black holes etc. Any even of this magnitude within a few thousands light years of earth could indeed destroy the biosphere or even strip the atmosphere away completely. It has been theorised that previous mass extinction events on earth were caused by GRB events from deep space.

So all in all, it turns out that the halo effect has far greater basis in real science than it has any right to have.

  • 10.17.2011 11:13 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Fatal Factor
I dont see where it is stated that a Halo produces a gamma ray burst. The truth is, a Halo is a neutron bomb device, somehow accelerating the neutrinos to far superluminal speeds via forerunner magic whilst also avoiding the constraints of the inverse-square law (i suspect slipspace is involved), and as pointed out above this effect has recently been all but confirmed even though it should be impossible to our current understanding of physics (to the guy above who stated plainly that neutrinos cannot exceed lightspeed at all, you dun goofed)

How did we get from neutrinos to neutrons?

Also, what effect has been confirmed? Violation of light speed?

  • 10.17.2011 11:20 AM PDT

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