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  • Subject: Who is playtesting Halo3 for balance?
Subject: Who is playtesting Halo3 for balance?

Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: ToXSicK II
Posted by: TheBigShow
but I would like to play a game on LIVE that is competetive, balanced, and skill based.


Halo 3 will NOT be that game. MLG found the most balanced settings Halo 2 had to offer, but they/we are a minority with roughly 100,000 members. Bungie has already stated that they will be creating Halo 3 by what the MAJORITY of the Halo 2 community had to say. I would not be suprised if the AR in Halo 3 shot out rockets.


100,000 people have a rod up their ass too. Seriously, if you cant play the game for fun then why play at all? Do you really get that angry when some kid owns you with a noob combo that you have to go whine with your other 100,000 -blam!- friends? If it was up to you I'm sure halo 3 would have one gun, that killed in three shots, with a really big crosshair, and we could call it halo 1, and then all would be happy.



You really have no idea what you are talking about, so please stop posting.

  • 06.19.2006 3:54 PM PDT
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Posted by: TheBigShow
Posted by: ToXSicK II
People. Please don't expect another Halo 1. Halo 1 was a fluke in it's own. Also, Alex Seropian left and created Wideload Games, which created Stubbs the Zombie.

With that said, if you want to play a balanced game don't look ahead, look back to H1.


That doesnt mean I have to resign myself to the likely outcome. I still do play Halo 1 and XBC , but I would like to play a game on LIVE that is competetive, balanced, and skill based.

Looks to me like we(you, me and Osaka and other people that agree with us) are in the same boat except I just push a little to get my point around. Sorry if it comes up as flaming but I see the little flaws(the little things that make up a great playtester) in a game that only some(other than me) realize.

  • 06.19.2006 3:54 PM PDT
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Posted by: TheBigShow
I completely agree with that. However, the masses don't know the difference between a balanced game and an unbalanced game, so why cater it to them?

Ask Bungie.

  • 06.19.2006 3:56 PM PDT

Posted by: ToXSicK II
Posted by: TheBigShow
I completely agree with that. However, the masses don't know the difference between a balanced game and an unbalanced game, so why cater it to them?

Ask Bungie.


Unfortunately I am not in a position to directly discuss these matters with them. So I resort to what I have been given.... the Bungie boards..... ::sigh::

  • 06.19.2006 3:58 PM PDT

gamer tag: CrazyChinchilla

If its balanced their is no challenge, just repitition. I like overcoming someone with a noob combo, it makes me feel better than them. Owning someone in a striaght up battle rifle fight doesnt, it just makes me feel like wow, I saw him first, I got my 4 shots off first. Also I like when crazy stuff happens, homing rockets barely missing, then coming back around, thats cool. I agree with having some playtesters brought in from the outside to playtest it, but not MLG only, you arent special, you dont know video games better than anyone else. Sure their are the "masses" that just play halo 2, and their are MLG players that play halo 2, but their are also many people who play a variety of games and you can't exclude these people and say no, just MLG players. BTW the community would know, a ton of people look at B.net everyday for new snippets of Halo 3, and when they see the news post of MLG testers, they will go ballistic, you cant let any certain type of people test it.

  • 06.19.2006 4:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: ToXSicK II
Posted by: TheBigShow
but I would like to play a game on LIVE that is competetive, balanced, and skill based.


Halo 3 will NOT be that game. MLG found the most balanced settings Halo 2 had to offer, but they/we are a minority with roughly 100,000 members. Bungie has already stated that they will be creating Halo 3 by what the MAJORITY of the Halo 2 community had to say. I would not be suprised if the AR in Halo 3 shot out rockets.


100,000 people have a rod up their ass too. Seriously, if you cant play the game for fun then why play at all? Do you really get that angry when some kid owns you with a noob combo that you have to go whine with your other 100,000 -blam!- friends? If it was up to you I'm sure halo 3 would have one gun, that killed in three shots, with a really big crosshair, and we could call it halo 1, and then all would be happy.

You do realize that this about how hyped it was when the Halo 2 announcement came out? In fact it wasn't even this excited, it was just like... yea... it looks good, but the game probably wont look like that. The hype engine starts slowly, then it hooks everyone, then it turns into a massive ad camapaign and rumor hype, viral marketing, crazy stuff every day shenanigan.


One gun? with three shot kills? Again, you had to be really good to do that. Also, every weapon i used in Halo:CE was good. I even liked running around with the plasma pistol(not charged) and pwning people. Now, its not good unless fully charged and used in conjunction with another weapon(which is a really cheesy combo). I would like all the weapons from all the games, and the gameplay as balanced as it was in halo:ce. Notice i didn't say weapons balanced, I know a rocket is supposed to be more powerful than a smg, but with more gameplay balance i can have that smg and with the right maneuvering have a chance against the rocket weilder.

In a nutshell, the smg and all duals were weak by themselves, and its the starting weapon. If they were good on their own, it wouldn't matter who got the power weapons first, the game would depend on how you played, not what you played with

  • 06.19.2006 4:04 PM PDT

gamer tag: CrazyChinchilla

Posted by: TheBigShow
Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: ToXSicK II
Posted by: TheBigShow
but I would like to play a game on LIVE that is competetive, balanced, and skill based.


Halo 3 will NOT be that game. MLG found the most balanced settings Halo 2 had to offer, but they/we are a minority with roughly 100,000 members. Bungie has already stated that they will be creating Halo 3 by what the MAJORITY of the Halo 2 community had to say. I would not be suprised if the AR in Halo 3 shot out rockets.


100,000 people have a rod up their ass too. Seriously, if you cant play the game for fun then why play at all? Do you really get that angry when some kid owns you with a noob combo that you have to go whine with your other 100,000 -blam!- friends? If it was up to you I'm sure halo 3 would have one gun, that killed in three shots, with a really big crosshair, and we could call it halo 1, and then all would be happy.



You really have no idea what you are talking about, so please stop posting.


And you do? Because you are MLG? I'm sorry but your retarded. Perfect balancing is not fun, name one game that is very well balanced that is extremely fun, one will come up, Halo. Now go back to halo and look how really balanced it is, Three guns that are useful, no others. Yea, thats fun, using the same three guns OVER AND OVER. Sure you can throw in a couple others if you get desperate, but basically if you aren't good with these three guns, you suck. Not only that, but look at the maps, any balanced map is really boring. Im sorry if you think Blood Gulch was the greatest thing to happen to video games, but if you played some other games, you would realize how bland these symetrical maps have become. These are fair, if you want a competition, their you go. But the majority of gamers dont play to compete that seriously. Plus these types of maps get old quick. I guarntee if you look at the majority of maps played in Halo 2 it will be the asymetrical ones. Don't say that I know nothing about what I am talking about, all you want is MLG testers... since they are obviously so much more inteligent, please stop posting unless you can look both ways before crossing the road.

  • 06.19.2006 4:08 PM PDT
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I never said that Bungie should only use MLG playtesters. Bungie is doing everything right in order to make money, which is what a business' main goal is. They are watching statistics and molding thier next game to fit the criteria.

The thing is, with this plan, Bungie's priorities are not in having a well rounded, balanced, competitive game. The MP could be comlete crap, but if the community ate it up then that's what Bungie would make.

  • 06.19.2006 4:09 PM PDT

Posted by: tex mex matt
If its balanced their is no challenge, just repitition. I like overcoming someone with a noob combo, it makes me feel better than them. Owning someone in a striaght up battle rifle fight doesnt, it just makes me feel like wow, I saw him first, I got my 4 shots off first. Also I like when crazy stuff happens, homing rockets barely missing, then coming back around, thats cool. I agree with having some playtesters brought in from the outside to playtest it, but not MLG only, you arent special, you dont know video games better than anyone else. Sure their are the "masses" that just play halo 2, and their are MLG players that play halo 2, but their are also many people who play a variety of games and you can't exclude these people and say no, just MLG players. BTW the community would know, a ton of people look at B.net everyday for new snippets of Halo 3, and when they see the news post of MLG testers, they will go ballistic, you cant let any certain type of people test it.


Once again, you lack the comprehension or understanding of the game.

  • 06.19.2006 4:09 PM PDT

Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: TheBigShow
Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: ToXSicK II
Posted by: TheBigShow
but I would like to play a game on LIVE that is competetive, balanced, and skill based.


Halo 3 will NOT be that game. MLG found the most balanced settings Halo 2 had to offer, but they/we are a minority with roughly 100,000 members. Bungie has already stated that they will be creating Halo 3 by what the MAJORITY of the Halo 2 community had to say. I would not be suprised if the AR in Halo 3 shot out rockets.


100,000 people have a rod up their ass too. Seriously, if you cant play the game for fun then why play at all? Do you really get that angry when some kid owns you with a noob combo that you have to go whine with your other 100,000 -blam!- friends? If it was up to you I'm sure halo 3 would have one gun, that killed in three shots, with a really big crosshair, and we could call it halo 1, and then all would be happy.



You really have no idea what you are talking about, so please stop posting.


And you do? Because you are MLG? I'm sorry but your retarded. Perfect balancing is not fun, name one game that is very well balanced that is extremely fun, one will come up, Halo. Now go back to halo and look how really balanced it is, Three guns that are useful, no others. Yea, thats fun, using the same three guns OVER AND OVER. Sure you can throw in a couple others if you get desperate, but basically if you aren't good with these three guns, you suck. Not only that, but look at the maps, any balanced map is really boring. Im sorry if you think Blood Gulch was the greatest thing to happen to video games, but if you played some other games, you would realize how bland these symetrical maps have become. These are fair, if you want a competition, their you go. But the majority of gamers dont play to compete that seriously. Plus these types of maps get old quick. I guarntee if you look at the majority of maps played in Halo 2 it will be the asymetrical ones. Don't say that I know nothing about what I am talking about, all you want is MLG testers... since they are obviously so much more inteligent, please stop posting unless you can look both ways before crossing the road.


Yes, actually I have a much better understanding of the game then most players. I have put the time in to learn the game and to understand it. I am much more qualified, so-to-speak, than your average gamer.

  • 06.19.2006 4:12 PM PDT

gamer tag: CrazyChinchilla

Posted by: Usedtabe

One gun? with three shot kills? Again, you had to be really good to do that. Also, every weapon i used in Halo:CE was good. I even liked running around with the plasma pistol(not charged) and pwning people. Now, its not good unless fully charged and used in conjunction with another weapon(which is a really cheesy combo). I would like all the weapons from all the games, and the gameplay as balanced as it was in halo:ce. Notice i didn't say weapons balanced, I know a rocket is supposed to be more powerful than a smg, but with more gameplay balance i can have that smg and with the right maneuvering have a chance against the rocket weilder.

In a nutshell, the smg and all duals were weak by themselves, and its the starting weapon. If they were good on their own, it wouldn't matter who got the power weapons first, the game would depend on how you played, not what you played with


Yea, that was fun, until someone pulled out a pistol and got you before you could possibly get them. I know what you are talking about with the spawn weapons, but a lot of that was fixed, plus a lot of that is also just stupid gaming. Plain and simple, if you have a SMG and the other guy has a BR, the correct strategy is to not run at him, its called waiting for him to get closer. I also know how you feel with certain power weapons, but if you ever played with really good people in Halo 1, it was the same way. ITs just the fact that XBL makes everyone good with every weapon, and it keeps you playing good people with MM, so its really hard to overcome those weapons, but its something you just have to learn to do or deal with it, think of way to get em back. There is no real way to eliminate these weapons from usage without ruining other parts of the game

  • 06.19.2006 4:13 PM PDT
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Posted by: ToXSicK II
I never said that Bungie should only use MLG playtesters. Bungie is doing everything right in order to make money, which is what a business' main goal is. They are watching statistics and molding thier next game to fit the criteria.

The thing is, with this plan, Bungie's priorities are not in having a well rounded, balanced, competitive game. The MP could be comlete crap, but if the community ate it up then that's what Bungie would make.

/Lock thread.

  • 06.19.2006 4:14 PM PDT

Posted by: tex mex matt
Posted by: Usedtabe

One gun? with three shot kills? Again, you had to be really good to do that. Also, every weapon i used in Halo:CE was good. I even liked running around with the plasma pistol(not charged) and pwning people. Now, its not good unless fully charged and used in conjunction with another weapon(which is a really cheesy combo). I would like all the weapons from all the games, and the gameplay as balanced as it was in halo:ce. Notice i didn't say weapons balanced, I know a rocket is supposed to be more powerful than a smg, but with more gameplay balance i can have that smg and with the right maneuvering have a chance against the rocket weilder.

In a nutshell, the smg and all duals were weak by themselves, and its the starting weapon. If they were good on their own, it wouldn't matter who got the power weapons first, the game would depend on how you played, not what you played with


Yea, that was fun, until someone pulled out a pistol and got you before you could possibly get them. I know what you are talking about with the spawn weapons, but a lot of that was fixed, plus a lot of that is also just stupid gaming. Plain and simple, if you have a SMG and the other guy has a BR, the correct strategy is to not run at him, its called waiting for him to get closer. I also know how you feel with certain power weapons, but if you ever played with really good people in Halo 1, it was the same way. ITs just the fact that XBL makes everyone good with every weapon, and it keeps you playing good people with MM, so its really hard to overcome those weapons, but its something you just have to learn to do or deal with it, think of way to get em back. There is no real way to eliminate these weapons from usage without ruining other parts of the game


If you have a stand-by weapon that is useful but not dominant in every situation, that gives you a chance against the power weapons. You will still be at a disadvantage, but not an insurmountable one if you are skilled enough.

  • 06.19.2006 4:15 PM PDT
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What you guys are forgetting is that you had to be atleast decent at H1 to be able to 3 shot effectivly. To be anywhere NEAR good you had to go to AGP tournements or attend locals. You need to stop thinking of H1 as H2 where auto-aim os dominant and go out to play the game for yourself. You might be suprised at what you find.

[Edited on 6/19/2006]

  • 06.19.2006 4:17 PM PDT

Posted by: ToXSicK II
What you guys are forgetting is that you had to be atleast decent at H1 to be able to 3 shot effectivly. To be anywhere NEAR good you had to go to AGP tournements or attend locals. You need to stop thinking of H1 as H2 where auto-aim os dominant and go out to play the game for yourself. You might be suprised at what you find.


Exactly, so many people think that getting a TSK was easy (at least they CLAIM it was too easy). They obviously never played competetively and dont fully understand the game. They are, in my mind, way less qualified to determine what is or isnt balanced.

  • 06.19.2006 4:20 PM PDT
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Posted by: ToXSicK II
What you guys are forgetting is that you had to be atleast decent at H1 to be able to 3 shot effectivly. To be anywhere NEAR good you had to go to AGP tournements or attend locals. You need to stop thinking of H1 as H2 where auto-aim os dominant and go out to play the game for yourself. You might be suprised at what you find.


like i've said numerous times, you had to damn near be a god at halo:ce to get three shot kills consecutively.

  • 06.19.2006 4:22 PM PDT
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It took me a few tournements before I could 3shot every time. =/

  • 06.19.2006 4:25 PM PDT

Posted by: ToXSicK II
It took me a few tournements before I could 3shot every time. =/


EVERY time???

  • 06.19.2006 4:26 PM PDT
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95%.
On XBC it is a little more difficult to lead your shots effectivly for the TsK, but LAN is a beautiful thing.

[Edited on 6/19/2006]

  • 06.19.2006 4:27 PM PDT

Yes, LAN was a beautiful thing.

Although, 95% may be a little generous.

[Edited on 6/19/2006]

  • 06.19.2006 4:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: TheBigShow
Posted by: ToXSicK II
It took me a few tournements before I could 3shot every time. =/


EVERY time???


I was bad ass at CE(meaning good) and played bad ass people, and we still give each other props for 3 shot kills

[Edited on 6/19/2006]

  • 06.19.2006 4:29 PM PDT
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I'm not saying it was impossible to TsK if you were bad, but it sure was hard under pressure.

  • 06.19.2006 4:31 PM PDT
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Great thread.

I haven't much to add I'm afraid. I would like to say something though...

To all the people here discussing possible ways to improve latency and lag, particularly with those concerned with lag/latency for UK / European players, I want you to know something:

I love you. Yes, I really do. I am feeling real love.... the true kind. For you.

I'm in the UK and aside from cheating, probably more so, the latency issue is the number one reason you'll see a grown man cry.

If Bungie manage something, anything, to improve the gaming experience in this regard I have a message for them:

Bungie. If you manage to improve the latency issue for Halo 3 I hereby state that I shall serve you with unwavering passion and loyalty for the rest of my mortal days. I'm not sure how this would benefit anybody at Bungie but I mean it anyway. I'm very good at making coffee.... very damn good. Yeah.... you think about that!!!

  • 06.19.2006 4:56 PM PDT
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In Halo: CE I was able to get two-shot kills with the pistol 124% of the time. That means I'm smarter and know more about gameplay balance than all of you.

  • 06.19.2006 5:04 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sniper Fodder
In Halo: CE I was able to get two-shot kills with the pistol 124% of the time. That means I'm smarter and know more about gameplay balance than all of you.


Your, sir, are what is known as the average Bungie.net forum goer. You are despised and scorned by the rest of the H2 community. Your own kind hates you, everyone on the competitive scene hates you.

You should stop being a dick and learn to add some intelligent input.

  • 06.19.2006 5:11 PM PDT