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This topic has moved here: Subject: Imago is garb
  • Subject: Imago is garb

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Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
your maps and ideas are worthless because you're terrible at this game.

^this is what i mean goat ... how the hell am i meant to listen if i constantly get told crap like this?


You don't listen to the personal attacks. Instead you sift through it and take the realistic and legitimate criticism. In the end you're the one who can forge and the ones attacking you most likely cannot, so you take from them what their experiences are on the map and you use it to improve upon it.

  • 05.05.2012 10:43 PM PDT
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Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
same. surprised we didn't match you


Lets match tomorrow then.

I want to try the new maps anyway. If you have skype PM me your name on it. Im interested to see how much better you have gotten.

  • 05.05.2012 10:44 PM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Explain to me whats going on, and I will do my best to help you understand whats going on.


good players thinking they understand map design from playing the game...

gameplay feedback is fine, that never happens though, it ends up being "you should do this, i'm right because i'm good you're wrong because you're bad" all the time, i've gotten to the point that i just ignore everything they say and write and instead watch the footage because the footage speaks a thousands words and the words the players say speak nothing.

[Edited on 05.05.2012 10:46 PM PDT]

  • 05.05.2012 10:45 PM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
same. surprised we didn't match you


Lets match tomorrow then.

I want to try the new maps anyway. If you have skype PM me your name on it. Im interested to see how much better you have gotten.

here you go if you want an early look, pulse and imago got added to arena, the rest got added to TS and SS

  • 05.05.2012 10:48 PM PDT
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Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Explain to me whats going on, and I will do my best to help you understand whats going on.


good players thinking they understand map design from playing the game...

gameplay feedback is fine, that never happens though, it ends up being "you should do this, i'm right because i'm good you're wrong because you're bad" all the time, i've gotten to the point that i just ignore everything they say and write and instead watch the footage because the footage speaks a thousands words and the words the players say speak nothing.


Umm, we do though...

Why do you think developers play test their games? The problem is most of them arent very good and dont understand how to make very well balanced maps. Its not always like that, because some of the maps they make are amazing. Sometimes they try to hard.

Saying we dont understand map design, when in reality the majority of what makes us good is that we understand map design, is ignorant.

  • 05.05.2012 10:50 PM PDT
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I play games for gameplay, not silly gimmicks

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Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
same. surprised we didn't match you


Lets match tomorrow then.

I want to try the new maps anyway. If you have skype PM me your name on it. Im interested to see how much better you have gotten.

here you go if you want an early look, pulse and imago got added to arena, the rest got added to TS and SS


I played both of those so far.

Imago is okay, but the spawns are a little funky.

I didnt like the way pulse played at all.

  • 05.05.2012 10:51 PM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Explain to me whats going on, and I will do my best to help you understand whats going on.


good players thinking they understand map design from playing the game...

gameplay feedback is fine, that never happens though, it ends up being "you should do this, i'm right because i'm good you're wrong because you're bad" all the time, i've gotten to the point that i just ignore everything they say and write and instead watch the footage because the footage speaks a thousands words and the words the players say speak nothing.


Umm, we do though...


then why don't you make the maps?

i've seen quite few good players clame this, the maps they end up building sucked badly because they didn't understand how to design and build a map to fit the gameplay.

  • 05.05.2012 10:51 PM PDT
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I play games for gameplay, not silly gimmicks

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Posted by: aBlueBookshelf
I lost to moneymitch. take that as you will.

also, the people I played with for most of the season don't play anymore (shl, secrets, faceripper). I've just searched 2s with 1 random friend every night I've played lately.


Lol moneymitch.

Meh one game doesnt really matter though. It should be fun either way, and it would be nice to actually find games lol

  • 05.05.2012 10:52 PM PDT
  • gamertag: Meagss
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I play games for gameplay, not silly gimmicks

H3 MM warrior

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Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Explain to me whats going on, and I will do my best to help you understand whats going on.


good players thinking they understand map design from playing the game...

gameplay feedback is fine, that never happens though, it ends up being "you should do this, i'm right because i'm good you're wrong because you're bad" all the time, i've gotten to the point that i just ignore everything they say and write and instead watch the footage because the footage speaks a thousands words and the words the players say speak nothing.


Umm, we do though...


then why don't you make the maps?

i've seen quite few good players clame this, the maps they end up building sucked badly because they didn't understand how to design and build a map to fit the gameplay.


Multiple reasons.

Starting with the fact that I dont have time. Making a good map is time consuming, and working over 40 hours a week doesnt leave me with a lot of it.

Second is I dont have the patience. Like I said it takes time, and I just dont have the patience to sit and make everything perfect.

And the last is I dont like forge. It bores me.

  • 05.05.2012 10:53 PM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: con_extreme

Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Explain to me whats going on, and I will do my best to help you understand whats going on.


good players thinking they understand map design from playing the game...

gameplay feedback is fine, that never happens though, it ends up being "you should do this, i'm right because i'm good you're wrong because you're bad" all the time, i've gotten to the point that i just ignore everything they say and write and instead watch the footage because the footage speaks a thousands words and the words the players say speak nothing.


Umm, we do though...


then why don't you make the maps?

i've seen quite few good players clame this, the maps they end up building sucked badly because they didn't understand how to design and build a map to fit the gameplay.


Multiple reasons.

Starting with the fact that I dont have time. Making a good map is time consuming, and working over 40 hours a week doesnt leave me with a lot of it.

Second is I dont have the patience. Like I said it takes time, and I just dont have the patience to sit and make everything perfect.

And the last is I dont like forge. It bores me.


then how can you clame to understand map design?

  • 05.05.2012 10:55 PM PDT

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You have to understand Halo gameplay to make a good map. But even if you did understand Halo gameplay and you did make a good map, what would make it stand out from the others is your creativity and talent, which only the truly gifted designers have.

Anybody can learn how to use Forge, reduce framerate, place spawns, etc.; However, piece usage, map style, and overall ingenuity all comes from the individual designer, and that's what gives us uniquely different maps.



  • 05.05.2012 10:55 PM PDT
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I dont have to spend hours everyday forging to understand the basics of map design, or what I look for in maps.

Your making it sound like map making is difficult. The only thing difficult about making maps is the time and patience.

Also what goat said. I understand map design, but I probably wouldnt make a great map if asked because I dont have the drive to do so.

Unfortunately most of the people that do have that drive, dont understand halo.

[Edited on 05.05.2012 10:58 PM PDT]

  • 05.05.2012 10:57 PM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Unfortunately most of the people that do have that drive, dont understand halo.


that i agree with, the amount of bad maps from eager forgers is enough to make your eyes bleed and to want to commit suicide from the extreme amount of ignorance (F you forgehub).

the difficult thing really i would say is figuring out how to build the map to fit the gameplay and expand upon it, finding new ways to use peices isn't that hard ...

  • 05.05.2012 11:03 PM PDT

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Posted by: con_extreme
finding new ways to use peices isn't that hard ...


There are some who are just naturally good at both using pieces in new ways and using areas of forge world in new ways.

If a forger goes on your map and doesn't know where he is on forge world or what piece he runs into, then you've successfully forged a good map design-wise.

  • 05.05.2012 11:05 PM PDT
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If you like Armor Lock, you are a troll.

I haven't even played the map, but I can most likely make the assumption that because it is symmetric and has dynamic spawns, it most likely doesn't play well. The problem stems from the fact that Reach's spawn logic is horrendous, and it takes LOS into account way too highly. Bungie was so scared of spawn-kills happening, that they'd rather have people literally spawn right behind someone (it's happened to me several times on the Cage) than the occasional spawn kill. Spawn kills really only happened when both teams were literally predicting every single spawn in the game. Some maps way too easy to spawn kill on without really having any knowledge of spawn logic. (Narrows)

The 4v4 spawn system was close to perfect in Halo 2, where enemy position was the biggest factor for your spawn. Halo CE's was without a doubt the best for 2v2, although it didn't really work the best for 4s.

  • 05.05.2012 11:09 PM PDT


Posted by: A 3 Legged Goat
If a forger goes on your map and doesn't know where he is on forge world or what piece he runs into, then you've successfully forged a good map design-wise.


thats kind of impossible to do when the people know forge objects inside and out, the trick is getting people away from seeing the object as on object but something else, but, when they stop and look they see what object it is.

the general players on the other hand don't know what is what, all they see is this is grey and that is grey ...

  • 05.05.2012 11:12 PM PDT
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Posted by: R0bin L0pez
I haven't even played the map, but I can most likely make the assumption that because it is symmetric and has dynamic spawns, it most likely doesn't play well. The problem stems from the fact that Reach's spawn logic is horrendous, and it takes LOS into account way too highly. Bungie was so scared of spawn-kills happening, that they'd rather have people literally spawn right behind someone (it's happened to me several times on the Cage) than the occasional spawn kill. Spawn kills really only happened when both teams were literally predicting every single spawn in the game. Some maps way too easy to spawn kill on without really having any knowledge of spawn logic. (Narrows)

The 4v4 spawn system was close to perfect in Halo 2, where enemy position was the biggest factor for your spawn. Halo CE's was without a doubt the best for 2v2, although it didn't really work the best for 4s.



I though Imago would play worse than it did. I never really noticed the dynamic spawning, and map control was very effective.

The rockets, GL, and sniper spawns complimented each other well from the game I played as well.

Ill have to play it more for a better assessment though.

  • 05.05.2012 11:19 PM PDT

All of the new community maps apart from Pulse are garbage lol..

  • 05.06.2012 12:32 AM PDT
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Lol. The enemies spawn behind you even if you don't leave your base on enclosed

doubles btw

[Edited on 05.06.2012 12:59 AM PDT]

  • 05.06.2012 12:59 AM PDT
  • gamertag: Meagss
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I play games for gameplay, not silly gimmicks

H3 MM warrior

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H4 MM legend


Posted by: ankerd123
Lol. The enemies spawn behind you even if you don't leave your base on enclosed

doubles btw


The spawns are beyond predictable though.

  • 05.06.2012 1:07 AM PDT


Posted by: meagsIZbeast

Posted by: ankerd123
Lol. The enemies spawn behind you even if you don't leave your base on enclosed

doubles btw


The spawns are beyond predictable though.


Yep, they will predictably screw you over everytime.

  • 05.06.2012 3:20 AM PDT