Halo: Reach Forum
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Subject: An apology to 'casuals'

I'm sorry that some people in this forum in a thread I've just read (not naming any names) are a poor representation of the real MLG population. I'm aware that anecdotal evidence means very little, but I un-mute every player I see in the lobby when I match up into an MLG game and not once have I heard trash talk from either team that you wouldn't get in any other playlist in Reach. It's a shame that a select few spoil it and taint your opinions of the rest of the MLG playing population.

NB. Players in MLG tend to be muted more because people mute the other team that that you can't hear them and vice versa, which prompts the mute ban to act on people to play MLG a lot.

However, it is true that MLG gametypes take more skill than default gametypes. They contain less random factors and the individual skill and teamwork involved is much greater than in default playlists. There's a good reason why everyone who plays MLG will have a much higher k/d in default playlists than in MLG, and that's because MLG is much harder to succeed at. Partly because the playlist relies much more on skill and decision making rather than random factors to succeed, and partly because bad players don't play it very much.

Why don't bad players play it very much? Because it relies less on random factors so they find it more difficult to succeed. I can't say I blame them in not finding it fun matching up against other players in a gametype which makes them rely on their skill rather than random chance and luck and then going negative every game.

Try it. Take any good player (I would say a good player has a k/d above about 1.5 in default Reach) and compare their default k/d with MLG k/d. If you can find someone with over 50 games of MLG and a higher MLG k/d than default k/d, then I'll be impressed.

Case 1 - me. 2.16 Competitive k/d, 0.99 MLG k/d
Case 2 - 2.37 Competitive k/d, 1.29 MLG k/d
Case 3 - 1.83 Competitive k/d, 1.32 MLG k/d
Case 4 - 2.50 Competitive k/d, 1.29 MLG k/d

I can go on and on with good players off the top of my head. Simple fact is, MLG is harder to play and succeed at than default because the settings are harder and more competitive and the players are better.

TL;DR Don't let a few bad representatives cloud your judgement on the whole. MLG takes more skill than default, though, which is why bad players don't play it.

[Edited on 01.08.2012 7:13 AM PST]

  • 01.08.2012 6:59 AM PDT

The Song Of Nephilim

Xenoblade <3

lolmlg.

  • 01.08.2012 7:03 AM PDT


Posted by: Destiny 7
How does playing on custom settings make you "pro"? A real pro would use the settings from Matchmaking provided by 343/Bungie.
Because the settings in default Matchmaking include great deals of randomness (see: bloom), unskilled gameplay (see: every game on Countdown ever played), and just being generally easier (see: low movement speed).

Every good MLG player totally dominates in default too.

  • 01.08.2012 7:05 AM PDT


Posted by: Nephilim713
lolmlg.
Don't post if you have nothing to add to the thread.

  • 01.08.2012 7:05 AM PDT


Posted by: X El BaZzA X

Posted by: Destiny 7
How does playing on custom settings make you "pro"? A real pro would use the settings from Matchmaking provided by 343/Bungie.
Because the settings in default Matchmaking include great deals of randomness (see: bloom), unskilled gameplay (see: every game on Countdown ever played), and just being generally easier (see: low movement speed).

Every good MLG player totally dominates in default too.


Actually, people get paid good money to play MLG settings (making it their profession).

People do not get paid to play lol default.

  • 01.08.2012 7:10 AM PDT


Posted by: SatansReverence

Posted by: X El BaZzA X

Posted by: Destiny 7
How does playing on custom settings make you "pro"? A real pro would use the settings from Matchmaking provided by 343/Bungie.
Because the settings in default Matchmaking include great deals of randomness (see: bloom), unskilled gameplay (see: every game on Countdown ever played), and just being generally easier (see: low movement speed).

Every good MLG player totally dominates in default too.


Actually, people get paid good money to play MLG settings (making it their profession).

People do not get paid to play lol default.
No one would pay anyone to play default because it's a joke anyway

  • 01.08.2012 7:12 AM PDT
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Lol, according to a large majority of the gaming population, anyone who likes Halo is a casual, regardless of whether or not they play MLG. Just saying, 'casual' is probably the wrong word for your subject.

  • 01.08.2012 7:15 AM PDT


Posted by: X El BaZzA X

People do not get paid to play lol default.[/quote]No one would pay anyone to play default because it's a joke anyway
\

Exactly.

So no one would or could be a pro because of their loldefault "skills".

  • 01.08.2012 7:15 AM PDT


Posted by: ChewyRibbit
Lol, according to a large majority of the gaming population, anyone who likes Halo is a casual, regardless of whether or not they play MLG. Just saying, 'casual' is probably the wrong word for your subject.
Halo is probably the most competitive of the console shooters. Other popular shooter franchises like CoD or BF contain too much randomness amongst other things to be competitive.

  • 01.08.2012 7:16 AM PDT
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Who would throw away a 100k over a couple of coin tosses?

  • 01.08.2012 7:17 AM PDT

At least you've posted a response which isn't derogatory and don't idolize people who 'play games as a career'.

Stripping down a game to its bare essentials however,(what MLG basically does) doesn't promote better 'skill'. Lack of weapon variety and team work being the only factor as to whether you win or not doesn't represent skill for me.

The fact that 'random' elements have been taken out means games should indeed be closer(hence the K/D drop), this does not mean that it is more skillful. The assumption that better players play MLG as well as Pros is incorrect as anyone can join an MLG game. It is not restricted to better players.

Who actually cares enough about how good they are in a videogame anyway? Hardly anyone will become pro in their lifetime, and their profession is a sad existence at that.

  • 01.08.2012 7:18 AM PDT


Posted by: DougiePooDollar
Stripping down a game to its bare essentials however,(what MLG basically does) doesn't promote better 'skill'. Lack of weapon variety and team work being the only factor as to whether you win or not doesn't represent skill for me.
You can't blame the players for the lack of weapon variety. If MLG had placed Plasma Repeaters, Spikers, ARs, etc. everywhere then it would be a joke because these guns take less skill to use than precision weapons, but also they're so useless there's no point in picking them up in the first place. They're just clutter. If there was a way to make them more powerful without changing the rest of the sandbox, I don't know if MLG would include a few on maps as sort of pseudo power weapons, but at the moment to include them would be pointless.

The fact that 'random' elements have been taken out means games should indeed be closer(hence the K/D drop)This is just incorrect at its core. By their very nature, random elements of a game will tend towards the game having an even net result, which would bring players closer to 1.0 k/d as succeeding amongst the randomness is hard. MLG actually allows the better players to beat the worse players more easily because of the lack of randomness in the game. The reason people's k/d in the playlist is closer to 1.0 is because the gametype is harder to succeed at and the competition is better players. Default will have all skill ranges of players, from the ones without hands all the way up to 'MM Pros'. MLG will likely only have the higher levels of these skill ranges playing because the worse players just get beaten up on more easily.The assumption that better players play MLG as well as Pros is incorrect as anyone can join an MLG game. It is not restricted to better players.Worse players are less likely to play MLG because they will get beaten on more easily by better players and so they are less likely to enjoy the game they're playing. Why play MLG and go negative against better players when they could play default and break even against the same players?


[Edited on 01.08.2012 7:27 AM PST]

  • 01.08.2012 7:24 AM PDT

/=\ncient \_|_/arriors


Posted by: X El BaZzA X
Don't let a few bad representatives cloud your judgement on the whole. MLG takes more skill than default, though, which is why bad players don't play it.


Two things.

Anyone with half a brain knows that the loudest, most immature and most hateful players are a tiny percentage of the MLG players. They seem to usually be the youngest too... but that's just my opinion. As a self-proclaimed casual, however, I appreciate the honesty.

My only issue is that you are equating casual with bad player. A casual is not necessarily bad, and a hardcore gamer is not necessarily good. Before you pull my stats: I am not bad... I'm horrible :). I wish the community could agree on what is causal and what isn't, but there is too much grey area. I'm going to leave it at that simply because my buddy Plunder loves that subject, lol

  • 01.08.2012 7:25 AM PDT


Posted by: WebFootFreak

Posted by: X El BaZzA X
Don't let a few bad representatives cloud your judgement on the whole. MLG takes more skill than default, though, which is why bad players don't play it.

My only issue is that you are equating casual with bad player.
It's less likely to be accused of 'rank flaming' if I use the term casual as pretty much a synonym of bad player.

[Edited on 01.08.2012 7:29 AM PST]

  • 01.08.2012 7:29 AM PDT

MLG is da bomb.

  • 01.08.2012 7:32 AM PDT
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  • Elder Legendary Member
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H: CE - Amazing.
Halo 2 - Revolutionary.
Halo 3 - Decent.
Halo Reach- An epic fail of monumental proportions.
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░▀▀▀ ░▀ ░░░▀ ░▀▀▀ ░░▀ ░░░▀░▀ ░▀ ░▀▀▀ ░

That's an opinion, not a fact.

Here's a fact; at MLG events COD gets more viewers than the Reach broadcast.

Your thread sucks. Stop trying to make your opinion look like facts.

Posted by: X El BaZzA X
Halo is probably the most competitive of the console shooters. Other popular shooter franchises like CoD or BF contain too much randomness amongst other things to be competitive.

  • 01.08.2012 7:33 AM PDT


Posted by: zuboy
Here's a fact; at MLG events COD gets more viewers than the Reach broadcast.
CoD is a more popular and mainstream franchise than Halo.

Everything I stated in the OP is a straight up fact.

  • 01.08.2012 7:36 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Elder Legendary Member
  • gamertag: Zutboy
  • user homepage:

H: CE - Amazing.
Halo 2 - Revolutionary.
Halo 3 - Decent.
Halo Reach- An epic fail of monumental proportions.
░█▀▀ ░█▀█ ░█ ░█▀▀ ░░█▀▀ ░█▀█ ░█ ░█ ░░░
░█▀▀ ░█▀▀ ░█ ░█ ░░░░█▀▀ ░█▀█ ░█ ░█ ░░░
░▀▀▀ ░▀ ░░░▀ ░▀▀▀ ░░▀ ░░░▀░▀ ░▀ ░▀▀▀ ░

Also not true, MLG takes just as much or less "lolskill" than any other playlist.

It boils down to how you look at the game.
If you join alone, other playlists require more "lolskill"?

Piloting vehicles takes "lolskill" and as there are none in MLG that aspect is lost.
AA aren't in the playlist (I think?) so the "lolskill" of using those also is lost.

Assuming you are playing in a team, MLG (and any other playlist) could take more skill than other playlists. Here individual skill is replaced by team-effort.

Posted by: X El BaZzA X
TL;DR Don't let a few bad representatives cloud your judgement on the whole. MLG takes more skill than default, though, which is why bad players don't play it.

  • 01.08.2012 7:44 AM PDT

Fhtagn

MLG only takes more skill because the average MLG player is better than in the other playlists.

  • 01.08.2012 7:46 AM PDT

Posted by: zuboy
Piloting vehicles takes "lolskill" and as there are none in MLG that aspect is lost.
AA aren't in the playlist (I think?) so the "lolskill" of using those also is lost.
True there aren't any vehicles, but there are jetpacks and evade. You have to keep an eye out for them and keep track of them or else they can really screw your team over. You can't just spawn with them like in default Reach, so you have to control them.

Assuming you are playing in a team, MLG (and any other playlist) could take more skill than other playlists. Here individual skill is replaced by team-effort.Halo is a team game though. Being good at MLG means you're generally pretty good at the default playlists as well.

  • 01.08.2012 7:48 AM PDT

/=\ncient \_|_/arriors


Posted by: X El BaZzA X
It's less likely to be accused of 'rank flaming' if I use the term casual as pretty much a synonym of bad player.


Hehehe. I see your point. Thing is you chose to target another user base. So, you spare the feelings of those who either:

A) want a true ranking system in Reach that actually works... or...

B) think that the little credit-based picture means something other than time played. (Not sure which definition you are using)

Over those that just pop in and out to play a bit here and there for fun.

Yup, you still pissed ppl off. I suggest you direct your comments towards the community as a whole vs singling one group out over a lolvideogame

  • 01.08.2012 7:58 AM PDT

"Before you insult someone, try walking a mile in their shoes. This way, when you insult them, you are a mile away and have their shoes."


Posted by: X El BaZzA X
I'm sorry that some people in this forum in a thread I've just read (not naming any names) are a poor representation of the real MLG population. I'm aware that anecdotal evidence means very little, but I un-mute every player I see in the lobby when I match up into an MLG game and not once have I heard trash talk from either team that you wouldn't get in any other playlist in Reach. It's a shame that a select few spoil it and taint your opinions of the rest of the MLG playing population.


I don't agree too much with the rest of your post, but this is a great thing to post. It's true, the real MLG pros are usually great people, the kids are not.

  • 01.08.2012 8:01 AM PDT

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
Goat was famous. Irie was infamous. Gh0st was FaMaS.

I'm gonna play the new mlg some day I swear

  • 01.08.2012 8:09 AM PDT

No doubt the MLG takes more skill, your DMR aim has to be on point, you have to know the maps well, and teamwork is VITAL. I don't know why the community is hating on the MLG playlist, you don't have to play it, and if you aren't super competitive you don't have to care about the players in that playlist, but it's true that the playlist takes more skill. I was doing well in Team Slayer and I went in there and got WRECKED.

  • 01.08.2012 9:01 AM PDT

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