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This topic has moved here: Subject: Master Chief Hate?
  • Subject: Master Chief Hate?
Subject: Master Chief Hate?

I love how the Master Chief gets all kinds of crazy heat about being unremarkable. Haters seem to think he was thoroughly average at everything besides Luck (which we can clearly measure empirically...)

Hear's the deal though. Its pretty much clear that that he is one of the top four leaders of the bunch. (with Kurt Fred and Jerome being the other three) (Again, something we can measure empirically...)

On top of that he was viewed as the Leader of the whole group.

While one can hem and haw about that statement, its in the literature.

But something you can't do is claim that that John is average. Leaders do not emerge from mediocrity. Leaders are the strongest individuals of the bunch. They display admirable qualities that set them above the rest. And while some of the group may display some higher aptitude in certain skills the leaders are highly skilled at nearly everything.

The leader of a Football team isn't a back-up lineman, The Star Quarterback is. John, Kurt, Fred and Jerome were/are the stars of the Spartan IIs

O and BTW many assumptions you make about John's supposed ineptitude arise from John's own thoughts. Ever hear of Humbleness and Humility. Admirable leadership qualities those two.

  • 12.19.2011 8:44 PM PDT

Kelly is faster
Kurt led better
Fred fought hand to hand better
Linda sniped better

That's all they have on John. John was above average in everything, he had no speciality really. But those four above were outstanding in their categories.

  • 12.19.2011 8:48 PM PDT

I think the Spartans more or less looked to him as their leader, but this was most recognizably in childhood than in their later years, as by the time Reach rolls around we've got Blue Team, Red Team, Green Team, etc. Not to mention Noble Team and the Spartan IIIs, from which we get Lieutenant Commander Kurt Ambrose, who has a friggen planetoid named after him, and Commander Carter-259, who outranks Master Chief by at least like six ranks. Who knows what Carter could've done to climb to such a rank in such a short amount of time?

[Edited on 12.19.2011 8:53 PM PST]

  • 12.19.2011 8:52 PM PDT

And I realize that this idea has been pretty well established in this forum. I just feel like that Master Chief hate coming from the Universers is just a result of Master Chief worshiping. The problem is claiming that John is unremarkable makes you sound kind of dumb.

Instead I would encourage our knowledgeable Universers to re-emphasize and celebrate the Merits of the other Spartans along with the Master Chief.

  • 12.19.2011 9:00 PM PDT

Posted by: mojeda101
Kelly is faster
Kurt led better
Fred fought hand to hand better
Linda sniped better

That's all they have on John. John was above average in everything, he had no speciality really. But those four above were outstanding in their categories.

One point being that while these people are better in their areas, they also have deficiencies in others, which is the reason their not the leader.

  • 12.19.2011 9:06 PM PDT


Posted by: ThePredkiller2
I think the Spartans more or less looked to him as their leader, but this was most recognizably in childhood than in their later years, as by the time Reach rolls around we've got Blue Team, Red Team, Green Team, etc. Not to mention Noble Team and the Spartan IIIs, from which we get Lieutenant Commander Kurt Ambrose, who has a friggen planetoid named after him, and Commander Carter-259, who outranks Master Chief by at least like six ranks. Who knows what Carter could've done to climb to such a rank in such a short amount of time?


Actually we know why Noble has such high ranks (Commander might not be what Carter started at, but the members of Noble team always have had higher ranks than most other Spartans), it's to give them more independence in the field so they can't be "hijacked" from their missions by just anyone, unlike the Spartan IIs, who did have a slight problem with this sometimes, like in First Strike, that one ONI guy who had been on the Pillar of Autumn. IIRC (I don't know very much at all about military ranking systems) even Johnson held a higher rank than Chief for most of the Trilogy.

The Spartans look to John as the leader because he is the leader. He's been such since the early days of the program, I'm sure you remember that little field trip into the wilderness the Spartans went on and the results of that :P After that Halsey and Mendez appointed him as the leader of the Spartans. And the Spartans have always had different teams, even in training, and I believe there wasn't really a set number of teams, as they seemed to vary. Like for instance during the Fall of Reach there's only Blue and Red Team, despite all the current Spartans being present at the time. Blue Team seems to have been the only team with any real degree of permanence.

  • 12.19.2011 9:22 PM PDT

Looking for clan that isn't too serious? Then join the ODST 501st Airborne Battalion. Go to http://www.501st.forumclan.com for more info.

Master Chief is obviously the best as he was the only one who could actually, you know, not die.

  • 12.19.2011 9:29 PM PDT

Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: ThePredkiller2
I think the Spartans more or less looked to him as their leader, but this was most recognizably in childhood than in their later years, as by the time Reach rolls around we've got Blue Team, Red Team, Green Team, etc. Not to mention Noble Team and the Spartan IIIs, from which we get Lieutenant Commander Kurt Ambrose, who has a friggen planetoid named after him, and Commander Carter-259, who outranks Master Chief by at least like six ranks. Who knows what Carter could've done to climb to such a rank in such a short amount of time?


Actually we know why Noble has such high ranks (Commander might not be what Carter started at, but the members of Noble team always have had higher ranks than most other Spartans), it's to give them more independence in the field so they can't be "hijacked" from their missions by just anyone, unlike the Spartan IIs, who did have a slight problem with this sometimes, like in First Strike, that one ONI guy who had been on the Pillar of Autumn. IIRC (I don't know very much at all about military ranking systems) even Johnson held a higher rank than Chief for most of the Trilogy.

The Spartans look to John as the leader because he is the leader. He's been such since the early days of the program, I'm sure you remember that little field trip into the wilderness the Spartans went on and the results of that :P After that Halsey and Mendez appointed him as the leader of the Spartans. And the Spartans have always had different teams, even in training, and I believe there wasn't really a set number of teams, as they seemed to vary. Like for instance during the Fall of Reach there's only Blue and Red Team, despite all the current Spartans being present at the time. Blue Team seems to have been the only team with any real degree of permanence.


But still... Master Chief aka John-117 has never had a PLANET named after him, not to mention a DYSON-FRIGGEN-SPHERE. =P

  • 12.19.2011 9:42 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.

  • 12.20.2011 12:41 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


[Edited on 12.20.2011 12:45 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 12:44 AM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


Not really, many share my opinion (aka the ones that actually see past all the glorification he gets), see some Master Chief vs (insert person that cannot possibly be better than him because he has luck and thus cannot be harmed here) threads and you will see.

  • 12.20.2011 12:47 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

you mean the vocal minority of haters that post on this forums?, you do realize that the forums don't represent even the half of halo fans right?

btw you know that opinions aren't facts right?.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


Not really, many share my opinion (aka the ones that actually see past all the glorification he gets), see some Master Chief vs (insert person that cannot possibly be better than him because he has luck and thus cannot be harmed here) threads and you will see.


[Edited on 12.20.2011 12:51 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 12:50 AM PDT


Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


No, it means people talk about him like the god he is not.

You know, claiming everything he did cannot ever be done by another when it's not true.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, OrderedComa here is one of the better chief fans. She doesn't put others down if they don't love him, and she's reasonable in her likes. She doesn't claim he's a flawless individual that can win everything without a problem.

  • 12.20.2011 12:50 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

Actually NO. I mantain my INITIAL statement

That's just your opinion. Why is more valid than others again? also the chief is a fictional character...
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


No, it means people talk about him like the god he is not.

You know, claiming everything he did cannot ever be done by another when it's not true.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, OrderedComa here is one of the better chief fans. She doesn't put others down if they don't love him, and she's reasonable in her likes. She doesn't claim he's a flawless individual that can win everything without a problem.


[Edited on 12.20.2011 12:53 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 12:52 AM PDT

Why is your opinion that those who don't like chief are "rightfully alone" valid?

  • 12.20.2011 12:53 AM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."


Posted by: BestSpartan117
you mean the vocal minority of haters that post on this forums?, you do realize that the forums don't represent even the half of halo fans right?

btw you know that opinions aren't facts right?.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


Not really, many share my opinion (aka the ones that actually see past all the glorification he gets), see some Master Chief vs (insert person that cannot possibly be better than him because he has luck and thus cannot be harmed here) threads and you will see.


Well, this "Vocal minority" is the one that actually gives coherent arguments as opposed to MAZTUR CHIEFZZ BEAT DA FLOODZ ND ZAVED DA UNIVERSES!1one!!!!

So, yeah, I'd rather be part of a minority instead of jumping in the Chief loving bandwagon.

  • 12.20.2011 12:53 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

You realise not all halo fans are forum users right?.

You seem to claim superiotity to others but I don't see how your opinion is more special than others you are just another fan.... also strawman fallacy
Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: BestSpartan117
you mean the vocal minority of haters that post on this forums?, you do realize that the forums don't represent even the half of halo fans right?

btw you know that opinions aren't facts right?.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Posted by: BestSpartan117
Overrated just means that you are mostly alone with your opinion and rightfully so.
Posted by: RKOSNAKE
John-117 is the embodiment of overrated, that's why he is hated.


Not really, many share my opinion (aka the ones that actually see past all the glorification he gets), see some Master Chief vs (insert person that cannot possibly be better than him because he has luck and thus cannot be harmed here) threads and you will see.


Well, this "Vocal minority" is the one that actually gives coherent arguments as opposed to MAZTUR CHIEFZZ BEAT DA FLOODZ ND ZAVED DA UNIVERSES!1one!!!!

So, yeah, I'd rather be part of a minority instead of jumping in the Chief loving bandwagon.


[Edited on 12.20.2011 12:55 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 12:54 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

I never said that was nor that my opinion was right. You have the burden of proof however.
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Why is your opinion that those who don't like chief are "rightfully alone" valid?

  • 12.20.2011 12:56 AM PDT

Actually, I'm with snake here. I've seen lots and lots of Chief fans who make BS claims or exaggerate his feats.

  • 12.20.2011 12:57 AM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

Pardon me, but I don't remember posting "My opinion is better than yours", if anything you're the one saying that your opinion is better with your whole "You're alone with your opinion" I am just stating what most people who dislike John already have said and will say, that he is an overrated character and it's all because of the fanboys, if he didn't have so much people putting him on a pedestal then he would be alright.

  • 12.20.2011 12:57 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Actually, I'm with snake here. I've seen lots and lots of Chief fans who make BS claims or exaggerate his feats.


how many? enough to obhetively say that all the fandom is based? did you actually made any research or it's simply your opinion?

  • 12.20.2011 12:58 AM PDT


Posted by: BestSpartan117
I never said that was nor that my opinion was right. You have the burden of proof however.
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Why is your opinion that those who don't like chief are "rightfully alone" valid?


Proof that chief fans can be mindless and drooling? Look at the Noble Six vs Master Chief thread. Enough proof for all.

  • 12.20.2011 12:58 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?

A forum thread from one of the least popular forums isn't enoght "proof".

As bungie has said before not even half of halo fans are b.net members then how can you objectively proof he is "overrated"?

at most you have proved that some people disagree with you.
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: BestSpartan117
I never said that was nor that my opinion was right. You have the burden of proof however.
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Why is your opinion that those who don't like chief are "rightfully alone" valid?


Proof that chief fans can be mindless and drooling? Look at the Noble Six vs Master Chief thread. Enough proof for all.


[Edited on 12.20.2011 1:01 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 1:00 AM PDT


Posted by: BestSpartan117

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Actually, I'm with snake here. I've seen lots and lots of Chief fans who make BS claims or exaggerate his feats.


how many? enough to objectively say that all the fandom is based? did you actually made any research or it's simply your opinion?


And have you done any research to prove those who think master chief is overrated to be a minority?

I think not.

Edit: When did I ever, or snake ever, say he was overrated is fact across all existance?

Last I checked we simply put that we think he's overrated.

[Edited on 12.20.2011 1:02 AM PST]

  • 12.20.2011 1:01 AM PDT

The bible is the best book Ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I AM A PROUD CHRISTIAN. HALO IS AWESOME BUT GOD IS MUCH BETTER!!!!!!!!
Did you knew that JESUSdied for you?


Posted by: RKOSNAKE
Pardon me, but I don't remember posting "My opinion is better than yours", if anything you're the one saying that your opinion is better with your whole "You're alone with your opinion" I am just stating what most people who dislike John already have said and will say, that he is an overrated character and it's all because of the fanboys, if he didn't have so much people putting him on a pedestal then he would be alright.


Actually you did

Posted by: RKOSNAKE

Well, this "Vocal minority" is the one that actually gives coherent arguments as opposed to MAZTUR CHIEFZZ BEAT DA FLOODZ ND ZAVED DA UNIVERSES!1one!!!!

So, yeah, I'd rather be part of a minority instead of jumping in the Chief loving bandwagon.


However implying that a character is good just by wheter or not he is liked or not is a bad criteria to say the least

  • 12.20.2011 1:03 AM PDT