Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: The Fall of Objective Gameplay (And its Possible Revival)
  • Subject: The Fall of Objective Gameplay (And its Possible Revival)
Subject: The Fall of Objective Gameplay (And its Possible Revival)

--Credit goes to Speedmachine202 for creating this post, I just revived it--

Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game with excellent graphics, game modes, maps, etc; However, the game itself has drifted towards being very slayer dominant. What I mean by this is that no matter what the gametype, most players will have a primary focus on getting kills and a secondary or even tertiary focus on getting the objective. Point being the core focus of objective gametypes has been lost between halo 3 and halo: reach and in this topic I plan to outline the flaws and propose a proper solution.

Problems

Most of my objective games, and most of everyone's objective games, turn into blood baths with no attempts at scoring the objective. Why go control the hill or capture the flag when you can just get in a tank and destroy everyone? The reason a player goes for kills more often than the objective is because the player is rewarded for every kill he gets and not for ANY objective he scores.

Every time you get a snipe, headshot, beatdown, assist, spree or multikill, a number pops up in the bottom corner saying something like, "+8cR". When you get many kills in these categories a giant box pops up on your screen which congratulates you on a job well done and rewards of lots of credits.

What happens when you score an objective? Nothing. The score increases by one, but you have gained no cR, and your rank has not increased. In fact, you probably died a lot in order to complete that objective. No cR for objective scoring, no ranking up by playing for objectives. And no victory bonus either so if you win an objective game, you get nothing for it.

So it seems that the only logical path for a smart player is to simply go for kills since that is what will rank you up and make you unlock new armor and lightning bolts on your head and gold visors and such, while going for objectives gets you death with no reward.

Solutions

But why in Halo 2/3 was this not a problem? People went for objectives all the time in those games! Its because the only way you could rank up in 2 and 3 was by winning. Trueskill goes up by winning, and experience goes up by winning. When you win objective games you are rewarded with a better rank in 2/3. 2 and 3 had incentive to win objective games while Reach has absolutely no incentive to win except for the satisfaction of winning.

So how can we reward people who go for objectives (as well as give people incentive to go for objectives)? It's simple:

1. Victory Bonus: If a person is awarded something like 800 cR for a victory, then the person will actually try to win the game because that is a nice boost for your rank.

2. Objective Daily and Weekly Challenges: Right now, challeges basically involve 3 things: kills, assists, and campaign mission completion. Nothing relating to objectives. If we have more objective challenges with large cR rewards, people will go for objectives. Such as:
a. Hoarding Problem: Capture 8 stockpile flags today in multi-player matchmaking (1200 cR).
b. Get Off My Cloud!: Rack up 200 points in KOTH gametypes today in multiplayer matchmaking (1000 cR).
c. Lawsuit: Detonate 3 bombs today in Assault gametypes in multi-player matchmaking (1500 cR)
-If you believe that challenges don't affect gameplay just pay attention to whenever there is a jetpack mp challenge, because most people use jetpacks during those games.

3. Objective Commendations: These of course are very similar to the challenges but they are long term such that even if there isn't a challenge, people will still go for objectives because they are consistently rewarded for it. Examples include:
a. Poor Yorick: Get Points in Oddball or Headhunter
b. Conquistador: Capture Territories in Territories
c. Star Spangled Banner: Capture Flags in CTF or Stockpile

If all of these are established, I guarantee that there will be a tremendous rise in objective play.



The only problem I can foresee is betrayals. It is true that within the first few weeks of establishment betrayals for objectives will rise, but eventually it will even out. People will stop betraying each other for objectives if there is strict betrayal boot enforcement, and eventually objective games will become a lot more competitive as people try to get to flags and capture them before their other teammates do.

--Credit goes to Speedmachine202 for creating this post, I just revived it--


[Edited on 01.19.2012 3:44 PM PST]

  • 01.19.2012 3:37 PM PDT

*reminisces when the Bungie/Halo community wasn't made up of CoD kids*
*sighs*
*activates time-machine and sets the clock back to Nov. 9, 2004*
glory days here I come..
*vanishes*


Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game with excellent graphics, game modes, maps, etc;

I'm afraid a lot of people might flame you for saying that.

But I do agree with you.

  • 01.19.2012 3:39 PM PDT


Posted by: lord of dahorde

I did not write this originally, it's a copy+paste of a thread that got locked about a year ago. Let me say that again: I did not write this.

  • 01.19.2012 3:41 PM PDT


Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game
Stopped right there. You're not allowed to have opinions anymore.

  • 01.19.2012 3:41 PM PDT


Posted by: Ninjection

Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game
Stopped right there. You're not allowed to have opinions anymore.

Good god, read the 3 different disclaimers saying I didn't write this..

  • 01.19.2012 3:43 PM PDT


Posted by: Ninjection

Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game
Stopped right there. You're not allowed to have opinions anymore.

And the most idiotic quote of the month goes to...Bookshelf!

Bookshelf, now that you won, what will you do? Retire or defend your title?

  • 01.19.2012 3:44 PM PDT


Posted by: Wumpa Warrior

Posted by: Ninjection

Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Introduction

Let me start by saying that Halo: Reach is a fantastic game
Stopped right there. You're not allowed to have opinions anymore.

Good god, read the 3 different disclaimers saying I didn't write this..
I realized that after my post, but I stand by what I said. You clearly supported this original thread, so you're in the same boat the original OP is.

  • 01.19.2012 3:45 PM PDT


Posted by: Ninjection
I realized that after my post, but I stand by what I said. You clearly supported this original thread, so you're in the same boat the original OP is.

You see, I strongly dislike most of the maps in reach. I just like this post because it illustrates a big problem with the game.

  • 01.19.2012 3:48 PM PDT

The cR system sucks, we know. Instead of rewarding cR for random stuff, take that pointless system out and put in a 1-50 system like Halo 2 and 3.

But Bungie was stupid.

  • 01.19.2012 3:50 PM PDT


Posted by: Ninjection

Indeed. It was a decent attempt to get out of the boosting of accts on H2/3, however it led to many other problems.

  • 01.19.2012 3:54 PM PDT

Boosting affected 1 person in past Halos: the booster. No one else.

Now we get Arena where 1 boosting retard can get Onyx just by playing with an Iron booster all the time - displacing others placements. Not to mention a pointless rank system of cR for barbie dolls. I enjoy seeing my meter go up, but I recognize that it's completely and utterly pointless.

Give me my 1-50 that meant something.

  • 01.19.2012 3:56 PM PDT

Yeah, I miss the good old days..

  • 01.19.2012 3:58 PM PDT


Posted by: Wumpa Warrior
Yeah, I miss the good old days..

Delusional.

  • 01.19.2012 4:04 PM PDT

Please don't hype for games...
They'll just fall short of your expectations and you'll complain for months.

My way of fixing this would just be to switch the game complete bonus and the victory bonus values around. You get more for winning, but not to make everybody feel bad, you get a tiny bit for just playing.

  • 01.19.2012 6:14 PM PDT


Posted by: Alpha00
My way of fixing this would just be to switch the game complete bonus and the victory bonus values around. You get more for winning, but not to make everybody feel bad, you get a tiny bit for just playing.

I feel like that tiny bit should be very minimal..

  • 01.31.2012 3:22 PM PDT

I've been saying that Objective commendations should be in the game since about a week after it dropped. It's absurd that every single rank-system related reward is based around Slayer gametyes. Well, the rank system in Reach is just absurd in general, but some attempt to balance the emphasis would've been nice.

  • 01.31.2012 3:37 PM PDT

Posted by: Darkside Eric
So basically... Waypoint is pro-vanilla?

Posted by: Sentox6
Waypoint isn't pro-anything so much as they're just anti-intelligence.

Someone matched a team that HTO.

  • 01.31.2012 3:38 PM PDT

~ Videogames are my favorite videogames ~

People still care about earning credits?

  • 01.31.2012 3:51 PM PDT


Posted by: Ryus Shoryuken
I've been saying that Objective commendations should be in the game since about a week after it dropped. It's absurd that every single rank-system related reward is based around Slayer gametyes. Well, the rank system in Reach is just absurd in general, but some attempt to balance the emphasis would've been nice.

Exactly, quite disappointing.

  • 01.31.2012 3:53 PM PDT