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Subject: What do you think is skill?
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Reach has ended my 5 year addiction to Halo. Thanks Bungie!
GOML Noob
6/1/07

The truth of the matter is your definition of skill is not accurate either.

Skills in Halo are things like the following:
-Aiming
-Grenade placement
-Strafing
-Tactical jumps
-Gandhi hopping

Those are about all the "skills" there are to Halo.

Now what makes a "good" Halo player is more than just their skills. Halo is a tactical video game. It requires tactics, strategies, teamwork, communication, etc to be good.

This is where spawn killing makes a good Halo player. It doesn't take skill, it takes team work, coordination, strategy, etc. Those are infinitely harder to master than the aiming mechanics of a console shooter.

So you can call spawn killing a cheap trick, and anyone who does it is a noob, but you are just making excuses. Get your head in the game because it is your thinking game that makes you a good Halo player.

  • 04.20.2012 7:25 PM PDT

Mediocre Backpacker
56% W\L
2.86 k\d
3.18 DMR
7.29 God Magnum
7.79 Sniper
5.34 Needle Rifle

Well this thread exploded, since I went to work.

  • 04.20.2012 7:44 PM PDT

old accounts:
Bungie.net:Yank33sfan17
gt:lE V A lD lE(those are L's) 50 in doubles, 45 MLG

Real Join Date: Member Since: 02.07.2008

OP claims he is competitive but doesn't understand that.

-Skill leads to map control.
-Map control leads to control of power weapons.
-Control of power weapons and the map, keeps the enemy in their spawn.
-Which leads to knowing the spawns and killing them to gain a bigger lead.

So based on his logic,
-People should not try to control the map.
-People should LET the other team pick up power weapons.

  • 04.20.2012 8:44 PM PDT

Shoryuken!

Mythic Mode Progress on Reach:
Winter Contingency, perfection.
Other levels in progress.

Skill is the ability to perform well.

If you and your team are put in a position to where you're being spawn trapped/camped, that's your fault.

Is turning invincible (a.k.a. using armor lock) skillful? No. Why? Because you're in a state of invulnerability and cannot be killed.

At least you have to aim with a sniper. Is it our fault you and your team don't rush for power weapons and pursue map control? Is it our fault that half of the maps favor one team? Is it our fault if they lag out or quit?

  • 04.21.2012 12:57 AM PDT

it's your own fault for a) searching with randoms and b) letting yourself be put into that position

get better and stop whining

  • 04.21.2012 2:08 AM PDT


Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
but ill say why it isnt later.


When is it EVER a good idea to let the enemies have their power weapons if you can stop it?


Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
They say using vehicles is skill. Kinda, that is really just a good tactic, but the next part is what throws that out the window.


Vehicle control is smart, it is not a skill.


Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
They say spawn killing is skill. NO, flat out NO, every way i look at it that immediately makes me classify them as a noob that is making up for their sheer lack of skill.


So they're "noobs" because they completely dominate you and push so far into your base that they kill you off spawn? LOL!

If they weren't far superior to you, they wouldn't be able to set up an effective spawn trap in the first place.

Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
How can people possibly think that killing someone with a sniper, tank, assassination, etc, the SECOND that they spawn is any kind of skill at all? They dont have any time to recognize where they are or where any visible enemies are. All they have is their starting weapons and armor ability and grenades, all of which cant do anything against enemies half way across the map or someone behind you (except armor lock for assassinations).
When a team is spawn killing the other team either by outnumbering their total team member count or overpowering them with tanks, banshees, snipers, rockets, swords or whatever they are not showing any skill in the game at all, its basically a shooting range where targets appear and cant do anything to counter the weapons and positions you have.


Wow, just wow.

A team of terribad randoms won't be setting up any sort of spawn trap.

Skilled players can set up and maintain a spawn trap.

  • 04.21.2012 2:14 AM PDT

Why even bother, really?
I rage.

.....Skill....btb
I don't get it.

  • 04.21.2012 5:40 AM PDT
  • gamertag: MR E0S
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Halo: Reach is the beginning of a new age for gaming.
It proves that developers can get away with punishing their players instead of fixing their game....and yet the fanboys will still sing praises to them.

-blam!- all of you fanboys!

See it's that maintaining part that he's getting at.

It might take skill to set-up (as if)

But the amount of effort required to maintain....well

Look at CoD as an example.

I put in just enough effort to get 7 kills, and magically that 7 kills turns into 25 kills and I didn't even bother to kill anyone after the 7th...
So really, in CoD's case. I earned 7 kills but my stats show 25 kills. That's over 2x what I actually earned. (7x3 = 21)

So in a sense. Stat's lie.
Because those of you that spawn kill, don't deserve the numbers gained from it. Because the kills gained from the "maintain" portion are not earned.

The point? Stats don't determine skill.
And neither does your ability to setup spawn traps against pubs.

Since stats are NOT a measure of skill. Can we all agree that TrueSkill is a waste of time?


No really though, if Halo focused more on server browser style of matchmaking, instead of trying to mold the service around TrueSkill. It'd be better off.

I never had any problems with skill levels with any other game.

When searching for a room. Skill levels are at the bottom of my priority list. And if skill levels do become an issue....I look for a different server to play on that matches my other criteria.

Halo...seems to only care about skill.
Halo...has the worst matchmaking of any game in history (don't fool yourself into thinking otherwise)

[Edited on 04.21.2012 6:16 AM PDT]

  • 04.21.2012 6:05 AM PDT

A good team can control the map and break setups. A bad team may be able to not get spawn trapped, but they cant break a setup.

The better team wins, therefor they have more skill.

  • 04.21.2012 6:15 AM PDT
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Redacted for response to quite possibly the dumbest thing I've ever seen on these forums below.

[Edited on 04.21.2012 6:22 AM PDT]

  • 04.21.2012 6:16 AM PDT
  • gamertag: MR E0S
  • user homepage:

Halo: Reach is the beginning of a new age for gaming.
It proves that developers can get away with punishing their players instead of fixing their game....and yet the fanboys will still sing praises to them.

-blam!- all of you fanboys!


Posted by: vballryan
A good team can control the map and break setups. A bad team may be able to not get spawn trapped, but they cant break a setup.

The better team wins, therefor they have more skill.


Notice how he said good teams can break "set-ups". Meaning the other team hasn't reached "Maintain" status yet.


Even the best of teams are presented with spawn traps situations that are IMPOSSIBLE to change. And...you know what. Alot of times it's not skill...but LUCK, that was the determining factor on who gets trapped. And I'm not talking about bloom either. It could be as simple as someone spawning just a little bit closer to a primary target.

Or..do you think skill played a role for the other 7 people on the team when the game pretty much comes down to who survived the first tank vs tank battle? The surviving tanks goes on to go 50-0 against their spawning areas... You think that's skill?

[Edited on 04.21.2012 6:22 AM PDT]

  • 04.21.2012 6:21 AM PDT
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Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD

Posted by: Dattebayo

Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD

Posted by: Dattebayo
An idiotic, subjective, incoherent, incomplete, inaccurate (depending on definition), unimportant method of measuring ability - by the loosest definition - of a player at a certain game and comparing them to others who devote more time into said game in order to conceive a weak basis on a player's worth and to justify the rather ridiculous amount of time they devote into the game.

You also need to have a legit 50 in Halo 3 for your opinion to matter.
halo 3's level system was -blam!-, if you lost a certain amount of times or took too long you could NEVER get to 50 no matter how good you were, why you think so many people made new accounts? learn your facts


Oh dear, if only you were a tinesy bit more dedicated to those whole "stupid, blind idiot" persona you seem to be emulating.

I already stated that I was being facetious, and even if I wasn't I'll direct your attention to the part where I said, "You also need to have a legit 50..."

Meaning that you can't have cheated to get your 50.

And I already know how stupid the Halo 3 system was.

I will gladly learn my facts when you learn to not be so hasty with your idiotic words.
its hard for me to not be hasty, you know the BS i went through halo 2 and 3 to get as good as i am? In halo 2 my ENTIRE team would quit on me about 90% of the time and i was left to fight the other team myself. the same thing happen in halo 3 just not as often or it was only 2-3 people that quit. It happens in reach too but hardly ever. Now players just suck in general and i cant do a thing about how good the rest of my team is. Basically my halo career is all about other players and how they affect me winning my games. Ive won enough games to know I am a great Halo player when i have a competent team to back me up and the enemy plays with some respect.


Holy -blam!-. You sound like a whiny 12 year old. Man up, -blam!- , and stop blaming others for not winning at a video game. Take a look in the mirror once-in-a-while and realize you are not as good as you think you are, and you're just as responsible for many of those losses.

Gotta love the entitled generation.

  • 04.21.2012 6:21 AM PDT
  • gamertag: MR E0S
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Halo: Reach is the beginning of a new age for gaming.
It proves that developers can get away with punishing their players instead of fixing their game....and yet the fanboys will still sing praises to them.

-blam!- all of you fanboys!

-blam!- off with that entitled generation -blam!-.

It's like one person says it, and suddenly a bunch of losers jump all over it like it's the coolest insult they ever heard.


You're part of the entitled generation.

When you were growing up, think about all the things you had.
That the generation before you didn't.

You know what. You want to keep throwing that -blam!- around. Here's what I suggest. Walk. Don't ever drive in a vehicle, because you are not entitled to it, because you didn't put forth the effort to invent, design and manufacture that vehicle.

Same with your phone. Stop using it and go back to using smoke signals you entitled -blam!-.

That lighter you use to smoke your cigarettes? That's right, toss it and get a couple of wooden sticks. You're going to be there awhile.

[Edited on 04.21.2012 6:28 AM PDT]

  • 04.21.2012 6:26 AM PDT

Posted by: MR E0S

Posted by: vballryan
A good team can control the map and break setups. A bad team may be able to not get spawn trapped, but they cant break a setup.

The better team wins, therefor they have more skill.


Notice how he said good teams can break "set-ups". Meaning the other team hasn't reached "Maintain" status yet.


Even the best of teams are presented with spawn traps situations that are IMPOSSIBLE to change. And...you know what. Alot of times it's not skill...but LUCK, that was the determining factor on who gets trapped. And I'm not talking about bloom either. It could be as simple as someone spawning just a little bit closer to a primary target.

Or..do you think skill played a role for the other 7 people on the team when the game pretty much comes down to who survived the first tank vs tank battle? The surviving tanks goes on to go 50-0 against their spawning areas... You think that's skill?

First of all, I wasnt talking about btb. I was referring to 4v4 with competitive settings. The best teams dont get spawn trapped, sorry to break it to you. They might be kept at their spawn, but a good team can break it and fight back. When getting killed near or off spawn, yu and your team have to play smart. No matter how good you are, you will not win a 1v4. That is where every dumb player goes wrong. They keep mindlessly rushing the enemy. Halo Reach is a team game, you must utulize your team if you want to do well.

A setup is a generealized term. It refers to the basic outline of where people should be to maximize the teams potential. Map control is in a sense different from a setup. In 4v4s (typically smaller maps), map control can be held down by 1 or 2 players. A setup requires the full teams involvement.

We have argues on multiple topics now and I dont think we will ever see eye to eye.

  • 04.21.2012 6:35 AM PDT

I'm not racist, I own a colored TV

Skill: Being able to go positive while blind.

  • 04.21.2012 8:29 AM PDT

Why even bother, really?
I rage.


Posted by: MR E0S


He's back...

  • 04.21.2012 8:56 AM PDT
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I wanna be the very best..

Skill= The ability to do something well; expertise.

  • 04.21.2012 9:38 AM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)


Posted by: MR E0S
snip
At least someone understands

  • 04.21.2012 1:32 PM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)

My god so many of you think its so easy to just stopped being spawn killed? You think my team can up and destroy every circling vehicle and sniper surrounding our in a instant? If you didnt read right we get killed ONCE WE SPAWN. there is absolutely nothing we can do if 4-5 people are aiming at you at once with either a wraith, tank, warthog, sniper, laser, rockets, YOU CAN NOT DO ANYTHING. apparently yall dont get in these situations alot to understand where im coming from.

  • 04.21.2012 1:36 PM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)


Posted by: MR E0S
-blam!- off with that entitled generation -blam!-.

It's like one person says it, and suddenly a bunch of losers jump all over it like it's the coolest insult they ever heard.


You're part of the entitled generation.

When you were growing up, think about all the things you had.
That the generation before you didn't.

You know what. You want to keep throwing that -blam!- around. Here's what I suggest. Walk. Don't ever drive in a vehicle, because you are not entitled to it, because you didn't put forth the effort to invent, design and manufacture that vehicle.

Same with your phone. Stop using it and go back to using smoke signals you entitled -blam!-.

That lighter you use to smoke your cigarettes? That's right, toss it and get a couple of wooden sticks. You're going to be there awhile.
*clap*

  • 04.21.2012 1:37 PM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)

You spawn, i kill you with a sniper, you spawn again, some wraith takes you out, you spawn again, a ghost takes you out, you spawn again, get sniped again, are you going to quit by now? no? spawn again, get DMR spammed, spawn again (inside your base or something) shotgun kills you one shot, spawn again, banshee bombs you, spawn again, the enemy stole your own wraith and revenant and now they all are camping your spawn, do you REALLY think that spawn killing takes ANY kind of skill? no it does not because they take EVERY advantage you can possibly have against them, that is not skill, that is them MAKING UP for their utter lack of it. Its basically the same as if no weapons or vehicles spawned on your side of the map.

  • 04.21.2012 1:43 PM PDT
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My Resume
Reach Stats
Halo 3 Stats

"In Halo 3 not all 50's were good players, but all good players were 50's."

Your opinion is invalid.

Being able to dribble a football is pretty skillful.

  • 04.21.2012 1:45 PM PDT

Posted by: LordMonkey
Posted by: ICanHasRofl
Bungie created the host-selection system.

And you know this how?


LOL, Mains kids


Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
You spawn, i kill you with a sniper, you spawn again, some wraith takes you out, you spawn again, a ghost takes you out, you spawn again, get sniped again, are you going to quit by now? no? spawn again, get DMR spammed, spawn again (inside your base or something) shotgun kills you one shot, spawn again, banshee bombs you, spawn again, the enemy stole your own wraith and revenant and now they all are camping your spawn, do you REALLY think that spawn killing takes ANY kind of skill? no it does not because they take EVERY advantage you can possibly have against them, that is not skill, that is them MAKING UP for their utter lack of it. Its basically the same as if no weapons or vehicles spawned on your side of the map.
Spawn killing is the result of being skillful.

Plus it takes skill to keep a spawn trap up.

I'll 4v4 you.

Since I'm more skillful than you, I will spawn kill you almost all game.

  • 04.21.2012 2:03 PM PDT

Herroh. U have reached teh BOOGIE LAND

Skill is defined on how well you can handle a controller.

  • 04.21.2012 2:24 PM PDT


Posted by: DxXOrangesXxD
Stop searching alone and stop being godawful at this game.

Voila! All of your problems are gone.

  • 04.21.2012 2:29 PM PDT

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