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Subject: About the "Warning on Leaking/Rumor Mongering..."
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Posted by: xXdeathomenXx
i gotta crash... just realised it's 4 a.m. and i have work in 3.5 hours.... see y'all later.


P.s. i say they should make a forum for Halo3 rumors and leaks speculation, and only blacklist someone who posted an Actual Leak!.... the only people that can do that if you think about it are microsoft/bungie employies and bill gates himself has leaked info........


Then they would know that what they speculated was right.

  • 05.17.2006 2:00 AM PDT
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Are you still on about that?

We were having a conversation were we not?

  • 05.17.2006 2:01 AM PDT
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than they shouldn't blacklist anything in said forum and make it a "possible Spoiler" forum where people enter and post at their own risk.

  • 05.17.2006 2:02 AM PDT
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This is not the place to have conversations. Say it in a pm next time.

  • 05.17.2006 2:02 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ninja_Biscuits
Posted by: icantfindaname
Posted by: Ninja_Biscuits
What if someone posts the plot to Halo 3? You'd spend all this time discussing whether it is real or not, and if it is real then that's the game spoilt, more than a year before it is actually released.

Discussing rumours will spoil the game for some people. The ninja's stance is justified.

P.S. Don't feed the trolls.


At least it would give us something solid to debate. And if the actual plot was posted, that is something that would be blacklist worthy. I would love to find or hear about tidbits of the Halo 3 plot to debate.

Understand, I'm not arguing that all blacklists for these violations are irrational/unfair. However, I think that, the way the rules are worded, many will be unwilling to post speculation or rumors OR will be unfairly blacklisted for said rumors.

The flaw in your argument: And if the actual plot was posted, that is something that would be blacklist worthy.
If they only blacklisted for true rumours, this leaves people to debate whether rumours they know aren't true are true or not. Its not really something solid to debate at all. Shouldn't this be in the Septagon?


Not quite. If the entire story, action for action, is somehow wrestled out of Bungie HQ and posted on the forums, that's blacklist worthy. If, somehow, a piece of the puzzle regarding the relationship between the MC and Arbiter finds its way onto the forums and happens to be true (without confirmation, of course) we should be allowed to discuss its merits or dismerits. It's not our fault if we find or receive information; it's our fault if we manufacture it with malicious or self-serving intent.

  • 05.17.2006 2:02 AM PDT
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Posted by: xXdeathomenXx
Posted by: Stapleyurdog
Deathomen, do you actually believe that piece of offal that is your signature? Or are you mocking the deranged fool who coined it?


it's a quote from a band... lay off.



.... also.... what does offal mean?


of·fal n.

1. Waste parts, especially of a butchered animal.
2. Refuse; rubbish.

The German wannaba is gone and all his posts have been deleted.

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 2:03 AM PDT
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I believe this is in the correct forum, as it is directly related to Halo 3.

The fact is that almost all of the mods on this site aren't Bungie employees. Meaning that they don't know any more than we do what is correct and what isn't.

Spreading rumors is spamming. People who make threads about rumors aren't looking for an official response. They are looking for attention. All it does is invite flame wars. If you were looking for an official response, then you'd private message someone who actually knows.

Leaking information can only be referred to as spreading rumors. If it comes from a Bungie employee, and it's official, then it will show up here first. They've stated over and over that anything from any other source can't be validated or construed as being the truth. If it's not true, then it's rumor... see above.

Banning is a perfectly acceptable response to anyone who is spamming the forums.

Edit: If you posted a thread starting with "What if this happens because of this?", it would probably be allowed to stay, as you are only conjecturing on the story. If you start a thread with, "Guess what I heard from a Bungie employee? This happens because of this! It's true!", then you deserve to get blacklisted. It's all about smart posting.

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 2:03 AM PDT
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Posted by: Stapleyurdog
Are you still on about that?

We were having a conversation were we not?



pretty sure we dropped that "conversation" a while ago.... if you have anything else to say on That particular subject go ahead and pm me but don't waste forum space writing lengthy paragraphs about it as this is not the topic of this thread nor does it have anything specific to do with Halo 3.

  • 05.17.2006 2:04 AM PDT
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Posted by: CONAN9845
I believe this is in the correct forum, as it is directly related to Halo 3.

The fact is that almost all of the mods on this site aren't Bungie employees. Meaning that they don't know any more than we do what is correct and what isn't.

Spreading rumors is spamming. People who make threads about rumors aren't looking for an official response. They are looking for attention. All it does is invite flame wars. If you were looking for an official response, then you'd private message someone who actually knows.


Except that someone who actually knows wont tell if it is truth or not, where as people on the forums would speculate about it.

Leaking information can only be referred to as spreading rumors. If it comes from a Bungie employee, and it's official, then it will show up here first. They've stated over and over that anything from any other source can't be validated or construed as being the truth. If it's not true, then it's rumor... see above.

Banning is a perfectly acceptable response to anyone who is spamming the forums.

I agree

  • 05.17.2006 2:05 AM PDT

Per t he rules: Rumormongering will get a thread locked, not a member blacklisted. If somebody were to create a thread saying that the flying version of the golden warthog will be in Halo 3, that thread will get locked.

Per t he rules: Attempting to spread false information under the pretense of knowing a Bungie.Net staff member or Bungie employee to any degree of separation. If somebody were to create a thread saying that his father's cousin's nephew's best friend's mother's father works as a janitor at Bungie and told his daughter's son's best friend's uncle's cousin's son that there will be a weapon available in multiplayer that vaporized all of the enemies at once, that person would be blacklisted for trying to spread false information under the pretense of knowing... etc.

The biggest problem is that the moderators (save Shishka and Ninja 0n Fire) do not work at Bungie and we do not have any idea as to what is "leaked" and what is purely "rumor", so we must treat everything the same.

Basically, don't try to start rumors, just "speculate" as to what you might think is in the game.

Moving to The Septagon.

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 2:05 AM PDT
Subject: About the "Warning on Leaking/Rumor Mongering..."
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Poll: Should the rumor/leaking blacklist rule stand? READ BELOW FIRST  [closed]
Yes:  53%
(17 Votes)
No:  47%
(15 Votes)
Total Votes: 32

OK, I understand why this post was made AND why it was stickied. However, I must disagree with it and its intentions.

This is supposed to be a Bungie fan forum; we should be able to (within reason) post on anything related to the forum in which we are currently operating. We get to do only a few things.

1. Suggest ideas for upcoming games (Halo 3) and ideas for improving existing games (Halo 2).
2. Theorize on the greater Halo Universe... topics such as The Ark, Dr. Halsey, Col. Ackerson, etc.
3. Generally bicker and banter

Of course users should be blacklisted if they violate reasonable rules, such as using racist or profane language, avoiding the blammer, spamming, flaming, trolling, etc. However, why take away the fun of researching and debunking rumors?

We all know that we have a long time to wait for Halo 3... probably (no rumors, just speculation) over a year. Yeah, there are a lot of really stupid and ignorant fanboys that post in these forums that will jump on any fuzzy screenshot and claim with certainty that it's from Halo 3, only to be followed by hundreds of others flaming and bumping it without restraint or remorse.

But isn't that our right? Shouldn't we be allowed to research rumors, speculate on their authenticity, and debate their merits? Sure, our input on games is taken into consideration. Yeah, it's fun to theorize on the games. Indeed, I like getting into a debate or a mild fight over someting minor on occasion. But I also enjoy seeing a screenshot, or reading a story, or seeing a page of a "script," and trying to find clues on the Net as to whether it's true or untrue.

Moderators should have every right to delete and close repeat topics on these subjects, and even blacklist users that repeatedly create new threads on an existing topic. But to blacklist someone for simply pointing out a suspicious story or screenshot seems harsh and against the very point of these forums: to give the community a place to hash out ideas with similarly-interested individuals. If something is a fake we'll figure it out, or eventually a weekly update will have something to prove that something's fakeness.

Finally, this new rule is waaaaaay to gray for my liking. Reputable source? IGN and Gamespot have been known to post completely innaccurate stories based on information found on other sites or information passed on from presumed "insiders." What about rather reputable sites that can easily fall victim to incorrect information, like wikipedia, or the halo wiki? Again, I understand why the forum ninjas decided to make this rule, but I must implore that it should not stand.

EDIT: Please note that many of us were talking to and about a now (ironically) blacklisted forum user. Further, note that the rules to which this thread speaks are in the Halo 3 forum (this thread was moved from there).

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 12:33 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ninja_Biscuits
This is not the place to have conversations. Say it in a pm next time.


No, the forums are a place for complete silence.

  • 05.17.2006 2:06 AM PDT
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Posted by: CONAN9845
I believe this is in the correct forum, as it is directly related to Halo 3.

The fact is that almost all of the mods on this site aren't Bungie employees. Meaning that they don't know any more than we do what is correct and what isn't.

Spreading rumors is spamming. People who make threads about rumors aren't looking for an official response. They are looking for attention. All it does is invite flame wars. If you were looking for an official response, then you'd private message someone who actually knows.

Leaking information can only be referred to as spreading rumors. If it comes from a Bungie employee, and it's official, then it will show up here first. They've stated over and over that anything from any other source can't be validated or construed as being the truth. If it's not true, then it's rumor... see above.

Banning is a perfectly acceptable response to anyone who is spamming the forums.


I disagree with your thesis. A rumor is not spam; spam is something with no value. A rumor may have value to those that theorize, or those that truly care about the development of the game. Like I've said, if I post something that I've created and claim that it's true, then by all means blacklist me.

However, if I come across the fake Halo 3 screenshot on the Internet (but don't know whether or not it's fake), I shouldn't be penalized for posting it in these forums and asking for second opinions. It's a Bungie (Halo, really) community; we should be allowed to discuss rumors regarding both enterprises.

  • 05.17.2006 2:07 AM PDT
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Posted by: icantfindaname
Posted by: Ninja_Biscuits
Posted by: icantfindaname
Posted by: Ninja_Biscuits
What if someone posts the plot to Halo 3? You'd spend all this time discussing whether it is real or not, and if it is real then that's the game spoilt, more than a year before it is actually released.

Discussing rumours will spoil the game for some people. The ninja's stance is justified.

P.S. Don't feed the trolls.


At least it would give us something solid to debate. And if the actual plot was posted, that is something that would be blacklist worthy. I would love to find or hear about tidbits of the Halo 3 plot to debate.

Understand, I'm not arguing that all blacklists for these violations are irrational/unfair. However, I think that, the way the rules are worded, many will be unwilling to post speculation or rumors OR will be unfairly blacklisted for said rumors.

The flaw in your argument: And if the actual plot was posted, that is something that would be blacklist worthy.
If they only blacklisted for true rumours, this leaves people to debate whether rumours they know aren't true are true or not. Its not really something solid to debate at all. Shouldn't this be in the Septagon?


Not quite. If the entire story, action for action, is somehow wrestled out of Bungie HQ and posted on the forums, that's blacklist worthy. If, somehow, a piece of the puzzle regarding the relationship between the MC and Arbiter finds its way onto the forums and happens to be true (without confirmation, of course) we should be allowed to discuss its merits or dismerits. It's not our fault if we find or receive information; it's our fault if we manufacture it with malicious or self-serving intent.

What if people don't want to hear anything about the plot of Halo 3? What if they want it to be a surprise?

  • 05.17.2006 2:08 AM PDT
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There you have it folks.... although i still think that they could make an " at your own risk" forum for rumors and what not.... but unless they do i'm pretty positive i'm not gonna go spread any myself.

  • 05.17.2006 2:08 AM PDT
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Posted by: dmbfan09

Moving to The Septagon.


I don't see why this is now in The Septagon; the original rules were in the Halo 3 section.

I appreciate the response. However, Shishka's language is a little stronger than what you imply. For instance, is speculating on something such as the now debunked UI subject to penalty? If I find a pic on the Net somewhere that claims to be from Halo 3, am I allowed to post a link to it and ask for opinions?

  • 05.17.2006 2:11 AM PDT
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Ninja Biscuits: then don't read it. Or, read it with the knowledge that it is (most likely) false.

  • 05.17.2006 2:13 AM PDT
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Posted by: icantfindaname
Posted by: dmbfan09

Moving to The Septagon.


I don't see why this is now in The Septagon; the original rules were in the Halo 3 section.

I appreciate the response. However, Shishka's language is a little stronger than what you imply. For instance, is speculating on something such as the now debunked UI subject to penalty? If I find a pic on the Net somewhere that claims to be from Halo 3, am I allowed to post a link to it and ask for opinions?

No, because that's rumor. If the pic were from THIS SITE, then it would be official, and then you could talk about it. If you find a pic on the net (not from THIS SITE), then it is fake. They don't want it to be discussed here. That's the rule, and I agree.

I do agree that I thought this was in the correct thread, though.

  • 05.17.2006 2:17 AM PDT

Posted by: icantfindaname
Posted by: dmbfan09

Moving to The Septagon.


I don't see why this is now in The Septagon; the original rules were in the Halo 3 section.
Discussing rules/forum policies takes place in The Septagon only. The Halo 3 Forum is for discussing Halo 3 only, not the rules of said forum.

I appreciate the response. However, Shishka's language is a little stronger than what you imply. For instance, is speculating on something such as the now debunked UI subject to penalty?Speculating is fine.

If I find a pic on the Net somewhere that claims to be from Halo 3, am I allowed to post a link to it and ask for opinions?For all you (or I) know, that would be a "leaked" picture (especially if it claims to be). That would get you blacklisted permanently. Just because you don't know if it is leaked or not, the fact that you think it might be and still decide to post it on the Bungie forums is a blacklistable offense.

Edit: OK, so I reread what you had typed, and talking about the UI (which I read as AI for some odd reason... I haven't been around for the past few days and missed a lot apparently) would get you blacklisted, since it is based of a leaked (for all you or I know it's leaked) screenshot. Even though now it has been debunked, talking about it after the fact is also just pointless.

Just be smart about what you post. Follow what Shishka has said and everything will be OK.

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 2:17 AM PDT
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Posted by: dmbfan09
If somebody were to create a thread saying that his father's cousin's nephew's best friend's mother's father works as a janitor at Bungie and told his daughter's son's best friend's uncle's cousin's son that there will be a weapon available in multiplayer that vaporized all of the enemies at once, that person would be blacklisted for trying to spread false information under the pretense of knowing... etc.


Like anyone would believe that in the first place.

It's a good thing we have the forum ninjas here, I don't know how to think for myself. You take the pressure to decide what is real and what is not off of my sorry shoulders. I was wondering, what should I have for lunch today? I am far too weak of mind to make such a difficult decision on my own.

  • 05.17.2006 4:44 AM PDT

Nice sig b33s, good taste. I went to see roots manuva last year he was great.

On the topic, I say keep up the BL rule. If they don't like the rules they can talk about it on another website can't they? And I don't particularly like using a forum filled with ZOMG SCREENSHOT time after time. And let's assume one of them is real? I don't want the game spoiled for me.

  • 05.17.2006 5:37 AM PDT

"FOR YOUR OWN PROTECTION: Ensure brain is engaged before putting keyboard into gear."
Need a ninja?
Got a cheater? [email]h2cheats@microsoft.com[/email]
Forum Rules.
FAQ.
I'm certifiable.

Posted by: icantfindaname
I disagree with your thesis. A rumor is not spam; spam is something with no value.

As are the vast majority of rumours.

People here are arguing high-level theories and airy statements on rights and wishes; I'm going to talk practicalities.

Anybody here remember how the forums were on August, 2004? A rumour started circulating that there would be an early release or a demo release of Halo 2 on August 24th of that year. Despite all the more cautious fans' warnings, large groups of people went out to stores on the 24th to find their "free" stuff, and when they didn't find it they came back angry. At Bungie. Because, y'know, they'd promised...

The atmosphere in here was absolutely toxic in the run-up and run-down to that; flamewars so thick you couldn't really discuss anything. Not that the rumour-mongers really wanted to discuss anything; they were more interested in posting than reading... leading to the same problem as a coordinated spam attack. Even the non-flame posts about the rumour so clogged New Mombasa that vigilante groups started to form in order to restore some sort of order; I'll even admit to joining one of those for a while, to my own shame.

I'll be damned if I let that happen again on my watch.

-- Steve will re-iterate; rumours do far more damage to the fan community than they do good. Don't spread them.

  • 05.17.2006 5:52 AM PDT
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Posted by: Anton P Nym
Posted by: icantfindaname
I disagree with your thesis. A rumor is not spam; spam is something with no value.

As are the vast majority of rumours.

People here are arguing high-level theories and airy statements on rights and wishes; I'm going to talk practicalities.

Anybody here remember how the forums were on August, 2004? A rumour started circulating that there would be an early release or a demo release of Halo 2 on August 24th of that year. Despite all the more cautious fans' warnings, large groups of people went out to stores on the 24th to find their "free" stuff, and when they didn't find it they came back angry. At Bungie. Because, y'know, they'd promised...

The atmosphere in here was absolutely toxic in the run-up and run-down to that; flamewars so thick you couldn't really discuss anything. Not that the rumour-mongers really wanted to discuss anything; they were more interested in posting than reading... leading to the same problem as a coordinated spam attack. Even the non-flame posts about the rumour so clogged New Mombasa that vigilante groups started to form in order to restore some sort of order; I'll even admit to joining one of those for a while, to my own shame.

I'll be damned if I let that happen again on my watch.

-- Steve will re-iterate; rumours do far more damage to the fan community than they do good. Don't spread them.


This is the first logical argument for the rule that I've read so far. Thank you for not posting another mindless canned response that places the fault / responsibility on another moderator. Thank you for having a spine and defending Bungie's position without being defensive or rude.

You're one of the good ones.

  • 05.17.2006 6:11 AM PDT
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For Carnage, Apply Within.

I have returned from the Untamed Lands. MOAP is dead.

Posted by: B33S
This is the first logical argument for the rule that I've read so far. Thank you for not posting another mindless canned response that places the fault / responsibility on another moderator. Thank you for having a spine and defending Bungie's position without being defensive or rude.

You're one of the good ones.
That's really arrogant to say. You're basically saying other members who responded to this thread had incoherent posts. Except of course for Anton P Nym who didn't even reply about the original topic, but rather the condition in which he feels about rumors. Which I believe more or less did have to do with leaked info. But the last sentence you made makes you the one look like a dastard.

[Edited on 5/17/2006]

  • 05.17.2006 6:45 AM PDT
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Well, really, Bungie can technically do what they want. This is their forum, which we're participating in voluntarily. If they decide that discussing or posting potentially leaked information is contrary to what they want in their forums, it's perfectly within their right to remove the content or user from the community.

We do have freedom of speech in this country, but there are limitations to it, specifically the ones you agree to when you sign up for forums such as this one.

  • 05.17.2006 8:25 AM PDT

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