- Zee JollyRoger
- |
- Exalted Mythic Member
"I pledge to punch all switches, to never shoot where I could use grenades, to admit the existence of no level except Total Carnage, to never use caps lock as my "run" key, and to never, ever, leave a single BoB alive."
2B || !2B - Why don't you look Inside the Machine?
Posted by: Achronos
Calling something "ridiculous" without answering the questions your submit is a little dishonest.
In an attempt to not be dishonest let me try:
1) What does the ignore feature truly accomplish?
First, we should have some idea of what the ignore feature will do.
As per the original post, the idea was to have a way for users to self-moderate content. The goal of this was to allow users to remove content they didn't want to read ("annoying crap").
The ignore feature should allow users to remove posts they don't like, break the CoC, etc., from their daily view. What benefits does an ignore feature have over a system that tags posts?
If a user wanted to view Halo story posts would it be easier for a user to ignore enough people or click on a few tags?
A benefit to the tagging system is that it globally archives posts by topic. This way any user can view certain topics just by browsing tags.
A tag systems main problem would probably be honest usage. People incorrectly tagging content would be a problem. Do we then have administrators/Bungie limiting what types of tags there are? Specific tags for certain categories like: Halo, Off-Topic, etc.? Do we have Free-For-All tagging? Again, how do we moderate it?
All issues with the system, but it sounds much better to filter content with an actual resource built for content. Rather than a feature built for removing content.
2) Why do we truly need it?
If we truly needed to ignore a post or user we should either report it for infractions of the CoC or scroll by the post.
I don't believe we truly need an ignore feature as described above. I had not thought of a filter system, but I like the idea. It would be nice and faster to view things relevant to my interests. I know, I said above that:
"Its sole purpose is to stifle discussion by allowing users to filter content into what they want to see."
I believe we shouldn't be excluding people or limiting what users can see as a way to get to what you want to see. If you can ignore a user I'm sure the Web Team would also allow you to reverse the ignore. The process is inefficient or at least annoying to cherry-pick people to ignore and reverse it to get the results you want. Assuming ignoring people meant you would no longer see their posts as described in question 1.
The benefit of a tagging system is that you can delve into whatever you want to see. As soon as you're done you can come back to the global community. You'll only see their content if it aligns with your interests. Again, if you don't like what a user says why not scroll by what they posted?
3) How will it be implemented?
I can only speculate or imagine here. I would think the ignore feature would function somewhat similar to the report feature. The ignore would collapse the user's post and mask it. Hitting the button or some other item would unmask the post. The feature might also allow you to permanently or temporarily ignore a user.
As I've described a tagging system I should discuss it too.
I think a tagging system would work similar to the file share system. A user creates a post. The user tags the post (either with custom tags or pre-defined tags). Other users could then navigate the content through use of a tag page or some other device.
4) How will it be controlled against abuse?
I am not sure how an ignore feature would be controlled against abuse. If it works as I described in my first question I can not say immediately if abuse can be prevented. The only person that is not being rewarded in the user doing all of the ignoring (in an extreme case).
As for a tag system? I would imagine reporting and profanity-filtering would have to do.
At its base level, the bungie.net forums suffer from a basic problem: you can't filter your view. If you want to talk Halo, you are given the Reach forum. Have you seen that forum and its activity level? And that's a lot less than it used to be. We had to designate an entire extra forum just for story discussion because it got lost under the people talking about the gameplay.
No, I don't really visit the Reach forum. I believe you when you say it is a busy place. I have used the forum in the past, but not recently.
We're thinking about that problem (which does exist, whether you admit it or not). And the idea of having an ignore list as one possible filter to your thread view (an optional filter, mind you) is intriguing because it ostensibly deals with some other issues involving moderation and scale: it makes it possible to view the public forums as a group-scaled place, without really losing the true scale.
I don't disagree with you that forums can get flooded and there isn't a way to filter it. I disagree with using or at least calling a filter feature an ignore feature. If we're using an ignore feature as originally described I think that it limiting the range of discussion to get what you want. If we're talking about your latter point, as a filter, then why call it an ignore feature? Its truly a filter feature and we're agreeing to the same idea in principle while calling it different names.
I am asking you, could a tagging system for content work with Bungie.net? Do you think it could provide the same solution as using an ignore feature to filter thread views?
Sure, you could make it ridiculous if you take the feature out of this context, but as I said, that is dishonest. This isn't a manufactured problem, this is having you guys talk about your feelings about such a feature that could be used to solve some problems that have gotten worse as bungie.net got larger, and that we don't intend to ignore this time around now that we're moving past Halo.
I'll list my feelings as best as I can:
1) We shouldn't allow users to limit other user speech solely based on the users ideas or feelings. Its easier to scroll past something you dislike.
2) If what we're talking about here is a way to get users to focus on content easier than I support a filtration system. As long as we're again not allowing people to cherry-pick how they interact with the global community. If you want people to experience group-like levels of interaction why not overhaul and advertise groups for this purpose? They're perfect!
3) We should find a way to spark community activity again. Either user created content: stories, games, contests, etc., or Bungie created material (which DeeJ has been doing [great job so far]).
Posted by: Zee JollyRoger
What does the ignore feature truly accomplish? Why do we truly need it? How will it be implemented? How will it be controlled against abuse? Etc.
When you start to break the idea down to its most basic principles it suddenly becomes ridiculous.
This feature, as far as I see it, in no way establishes a way to enrich community discussion. Its sole purpose is to stifle discussion by allowing users to filter content into what they want to see.