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Subject: Primordium ~ Chapters 1-4 discussion

yas334229812


Posted by: Xd00999
For some reason I doubt it is Faber. For starters Faber was killed/captured at the Capital and if he was I doubt the Primordial or Bias would transfer his conscience inti a monitor. Another thing is the fact that the people in charge (Didact at least) don't seem to fond of him so putting Faber in charge of a Halo seems like a odd choice.

@Roberto
From the description it almost sounds like the Primordial is some big spider-like creature. Racnoss anyone?

In general I hope that the novel is not solely set on the Halo. It would be nice to see what the forerunners and the galaxy at large is doing at that time; seeing how the forerunners are acting with the Capital destroyed and whatnot.


Still he has power and knows how it work, and they may need him as they were out of people, may be out of desperation.

I like the way he is writing it, i like the character building that was lost from the first story. Although i would like some of the more technical parts of the story to be hidden within the text. Not that out there but hidden.

  • 12.28.2011 5:05 PM PDT

yas334229812


Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: Xd00999
Can you give me a quote that implies the humans imprisoned the Prisoner? I must have missed it.

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Also, someone managed to get the book early through a preorder screw up. From what I read of his posts on halo.xbox.com, the Primordial is hearding thousands of humans into the Palace to turn them into the Flood. The Primordial, by some means that I either missed the explanation of or wasn't explained in the quoted passage, floats above the cattle-like humans as they walk to their doom, hearding them, all the while accompanied by a shimmering green light, most likely Medicant.

There were so many humans, their combined weight and walking kicked up a massive dust cloud that obscured them and the Primordial.

I am intrigued by this but will regard it with sceptism. Is the person who posted this trustworthy and/or is the passage confirmed by another member in a similar situation?

My question is why are the Forerunners letting this go on on a Halo? Why are they allowing these extremely dangerous people to continue their actions on a key military structure?


I can probably give you the direct quote.

Yeah, here it is

"I walked right up to the rim and glanced down at the masses, milling around the base of the monument like so many turbulent pools, raising another great cloud of dust. Then my blood seemed to stop and freeze. There was something different moving now among the hordes, a kilometer or two away, half-obscured by the dust,hovering over the silent crowds. At first I could not tell whether it was a variety of war sphinx. But the dust raised by tramping feet briefly cleared and I saw a huge, curled up spider with many legs, nine or ten meters wide, resting on a round disk and floating with insolent majesty above the migration. Sparkling glints shone from the facets of two oval, slanted, widely spaced eyes on the front of its broad, flat head. The Captive. The Primordial."

The OP said in a different post what the Primordial was using the humans for.

This was the only direct quote he provided. He didn't want to post any significant spoilers. He said it was around 110 pages in.

Remember, the ring is a rogue Halo according to the description, not under Forerunner control. Also note that the People, specifically Vinerrva, haven't seen a living Forerunner in several days, only dead ones from the battle. Presumably, a few days earlier the battle over the Capital took place, and since then, the Halo's been under Medicant's control--again, presumably. How it all fits I don't know. A lot might be explained between the end of Ch. 4 and page 110.


The building of flood army looks like it is being made. Question is how did Chakas get his brain made into an a.i.

This may be true but question is whether this is just mere speculation. It could be false but this type of story is not something that was expected so it could verylikely to be true.

  • 12.28.2011 5:10 PM PDT

I am alpha, i am omega.

I am the last of the primes.

I have no godamn idea what the -blam!- any of you are saying, just to let you know..

  • 12.28.2011 6:59 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

You have been out of it then.

  • 12.28.2011 7:03 PM PDT

Oly Oly Oxen Free


Posted by: ajw34307
Also, The Mona Lisa makes Threshold blue. This seems to be like a Mass Effect case, when you're scrolling around the Galaxy Map and look at a planet it appears to be one colour but as you zoom in closer to it you see it's actually a different colour. IDK but it just seems a little silly for 343 to intentionally lie to everyone about whether it's Installation 04 or 5.


There's multiple sources stating it's 04... plus, time of day, artistic license and 'non-canon mp map' arguments all hold water when it's not story specific.

  • 12.28.2011 7:11 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

Since the Captive is the Gravemind that means he will be caught once again, which means that it is 05.

  • 12.28.2011 7:13 PM PDT


Posted by: Xd00999
For some reason I doubt it is Faber. For starters Faber was killed/captured at the Capital and if he was I doubt the Primordial or Bias would transfer his conscience inti a monitor. Another thing is the fact that the people in charge (Didact at least) don't seem to fond of him so putting Faber in charge of a Halo seems like a odd choice.

@Roberto
From the description it almost sounds like the Primordial is some big spider-like creature. Racnoss anyone?

In general I hope that the novel is not solely set on the Halo. It would be nice to see what the forerunners and the galaxy at large is doing at that time; seeing how the forerunners are acting with the Capital destroyed and whatnot.


Have you ever seen Super 8? I often think of the Visitor whenever I think of Primordial. They look very similar.

Anyway, I think the Forerunners are being held off until book 3. 343i has been saying recently that Primordium is closer to the ground the Cryptum, more personal. So I would asume we're not talking about a galactic adventure like Cryptum.

  • 12.28.2011 7:23 PM PDT

My honor student can beat up your honor student.


Posted by: grey101
Since the Captive is the Gravemind that means he will be caught once again, which means that it is 05.
I agree.

I have a feeling that Chakas and 2401 Penitent Tangent will be related in some way, but I can not be sure. For some reason, 049 Abject Testament, monitor of Installation 03, comes up in my mind. From a storytelling standpoint, why would 343i mention him in HCE Anniversary for such a brief amount of time? He doesn't do much of anything besides say 5 words.

Oddly enough, this isn't the first time that he and Installation 03 have been mentioned. The UNSC Ivanoff currently orbits Installation 03, as we find out in Glasslands. Would 049/2401 actually be Chakas by the end of the novel? Could be nothing, but I have a knack for seeing small things like this. Possibly could be a big deal; most likely isn't. Just food for thought.

The human settlements in Primordium would explain the ruinous structures in Halo 2 on Installation 05 as well. Again, could just be a coincidence, but it would make sense if this were the reasoning behind the ruins.

[Edited on 12.28.2011 7:34 PM PST]

  • 12.28.2011 7:31 PM PDT


Posted by: MickelPickel

Posted by: grey101
Since the Captive is the Gravemind that means he will be caught once again, which means that it is 05.
I agree.

I have a feeling that Chakas and 2401 Penitent Tangent will be related in some way, but I can not be sure. For some reason, 049 Abject Testament, monitor of Installation 03, comes up in my mind. From a storytelling standpoint, why would 343i mention him in HCE Anniversary for such a brief amount of time? He doesn't do much of anything besides say 5 words.

Oddly enough, this isn't the first time that he and Installation 03 have been mentioned. The UNSC Ivanoff currently orbits Installation 03, as we find out in Glasslands. Would 049/2401 actually be Chakas by the end of the novel? Could be nothing, but I have a knack for seeing small things like this. Possibly could be a big deal; most likely isn't. Just food for thought.

The human settlements in Primordium would explain the ruinous structures in Halo 2 on Installation 05 as well. Again, could just be a coincidence, but it would make sense if this were the reasoning behind the ruins.


I noticed this too, but Abject in CEA talks as if he is a Forerunner creation at least, at most a Forerunner at one point with the use of the word "we." So he may not be Chakas, but no doubt he will be important later on.

  • 12.28.2011 7:38 PM PDT

@accordingto343

Your one stop shop for all of 343's fabulous errors and ridiculous notions in the Halo lore.

If it is on Delta Halo, I KNEW those ruins were human in origin.

  • 12.28.2011 7:40 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

Hm.


If a monitor was created from a human mind it could be re-programmed [Mind controlled?] into thinking it was once forerunner for services purposes. When rampancy comes into play that lock is released allowing the former being to resurface and the AI to take a break.


Gamer Whale and Onyx brought something to my attention afew days ago.


In Contact Harvest any time Mack was about to go rampant he would switch with Loki and vice-versa; Which would explain how
lasted so long. This could work with "forerunner" AI's also, in theory.

  • 12.28.2011 7:45 PM PDT

My honor student can beat up your honor student.


Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: MickelPickel

Posted by: grey101
Since the Captive is the Gravemind that means he will be caught once again, which means that it is 05.
I agree.

I have a feeling that Chakas and 2401 Penitent Tangent will be related in some way, but I can not be sure. For some reason, 049 Abject Testament, monitor of Installation 03, comes up in my mind. From a storytelling standpoint, why would 343i mention him in HCE Anniversary for such a brief amount of time? He doesn't do much of anything besides say 5 words.

Oddly enough, this isn't the first time that he and Installation 03 have been mentioned. The UNSC Ivanoff currently orbits Installation 03, as we find out in Glasslands. Would 049/2401 actually be Chakas by the end of the novel? Could be nothing, but I have a knack for seeing small things like this. Possibly could be a big deal; most likely isn't. Just food for thought.

The human settlements in Primordium would explain the ruinous structures in Halo 2 on Installation 05 as well. Again, could just be a coincidence, but it would make sense if this were the reasoning behind the ruins.


I noticed this too, but Abject in CEA talks as if he is a Forerunner creation at least, at most a Forerunner at one point with the use of the word "we." So he may not be Chakas, but no doubt he will be important later on.
True, he does seem to see himself as a forerunner construct. But, if Chakas does end up being an AI we have met before on, per say, Installation 05 like Penitent, why are the UNSC still there looking for information on the Didact?

Last time I checked, Installation 05 was still in the midst of a Flood outbreak and was partially glassed by the Covenant Separatists. Why would the UNSC look there if they needed info on the Didact? It would make more sense if the AI Chakas was located somewhere else. But that leaves the question, "Where else?"

That is a question I cannot answer. Hopefully Primordium will give better explanations than me. I can't wait to get my hands on it.

  • 12.28.2011 7:47 PM PDT

yas334229812

Wait has anyone considered that the humans being turned into flood by the certain leak, may be to make a gravemind, or a backup one not known to medicant bias.

I have a feeling that the Primoridum that was a called a spider and from the certain leak turning people into flood may have been created by the timeless one to build his army of flood.

  • 12.28.2011 8:28 PM PDT

yas334229812


Posted by: MickelPickel

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: MickelPickel

Posted by: grey101
Since the Captive is the Gravemind that means he will be caught once again, which means that it is 05.
I agree.

I have a feeling that Chakas and 2401 Penitent Tangent will be related in some way, but I can not be sure. For some reason, 049 Abject Testament, monitor of Installation 03, comes up in my mind. From a storytelling standpoint, why would 343i mention him in HCE Anniversary for such a brief amount of time? He doesn't do much of anything besides say 5 words.

Oddly enough, this isn't the first time that he and Installation 03 have been mentioned. The UNSC Ivanoff currently orbits Installation 03, as we find out in Glasslands. Would 049/2401 actually be Chakas by the end of the novel? Could be nothing, but I have a knack for seeing small things like this. Possibly could be a big deal; most likely isn't. Just food for thought.

The human settlements in Primordium would explain the ruinous structures in Halo 2 on Installation 05 as well. Again, could just be a coincidence, but it would make sense if this were the reasoning behind the ruins.


I noticed this too, but Abject in CEA talks as if he is a Forerunner creation at least, at most a Forerunner at one point with the use of the word "we." So he may not be Chakas, but no doubt he will be important later on.
True, he does seem to see himself as a forerunner construct. But, if Chakas does end up being an AI we have met before on, per say, Installation 05 like Penitent, why are the UNSC still there looking for information on the Didact?

Last time I checked, Installation 05 was still in the midst of a Flood outbreak and was partially glassed by the Covenant Separatists. Why would the UNSC look there if they needed info on the Didact? It would make more sense if the AI Chakas was located somewhere else. But that leaves the question, "Where else?"

That is a question I cannot answer. Hopefully Primordium will give better explanations than me. I can't wait to get my hands on it.


Another question i had was why and how did the outbreak happen. Was this one the same as the one in primoridum and by the unproven leaks why the outbreak happen. Maybe Didact had to come here and release the flood and push them back and may have been one of the last places he left some secrets.

Hiding some vital info under your enemies nose right in plain sight, is sometime's one of the most successfull way of hiding something, although very unreliable, but many smart geniuses tend to overlook it.

  • 12.28.2011 8:32 PM PDT
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All kinds of psyched. That's all I gotta say.

  • 12.29.2011 4:22 AM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.

The Visitor from Super 8 would definitely be a good representation (awesome movie by the way). The head is the only thing you need to change. But the passage you gave said:
[...]I saw a huge, curled up spider with many legs,nine or ten meters wide[...]The Captive. The Primordial.
Seems like a spider to me.

Even though this will be mainly about Chakas I'm sure some forerunners will appear or at least be mentioned.

  • 12.29.2011 5:50 AM PDT


Posted by: risay_117
Wait has anyone considered that the humans being turned into flood by the certain leak, may be to make a gravemind, or a backup one not known to medicant bias.

I have a feeling that the Primoridum that was a called a spider and from the certain leak turning people into flood may have been created by the timeless one to build his army of flood.


The giant spider called Primordial is the Timeless One. Primordial was another name for it, it was what The People--or ancient Man--called it.

  • 12.29.2011 7:10 AM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.

Shame another one of my theories was shot to bits by the revelation that AM imprisoned the Primordial.

[Edited on 12.29.2011 7:18 AM PST]

  • 12.29.2011 7:17 AM PDT

Well, I just finished reading Primordium and I have to say wow.

I won't spoil anything unless quotes are requested or if it follows along information already known but you can all read it noe at the below link if you are wanting to buy the ebook.

https://booki.sh/titles/9781743294468

  • 12.31.2011 11:28 PM PDT

Posted by: risay_117
Wait has anyone considered that the humans being turned into flood by the certain leak, may be to make a gravemind, or a backup one not known to medicant bias.

I have a feeling that the Primoridum that was a called a spider and from the certain leak turning people into flood may have been created by the timeless one to build his army of flood.



The giant spider called Primordial is the Timeless One. Primordial was another name for it, it was what The People--or ancient Man--called it.


Sure is, except the primordial is also the precursor which is also the flood. It is also confirmed that it is ...................... (I dont want to ruin it so pm me if u want more info)

And a few very very nice new tidbits of information have uncovered and I am definitly looking forward to future Halo lore releases :)

[Edited on 01.01.2012 12:35 AM PST]

  • 12.31.2011 11:33 PM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.


Posted by: Urban GFX
Posted by: risay_117
Wait has anyone considered that the humans being turned into flood by the certain leak, may be to make a gravemind, or a backup one not known to medicant bias.

I have a feeling that the Primoridum that was a called a spider and from the certain leak turning people into flood may have been created by the timeless one to build his army of flood.



The giant spider called Primordial is the Timeless One. Primordial was another name for it, it was what The People--or ancient Man--called it.


Sure is, except the primordial is also the precursor which is also the flood. It is also confirmed that it is ...................... (I dont want to ruin it so pm me if u want more info)

And a few very very nice new tidbits of information have uncovered and I am definitly looking forward to future Halo lore releases :)


Are you confirming that the Timeless One is the Gravemind?

  • 01.01.2012 6:49 AM PDT

A Gravemind is mearly the collection of multiple flood individuals. It is said that they grow together to form them and that the flood and precursor are one in the same

  • 01.01.2012 10:00 AM PDT

Huh. Could Snakie's age old theory have been at least partially right?

  • 01.01.2012 10:38 AM PDT

Mendiciant Bias wasn't convinced by a Gravemind to switch sides. He was convinced by 43 years of talking with the Precursor.

And Gravemind didnt asorb the precursor and there are multiple graveminds, they are essentially (it seems) considerably lesser than the precursor but could eventually becomes like it I assume/

In regards to living ais, some of their ais were living. Case and poing chakas who died and was put into a monitor to preserve him and he continued to live in one for over a hundred thousand years.

The rest of his post it too long to read lol so I stopped there

  • 01.01.2012 10:58 AM PDT

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