Halo 1 & 2 for PC
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  • Subject: Halo 2 For The XP! Real and I'm working on it!
Subject: Halo 2 For The XP! Real and I'm working on it!
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Yet K98 is doing exactly the same thing. He's doing a total conversion of H2 to HaloCE. With new voice acting, different graphics, but the same map structure etc.

Another example is http://www.blackmesasource.com/
This is a remake of 1: Half life. 2: Half life: Source.
It has been started by fans very soon after HL: Source has been released, has talked with Valve thoroughly and while they DID have to change the name from black mesa source to black mesa, they're still doing it.

(NOTE! Marathon: Resurrection is STILL not finished after 5 years, and Black Mesa is STILL not finished after two. And H2 is BIG.)

Still, caution would be advised. Go email Bungie about it first instead of hiring a lawyer. If they say it's ok, then he should think about going ahead.

  • 04.26.2006 4:02 PM PDT

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  • 04.26.2006 4:24 PM PDT
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  • 04.26.2006 4:30 PM PDT
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Iggwilv I asked for that a while back, but people want to debate so let them.

  • 04.26.2006 4:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: Reaver225
Yet K98 is doing exactly the same thing. He's doing a total conversion of H2 to HaloCE. With new voice acting, different graphics, but the same map structure etc.

Another example is http://www.blackmesasource.com/
This is a remake of 1: Half life. 2: Half life: Source.
It has been started by fans very soon after HL: Source has been released, has talked with Valve thoroughly and while they DID have to change the name from black mesa source to black mesa, they're still doing it.

(NOTE! Marathon: Resurrection is STILL not finished after 5 years, and Black Mesa is STILL not finished after two. And H2 is BIG.)

Still, caution would be advised. Go email Bungie about it first instead of hiring a lawyer. If they say it's ok, then he should think about going ahead.


what profit and/or revenue could bungie possibly lose from marathon 2????

and what profit and/or revenue could valve possible lose from hl1??????

the point is, the point of this project isnt to remake an old game to make it nicer, its to remake a new game so people dont have to buy it.

see the difference?

  • 04.26.2006 7:05 PM PDT
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Posted by: Reaver225
Marathon 2 was made by Bungie.

A bunch of fans made a copy of it for Unreal tournament (well, they're still making it).

They have not been sued by Bungie.

Halo 2 was made by Bungie.

K98 intends to make a total conversion for Halo CE.

People are advising him not to do it, because he'll get sued.

Spot the similarities?


You overlook the fact that Marathon is in fact avalible for download for free nowadays. Bungie's not making a profit outta that baby anymore.

  • 04.26.2006 7:32 PM PDT

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Marathon 2 is open source, Halo 2 is not.

  • 04.27.2006 6:56 AM PDT
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Well the gray area is that one could claim that because people would have to purchase a Bungie/Microsoft game to play it (halo pc/ce) then there is no profit loss. Now if he makes this game free for download and you don’t need a copy of halo pc to play then there would be a legitimate lawsuit. But because Bungie and Microsoft (through Gearbox) created a game that supports user created mods, they would have a very hard time winning a lawsuit, considering you need to purchase halo pc to play it and the game was designed to support mods.

  • 04.27.2006 9:19 AM PDT

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Those mods cannot infringe on a copyrighted property. The lawsuit would be cake, it's a duplication of campaign content and the net effect would be to cause a loss of income from those people that downloaded it. It's not really a gray area, what would happen if someone made a Half Life 2 mod to work under the original Counter Strike? As in, the full game like this guy is planning? Lawsuit city. Seriously, it doesn't take a genious to realize that there's a difference in a map and a whole game. Under your "mod" legal scenario, he would only be able to have one type of enemy in the entire game, since the mods supported are multiplayer only.

  • 04.27.2006 9:56 AM PDT
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He has a point. I have seen things like this in regards to Counter Strike/ Half Life 2 mods.
I am reasonably good at modeling, design, voice acting, story writing, creativity, ideas, concept art.

If you need any help then just drop me a private messege or something but i'll only do it if you're 100% sure you're goin to make it because i have helped with many projects from Star Wars BattleFront, Counter Strike, Halo and other games and the person who started it changes their mind.

Also just a minor question... If you require all of these people to do this doesn't that mean THEY will, in theory, be making the game for you? What part do you have to play in this other than submitting an idea?

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  • 04.27.2006 10:28 AM PDT

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Join this Group now, help us make Halo Source.

Posted by: Spartan_113
you need air dude.............

you can't say that Hammer is a joke. its a very good mod tool. i have a room for counter strike source. its my first map mod. if you know what you're doing then you can make a new game using the source engine and the SDK.

  • 04.27.2006 11:17 AM PDT
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Posted by: GameJunkieJim
Those mods cannot infringe on a copyrighted property. The lawsuit would be cake, it's a duplication of campaign content and the net effect would be to cause a loss of income from those people that downloaded it. It's not really a gray area, what would happen if someone made a Half Life 2 mod to work under the original Counter Strike? As in, the full game like this guy is planning? Lawsuit city. Seriously, it doesn't take a genious to realize that there's a difference in a map and a whole game. Under your "mod" legal scenario, he would only be able to have one type of enemy in the entire game, since the mods supported are multiplayer only.


Well isn’t halo 1 copyrighted material? So by your reasoning making any mod for halo pc could get you sued. Not to mention the fact that there have been halo 2 mods and maps already done with no ramifications so the precedent has been set. Now if they use the source engine like somebody suggested then there would be a problem because people could play halo 2 without having to buy halo pc then there would be an easy case to prove loss of sales because the $$ to play the game would be going to valve rather then Bungie/Microsoft.

As far as Half-life 2 being made for the original counter strike. It’s funny that you bring that up. Counter-strike (the most played multiplayer game) was not made by any developer, it was a user made mod that ran on the half-life engine. So if you are referring to making a mod that makes half life 2 run on the half life 1 engine then I would say the same thing would happen… nothing. First there would be no way that a carbon copy could be made in either case. Halo 2 running on the halo 1 pc engine would be a completely inaccurate representation of halo 2 at best and more likely a complete pile of buggy garbage. So realistically a lawsuit will never happen.

On a different note if you guys want to play halo 2 why not just get it for the xbox? You can use the xbox just like you use your pc. They make adapters to hook up to your monitor and there are mouse/keyboard adapters as well.

Not to mention if you guys are unwilling to upgrade your system than you really should make the switch over to console gaming anyway. Pc gaming means never ending upgrades and if you guys are unwilling to upgrade a 5 year old os then you have no business being a pc gamer.

  • 04.27.2006 11:27 AM PDT
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This is so funny, you guys are all arguing about basically that u cant affored to by Vista... I mean its not gonna be so expensive that no one will by it i say 600$ tops. As for this silly Halo2 for xp it probley wont work and if u ever even get close ull run into problems. codes, voices etc. The you will get sued hard time by MS becuase if ppl are just gonna by Vista for H2 then they lose out on bussines and im pretty sure they dont want to to.

So my advice is STOP befor u get yourself into unessisary trouble!

  • 04.27.2006 11:46 AM PDT
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Also, ImSpartacus, your post has actually hurt my brain. You are mutilating the English language. With a dull, rusty knife.
I couldn't have put it better myself, Reaver225.

  • 04.27.2006 12:22 PM PDT
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Posted by: GameJunkieJim
Marathon 2 is open source, Halo 2 is not.


Hmm, that might make a tiny difference. Erk.

Posted by: DBLDREW
Well isn’t halo 1 copyrighted material? So by your reasoning making any mod for halo pc could get you sued. Not to mention the fact that there have been halo 2 mods and maps already done with no ramifications so the precedent has been set. Now if they use the source engine like somebody suggested then there would be a problem because people could play halo 2 without having to buy halo pc then there would be an easy case to prove loss of sales because the $$ to play the game would be going to valve rather then Bungie/Microsoft.


Just because the Halo 2 mods that are currently out now haven't been sued, doesn't mean that they CAN'T be sued. Think of it this way. Bungie/M$ could probably have put a stop to the mods and maps that try to emulate H2 gameplay, but didn't because it helped the fanbase without damaging their profits. However, it doesn't mean that they wouldn't stop it, say, if there was a carbon copy of H2 out there, or if there was some disgusting mod where Master Chief goes to the Covenant homeworlds and starts disembowling young children and desecrating their corpses.

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I couldn't have put it better myself, Reaver225.


Indeed, mine thoughts are bereft at such crude attempts of broken communication.

  • 04.27.2006 1:27 PM PDT
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Posted by: Zone Trooper
you can't say that Hammer is a joke. its a very good mod tool. i have a room for counter strike source. its my first map mod. if you know what you're doing then you can make a new game using the source engine and the SDK.


I can say its a joke compared to 3dsmax because it is a joke. I have used both, and hammer just sucks majorly.

  • 04.27.2006 1:35 PM PDT
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Posted by: Reaver225

Just because the Halo 2 mods that are currently out now haven't been sued, doesn't mean that they CAN'T be sued. Think of it this way. Bungie/M$ could probably have put a stop to the mods and maps that try to emulate H2 gameplay, but didn't because it helped the fanbase without damaging their profits. However, it doesn't mean that they wouldn't stop it, say, if there was a carbon copy of H2 out there, or if there was some disgusting mod where Master Chief goes to the Covenant homeworlds and starts disembowling young children and desecrating their corpses.



Anybody can sue for just about any reason, but just because they can sue doesn’t mean that they will a) win or b) have it be cost effective for them to sue.

Think about it lets say that M$ actually sued someone who made a halo 2 mod for halo pc/ce. If it goes to court the only way that M$ will win is if they get a lot of very savvy computer geeks on the jury. Just remember juries are always made up with the elderly and people to stupid to get out of jury duty. So a good defense attorney will make sure to point out that the defendant would be unable to purchase and use Halo vista because his computer is running xp. So regardless if the mod was made or not has no bearing on the potential lost sale of Halo vista. The loss of the sale is because M$ decided to not support their other operating systems, that is the reason for the loss of the sale. They made a product that is incompatible with 99% of the computers out their and that are going to blame the potential lost sales on a mod?!? Furthermore he has to purchase halo pc to play the mod anyway so it could be argued that this mod is only helping the halo pc sales. So rather then a loss of revenue it would be argued that this mod actually could help M$.

Regardless there is no way that M$ would actually sue anyway. What would they gain if they actually won? The cost to win that lawsuit would be way too high.

Think about this M$ has xbox live that is a service that allows people to play online against each other, now this service has a yearly cost. So lets say I come up with a free version for people to play xbox games online. Do you think I would get sued for loss of profits?

  • 04.27.2006 2:20 PM PDT

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And then the Microsoft Attorney brings up the even larger loss of profit from Vista sales, and they're even more screwed. And points out that it's not Microsofts responsibility to make sure the masses purchase new product, and that they aren't requiring them to purchase the game. But if the public wishes to play their IP (intellectual property) then they have to upgrade to do so. Then they bring in the copyright infringements, and the plagiarism, and before you know it Microsoft comes out with the only possible verdict anyone with more than 2 brain cells would be able to come up with. And what kind of lawyer can Widowmaker afford? Microsoft wouldn't be suing for the money, they'd be suing for the precedent, and precedent in a case like that is worth millions to a corporation.

And yes, if you came up with something that took advantage of the Live framework, I imagine you would be sued. Stick with something safer like a tunneler that just utilizes the LAN capability of the console. Except XBC already did that.

  • 04.27.2006 2:40 PM PDT
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Is it just me or does anybody else think that this whole thread is pointless.......

  • 04.27.2006 3:59 PM PDT
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Yeah me too muskets. Origianlly, I just wanted to see what you guys think, now it's turned into a whole long legal debate, and if I myself had a lock-wand I would use it.

  • 04.27.2006 4:49 PM PDT
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Exactly. These people are getting worked up all over nothing. Who cares if MS would lose a pretty penny?? Bill Gates has more cash than he can count, and the only way this could actually hurt MS is if the WHOLE FREAKIN GAME WAS BEING PORTED/HACKED OVER. Now I think that this whole subject should be dropped entirely.

  • 04.27.2006 5:59 PM PDT
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I don't know about you guys, but I'm going to play Halo 2 for Vista instead.

I mean no offense to Widowmaker, I'm just stating what I'm planning to do.

[Edited on 4/27/2006]

  • 04.27.2006 6:05 PM PDT

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Posted by: MuSkets
Exactly. These people are getting worked up all over nothing. Who cares if MS would lose a pretty penny??
Well, I'm sure Microsoft would care a little. But mostly I think Microsoft would be interested in setting a precedent and making an example.

Bill Gates has more cash than he can count, and the only way this could actually hurt MS is if the WHOLE FREAKIN GAME WAS BEING PORTED/HACKED OVER.

Have you not been paying attention? That is exactly what he intends to do.

Now I think that this whole subject should be dropped entirely.

I couldn't agree more, but we have more Forum lawyers than we can shake a stick at. It isn't really lockworthy, but since Widowmaker requested it I suppose I can make an exception.

  • 04.27.2006 6:08 PM PDT