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Subject: Question about Energy Shields

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.

Posted by: grey101
They are based off jackal shielding.

This entire thread is based off misinformation.

I knew that. I knew that. Because they retrieved the shields from the field. Totally knew that. You don't even know how much I knew that.

But still, knife through shields doesn't make much sense.

  • 12.02.2011 7:01 AM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

Probably because the knife is too slow to activate the shields or (as others have said several times) the blunt force is more than enough to negate it.

  • 12.02.2011 7:07 AM PDT
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Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Sigh, doesn't factpile and spacebattles have a tendency of bias/misinformation?



Against Halo, yes. But these calculations are pretty impressive. Factpile won't work on this computer, but I can point you to the page it is on. Alcatraz vs Master Chief on the second to last page.

It's hard to argue against physics.

  • 12.02.2011 1:48 PM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Posted by: grey101
or (as others have said several times) the blunt force is more than enough to negate it.


This is the logical answer. The force of the impact of a bullet is no where even close to the amount of force a knife a Spartan can put behind it. The blow completely blows the shield to hell, leaving it as if it never existed. It's like getting shot by a tank point-blank.

There is no way a shield can stop so much force at once. It instantly breaks.

  • 12.02.2011 2:53 PM PDT


Posted by: HipiO7
Posted by: grey101
or (as others have said several times) the blunt force is more than enough to negate it.


This is the logical answer. The force of the impact of a bullet is no where even close to the amount of force a knife a Spartan can put behind it. The blow completely blows the shield to hell, leaving it as if it never existed. It's like getting shot by a tank point-blank.

There is no way a shield can stop so much force at once. It instantly breaks.


Source?

  • 12.02.2011 3:46 PM PDT
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Here it is:

http://www.factpile.com/6191-alcatraz-vs-master-chief/comment -page-5/#comments

Comment #89

  • 12.02.2011 5:30 PM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Posted by: FISHYburned
Posted by: HipiO7
Posted by: grey101
or (as others have said several times) the blunt force is more than enough to negate it.


This is the logical answer. The force of the impact of a bullet is no where even close to the amount of force a knife a Spartan can put behind it. The blow completely blows the shield to hell, leaving it as if it never existed. It's like getting shot by a tank point-blank.

There is no way a shield can stop so much force at once. It instantly breaks.


Source?


Are you serious?

Isnt common sense enough of a source for you?

  • 12.02.2011 5:38 PM PDT
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I can understand the knife going through an Elite's shield, but not the whopping 30MJ MJOLNIR Mark VI. Unless S-IIs can punch out tanks in a single hit....

  • 12.02.2011 5:42 PM PDT


Posted by: superiorarsenal
I can understand the knife going through an Elite's shield, but not the whopping 30MJ MJOLNIR Mark VI. Unless S-IIs can punch out tanks in a single hit....


This is my logic too. Even the Elite Combat Harness I dont see getting scratched by this thing. What all these people are suggesting is that he is Hercules from that one Disney movie and can bench press 100 trillion pounds. Like no.

  • 12.02.2011 5:46 PM PDT
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Halo sniper rifle comes in at a whopping 60kJ(Twice our current most powerful). Elite shields(Basic ones) can take 1 or more of these. If you can do 60kJ+ with a knife, you can effectivly punch/stab THROUGH heavy tank armor.

  • 12.02.2011 5:58 PM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Posted by: FISHYburned
Posted by: superiorarsenal
I can understand the knife going through an Elite's shield, but not the whopping 30MJ MJOLNIR Mark VI. Unless S-IIs can punch out tanks in a single hit....


This is my logic too. Even the Elite Combat Harness I dont see getting scratched by this thing. What all these people are suggesting is that he is Hercules from that one Disney movie and can bench press 100 trillion pounds. Like no.
]

If you notice, when the Elite's are stabbed, they are normally stabbed in weak spots in their armor, like the neck joints, helmet and vertebrae joints. I highly doubt the armor has the same strength there.

And a Spartan, in full MJLONIR armor, could no doubt punch a serious dent into a tank. I'm not saying he could take it out, but he could do some non-critical damage. Shields could never take so much pressure from the tip of a knife at such high speeds and with all the momentum the Spartans put behind it.

  • 12.02.2011 6:13 PM PDT


Posted by: superiorarsenal
Halo sniper rifle comes in at a whopping 60kJ(Twice our current most powerful). Elite shields(Basic ones) can take 1 or more of these. If you can do 60kJ+ with a knife, you can effectivly punch/stab THROUGH heavy tank armor.


Humm... source?

Edit: Another thing you know. A burst of bullets = downed sentinel. But, a single punch = down sentinel. :P.

[Edited on 12.02.2011 7:20 PM PST]

  • 12.02.2011 7:16 PM PDT

-The full bottle is a silent bottle.

I looked over the forum posts again after my post, and I noticed that most people here did a lot more research than I did (: While this doesn't render my opinion useless, it makes it... unreliable. I gave it some more though, anyway, and while a knife might be able to at any rate drain the shields... it probably couldn't take out armor and shielding in one hit. And discrepancies between game mechanics and cannon lore (and sometimes, but rarely, logic) do exist, so perhaps the whole 1-hit system was just for gameplay. And again, Spartan shields are not based on Forerunner technology. Well, they sort of are indirectly since Covie tech was based on Forerunner tech, but it doesn't quite count.
Oh, and guys, don't cite "common sense" for physics. Many things are not as they seem. :)

  • 12.02.2011 7:19 PM PDT

Why are you here?

I think it's just gameplay physics.

gameplay=/=real Halo physics

  • 12.02.2011 10:49 PM PDT

The Elite's shields are not activated solely for high-velocity projectiles, as we can melee an Elite while facing him and still observe the shields flare from the impact. Their shields can be assumed to be on at all times, at least for visible (no camo) Elites actively involved in combat.

Has anyone considered the effects of a Spartan's MJOLNIR V/VI shield systems rubbing up against an Elite's shields? We know Cortana could use the Mk.V shields to (adversely) affect Forerunner generators on Halo (04), so would it really be so strange to think that perhaps direct contact between shield systems causes trouble for one or the other or both? Perhaps a weakening in those shield systems, or a heightened vulnerability at certain points in the shielding, etc.?

As a nitpick, someone mentioned that the sniper rifle is roughly .85 caliber. Unless you're talking about the Guass weapon Johnson used in Contact Harvest, which I am admittedly less familiar with, no. The sniper rifle used in the Halo campaigns is something like 14.5 mm, which would be roughly .57 caliber. Still a big gun, but not as big.

[Edited on 12.03.2011 2:48 AM PST]

  • 12.03.2011 2:47 AM PDT
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I swear the stated velocity of the round is 1468 m/s, and 14.5mmX114mm APFSDS round weighs 0.06kg, so kinetic energy would be(K.E.=0.5x0.06x1468^2) about 64kJ. There is a quote though that says the round will go through 13 feet of flesh and bone.

Also, a burst of bullets(From the Assault Rifle) can deliver anywhere from 8kJ to 20kJ, anymore bullets and it isn't really a burst anymore.

  • 12.03.2011 9:00 AM PDT
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Posted by: TheAsterisk
The Elite's shields are not activated solely for high-velocity projectiles, as we can melee an Elite while facing him and still observe the shields flare from the impact. Their shields can be assumed to be on at all times, at least for visible (no camo) Elites actively involved in combat.

Has anyone considered the effects of a Spartan's MJOLNIR V/VI shield systems rubbing up against an Elite's shields? We know Cortana could use the Mk.V shields to (adversely) affect Forerunner generators on Halo (04), so would it really be so strange to think that perhaps direct contact between shield systems causes trouble for one or the other or both? Perhaps a weakening in those shield systems, or a heightened vulnerability at certain points in the shielding, etc.?

As a nitpick, someone mentioned that the sniper rifle is roughly .85 caliber. Unless you're talking about the Guass weapon Johnson used in Contact Harvest, which I am admittedly less familiar with, no. The sniper rifle used in the Halo campaigns is something like 14.5 mm, which would be roughly .57 caliber. Still a big gun, but not as big.


Which supports my theory that the fields that contain the plasma and maintain the shields interfere with eachother.

Also, the M99 fires a much smaller round. I believe it is a .21 caliber, giving it the kinetic energy of roughly 225kJ, which kinda explains why people hit with it get torn apart, that is roughly 1/3-1/5 of the energy released from a grenade.

  • 12.03.2011 9:04 AM PDT

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Well, to make it simple, we'll break it down.

The elite that stabbed Emile picked him up easily before being stabbed. This means that an Elite can hold half a ton in one hand like it is nothing.

Elites aren't a massive amount stronger than Spartan III's.

So, when all of the force of someone that strong is focused into one point, (the point of a knife), it would easily be able to cleave through shields, metal armor and flesh. I hope that answers your question.

  • 12.10.2011 12:19 AM PDT

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