Halo 1 & 2 for PC
This topic has moved here: Subject: Halo PC: The Halo That Never Existed
  • Subject: Halo PC: The Halo That Never Existed
Subject: Halo PC: The Halo That Never Existed

Halo 3


Posted by: Dr Syx
I corrected what I said. He said "our community" not "the community". Our community would mean Bungie's community so that means I could even state that he's forgetting Marathon, Myth, Halo: Combat Evolved PC, and Halo 2 Vista.

This is also only part of what I'm talking about. I've run into several people who do in fact disregard Halo PC because it wasn't on the Xbox. Saying that it doesn't count.


/thread

  • 04.13.2012 11:19 AM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!


Posted by: Dr Syx

Posted by: Ben2974
As long as there is ambiguity in the article in regards to the domain of the "community", you can't give clean judgement. As far as I know, after skimming through the "Bungie Rides Along with Blueprint", it seems the community they were talking about is the xbox community. Therefore, Halo pc and H2PC are completely excluded from the achievements because they are not part of the community.
Flatly saying "The community" makes me feel that he was talking about the Halo community in general. If he meant the Xbox community specifically that helps out what I meant by people just dismissing the PC version of Combat Evolved as though it doesn't exist. They should not be excluded just because it's not on Xbox. It's just as much a part of this community as any other Halo.

In fact, I want to point this out as well: We were the original Halo community. Before the game released ages ago, we were the ones that were waiting. We were the people hyped for this game to come into existence. It was ripped out of our hands by Microsoft. Many PC gamers are still hurt by that happening. Separating Xbox and PC Halo communities isn't right. We're all equal.

(As for the Microsoft/Bungie thing, I understand why it happened. If they wouldn't have signed the deal Bungie would have probably gone under and so would have Halo. It's ultimately good that it happened but that doesn't change the hurt that caused to Bungie's original audience.)


Technically, Halo wasn't taken from PC gamers. It was taken from Mac Gamers. Halo was originally meant to be a Mac-exclusive RTS game. Then Microsoft came in a took Halo away from Mac users and forced Bungie to make Halo for the Xbox which in early stages was a third person shooter and finally a first person shooter. It's difficult to say how popular Halo would've been if Microsoft never stepped in. But the fact that there aren't really any popular Mac-exclusive games suggests that Halo would've never become popular.

Anyways, I'm surprised there are actually people who know about the history of Halo PC but actively deny the facts about it. I'd understand if they said among the Xbox version of Halo games, Halo 2 was the first to have online multiplayer and Halo 3 was the first to have a map editor. But yeah, in that case, I agree with you.

However, I think I know where these people are coming from. I don't necessarily agree with them, but I think their logic is that the pc versions of Halo were just simply ports and never meant to be a flagship game like the Xbox versions were. I don't agree with that, but I think that's what their thinking might be.

[Edited on 04.13.2012 12:17 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 12:14 PM PDT

Halo 3


Posted by: General Heed

I think their logic is that the pc versions of Halo were just simply ports and never meant to be a flagship game like the Xbox versions were. I don't agree with that, but I think that's what their thinking might be.


seems legit.

The opposite also has to do a lot with fanboyism...based off of the responses I got here. Just sayin' :p

[Edited on 04.13.2012 12:35 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 12:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: General Heed
Technically, Halo wasn't taken from PC gamers. It was taken from Mac Gamers. Halo was originally meant to be a Mac-exclusive RTS game. Then Microsoft came in a took Halo away from Mac users and forced Bungie to make Halo for the Xbox which in early stages was a third person shooter and finally a first person shooter. It's difficult to say how popular Halo would've been if Microsoft never stepped in. But the fact that there aren't really any popular Mac-exclusive games suggests that Halo would've never become popular.
First off, it was never supposed to be a Mac exclusive. It was coming out for Windows PC as well. This is another case of you not really knowing all the information. When I say "PC gamers" I include Mac users because the Mac is a personal computer.

However, I think I know where these people are coming from. I don't necessarily agree with them, but I think their logic is that the pc versions of Halo were just simply ports and never meant to be a flagship game like the Xbox versions were. I don't agree with that, but I think that's what their thinking might be. It doesn't matter if they were ports or not. Halo: Combat Evolved PC was treated with the same sort of respect as a main game. If you would have been around in the beginning, you would have known that. Bungie even had many dedicated servers set up. There was a good bit of interaction as well. It wasn't like Halo 2 Vista where they even denied having anything to do with it. To anyone that was actually around during those times, they would know it wasn't anything short of a big deal for this community.

Posted by: Ben2974
The opposite also has to do a lot with fanboyism...based off of the responses I got here. Just sayin' :p
Are you talking about us being fanboys over this situation? If so, that's completely ridiculous. In this situation, the fanboys are the people who only consider Halo games for the Xbox to be real Halo titles. I was wanting to be considered equal, not better than. That's like calling Martin Luther King Jr. a racist.

[Edited on 04.13.2012 12:44 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 12:37 PM PDT

Halo 3

Posted by: Ben2974
The opposite also has to do a lot with fanboyism...based off of the responses I got here. Just sayin' :p[/quote]Are you talking about us being fanboys over this situation? If so, that's completely ridiculous. In this situation, the fanboys are the people who only consider Halo games for the Xbox to be real Halo titles. I was wanting to be considered equal, not better than. That's like calling Martin Luther King Jr. a racist.


But see, you'd be that black kid in today's world where you'd notice a white guy looking at you for 1 second and then automatically think he's got some sort of racist prejudice against you ... when really, he was just looking at you because it's a freaking human response to look around.

This is an awesome thread.

  • 04.13.2012 12:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ben2974
But see, you'd be that black kid in today's world where you'd notice a white guy looking at you for 1 second and then automatically think he's got some sort of racist prejudice against you ... when really, he was just looking at you because it's a freaking human response to look around.
Not exactly, no. If someone is purposely excluding the PC versions just because they're not on Xbox that shows they're just being an "Xbox fanboy". I'm not a fanboy for thinking it shouldn't matter what platform it's on. In fact, that's the exact opposite of being a fanboy.

[Edited on 04.13.2012 1:37 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 1:36 PM PDT

Halo 3




You insist that it's a problem and it upsets you, but yet, you don't even know the exclusivity of the situation. You just assume so, because of how much of a fan you are.

wow i can't believe how well that tied up!

Posted by: Dr Syx
If someone is purposely excluding the PC versions just because they're not on Xbox


[Edited on 04.13.2012 1:45 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 1:41 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ben2974
You insist that it's a problem and it upsets you, but yet, you don't even know the exclusivity of the situation. You just assume so, because of how much of a fan you are.
What? Do you even understand anything you're saying?

This isn't just about what DeeJ said. This is about many encounters I've had with people throughout forums. Pretty much every time I mention to someone that Halo 2 wasn't the first online Halo and Halo PC was they immediately dismiss it because of this.

Also, I don't consider myself a "fan" of anything. To be a fan, you're calling yourself a fanatic. I'm definitely not a fanatic for Halo: Combat Evolved PC. Definitely since I have many reservations against it.

[Edited on 04.13.2012 1:48 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 1:46 PM PDT

Halo 3


Posted by: Dr Syx
This isn't just about what DeeJ said. This is about many encounters I've had with people throughout forums. Pretty much every time I mention to someone that Halo 2 wasn't the first online Halo and Halo PC was they immediately dismiss it because of this.

Also, I don't consider myself a "fan" of anything. To be a fan, you're calling yourself a fanatic. I'm definitely not a fanatic for Halo: Combat Evolved PC. Definitely since I have many reservations against it.


Well ok if it's about those random encounters, then whatever. I've been referring to your OP for my responses for quite some time now. Sorry to ignore that subtle change in your argument.

Also, when I mean fan, I mean that you defend the hell out of Halo 1 (PC or w.e) whenever it's challenged by the other Halos in any respect.

  • 04.13.2012 2:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ben2974

Well ok if it's about those random encounters, then whatever. I've been referring to your OP for my responses for quite some time now. Sorry to ignore that subtle change in your argument.
That's not a change in my argument... I gave one example specifically in my OP but I was always talking about the many times this has happened.

Also, when I mean fan, I mean that you defend the hell out of Halo 1 (PC or w.e) whenever it's challenged by the other Halos in any respect. I don't defend Halo without objective thought. What I'm saying is that people shouldn't throw away the game just because it's on the PC. I don't defend it against any argument. One example is how it obviously has the worst netcode in the series. I'm far from being a fanboy for this game and it's far from even being my favorite game.

[Edited on 04.13.2012 2:52 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 2:51 PM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!


Posted by: Dr Syx

Posted by: General Heed
Technically, Halo wasn't taken from PC gamers. It was taken from Mac Gamers. Halo was originally meant to be a Mac-exclusive RTS game. Then Microsoft came in a took Halo away from Mac users and forced Bungie to make Halo for the Xbox which in early stages was a third person shooter and finally a first person shooter. It's difficult to say how popular Halo would've been if Microsoft never stepped in. But the fact that there aren't really any popular Mac-exclusive games suggests that Halo would've never become popular.
First off, it was never supposed to be a Mac exclusive. It was coming out for Windows PC as well. This is another case of you not really knowing all the information. When I say "PC gamers" I include Mac users because the Mac is a personal computer.

However, I think I know where these people are coming from. I don't necessarily agree with them, but I think their logic is that the pc versions of Halo were just simply ports and never meant to be a flagship game like the Xbox versions were. I don't agree with that, but I think that's what their thinking might be. It doesn't matter if they were ports or not. Halo: Combat Evolved PC was treated with the same sort of respect as a main game. If you would have been around in the beginning, you would have known that. Bungie even had many dedicated servers set up. There was a good bit of interaction as well. It wasn't like Halo 2 Vista where they even denied having anything to do with it. To anyone that was actually around during those times, they would know it wasn't anything short of a big deal for this community.

Posted by: Ben2974
The opposite also has to do a lot with fanboyism...based off of the responses I got here. Just sayin' :p
Are you talking about us being fanboys over this situation? If so, that's completely ridiculous. In this situation, the fanboys are the people who only consider Halo games for the Xbox to be real Halo titles. I was wanting to be considered equal, not better than. That's like calling Martin Luther King Jr. a racist.


Yeah I missed the part about PC's. Also, Macs don't count as PC's, at least not in the eyes of Valve and other game developers. PC's and Macs are considered two different platforms according to Valve. When they announced Counter Strike: GO, they said it would be cross-platform compatible between the PC and Mac. Inititally it would've supported more platforms, but they announced it would only be cross-platform with PC and Mac now. They wouldn't have bothered categorizing games as PC games and Mac games on Steam if PCs and Macs were the same.

Like I said, I don't agree with the thinking that just because it's a port, it's not a real halo game. All I said was that I suspect that's what they might've been thinking.

You'd think that a Halo fan would try to collect every Halo game/merchandise possible... That's part of the reason why I got Halo 2 Vista, to collect all the Halo games. Other reasons included getting achievements and being able to private chat with my xbox live friends while on the PC. Plus, I wanted to enjoy the Halo 2 campaign in HD on the go.

  • 04.13.2012 6:26 PM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!


Posted by: Dr Syx

Posted by: Ben2974
You insist that it's a problem and it upsets you, but yet, you don't even know the exclusivity of the situation. You just assume so, because of how much of a fan you are.
What? Do you even understand anything you're saying?

This isn't just about what DeeJ said. This is about many encounters I've had with people throughout forums. Pretty much every time I mention to someone that Halo 2 wasn't the first online Halo and Halo PC was they immediately dismiss it because of this.

Also, I don't consider myself a "fan" of anything. To be a fan, you're calling yourself a fanatic. I'm definitely not a fanatic for Halo: Combat Evolved PC. Definitely since I have many reservations against it.


I do agree about the Xbox fanboys. They are very much against the PC for some reason. I make a lot of Halo videos on Youtube (most of them Halo 3). From time to time, I'll make Halo videos from other Halo games including older ones. If I film the older ones on Xbox, everyone is happy. But if I release a Halo 1 or 2 PC video, there's always at least one person that starts ranting about how the Xbox version is better or something along those lines.

  • 04.13.2012 6:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: General Heed
Yeah I missed the part about PC's. Also, Macs don't count as PC's, at least not in the eyes of Valve and other game developers. PC's and Macs are considered two different platforms according to Valve. When they announced Counter Strike: GO, they said it would be cross-platform compatible between the PC and Mac. Inititally it would've supported more platforms, but they announced it would only be cross-platform with PC and Mac now. They wouldn't have bothered categorizing games as PC games and Mac games on Steam if PCs and Macs were the same.
That's because the games aren't compatible with each other. They have to list whether or not the game will have a Mac compatible version. They run off a different operating system. They're still very much "Person Computers". In fact, most Mac/PC games are interconnected online.

You'd think that a Halo fan would try to collect every Halo game/merchandise possible... That's part of the reason why I got Halo 2 Vista, to collect all the Halo games. Other reasons included getting achievements and being able to private chat with my xbox live friends while on the PC. Plus, I wanted to enjoy the Halo 2 campaign in HD on the go. I'm not really getting what you're getting at with any of this. It almost feels like you're accidentally typing out a message in the wrong post. I do like what you have to say, though.

I do agree about the Xbox fanboys. They are very much against the PC for some reason. I make a lot of Halo videos on Youtube (most of them Halo 3). From time to time, I'll make Halo videos from other Halo games including older ones. If I film the older ones on Xbox, everyone is happy. But if I release a Halo 1 or 2 PC video, there's always at least one person that starts ranting about how the Xbox version is better or something along those lines.Fanboys and poorly based hate is within both communities. It's terrible. It's funny because Xbox "fanboys" see me as a PC elitist while all my friends on PC tend to laugh at me for having an Xbox 360/PS3 while owning a high end PC. If I actually "hated" the Xbox, I wouldn't own one. xD

[Edited on 04.13.2012 7:28 PM PDT]

  • 04.13.2012 7:22 PM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!

Yeah don't worry, the dismissal of Halo 1 PC isn't exclusive to that game. It's definitely just fanboys defending their own platforms. Some of my friends on Xbox Live don't even consider Games For Windows Live part of the Xbox Live service. It gets even worse with Xbox Live on Windows Phones.

I've also seen PC gamers claim that FPS games on consoles aren't real shooters at all when the games are the same with the exception of input methods.

It's difficult to compromise between fanboys of both sides.

  • 04.13.2012 9:15 PM PDT

Halo 3

Well, just consider that I focused on the example.

  • 04.13.2012 9:22 PM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!

Oh and one more thing Dr Syx, this is a bit off topic, but going back to an earlier debate, I remember you mentioned something about the Xbox Live update size limit. I just saw an example of that today. In the game Need For Speed: The Run, it has an update that's almost 300 MB in size and has to be downloaded as Free DLC. If for some reason people choose not to update their game, they can only play with other people who did not update their games.

The fact that the DLC Update is free makes me question why Valve couldn't do that with the updates for their games like Portal or Team Fortress 2. I'm positive Valve can already run Steam on top of Xbox Live like SquareEnix does with their Final Fantasy Online Subscription service. That just leaves updates as the other issue that Valve brought up. Their updates are so big that it would have to be released as DLC. Valve claimed Microsoft wouldn't let them release DLC for free. However, it seems EA can do it. In fact, quite a few EA games have plenty of free DLC. Mass Effect 3 will have an upcoming free DLC.

Unless EA has a deal with Microsoft where they subsidized the DLC (unlikely), I don't see why Valve can't do the same and release the large updates for CS: GO as Free DLC in order to keep the Xbox version of CS cross-platform compatible. I honestly think Valve exagerrated the challenges with making CS: GO cross-platform compatible on the Xbox 360. In my personal opinion, I think Valve just didn't have the resources to do it on so many consoles. Since they already have the infrastructure in place on PS3, they figured they'd focus on that platform more. But in the end, they removed cross-platform from PS3 as well. That just seems like they didn't have the time nor resources to pull off their goal.

  • 04.13.2012 9:43 PM PDT
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I wasn't the one that was talking about the update limit on Xbox Live. DusK is the guy you're thinking about. :P

As for Steam not being on Xbox Live, I believe what Gabe Newell has to say. Microsoft is a lot more restrictive with how third party applications on Xbox Live than Sony is with the Playstation Network. They don't give Valve their desired amount of freedom and Valve isn't really the type of developer to just let another company set strict rules upon them.

The real reason why Valve can't do the DLC thing is because Microsoft has to approve each update. That process actually takes some time and it takes away from how fast it happens on the PC. For an example of how long it takes to approve updates, you can look towards how long it takes for them to update the Xbox version of Skyrim against how long it takes for the PC/Steam version.

Valve says the reason is for not having cross-platform play between PC and PS3 users was caused by the same reason as I mentioned for Xbox Live. While I believe this is the most likely case, there is one other glaring issue. The entire Counter-Strike community was up in arms over this from the beginning. Like I said before, both PC/console gamers have their elitists and Counter-Strike is the Tatooine of PC elitism. They'd rather have Barney stab them 5 times in the throat than to play cross-platform with any console players. I don't doubt for a second that Valve would make that excuse to cover up for them stopping the cross-platform initiative because of that.

  • 04.13.2012 11:01 PM PDT

Bring Back Rocket Race!!!


Posted by: Dr Syx
I wasn't the one that was talking about the update limit on Xbox Live. DusK is the guy you're thinking about. :P

As for Steam not being on Xbox Live, I believe what Gabe Newell has to say. Microsoft is a lot more restrictive with how third party applications on Xbox Live than Sony is with the Playstation Network. They don't give Valve their desired amount of freedom and Valve isn't really the type of developer to just let another company set strict rules upon them.

The real reason why Valve can't do the DLC thing is because Microsoft has to approve each update. That process actually takes some time and it takes away from how fast it happens on the PC. For an example of how long it takes to approve updates, you can look towards how long it takes for them to update the Xbox version of Skyrim against how long it takes for the PC/Steam version.

Valve says the reason is for not having cross-platform play between PC and PS3 users was caused by the same reason as I mentioned for Xbox Live. While I believe this is the most likely case, there is one other glaring issue. The entire Counter-Strike community was up in arms over this from the beginning. Like I said before, both PC/console gamers have their elitists and Counter-Strike is the Tatooine of PC elitism. They'd rather have Barney stab them 5 times in the throat than to play cross-platform with any console players. I don't doubt for a second that Valve would make that excuse to cover up for them stopping the cross-platform initiative because of that.


I'm surprised elitists from both sides would be against the cross-platform initiative. They've been bragging for a long time that their controller/keyboard & mouse was better. Now they finally have the chance to prove it. Why are they against it? Perhaps it's because both sides are afraid they might be proven wrong. I'm not going to take a side here cause I know what'll happen if I do. But I think both sides are just afraid about what'll really happen when the time comes to test their skills. Unless there's another reason that I'm not aware of.

If PC-PS3 cross platform play was removed because of the same reason as Xbox Live, then what about Portal 2 and its continued cross-platform support?

And I still don't understand how SquareEnix is able to run their own online network on top of Xbox Live which operates independently of Xbox Live and doesn't even require a gold subscription. It's also cross-platform across PS2, PS3 (backwards compatibility), Xbox 360, and PC (Windows). I believe the online network is called PlayOnline. Plus, EA Origin with EA's Online Pass kind of act the same way.

  • 04.14.2012 10:23 AM PDT
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Posted by: General Heed
I'm surprised elitists from both sides would be against the cross-platform initiative. They've been bragging for a long time that their controller/keyboard & mouse was better. Now they finally have the chance to prove it. Why are they against it? Perhaps it's because both sides are afraid they might be proven wrong. I'm not going to take a side here cause I know what'll happen if I do. But I think both sides are just afraid about what'll really happen when the time comes to test their skills. Unless there's another reason that I'm not aware of.
No one has to prove the mouse/keyboard is better for aiming. It just is. There's no debating the fact that you're able to be much more accurate with a mouse than you are a joystick. If you're actually willing to debate that you're completely ignorant to the situation. It's been proven countless times and that's why Bungie had to invent aim assist to make playing Halo on the Xbox even bearable. Besides, the PS3 has keyboard/mouse support for Global Offensive anyways.

As for why Counter-Strike players don't want to play with people on the PS3, it's because they look at all console gamers as absolute scum in their perfect game. They look at Counter-Strike/PC as the "pure race" of gaming platforms and to have that console "riff-raft" weasel their way in would taint that.

(Please know that none of this is what I believe. This is what a large portion of the Counter-Strike community believes.)

If PC-PS3 cross platform play was removed because of the same reason as Xbox Live, then what about Portal 2 and its continued cross-platform support?Because Portal 2 doesn't require fast patches to fix bugs when it's a cooperative multiplayer experience whereas Counter-Strike is a very serious competitive shooter. Waiting months for a patch would piss Counter-Strike players whereas Portal players would just go "Sounds good!" and wait it out as if it's no big deal.

And I still don't understand how SquareEnix is able to run their own online network on top of Xbox Live which operates independently of Xbox Live and doesn't even require a gold subscription. It's also cross-platform across PS2, PS3 (backwards compatibility), Xbox 360, and PC (Windows). I believe the online network is called PlayOnline. Plus, EA Origin with EA's Online Pass kind of act the same way.Like I said, there are most likely a lot of rules Valve would have to follow if they had Steam on Xbox Live. Valve isn't the type of company to be okay with those sorts of rule sets like Square-Enix and EA are. They need absolute control and pretty much everyone knows Microsoft would not allow that.

Valve only does something when they know they can make it the best that it can be. That's one of the main reasons we haven't seen a third Half-Life. They have a very reputable name that many gamers hold in high regards. They're not going to do attempt something like Steam on Xbox Live unless Microsoft lays all trust and freedom to them.

[Edited on 04.14.2012 12:38 PM PDT]

  • 04.14.2012 12:36 PM PDT

Halo 3

It would be cool to see xbox controller with aim assist vs m/kb in counterstrike

  • 04.14.2012 12:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ben2974
It would be cool to see xbox controller with aim assist vs m/kb in counterstrike
Aim assist is an absolute blight to competitive first person shooting and should only be a part of casual gaming. Any piece of software that "assists" you in a shooter shouldn't exist. If the hardware isn't up to par, update the hardware. Don't ruin the game by changing the software.

I do know the positives for a controller and they're all positives for casual gameplay. There are no positives for actual competitive gameplay. Don't even start on movement because you can get this for that.

[Edited on 04.14.2012 12:51 PM PDT]

  • 04.14.2012 12:45 PM PDT

Halo 3


Posted by: Dr Syx

Posted by: Ben2974
It would be cool to see xbox controller with aim assist vs m/kb in counterstrike
Aim assist is an absolute blight to competitive first person shooting and should only be a part of casual gaming. Any piece of software that "assists" you in a shooter shouldn't exist. If the hardware isn't up to par, update the hardware. Don't ruin the game by changing the software.

I do know the positives for a controller and they're all positives for casual gameplay. There are no positives for actual competitive gameplay. Don't even start on movement because you can get this for that.


Oh yeah aim assist doesn't increase competitive play for sure

[Edited on 04.14.2012 2:19 PM PDT]

  • 04.14.2012 2:10 PM PDT

This is actually the stupidest thing ever posted on B.net:

Posted by: the omega man117
Why does everyone hate Halo 2? Maybe its because its the worst game ever next to mario.

Posted by: Dr Syx
Don't even start on movement because you can get this for that.

That looks intense.

  • 04.14.2012 2:29 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ben2974
Oh yeah aim assist doesn't increase competitive play for sure
I have a hard time picking up sarcasm on the Internet so I'm really hoping you're being sincere with this.

Posted by: Super PolarBear
That looks intense.
I was thinking of buying one of those. I'd only want one if it didn't have those silly designs on them. I don't want to feel like I'm a want to be pro every time I look at my mouse. xD

[Edited on 04.14.2012 7:07 PM PDT]

  • 04.14.2012 7:05 PM PDT

Halo 3

There's no sarcasm, no worries.I wouldn't argue for this in a million years.

  • 04.14.2012 7:10 PM PDT