Halo: Reach Forum
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  • Subject: How true is my claim?
Subject: How true is my claim?

Hi.

I'm just a little curious: In Halo, variety is mutually exclusive to consistency, and consistency is the key to skillful gameplay.

Always true, sometimes true, or never true? Why?

  • 12.19.2011 12:44 PM PDT

Welcome to the internet. Joy dies here.

The answer: 32

  • 12.19.2011 12:46 PM PDT

@spawn031

"So much of what we do is ephemeral and quickly forgotten, even by ourselves, so it's gratifying to have something you have done linger in people's memories." John Williams

Always true, except in Reach.

  • 12.19.2011 12:46 PM PDT
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Posted by: Horse Repairman
RC RuNz the internet. Like the superintendent.

Posted by: SouthPoIe
Clone is an internet God.

Posted by: DerpRoids
RC Clone is the anti-thesis of a lurker.

Consistency is the mother of skilled gameplay. So true.

  • 12.19.2011 12:53 PM PDT

Hi.

Posted by: RC Clone
Consistency is the mother of skilled gameplay. So true.
But always? In all ways?

  • 12.19.2011 12:56 PM PDT
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Some variety can be good but there is such thing as too much and that can be bad.


Would you have happened to get this out of goats thread? I posted like a book in there.

  • 12.19.2011 1:01 PM PDT

Hi.

Posted by: Apocalypse
Some variety can be good but there is such thing as too much and that can be bad.
This is what I'm thinking, but that also comes with a lessened consistency which is... also bad? I'm not exactly sure.Posted by: Apocalypse
Would you have happened to get this out of goats thread? I posted like a book in there.
Nah.

  • 12.19.2011 1:05 PM PDT
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Posted by: Horse Repairman
RC RuNz the internet. Like the superintendent.

Posted by: SouthPoIe
Clone is an internet God.

Posted by: DerpRoids
RC Clone is the anti-thesis of a lurker.


Posted by: Zomechin
Posted by: RC Clone
Consistency is the mother of skilled gameplay. So true.
But always? In all ways?

That depends on the type of consistency you are talking about. Personally I would like to see more than just be style headshots as the only viable ranged strategy off spawn.

  • 12.19.2011 1:11 PM PDT

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The variety comes from the players more than the sandbox. Every map and weapon grows stale after years of being played, but the players are constantly playing differently and varying in skill.

  • 12.19.2011 1:33 PM PDT

@spawn031

"So much of what we do is ephemeral and quickly forgotten, even by ourselves, so it's gratifying to have something you have done linger in people's memories." John Williams

Posted by: Zomechin
Posted by: RC Clone
Consistency is the mother of skilled gameplay. So true.
But always? In all ways?

Yep. look at Starcraft II. The competitive fan base and how it's actually considered a national sport in South Korea. What's the key to that? Consistancy.

Everything competitive about that game is the same across the board. Weapon build times, tournament settings monthly patch updates. Blizzard has catered to the competitive community when fixing that game. The casual players of Starcraft II can't even tell the difference between updates. Since everything is consistent, a casual player will know the build time of a probe is 20 seconds and that it takes 1 supply. A competitive knows that as well, it's just common knowledge.

The point is that no matter what play-style you play, you know what is expected with the game. Reach has so many variations it lacks consistency. How many version of the DMR are currently in Matchmaking right now?

3

Default DMR - 100% bloom.
TU/Anniversary DMR - 85% bloom.
MLG/TU Playlist - 0 bloom.

How the hell can anything be played competitively if you have 3 different variations of the same weapon in matchmaking simultaneously? We also have 2 different versions of armor lock and sword block as well. Look at the maps! How many of them switch spawns depending on the gametype? In a competitive game, the spawns should be the same across the board regardless. The fan base has realized that these changes aren't consistent - therefore you have an uncompetitive game.

A truly competitive games can be played casually. A truly casual game cannot be played competitively - because of the consistency.

  • 12.19.2011 2:07 PM PDT

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Sometimes true I guess...

  • 12.19.2011 2:09 PM PDT

Hi.

Posted by: spawn031
The point is that no matter what play-style you play, you know what is expected with the game. Reach has so many variations it lacks consistency. How many version of the DMR are currently in Matchmaking right now?

3

Default DMR - 100% bloom.
TU/Anniversary DMR - 85% bloom.
MLG/TU Playlist - 0 bloom.
Playing the devil's advocate: Wouldn't that require 3 skillsets, as opposed to only one?

  • 12.19.2011 2:09 PM PDT

As you fire the AR the bullet spread becomes more inconsistent. This forces the player to burst fire. So, yes, sometimes inconsistency can lead to more skilled play.

  • 12.19.2011 2:10 PM PDT

Yeah they really need to -blam!- or get off the pot. One DMR please.

There weren't 8 different BRs in Halo 3.

It can do more damage in MLG or whatever, but it should shoot the same wherever you use it.

  • 12.19.2011 2:15 PM PDT

@spawn031

"So much of what we do is ephemeral and quickly forgotten, even by ourselves, so it's gratifying to have something you have done linger in people's memories." John Williams

Posted by: Zomechin
Playing the devil's advocate: Wouldn't that require 3 skillsets, as opposed to only one?

One would think. In a game like Reach, most people don't exclusively always play 1 playlist. That's where the fault lies. I switch playlists between 100% bloom and 85% bloom to 0% bloom and whether there is sword block or how effective Active Camo is.

I'm not alone, many people switch playlists often - and it's the most frustrating thing when you learn the niche of a weapon and get so "adapted" to it that when you switch a playlist everything changes. Where instead of trying to master 3 different skillsets, you're really just getting frustrated over how to play the one skillset.

Players that exclusively play MLG have acquired the skillset of moving at a faster pace and always aiming with 0 bloom. If they turn around and play Arena, it's a completely new ball game. They literally have to slow their shots down to some degree to even land them in Arena.

There are different levels in skill. First, you obviously have to know what weapons are good at what ranges, what is consistent with play-style and where your power weapons spawn. Second, you have to communicate with your teammates to obtain map control and establish what the enemy has coming for your. Third, you should be able to predict their next spawn so you can position yourself accordingly.

Since the first level varies so much, for a team of players that switch playlists constantly, how can players expect truly competitive games when players are worrying about whether or not a strategy will work or not? Players will have to think if their sword has a chance of being blocked, or how many seconds until their camo runs out or if grenading a guy in armor lock actually does something.

Since the niche of the DMR is so widespread across playlists, it becomes frustrating to the user so what happens? They quit. They get annoyed, they stop playing. This is happening everyday and hence why Halo Reach is number 7 now on the Xbox Live played list. Players give up because it's frustrating. There are other frustrations that cause this as well, not just the DMR.

Do you get my point though? Something like starcraft of Halo 3 or Halo 2 is the same across all playlists. When the TU for Halo 2 launched, everyone knew that the Melee to kill a player was changed from 5 hits to 2. In every situation, even MLG. Players of today like simple games where they don't have to constantly think about the first layer of skill. Just thinking "man does this happen in this playlist?" By the time they think that, they've already lost the battle.

Just my $0.02

  • 12.19.2011 2:25 PM PDT

Hi.

I agree. Great post.

However, I don't agree on an extreme level; if it were to be 100% consistent there'd be no team snipers, no team swat, no extras.

  • 12.19.2011 2:43 PM PDT

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da hell does dat mean

  • 12.19.2011 2:50 PM PDT

@spawn031

"So much of what we do is ephemeral and quickly forgotten, even by ourselves, so it's gratifying to have something you have done linger in people's memories." John Williams

Posted by: Zomechin
I agree. Great post.

However, I don't agree on an extreme level; if it were to be 100% consistent there'd be no team snipers, no team swat, no extras.

Right, so there needs to be a compromise. Obviously a 0 bloom pistol wouldn't work well in Team Snipers or Infection. Or having super long camo times in BTB.

I'm just simply saying because there is so many options, it forces the player to choose the most "niche" weapons because all the other ones are useless - but that all depends on what playlist you're currently playing in. Which makes it inconsistent.

More elaboration here. But you get my point. Good thread :)

  • 12.19.2011 3:04 PM PDT
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Hey, uh, if you like vs threads, then check out this little group right here, if you have the time. It's pretty fun, just hop right in.

Consistent gameplay is the most skillful.




It's also the most boring.

  • 12.19.2011 3:07 PM PDT

.......

  • 12.19.2011 3:33 PM PDT


Posted by: WhackyGordon
The answer: 32

  • 12.19.2011 3:37 PM PDT


Posted by: MajorGroove
As you fire the AR the bullet spread becomes more inconsistent. This forces the player to burst fire. So, yes, sometimes inconsistency can lead to more skilled play.


lolwut

  • 12.19.2011 3:38 PM PDT


Posted by: jedimasterltmr
.......


worst thread ever..of all time

  • 12.19.2011 3:38 PM PDT