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This topic has moved here: Poll [23 votes]: Should grunts have been enemies in Halo 3?
  • Poll [23 votes]: Should grunts have been enemies in Halo 3?
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Subject: Should grunts have been enemies in Halo 3?

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.

Poll: Should grunts have been enemies in Halo 3?  [closed]
Yes:  65%
(15 Votes)
No:  22%
(5 Votes)
I dont care:  13%
(3 Votes)
Total Votes: 23

I personally think grunts should have been allies, not enemies in Halo 3.

Just look at the last 4 missions of Halo 2. The grunts were fighting with the elites. In Gravemind and High Charity the grunts are frequently seen being killed by brutes. In Uprising and The Great Journey grunts were fighting brutes and they were even shown to be allies with the humans on the last mission.

So why, suddenly, when Master Chief lands of earth, are they suddenly loyalist again? I mean, Halo 3 takes place straight after Halo 2, there's hardly enough time for that to happen.

And before someone says it was out of fear, if they were scared they wouldnt have had the courage to join the elites in he first place.

Personally i think the grunts should have been allies in Halo 3. The first time you meet them is Floodgate, where spec ops grunts help you to fight the flood, and they would have also appeared in The Covenant.

Jackals should have replaced them. Thy're easy enough to kill in Halo 3, so you should have just fought jackals, brutes and drones in Halo 3.

I also think Hunters should have been allies for the same reasons, but they wouldnt appear too often as they would be too OP. Maybe once on Floodgate and The Covenant.

So theres why grunts should have been allies in Halo 3.

  • 01.13.2012 9:19 AM PDT

The WorkPLace

Posted by: FALSE R3ALITYx
And Cobravert is absolutely correct.

Posted by: Der Todesengel
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth and Cobra."
- Der

Hunters were never on Floodgate. No Covenant were.
They were on The Storm, The Ark, and Covenant.

Grunts, I'd rather be shooting them than depending on them. They're too funny not to be shot at, and the game had to have some lower tiered adversaries. Jackals would not have been enough, too many snipers and shields, and the Brutes do not have enough range to fit the Grunts ineptitude.

  • 01.13.2012 10:18 AM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: Cobravert
Hunters were never on Floodgate. No Covenant were.
They were on The Storm, The Ark, and Covenant.

Grunts, I'd rather be shooting them than depending on them. They're too funny not to be shot at, and the game had to have some lower tiered adversaries. Jackals would not have been enough, too many snipers and shields, and the Brutes do not have enough range to fit the Grunts ineptitude.


Yes, I know there were no covenant on Floodgate apart from the elites. I'm saying that if they were allies they could have been aiding the elites on Floodgate.

Also, you had grunts as allies in Halo 2, did you shoot them then?

I think that the levels Uprising and The Great Journey worked out really well without grunts, I dont see why Halo 3 wouldnt work out the same

  • 01.13.2012 11:31 AM PDT

Call me Stu

No all I wanted was grunt flood forms.

  • 01.13.2012 11:46 AM PDT

The WorkPLace

Posted by: FALSE R3ALITYx
And Cobravert is absolutely correct.

Posted by: Der Todesengel
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth and Cobra."
- Der

Posted by: Mark V guy

Also, you had grunts as allies in Halo 2, did you shoot them then?

Maybe.

<.<

>.>

yes...

  • 01.13.2012 12:46 PM PDT
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Do da la la!

From what i know supposedly grunts as a whole remained loyal to the covenant and the few who were serving under elites at the time of the schism stayed with their elite leaders, hence the grunt allies in halo 2.
There should have been some grunt allies in halo 3, but were probably not included to avoid confusion.

[Edited on 01.13.2012 1:07 PM PST]

  • 01.13.2012 1:06 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: Cobravert
Posted by: Mark V guy

Also, you had grunts as allies in Halo 2, did you shoot them then?

Maybe.

<.<

>.>

yes...


Lol. I personally found the Halo 2 grunts to be too cute to kill. Just some of the funny and innocent dialogue that they came out with, like 'Me and you make great team!'

On Gravemind and High Charity I was defending the grunts even though they were still attacking me.

  • 01.13.2012 1:08 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: Do Da Lalalala
From what i know supposedly grunts as a whole remained loyal to the covenant and the few who were serving under elites at the time of the schism stayed with their elite leaders, hence the grunt allies in halo 2.
There should have been some grunt allies in halo 3, but were probably not included to avoid confusion.


Yeah, although it couldnt be that confusing if they had similar stuff going in Halo 2. At the beginning of Gravemind the grunts are serving the brutes, and by the end of it the brutes are killing them.

Also, I'm pretty sure that in Halo 2 the vast majority of grunts were separatist, hence their persecution in Halo 2 by the brutes

  • 01.13.2012 1:10 PM PDT
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Posted by: Mark V guy
And before someone says it was out of fear, if they were scared they wouldnt have had the courage to join the elites in he first place.
The Arbiter said that the Grunts are scared of the Brutes, 'their new found courage is but fear'. Also, a marine hints that the Brutes put something in their methane tanks, which is why they are as tough as the Brutes. The Final Grunt also hints at methane tank changes. Finally, it has been stated that the Grunts were too indecisive to continue the war after the Covenant hierarchy had been killed.

So the reason is:

fear of Covenant Loyalists

Posted by: Mark V guy
The first time you meet them is Floodgate, where spec ops grunts help you to fight the flood, and they would have also appeared in The Covenant.
They would drop down on the Phantom that comes when you first encounter the Pure Form and have lost most of your Elites but there's no way I'd like to see the Grunts so early. The Flood combat forms and infection forms would destroy them. They might have a chance against Pure Forms if they spam plasmas or spawn with fuel rod guns.

Posted by: Mark V guy
Jackals should have replaced them. Thy're easy enough to kill in Halo 3, so you should have just fought jackals, brutes and drones in Halo 3.
N-O. NO! That would be boring, un-fun, and would kill the H3 campaign like it did with Uprising.

Uprising looks nice on Easy but on Legendary, none of it is fun. It's frustrating. Some spawns are random. No one wants to play through the entire level, preferring going up the top of the map.

It's better if some Grunts were allies and some Grunts were enemies. To distinguish allies from enemies, they could be wearing a darker armor like the Spec Ops Elites (as the current Spec Ops Grunts had dark white armor reminiscent of Ultra Grunts).

So... it's clear that Bungie simply doesn't know how to balance their friendly AI in Halo (nullifying it greatly in Reach). Arbiter was a risky gamble they took and they succeeded. Arby was a freakishly good killing machine in the right hands. But other than that, Bungie weren't daring enough to include Grunts or Hunters as allies, or even higher ranking Elites. H3 was a watered down H2 with incredible improvements, but not enough boldness as it's predecessor.

So many enemy variants were ignored, even honor guard Brutes, which would have added authenticity to the cutscene where Truth is preparing to activate the Ark. Also, it would mean Brute plasma rifles. I'd actually like to fight honor guard Brutes when activating the light bridge and then for the cutscene to show up.

Think about it:

2-4 honor guard Brutes (6-8 on Heroic and Legendary) wielding Brute plasma rifles, Brute Shots, and perhaps 1 or 2 with a hammer situated at the back of the activation platform, out of sight. They are invincible, not even taking power armor damage, although they can be knocked off the platform or made into going into their berserk state via grenade stick. When you activate the light bridge, that's when they will engage you and that's when they can be killed. For this part, a Phantom would arrive and drop off Spec Ops Elites and Spec Ops Grunts, perhaps even 1 or 2 Elite Councilor.

Posted by: Mark V guy
I also think Hunters should have been allies for the same reasons, but they wouldnt appear too often as they would be too OP. Maybe once on Floodgate and The Covenant.
Covenant Loyalists are never fun to fight without at least 1 of the core Covenant species: Grunts, Hunters, Elites, especially Grunts.

Brutes may be interesting in H3, but if you've ever played Crow's Nest thoroughly and on higher difficulties, you'll know what I mean by boring and un-fun. It's an infestation on that level!

[Edited on 01.13.2012 2:06 PM PST]

  • 01.13.2012 1:56 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.



Posted by: Sliding Ghost
Posted by: Mark V guy
And before someone says it was out of fear, if they were scared they wouldnt have had the courage to join the elites in he first place.
The Arbiter said that the Grunts are scared of the Brutes, 'their new found courage is but fear'. Also, a marine hints that the Brutes put something in their methane tanks, which is why they are as tough as the Brutes. The Final Grunt also hints at methane tank changes. Finally, it has been stated that the Grunts were too indecisive to continue the war after the Covenant hierarchy had been killed.

So the reason is:

fear of Covenant Loyalists

Posted by: Mark V guy
The first time you meet them is Floodgate, where spec ops grunts help you to fight the flood, and they would have also appeared in The Covenant.
They would drop down on the Phantom that comes when you first encounter the Pure Form and have lost most of your Elites but there's no way I'd like to see the Grunts so early. The Flood combat forms and infection forms would destroy them. They might have a chance against Pure Forms if they spam plasmas or spawn with fuel rod guns.

Posted by: Mark V guy
Jackals should have replaced them. Thy're easy enough to kill in Halo 3, so you should have just fought jackals, brutes and drones in Halo 3.
N-O. NO! That would be boring, un-fun, and would kill the H3 campaign like it did with Uprising.

Uprising looks nice on Easy but on Legendary, none of it is fun. It's frustrating. Some spawns are random. No one wants to play through the entire level, preferring going up the top of the map.

It's better if some Grunts were allies and some Grunts were enemies. To distinguish allies from enemies, they could be wearing a darker armor like the Spec Ops Elites (as the current Spec Ops Grunts had dark white armor reminiscent of Ultra Grunts).

So... it's clear that Bungie simply doesn't know how to balance their friendly AI in Halo (nullifying it greatly in Reach). Arbiter was a risky gamble they took and they succeeded. Arby was a freakishly good killing machine in the right hands. But other than that, Bungie weren't daring enough to include Grunts or Hunters as allies, or even higher ranking Elites. H3 was a watered down H2 with incredible improvements, but not enough boldness as it's predecessor.

So many enemy variants were ignored, even honor guard Brutes, which would have added authenticity to the cutscene where Truth is preparing to activate the Ark. Also, it would mean Brute plasma rifles. I'd actually like to fight honor guard Brutes when activating the light bridge and then for the cutscene to show up.

Think about it:

2-4 honor guard Brutes (6-8 on Heroic and Legendary) wielding Brute plasma rifles, Brute Shots, and perhaps 1 or 2 with a hammer situated at the back of the activation platform, out of sight. They are invincible, not even taking power armor damage, although they can be knocked off the platform or made into going into their berserk state via grenade stick. When you activate the light bridge, that's when they will engage you and that's when they can be killed. For this part, a Phantom would arrive and drop off Spec Ops Elites and Spec Ops Grunts, perhaps even 1 or 2 Elite Councilor.

Posted by: Mark V guy
I also think Hunters should have been allies for the same reasons, but they wouldnt appear too often as they would be too OP. Maybe once on Floodgate and The Covenant.
Covenant Loyalists are never fun to fight without at least 1 of the core Covenant species: Grunts, Hunters, Elites, especially Grunts.

Brutes may be interesting in H3, but if you've ever played Crow's Nest thoroughly and on higher difficulties, you'll know what I mean by boring and un-fun. It's an infestation on that level!


I sort of agree. I think zealots and ultras should have been in Halo 3. All the thunderstorm skull does is make them all majors.

And yes, the brute plasma rifle should have been in Halo 3. I really dont see why it wasnt.

Another cool reason why grunts should have been allies in Halo 3, you could give them cool weapons like in Halo 2. I would give them all rockets, maulers and spikers.

  • 01.13.2012 2:24 PM PDT
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Posted by: Mark V guy

I sort of agree. I think zealots and ultras should have been in Halo 3. All the thunderstorm skull does is make them all majors.

And yes, the brute plasma rifle should have been in Halo 3. I really dont see why it wasnt.

Another cool reason why grunts should have been allies in Halo 3, you could give them cool weapons like in Halo 2. I would give them all rockets, maulers and spikers.
Hammer Chieftains are mildly reminiscent of Goldies (they can never replace them, no matter how absurd their leap melee distance is). But War Chieftains just don't cut it. They are an insult to Ultra Elites.

Well, it is just a reskinned plasma rifle with a faster rof and more damage. But combining it with a plasma rifle via dual wield looks neat and is a decent combo.

I like the idea of giving them maulers. Sounds wickedly awesome!

  • 01.13.2012 10:54 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: Sliding Ghost

Posted by: Mark V guy

I sort of agree. I think zealots and ultras should have been in Halo 3. All the thunderstorm skull does is make them all majors.

And yes, the brute plasma rifle should have been in Halo 3. I really dont see why it wasnt.

Another cool reason why grunts should have been allies in Halo 3, you could give them cool weapons like in Halo 2. I would give them all rockets, maulers and spikers.
Hammer Chieftains are mildly reminiscent of Goldies (they can never replace them, no matter how absurd their leap melee distance is). But War Chieftains just don't cut it. They are an insult to Ultra Elites.

Well, it is just a reskinned plasma rifle with a faster rof and more damage. But combining it with a plasma rifle via dual wield looks neat and is a decent combo.

I like the idea of giving them maulers. Sounds wickedly awesome!


Yeah, the plasma rifle in ODST should have been more reminiscent of the Halo 2 brute plasma rifle.

And chieftains are just too easy to kill if you ask me. All you have to do is sidestep and assassinate, or on higher difficulties, noob combo or sniper.

And war chieftains are pretty pathetic. They look awesome, but they just behave like any other brute, and can be killed just as easily. Sidestep and assassinate, shotgun, brute shot, sword, noob combo, in fact any weapon can kill one easily.

Also, have you ever encountered any Halo 3 grunts with spikers or maulers? Apparently its a rare occurrence but when grunts are knocked out of a phantom they sometimes pull out a spiker or mauler. If they were in Halo 3 i would have given them all plasma rifles, maulers, rockets and SMGs if they could hold them.

  • 01.14.2012 4:23 AM PDT
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Posted by: Mark V guy
And chieftains are just too easy to kill if you ask me. All you have to do is sidestep and assassinate, or on higher difficulties, noob combo or sniper.

And war chieftains are pretty pathetic. They look awesome, but they just behave like any other brute, and can be killed just as easily. Sidestep and assassinate, shotgun, brute shot, sword, noob combo, in fact any weapon can kill one easily.
Exactly. They were too similar. Their only distinction (gameplay wise) is their armor, which can't be stuck by grenades or affected by needler super combine, but that's cheap. The best thing would have been to simply give them a bigger melee range. That's what made CE Zealots so tough to fight. I don't understand how H3 Elites have a big melee range like CE Elites but Reach Elites have shorter, more realistic melee range...

Posted by: Mark V guy
Also, have you ever encountered any Halo 3 grunts with spikers or maulers?

Apparently its a rare occurrence but when grunts are knocked out of a phantom they sometimes pull out a spiker or mauler.

If they were in Halo 3 i would have given them all plasma rifles, maulers, rockets and SMGs if they could hold them.
Yeah, I have. Most of the time, on The Storm.

I don't think it's rare or random.

They can wield the Needler so I don't see why they would have difficulty with the SMG. And I don't think it would be heavy for them since they can wield fuel rod guns and plasma cannon turrets. Not to mention that Spartans can use it with one hand when dual wielding (Elites always wield it with one hand).

  • 01.14.2012 6:28 AM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: Sliding Ghost

Posted by: Mark V guy
And chieftains are just too easy to kill if you ask me. All you have to do is sidestep and assassinate, or on higher difficulties, noob combo or sniper.

And war chieftains are pretty pathetic. They look awesome, but they just behave like any other brute, and can be killed just as easily. Sidestep and assassinate, shotgun, brute shot, sword, noob combo, in fact any weapon can kill one easily.
Exactly. They were too similar. Their only distinction (gameplay wise) is their armor, which can't be stuck by grenades or affected by needler super combine, but that's cheap. The best thing would have been to simply give them a bigger melee range. That's what made CE Zealots so tough to fight. I don't understand how H3 Elites have a big melee range like CE Elites but Reach Elites have shorter, more realistic melee range...

Posted by: Mark V guy
Also, have you ever encountered any Halo 3 grunts with spikers or maulers?

Apparently its a rare occurrence but when grunts are knocked out of a phantom they sometimes pull out a spiker or mauler.

If they were in Halo 3 i would have given them all plasma rifles, maulers, rockets and SMGs if they could hold them.
Yeah, I have. Most of the time, on The Storm.

I don't think it's rare or random.

They can wield the Needler so I don't see why they would have difficulty with the SMG. And I don't think it would be heavy for them since they can wield fuel rod guns and plasma cannon turrets. Not to mention that Spartans can use it with one hand when dual wielding (Elites always wield it with one hand).


Can you give them SMGs in Halo 2? I forgot. But i suppose they could hold SMGs

Oh, and hoe about giving a grunt a laser on The Covenant, that would be sweet.

I hate how in Halo Reach when you are an elite you cant give your allies human weapons. I would totally give magnums, rockets and lasers to grunts and i would give shotguns to the brutes


[Edited on 01.14.2012 8:23 AM PST]

  • 01.14.2012 7:17 AM PDT
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'To create an apple pie from scratch first you must create the universe'.

The reason Grunts wern't allies in this was down to the face it could get confusing when fighting. Some Grunts also stayed allied with the Covenant Loyalists out of fear the UNSC & Seperatists would lose the war; the Grunts are cannon fodder to the Loyalists, if they could all break away without the fear of extinction they would.

  • 01.14.2012 10:58 AM PDT

alexander

I would love to have grunt allies because its always fun to have dunny sounding cannon fodder. :D

  • 01.23.2012 2:57 PM PDT

Yep

Grunts are awesome and smart. They shouldn't be enemies.

  • 01.25.2012 6:40 AM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: CopyBookGangsta
Grunts are awesome and smart. They shouldn't be enemies.


They are awesome but they're not smart lol

  • 01.25.2012 8:28 AM PDT

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well to be honest it would be cool if they were teamates but they would just die all the time and what guns would they hold and plus there aliens not humans so how could they be apart of the unsc


[Edited on 01.25.2012 12:22 PM PST]

  • 01.25.2012 12:20 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: duff b0y 1o1
well to be honest it would be cool if they were teamates but they would just die all the time and what guns would they hold and plus there aliens not humans so how could they be apart of the unsc


They wouldn't be art of the UNSC, they would be Covenant Separatists like they were at the end of Halo 2

Weapons? Probably usual, plasma pistols, needlers and fuel rod guns. However, if they were allies you could give them cool weapons like SMGs, Magnums, plasma rifles, spikers, maulers, rocket launchers and spartan lasers.

And would they really die that much? Not a lot of enemies in Halo 3 use headshot weapons, the only threats I can think off to allied grunts would be jackal snipers and brute bodyguards, both of which are farely infrequent enemies. Grunts would be able to dodge enemy fire in Halo 3 without a whole lot of difficulty methinks

  • 01.25.2012 12:44 PM PDT

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i get what your saying but grunts can't learn how to use allied weapons e.g. spartan laser...

grunts are weak and can't carry those weapons and i really can't imagine a grunt using a br or dmr

  • 01.25.2012 12:47 PM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: duff b0y 1o1
i get what your saying but grunts can't learn how to use allied weapons e.g. spartan laser...

grunts are weak and can't carry those weapons and i really can't imagine a grunt using a br or dmr


They can use human weapons. In Halo 2 as the Arbiter you can give human weapons like rocket launchers, smgs and magnums to grunts.

No, a grunt couldnt use a br or dmr. Jackals can though

  • 01.25.2012 12:55 PM PDT
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Posted by: duff b0y 1o1
i get what your saying but grunts can't learn how to use allied weapons e.g. spartan laser...

grunts are weak and can't carry those weapons and i really can't imagine a grunt using a br or dmr
Grunts are stronger than or equal to marines.

However, their diving speed in post-CE is unrealistic. They're slow.

[Edited on 01.25.2012 2:29 PM PST]

  • 01.25.2012 2:28 PM PDT

Yep

@Mark V guy

It was a joke.

  • 01.26.2012 1:19 AM PDT

Halo 2 > Halo 3 > Halo 3 ODST > Halo Reach > Halo CE

Based on campaigns.


Posted by: CopyBookGangsta
@Mark V guy

It was a joke.


I know lol

  • 01.26.2012 9:51 AM PDT

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