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  • Subject: "Gods and Demons" a dule meaning
Subject: "Gods and Demons" a dule meaning
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When Cortona/Gravemind speaks of Gods and Demons I believe that he is dually refering to the spartans. This is because, as 343 guilty spark gives evidence to, the spartans were on halo before, and there armor was stronger etc, w/e. The point is that these things, the forerunners, which are somehow related to spartans, are gods to the covenent. They are also demons. I believe that gravemind has taken over or is cooperating with cortona and is using cortona to speak to MC. I believe that the halo rings did not kill him the first time, and that is why the flood still exist. But The post about the Halo rings being some kind of time machine might be a little less crazy then I thought. Just look at some of these exceprts from the cortona letters.


"I have governed the unwilling.(Gravemind???)
I have witnessed countless empires break before me. (Did Doc Hasley Find her? Not make her? and therefore she has existed for a long long time?)
I have seen your future.(time machine?? this has happened before)
And I have learned.
There will be no more Sadness. No more Anger. No more Envy.
I HAVE WON. (she has won??)

"I've had the strangest dreams lately - raging seas, howling beasts, a Demon folded in black clouds. I believe I know what it guards, and I will have it, to the chagrin of the faith-blinded zealots that challenge me. Don't waste your pity on them; I don't think they would like you much anyway. "-What thing?

"And what of the Giants who formed this world? So much to tell you, but so many more important things to do. There was a fourth. You couldn't have known. And I haven't forgotten.
It is a blurred line that lies at the edge of Godhood and Insanity. Guess which side of it I am on. " - Cortona is Doc Halsey? There was a fourth -I believe she is talking about spartans.
Cortona is speeking of godhood. I belive doc halsey wants to become a god or something. She has figured out the secrets of the halo rings.



Another wierd message from cortona

"Entry: 97 - SC1C
In a relatively brief period of time, the achievements of SolCore had resulted in an economically stable, technologically mature, rapidly expanding empire of eight human worlds. Advancements in technology arrived at a faster pace than the most optimistic scientists could have ever envisioned. Unexpected contact with indigenous human populations on four "lost colony" worlds led to a frenzy of research as archaeologists, theologians, astronomers, and evolutionary biologists competed to offer an explanation for the startling discovery. Many accepted the findings as proof that their privileged civilization must surely be the most advanced in the universe. Others eagerly anticipated future interaction with intelligent "aliens". The fear of not being the only sentient species in the universe was forgotten in the giddy excitement of a new era for humanity.
No one was prepared for their arrival.
No one expected this.
You brought nothing to this world, and we will ensure you bring nothing out. "

Dont know what they are talking about at the end but

Eight human worlds
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Seven rings, one earth??????


The Flood appear to be in control of High Charity as well as several Covenant ships at the end of Halo 2. Maybe that is the flood in the covenent ships and gravemind is trying to destroy the galaxy and make the flood supreme

[Edited on 5/15/2006]

  • 05.15.2006 4:46 PM PDT
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or maybe she's the founder of a new cult religion? I unno....

  • 05.15.2006 4:47 PM PDT

I'm awesome.

My mom says so.

things arent "related to spartans", cept mby john's mom. spartans are just humans...

  • 05.15.2006 4:49 PM PDT

I don't believe 343's reference to other battle skins to be an indication of other spartans, but I do see this to mean they were far more advanced, and also a possible belief that the forerunners thought we would be more advanced then this, assuming they are our creators or benefactor of some sort. I think you are on the right track about the demons and gods thing though. The Forerunners are seen as gods by the covenant and the chief was refered to as the demon. Gravemind had survived that entire time on halo defying the fore runners and sending the chief off without bothering him really. He also left Cortona there and she does appear under his control which may explain the early emails from Cortona. The way she spoke in the trailer in the same manor as the emails did. I think you are on the right track with this theory for the most part.

  • 05.15.2006 5:06 PM PDT
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spartan's are still humans.
thats why the monitor(s) believe MC or any human are the forerunners.

  • 05.15.2006 5:09 PM PDT
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bump/ any ideas?

  • 05.15.2006 7:02 PM PDT
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If I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening, and good nite.

Cortana speaks about the chief in the trailer I believe. She is taken from Dr. Halsey's brain so she might have the same thoughts. I'll get there. First she says I've defied gods and demons. She's schooled the prophets and maybe is referring to humanity as demons. The Chief is THE DEMON but he is of a race of demons maybe? I am your shield. She's gotten Chief through a lot of tough jams. She's his intel and closest thing to a reliable friend. I am your sword. She doubles as the sword and takes pride in saying this I think, because she indirectly is fighting and winning battles with the chief. I know you, your past, your future. She says this very softly and compassionately. Some could argue she is being controlled by Gravemind and if so, I believe that when she says this, she is sorry about what is going to happen. This is the way the world ends. I don't think ppl are going to be happy with how true that statement sounds. The trumpets in the music sound climatic and mournful. Chief is walking with his gun slung over his shoulder. He's not worried about an ambush. He's accepted the fate. I think that when the world ends in halo 3, it rips a hole in the space time continuum looping the galaxy into the same fate every time.

  • 05.15.2006 7:20 PM PDT
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I'd totally forgotten about some of this. It makes me question... well, a lot of things.

Most notable is Cortana's mention of the lost human colonies. It seems quite clear from the context that these colonies are ancient, but I could be wrong. Would we simply have forgotten about colonists sent out ~200-300 years previously? It doesn't seem right that there would be a scramble among the scientific community to explain "lost ships" in such a current time frame. It'd be quite obvious that they had hit habitable planets and simply been unable to call home. No brainer. No, I think it's pointing towards pre-modern tech colonization, but damn I'm going to be pissed if that's the case. I've always hated the "humans are Forerunners" theory, despite knowing there was a good change Bungie was going to spring that one on us.

Since Halo 1, it's been an option to believe that humans are in fact the Forerunners, or what's left of them. If the rings were activated, it makes sense that a few scattered survivors could repopulate a number of planets, Earth included, but they'd have to survive somehow.

Random question time: Would activation of the rings effect life forms currently in slip space? Could that allow a number of space faring vessels to survive the destructive blast of the rings without having to be outside of the blast radius in real space? I.e. Is this a realistic proposal for survival of the Forerunner race (supposing it's humans) without having to claim that all of these ships left the blast radius and then voluntarily re-entered it?

Okay, back on track... and on to Gravemind.

History is about as good a predictor of the future as glimpsing the future itself. It stands to reason that any intelligent being who has witnessed eons of history knows that history simply repeats itself, to a dishearteningly predictable certainty. It is far a more accurate formula for prophecy than any "beginning and end of the world" predictions fostered by religious convictions - all of that "gods and demons" business... but I digress.

If "we" activated the rings in the past, could that be our future? To do so again? When humanity is all but destroyed by the Covenant and the Flood is rampant across the galaxy, is humanity staring the same horrible choice in the face as it was the last time the rings were activated? Would Gravemind know this is sure to come to pass, as the galaxy's ultimate witness to history?

Ugh.. my brain hurts. Curse you people for making me use it.

[Edited on 5/15/2006]

  • 05.15.2006 7:29 PM PDT
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Posted by: Desmos
When Cortona/Gravemind speaks of Gods and Demons I believe that he is dually refering to the spartans. This is because, as 343 guilty spark gives evidence to, the spartans were on halo before, and there armor was stronger etc, w/e. The point is that these things, the forerunners, which are somehow related to spartans, are gods to the covenent. They are also demons. I believe that gravemind has taken over or is cooperating with cortona and is using cortona to speak to MC. I believe that the halo rings did not kill him the first time, and that is why the flood still exist. But The post about the Halo rings being some kind of time machine might be a little less crazy then I thought. Just look at some of these exceprts from the cortona letters.


"I have governed the unwilling.(Gravemind???)
I have witnessed countless empires break before me. (Did Doc Hasley Find her? Not make her? and therefore she has existed for a long long time?)
I have seen your future.(time machine?? this has happened before)
And I have learned.
There will be no more Sadness. No more Anger. No more Envy.
I HAVE WON. (she has won??)

"I've had the strangest dreams lately - raging seas, howling beasts, a Demon folded in black clouds. I believe I know what it guards, and I will have it, to the chagrin of the faith-blinded zealots that challenge me. Don't waste your pity on them; I don't think they would like you much anyway. "-What thing?

"And what of the Giants who formed this world? So much to tell you, but so many more important things to do. There was a fourth. You couldn't have known. And I haven't forgotten.
It is a blurred line that lies at the edge of Godhood and Insanity. Guess which side of it I am on. " - Cortona is Doc Halsey? There was a fourth -I believe she is talking about spartans.
Cortona is speeking of godhood. I belive doc halsey wants to become a god or something. She has figured out the secrets of the halo rings.



Another wierd message from cortona

"Entry: 97 - SC1C
In a relatively brief period of time, the achievements of SolCore had resulted in an economically stable, technologically mature, rapidly expanding empire of eight human worlds. Advancements in technology arrived at a faster pace than the most optimistic scientists could have ever envisioned. Unexpected contact with indigenous human populations on four "lost colony" worlds led to a frenzy of research as archaeologists, theologians, astronomers, and evolutionary biologists competed to offer an explanation for the startling discovery. Many accepted the findings as proof that their privileged civilization must surely be the most advanced in the universe. Others eagerly anticipated future interaction with intelligent "aliens". The fear of not being the only sentient species in the universe was forgotten in the giddy excitement of a new era for humanity.
No one was prepared for their arrival.
No one expected this.
You brought nothing to this world, and we will ensure you bring nothing out. "

Dont know what they are talking about at the end but

Eight human worlds
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Seven rings, one earth??????


The Flood appear to be in control of High Charity as well as several Covenant ships at the end of Halo 2. Maybe that is the flood in the covenent ships and gravemind is trying to destroy the galaxy and make the flood supreme

Ok look.
Some of that makes sense and some of it is just you rambling about things of which you have no way to understand.
But the last line from the second letter you quoted.
Cannot be cortana.
If you notice it says something like message interruption or something when it displays that message.
The same thing is done before in other messages and it is as if someone else has interrupted her transmission and made their own.
If i find the site i'll post them here, give me a while.

  • 05.15.2006 7:43 PM PDT
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i love the ideas and i have a couple of my own but you r a blow hard ( at least thats what your husband tells me) ooooooooooooh what now

  • 05.15.2006 7:55 PM PDT