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This topic has moved here: Subject: Halo: Primordium discussion [spoilers]
  • Subject: Halo: Primordium discussion [spoilers]
Subject: Halo: Primordium discussion [spoilers]

bs

[Edited on 01.10.2012 3:37 AM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 2:57 AM PDT

Posted by: prometheus25
Posted by: Alexthekid3000
So the Flood is actually the Precursors?


No, Didact goes on to say:

"Or are you after all only an imitation of a Precursor, a puppet-a reanimated corpse? Are all the Precursors gone-or is it that the Flood will make new Precursors?"

He's speculating on the Primordal/Precursor relationship, but confirms that it is, at least, a Gravemind. They don't necessarily know that this is what Precursors looked like, only assumed because they thought it was one at one time.



I really want my copy to arrive, just so I can understand everything that is going on.

Anyway, on a rather unrelated note, the Primordial seems fairly small for a Gravemind, considering how large the one that was dealt with in Halo 2 and 3 was.

  • 01.10.2012 4:12 AM PDT

Old school Bungie, born and raised,
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Posted by: Rolling Flame
Anyway, on a rather unrelated note, the Primordial seems fairly small for a Gravemind, considering how large the one that was dealt with in Halo 2 and 3 was.


I don't think size ultimately matter. The Gravemind in Halo 2 had much more time to build up more biological matter for a larger size. Plus, we don't necessarily know the Primordal's origins.

Posted by: Urban GFX
One thing that I wondered is, how did ONI find chakas or did chakas find them? That would be interesting to know once we find out, im guessing the next forerunner book will touch on what happens next but it will be interesting regardless


Have you read Glasslands yet? I only ask because I don't want to spoil anything. While this book doesn't mention anything on this subject, perhaps the new Forerunner location, the big one, would be a likely location. Just a guess though.


[Edited on 01.10.2012 6:55 AM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 6:53 AM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

They didn't find him on onyx because they kept bringing onyx up, and i doubt it's infinity.

  • 01.10.2012 6:54 AM PDT

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Posted by: CM Punk
Can someone explain how after like 4 consecutive laser shots 343 is still "alive"?
Chakas/Spark mentions in the book that there are several of him, and that one of him caused the humans quite a bit of trouble. This GS is just a copy of installation 04's GS.

  • 01.10.2012 10:02 AM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins

Perhaps the whole mantel thing, is how the flood ensure that they never run out of food and new technology to assimilate. They let a species rise to it's pinnacle while the flood hibernates or something, and then they come back, consume them, and let the next race take the mantel. This would be consistent with what the primordial was saying, and would also accommodate the flood's all consuming nature. Also (assuming the precursors were literally the flood) perhaps when they created the galaxy's sentient races, it was to replace the races that the flood/precursors had already wiped out.

  • 01.10.2012 10:13 AM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Darthbill99

[quote]Posted by: CM Punk
This GS is just a copy of installation 04's GS.


Backwards; Chakas is 343 but 343 is only a fragment of chakas.
It is like how humans are indeed apes but Apes aren't human (other than humans).

  • 01.10.2012 10:14 AM PDT

yas334229812


Posted by: Darthbill99
Perhaps the whole mantel thing, is how the flood ensure that they never run out of food and new technology to assimilate. They let a species rise to it's pinnacle while the flood hibernates or something, and then they come back, consume them, and let the next race take the mantel. This would be consistent with what the primordial was saying, and would also accommodate the flood's all consuming nature. Also (assuming the precursors were literally the flood) perhaps when they created the galaxy's sentient races, it was to replace the races that the flood/precursors had already wiped out.

That might be true but another question one must ask was that if the Mantle is truly horrible then would it maybe be more darker. Plus no one usually uses this idea for randomness there has to be a motive.

To your reasoning the motive could be to become biologically supreme via taking all the abilities and immunities of a species. Not only that but alot more wisdom and tech that could make them greater and more powerfull then what they were previous.

  • 01.10.2012 11:41 AM PDT
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I agree with you here. although i believe the primoridium is actually a precursor and not infected by the flood.
And no the Precursor was not the pinnacle of the flood creation but the pinacle of the flood was when all life is assimilated into one form.

Like the melting pot. While the Librarian tends to favour multiculturalism.



It is confirmed by didact that the primordial is infact a gravemind.

I dont think the precursor is any form of flood, just that they used this parasite to test subject species.

  • 01.10.2012 12:08 PM PDT

Old school Bungie, born and raised,
In the Septagon is where I spend most of my days.
Relaxin', maxin', posting all cool,
Talking about Halo, life and some school.
Got in one little argument, and the mods got scared,
they said "You're gonna get banned and your member title'll be bare!"

Posted by: grey101

Posted by: Darthbill99

[quote]Posted by: CM Punk
This GS is just a copy of installation 04's GS.


Backwards; Chakas is 343 but 343 is only a fragment of chakas.
It is like how humans are indeed apes but Apes aren't human (other than humans).


Agreed. Squares are quadrilaterals, but not all quadrilaterals squares. You've got rhombuses, rectangles, parallelograms, diamonds, etc, etc.

  • 01.10.2012 12:10 PM PDT
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@ Prometheus
Excellent point, whether the Gravemind that appeared in Halo 2 somehow survived the Flood-Forerunner war is tough to say, or from the breach in containment at Installation 05 but I would like that to be explained.


I can't recall exactly where this occured but towards the end before Chakas has the Lord of Admirals extracted, but Vinnevra was talking about the Primordial, and she called it a child-a young child if im quoting correctly. The Lord of Admirals rose from Chakas and said, "They start again as children-all together. It is what the Composer was designed to prevent."

Maybe the gravemind or graveminds reach a certain stage, possibly after the "pure" flood form stage and a precursor can be born. Pure speculation of course!!

I'm surprised that no one has brought up the "Bornstellar Relation", that the human science team mentioned a few time during Primordium. I believe he/she or it, was found on Onyx and more likely the Sharpened Shield mentioned in Halo Glasslands.

I don't think this is just the connection between the Didact and Bornstellar, but through unknown means one of Bornstellar's family is alive. Bornstellar/Didact could of also had children at some point before the activation of the Halo Array.



[Edited on 01.10.2012 12:31 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 12:29 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: NakMuay4life1178
@ Prometheus
Excellent point, whether the Gravemind that appeared in Halo 2 somehow survived the Flood-Forerunner war is tough to say, or from the breach in containment at Installation 05 but I would like that to be explained.


I can't recall exactly where this occured but towards the end before Chakas has the Lord of Admirals extracted, but Vinnevra was talking about the Primordial, and she called it a child-a young child if im quoting correctly. The Lord of Admirals rose from Chakas and said, "They start again as children-all together. It is what the Composer was designed to prevent."

Maybe the gravemind or graveminds reach a certain stage, possibly after the "pure" flood form stage and a precursor can be born. Pure speculation of course!!

I'm surprised that no one has brought up the "Bornstellar Relation", that the human science team mentioned a few time during Primordium. I believe he/she or it, was found on Onyx and more likely the Sharpened Shield mentioned in Halo Glasslands.

I don't think this is just the connection between the Didact and Bornstellar, but through unknown means one of Bornstellar's family is alive. Bornstellar/Didact could of also had children at some point before the activation of the Halo Array.




The Pedia confirms the gravemind that the forerunners fought was killed by the array. The breach on 05 happens AFTER the array fired.

I honestly didn't get the whole children thing, could we further talk about that?


You Bastard! what if one of his spawn was in the slipspace pod?

  • 01.10.2012 12:37 PM PDT

yas334229812


Posted by: grey101


You Bastard! what if one of his spawn was in the slipspace pod?


What?\

Do you mean that TO left one of its spawn or kids in a pod and sent it to this planet where it is slowly with the memory of its father planning its last stages of assault and victory. And chief needs to save the whole galaxy from this threat now.

  • 01.10.2012 12:40 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: risay_117

Posted by: grey101


You Bastard! what if one of his spawn was in the slipspace pod?


What?\

Do you mean that TO left one of its spawn or kids in a pod and sent it to this planet where it is slowly with the memory of its father planning its last stages of assault and victory. And chief needs to save the whole galaxy from this threat now.


I was talking about the bornstellar relation.

  • 01.10.2012 12:43 PM PDT
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Pedia's not the best source, but I can see your point. I could just see it being as explained as, Oh it was on a Halo when the Array was fired, it's cool lol.

The Lord of Admirals and Yprin seemed to know more about the Primordial than anyone else. Yprin actually excavated it from an unknown planet, and lead the team that interrogated the Primordial. Forthencho I believe said that the Primordial or maybe it was the Precursors were composed of more than one body. It's most likey the Primordial being it was a Gravemind but I can not recall.

??? Slipspace Pod ????

And what about this Composer...possibly the creature/robot seen at the concept art tease from Halo Fest.

[Edited on 01.10.2012 12:50 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 12:48 PM PDT

Now I'm just throwing this out here, but what if the Bornstellar Relation was Cryptum in the same sense that Primordium is Chakas story?

[Edited on 01.10.2012 12:52 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 12:50 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: NakMuay4life1178
Pedia's not the best source, but I can see your point. I could just see it being as explained as, Oh it was on a Halo when the Array was fired, it's cool lol.

The Lord of Admirals and Yprin seemed to know more about the Primordial than anyone else. Yprin actually excavated it from an unknown planet, and lead the team that interrogated the Primordial. Forthencho I believe said that the Primordial or maybe it was the Precursors were composed of more than one body. It's most likey the Primordial being it was a Gravemind but I can not recall.

??? Slipspace Pod ????

And what about this Composer...possibly the creature/robot seen at the concept art tease from Halo Fest.


"The Pedia" as in the encyclopedia

  • 01.10.2012 12:53 PM PDT
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I don't know if Forerunners can live and not age in armor, or if there is a large scale cryptum but it seems that one or more Forerunners did not die by the Array.

Forerunners obviously have knowledge of time manipulation, i.e. a cryptum and the time displacement in the Sharpened Shield.

Very curious to see how this plays out.

Oh encyclopedia, my bad bro

[Edited on 01.10.2012 12:58 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 12:56 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: NakMuay4life1178
I don't know if Forerunners can live and not age in armor, or if there is a large scale cryptum but it seems that one or more Forerunners did not die by the Array.

Forerunners obviously have knowledge of time manipulation, i.e. a cryptum and the time displacement in the Sharpened Shield.

Very curious to see how this plays out.

Oh encyclopedia, my bad bro


It seems that they could live "forever" in their armor. But it seems that during the war the flood turned off their armor.

And The Pedia also states they relocated to another space in the galaxy.

  • 01.10.2012 1:01 PM PDT
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By space does this mean, another "dimension", slipspace, or one of the other spaces the Forerunners know. They would of had to be on another plane of reality to escape the Halo effect, yes?

Was it the Flood that used the armor breakin units, or the conflict between the Lifeworkers and Builders that used that technology?

  • 01.10.2012 1:05 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: NakMuay4life1178
By space does this mean, another "dimension", slipspace, or one of the other spaces the Forerunners know. They would of had to be on another plane of reality to escape the Halo effect, yes?

Was it the Flood that used the armor breakin units, or the conflict between the Lifeworkers and Builders that used that technology?


Space as in, they no longer live in the orion arm.

  • 01.10.2012 1:19 PM PDT
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That I thought was obvious, due to the fact that the Covenant and Humainty now occupy a majority of the Orion arm in the Halo timeline. Being that the Forerunner ecumene spread over 3 million fertile world, even though the Orion Complex was the birthplace of Forerunners, they spread their empire far beyond the Orion arm.

And just to confirm, it was the conflict between the Lifeworkers and Builder that the armor breaking units were used. Some Forerunners, that were infected by the flood had a special almost liquid nano machine suit, made by the Composer, that delayed in spread of the infection. This made them still useful to Mendicant Bias to help maintain the Installation.

[Edited on 01.10.2012 1:59 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 1:57 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

I don't remember all that. I recall the flood not being able to fully infect forerunners that had armor thus they could still be used.

  • 01.10.2012 2:24 PM PDT

The book is good.

[Edited on 01.10.2012 2:49 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 2:28 PM PDT
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I'm sure of the page number but it was when Chakas, Riser, and Vinnera were on the Forerunner transport for the first time. A bunch of Forerunner infected were on other transports and pushed past them. Eventually they were put in cages by green eyed monitors.

Chakas noticed little machines I believe he described them as fish breaking out of water, trying to hold back the infection. The Lord of Admirals was the one who identified it as a creation of the Composer.

[Edited on 01.10.2012 2:31 PM PST]

  • 01.10.2012 2:30 PM PDT