Bungie.net Community
This topic has moved here: Subject: Bungie's Jason Jones Being Bit of a Hypocrite
  • Subject: Bungie's Jason Jones Being Bit of a Hypocrite
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3
Subject: Bungie's Jason Jones Being Bit of a Hypocrite

I acknowledge my user name is stupid. However, I promise I'm not.

Disclaimer: The latter is a lie.

Bungie's Jason Jones Being Bit of a Hypocrite


Would you say the text between the indicated marks of this quote sums up Halo's life in Bungie's hands?

Jones: I don't think that Bungie will ever publish a game called Pathways into Darkness II. There's a lot of reasons for that, one of them being that I tend to dislike sequels. *Many times when a publisher comes out with a sequel to a game, it means that they made a lot of money on the first one and they're going to continue to publish similar games until everyone gets sick of them*.Sometimes those games are actually fun, and the people who liked the first one also like the second one, but sometimes they're not.

Link to the orginal interview

I found this interview after reading a recent post here in the community forum, and found it a very interesting read. However, when I saw Jason criticzing developers (to a certain extent) who release sequels, prequels and the sort, it made me wonder about the question I've already posed to you.

Although, Jones does save himself slightly when he states that sequels can be successful, I still find it amusing that he, himself, when taking such a view of sequels, partners with Microsoft and releases: Halo Combat Evolved, Halo Combat Evolved (PC), Halo 2, Halo 2 (PC), Halo 3, Halo 3: ODST and Halo: Reach in under ten years of Halo's beginnings.

Funny thing... money.

  • 02.03.2012 6:39 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: chotato
smart, interesting, seems out of place.


Official fan of Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, (Problem with that?) Halo, and Bungie, also a total gaming junkie.

Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

  • 02.03.2012 6:45 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

:)


Posted by: Ktan Dantaktee
Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

Article is almost 20 years old. Times have changed.

  • 02.03.2012 6:50 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: chotato
smart, interesting, seems out of place.


Official fan of Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, (Problem with that?) Halo, and Bungie, also a total gaming junkie.

Posted by: jross1993

Posted by: Ktan Dantaktee
Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

Article is almost 20 years old. Times have changed.


Oh. I really ought to start clicking them links.

  • 02.03.2012 6:52 AM PDT

“Oh, it’s a little bit of everything, it’s the mountains, it’s the fog, it’s the news at six o’clock, it’s the death of my first dog, it’s the angels up above me, it’s the song that they don’t sing, It’s a little bit of everything.”
- Dawes, A little bit of everything

Microsoft + Goose that laid the golden eggs = An injured goose and a broken carton of eggs.

I think that Microsoft was the driving force behind the sequels, and while I love that they did the sequels, I'd hate to think that they were forced to make them.

On an unrelated note, weren't the PC version of CE and H2V done by different groups and not Bungie (at least not exclusively Bungie)? I seem to remember Gearbox and ...something else for H2V.

[Edited on 02.03.2012 6:54 AM PST]

  • 02.03.2012 6:54 AM PDT

I acknowledge my user name is stupid. However, I promise I'm not.

Disclaimer: The latter is a lie.

Most likely, to be honest, mate. I'm not too sure myself. If you do find out, I'll edit the OP.

Posted by: Kickimanjaro
Microsoft + Goose that laid the golden eggs = An injured goose and a broken carton of eggs.

I think that Microsoft was the driving force behind the sequels, and while I love that they did the sequels, I'd hate to think that they were forced to make them.

On an unrelated note, weren't the PC version of CE and H2V done by different groups and not Bungie (at least not exclusively Bungie)? I seem to remember Gearbox and ...something else for H2V.


[Edited on 02.03.2012 7:09 AM PST]

  • 02.03.2012 7:08 AM PDT

Posted by: Kickimanjaro
On an unrelated note, weren't the PC version of CE and H2V done by different groups and not Bungie (at least not exclusively Bungie)? I seem to remember Gearbox and ...something else for H2V.

You're thinking of Hired Gun.

  • 02.03.2012 7:16 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten

They HAD to make multiple Halo games for Microsoft.

Bungie made the Marathon series very fun and cool becuase there was a DEMAND and a HUGE story to conintue.

Myth 2 did a good job of also finsihing off the Soulblighter saga.

Pathways into darkness would not make a good sequel unless they did immortals.

  • 02.03.2012 7:21 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

:)

Posted by: spartain ken 15
They HAD to make multiple Halo games for Microsoft.

Bungie made the Marathon series very fun and cool becuase there was a DEMAND and a HUGE story to conintue.

Myth 2 did a good job of also finsihing off the Soulblighter saga.

Pathways into darkness would not make a good sequel unless they did immortals.

Because you know, there was no demand for a Halo sequel and there wasn't any potential for a continuation of Halo's story..

Eh.

*refrains from making remark that will get him banned*

[Edited on 02.03.2012 7:27 AM PST]

  • 02.03.2012 7:26 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Noble Heroic Member

"A life lived for others is the only life worth living" - Albert Einstein

"I have your RCON right here." - Iggwilv

"Always my pleasure to be lazy." - InvasionImminent

Like many people said, it was all part of a contract with Microsoft. In fact, Bungie got so tired of only making Halo games that they separated from Microsoft early near the end of Halo 3's development to start working on the new game. They still owed Microsoft two Halos so that's where ODST and Reach came from. If it was really up to them they would have taken longer to work on Halo 2 and it would have been the last Halo game from what I've heard.

Nothing hypocritical about it. They're having to do what they have to do. Now, once they have a choice, they're doing what they want to do.

[Edited on 02.03.2012 7:27 AM PST]

  • 02.03.2012 7:26 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten


Posted by: jross1993

Posted by: spartain ken 15
They HAD to make multiple Halo games for Microsoft.

Bungie made the Marathon series very fun and cool becuase there was a DEMAND and a HUGE story to conintue.

Myth 2 did a good job of also finsihing off the Soulblighter saga.

Pathways into darkness would not make a good sequel unless they did immortals.

Because you know, there was no demand for a Halo sequel and there wasn't any potential for a continuation of Halo's story..

Eh.


No, becuase Microsoft owned Bungie and they decided to make a Halo 2 becuase Halo was very popular.

I think what jason was saying is that Bungie does not want to make sequels to make sequels, they want to do it right.

  • 02.03.2012 7:27 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Jones became less and less involved with Halo. I think Halo 3 was the last Halo he truly was involved with, I think. Hell, Halo was sort of supposed to end with Halo 2, originally.

And then there was that deal with Microsoft of course, having to make more Halo games to leave.

  • 02.03.2012 7:28 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten


Posted by: just another fan
Jones became less and less involved with Halo. I think Halo 3 was the last Halo he truly was involved with, I think. Hell, Halo was sort of supposed to end with Halo 2, originally.

And then there was that deal with Microsoft of course, having to make more Halo games to leave.


I personally think many of the senior employees were brain storming Destiny around Halo 3.

Kason Jones also went to work on "project Pheonix" (I think) which kind of crashed and burned.

  • 02.03.2012 7:30 AM PDT

I acknowledge my user name is stupid. However, I promise I'm not.

Disclaimer: The latter is a lie.

There is really no point defending Jones' statement, Ken. Despite demand, and opportunities to expand on their stories, we all know that Bungie make games for money, which is fair enough and I completely understand that.

However, I find it amusing that Jones can be so concrete on his opinion on sequels and the sort, and then, much like a politician with the opportunity of selling out for money, does a complete U-turn.

This quote I believe also echoes how Bungie have distanced themsevles ridiculously from their roots. I love Bungie - Bungie is full of great, weird and wonderful game developers, with a equally funny and loyal fan base, but that doesn't mean that they are not due criticsm for forgetting their fundemental, original principles.

Posted by: spartain ken 15
They HAD to make multiple Halo games for Microsoft.

Bungie made the Marathon series very fun and cool becuase there was a DEMAND and a HUGE story to conintue.

Myth 2 did a good job of also finsihing off the Soulblighter saga.

Pathways into darkness would not make a good sequel unless they did immortals.

  • 02.03.2012 7:30 AM PDT

http://thexboxnetwork.com

I don't find his statement hypocritical at all. He's just stating what's true in this industry. Sequels are normally subpar of the original game, but sometimes, some rare times, the sequels does just as good or even better.

  • 02.03.2012 7:32 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Legendary Member

Posted by: jross1993

Posted by: Ktan Dantaktee
Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

Article is almost 20 years old. Times have changed.

I was going to say the exact same thing.

I'm unfamiliar with the role this gentleman plays at Bungie Studios, but I doubt he's responsible for all the studios decisions. He might be one of many who vote on issues, like a committee.

[Edited on 02.03.2012 7:36 AM PST]

  • 02.03.2012 7:34 AM PDT

You are now reading my signature, the following proceeds as the amazing group i am in and the best person in Bungie.net who i am not stalking at al... >.>

The Reach Asset

Xhavalor is amazing <3

This changes my opinion of Jason, not of Bungie.

  • 02.03.2012 7:35 AM PDT

I acknowledge my user name is stupid. However, I promise I'm not.

Disclaimer: The latter is a lie.

Read my reply to Ken.

And how is it not hypocritical? I can infer that he criticzes those who make sequels and the sort, and then he, with his company, create a complete Franchise of games. Sequel after sequel, an expansion and even a prequel.

I don't care about the deal with Microsoft. Jones and Bungie knew exactly what they were entering in to. If they wanted to remain independent and keep making fresh games, they wouldn't have made the deal. But they did. They earned a huge cash sum because of it.

Yup.

Posted by: Gl0ry Jo3
I don't find his statement hypocritical at all. He's just stating what's true in this industry. Sequels are normally subpar of the original game, but sometimes, some rare times, the sequels does just as good or even better.

  • 02.03.2012 7:36 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

:)


Posted by: RigZ Boi
However, I find it amusing that Jones can be so concrete on his opinion on sequels and the sort, and then, much like a politician with the opportunity of selling out for money, does a complete U-turn.

In a time where people are unwilling to buy something that they aren't familiar with, sequels are the safest way to ensure a profit.

Look at Call of Duty. People buy it because they know exactly what they're getting. Sure, that statement might've been relevant back then, but it certainly isn't now.

  • 02.03.2012 7:37 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten


Posted by: RigZ Boi
There is really no point defending Jones' statement, Ken. Despite demand, and opportunities to expand on their stories, we all know that Bungie make games for money, which is fair enough and I completely understand that.

However, I find it amusing that Jones can be so concrete on his opinion on sequels and the sort, and then, much like a politician with the opportunity of selling out for money, does a complete U-turn.

This quote I believe also echoes how Bungie have distanced themsevles ridiculously from their roots. I love Bungie - Bungie is full of great, weird and wonderful game developers, with a equally funny and loyal fan base, but that doesn't mean that they are not due criticsm for forgetting their fundemental, original principles.

Posted by: spartain ken 15
They HAD to make multiple Halo games for Microsoft.

Bungie made the Marathon series very fun and cool becuase there was a DEMAND and a HUGE story to conintue.

Myth 2 did a good job of also finsihing off the Soulblighter saga.

Pathways into darkness would not make a good sequel unless they did immortals.


Bungie was for a while in deep financial trouble. They went from Alex's garage to a massive studio.

The Myth 2 Soulblighter bug is one of the reasons we have Halo. Bungie needed a huge game to save the company. They also needed the money from Microsoft who owned Bungie at that point.

Was Jason Jones being hypocritical? Maybe. But, when Bungie made sequels they spent time on them and made them unique and cool and well expanded into the story of the games.

But, Pathways into Darkness would be a BAD game for a sequel. You trapped the GodKing under the temple, nothing more to do really.

Marathon however took place from Pathways into the future and while not a sequel, greatly expanded on the universe.

This is all up to views but I think Bungie has always been true to their values and they left the control of Microsoft to be independent again. If Bungie really wanted more $$$, they would keep making Halo games. I think they wanted to stop after 3 but they had 2 more to make.

  • 02.03.2012 7:37 AM PDT

I acknowledge my user name is stupid. However, I promise I'm not.

Disclaimer: The latter is a lie.

Jason Jones, co-founder of Bungie.

Posted by: MR DROZ
Posted by: jross1993

Posted by: Ktan Dantaktee
Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

Article is almost 20 years old. Times have changed.

I was going to say the exact same thing.

I'm unfamiliar with the role this gentleman plays at Bungie Studios, but I doubt he's responsible for all the studios decisions. He might be one of many who vote on issues, like a committee.

  • 02.03.2012 7:37 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten


Posted by: MR DROZ
Posted by: jross1993

Posted by: Ktan Dantaktee
Oh man I hope this doesn't mean Destiny is just one game, not a brand new series. I'd cry if that happened.

Article is almost 20 years old. Times have changed.

I was going to say the exact same thing.

I'm unfamiliar with the role this gentleman plays at Bungie Studios, but I doubt he's responsible for all the studios decisions. He might be one of many who vote on issues, like a committee.


Jason Jones is co-founder of Bungie. I am sure he has a lot of authority but Bungie is split up into dev teams. There was an Oni team, Myth team, halo team, ODST team, Reach team, and a destiny team.

  • 02.03.2012 7:39 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Legendary Member

K. But how much say-so does he actually have in the corporate decision making process?

  • 02.03.2012 7:45 AM PDT

I'm not so sure he was ever thrilled about making so many Halo games. I see that quote as speaking of not making anymore Pathways. It's just an old quote. Off the cuff, it makes sense to rationalize his feeling at that point in time about not making a Pathways sequel.
Every situation is different. So I'm not looking at that quote and saying he is a Hypocrite, in fact, I look at the Halo events and see where Bungie is right now as confirmation of that opinion. Bungie gave up a ton to stop making Halo. Who does that? The whole company kicks ass.

  • 02.03.2012 7:46 AM PDT

In a time long past, the armies of the dark came again to the lands of men. Their leaders became known as the fallen lords, and their terrible sorcery was without equal in the west.
In 30 years they reduced the civilized nations into carrion and ash. Until the free city of Madrigal alone defined them. An army gathered there, and a desperate battle was joined against the fallen
Heros were born in the fire and bloodshed of the wars which followed and their names and deeds will never be forgotten


Posted by: MR DROZ
K. But how much say-so does he actually have in the corporate decision making process?


I would think a lot. he was the co-founder of Bungie and Alex now is vice-president of a Dysney owned gameing company.

But, I would think there would be a lot of meetings among senior members and team members in deciding content and future games.

  • 02.03.2012 7:47 AM PDT

  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3