Off Topic: The Flood
This topic has moved here: Subject: Where Bungie Failed, 343i Succeeded
  • Subject: Where Bungie Failed, 343i Succeeded
Subject: Where Bungie Failed, 343i Succeeded

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein

Ever since Halo 4's release, there hasn't been lack of reviews and impressions from Floodians on the game's campaign, multiplayer, and community tools. The Flood has hosted diverse opinions, from disgust to adoration.

I'm of the belief that 343i ultimately managed to accomplish what Bungie has failed to accomplish in any of their Halo games. I say this out of immense love for Bungie, even if it isn't construed that way by the public, because I want the developer that created the Universe I love to learn from the mistakes they made and grow stronger as artists and storytellers as a result.

Let me preface my case by saying that Halo, to me, is about the Universe the game takes place in: the characters, the conflicts, the arcs, and the technology. While I enjoy my own dose of frantic multiplayer and fun forging, this is not the reason I love this franchise. As a result, my general judgment of a Halo game's success is based on its campaign, from its story and character development to its gameplay and environments.

I believe 343i has delivered a better experience in this department than Bungie ever has. Bungie treated the Halo Universe as two separate domains: the extended media and the games. Through the decisions they made, they demonstrated that they are unwilling to incorporate elements of the extended media into their games, even if it meant enhancing the experience not only for its dedicated fans, but enhancing the storytelling and character arcs in general. A classic example of this divorce would be Halo: Reach, wherein Bungie "reformatted" (to say the least) the entire Battle of Reach to avoid the established elements set out by them through the author they worked with.

343i's biggest success with Halo 4's campaign was realizing the massive potential incorporating the elements of the extended media to the game itself, thereby giving the storytelling and character development a hefty enhancement. This is seen immediately from starting the campaign with the Prologue, where Dr. Halsey justifies the decisions she made regarding the Spartan-II program. It is seen in the cordial familiarity between John and Lasky. And finally, it is seen in the heart of Halo 4's campaign: the relationship between Cortana and John.

Bungie's strength as a developer was always environments and gameplay, never storytelling and character development. While this served them quite well initially, it ultimately forced them to concentrate more on one portion of all the Halo games post-CE: the multiplayer.

What 343i may lack in multiplayer management and user-interface, they more than compensate for in the storytelling and development department. These two facets of good writing will carry the Halo Universe much further because a) the management can be learned fairly quickly whereas storytelling is an art, and b) the core of Halo's appeal for many lies in its expansive and compelling Universe.

As a long time fan of Bungie, my only advice to them as they move on from Halo to other endeavors is to realize that the Universe you create cannot be fragmented and separate for it to be developed and vibrant; and that storytelling still matters for many of your fans. I am not a 343i apologist: I recognize the mistakes they have made and insist that they fix them, but I am also aware of this developer's obvious strengths and what my all-time favorite developer can learn from them. I wish the success of Halo as a fan, but I also wish the future success of Bungie for all they have done for not only the Halo Universe, but the gaming industry in general.



[Edited on 11.27.2012 3:38 PM PST]

  • 11.27.2012 3:38 PM PDT

My legit Killtrocity

Camping like a 'mouth breather'
If Fed Ex and UPS merged into one company, would it be called Fed Up?

I don't want to start another account for a digital number that has no true value in ten years.

343 didn't learn anything from Reach

  • 11.27.2012 3:38 PM PDT

TLDR

  • 11.27.2012 3:38 PM PDT

#rubberdingirapids

lolbungie
lol343
lolhalo
lolreach
lolhalo4
tldr

  • 11.27.2012 3:39 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein


Posted by: DarkVader9494
343 didn't learn anything from Reach

While I'd like to hear your opinions, I'd like it if you'd read the content of my post before responding.

  • 11.27.2012 3:39 PM PDT

Clear eyes, full hearts, can't lube.

Where Bungie succeeded, 343 failed miserably.

Replayability.

  • 11.27.2012 3:40 PM PDT

My legit Killtrocity

Camping like a 'mouth breather'
If Fed Ex and UPS merged into one company, would it be called Fed Up?

I don't want to start another account for a digital number that has no true value in ten years.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494
343 didn't learn anything from Reach

While I'd like to hear your opinions, I'd like it if you'd read the content of my post before responding.
I don't consider 343 succeeding with what they've added or kept onto this game. They'll never make a game even close to comparable among Halo CE - 3.

  • 11.27.2012 3:41 PM PDT

So for you idiots who think Bungie is the devil and 343i is god...Bungie did not really give a -blam!- about Reach. They had to make another Halo game and that was Reach.

  • 11.27.2012 3:42 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein


Posted by: DarkVader9494

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494
343 didn't learn anything from Reach

While I'd like to hear your opinions, I'd like it if you'd read the content of my post before responding.
I don't consider 343 succeeding with what they've added or kept onto this game. They'll never make a game even close to comparable among Halo CE - 3.

Honestly, it seems to me that is nostalgia speaking. Halo 2 had a great campaign because it massively expanded the scope of Halo's lore, not because it necessarily developed characters. Halo 4 executed many basic "Writing 101" elements far better than any of Bungie's previous games.

  • 11.27.2012 3:43 PM PDT

Yes, the Campaign kicked ass, I'm just not sure it made a ton of sense to fans of the game who aren't into the extended lore. Personally, it's my favorite Campaign in a Halo game. BUT you have to realize that the core of Halo is the multiplayer, that's what counts to the most players and that's what counts to the producers and developers, because the multiplayer players are what pay the bills long term. Granted, MP was handled by Certain Affinity, but if 343 doesn't pick up the ball that they dropped with Custom Games, Forge, and UI they're going to lose a fair amount of players.

  • 11.27.2012 3:44 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE.

The only part of the story I didn't like was how John was able to smash a nuke in his hands and be 'saved' by Cortana. I mean come on, how is that even possible? The ending felt anti-climactic, and that's where 343 fell on their face. To me at least.

  • 11.27.2012 3:45 PM PDT

My legit Killtrocity

Camping like a 'mouth breather'
If Fed Ex and UPS merged into one company, would it be called Fed Up?

I don't want to start another account for a digital number that has no true value in ten years.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494
343 didn't learn anything from Reach

While I'd like to hear your opinions, I'd like it if you'd read the content of my post before responding.
I don't consider 343 succeeding with what they've added or kept onto this game. They'll never make a game even close to comparable among Halo CE - 3.

Honestly, it seems to me that is nostalgia speaking. Halo 2 had a great campaign because it massively expanded the scope of Halo's lore, not because it necessarily developed characters. Halo 4 executed many basic "Writing 101" elements far better than any of Bungie's previous games.
It seems as if 90% of those who praise Halo 4 started playing the series a few years after Halo 3's release. They don't understand how great the originals were in their prime, and don't view the games from their time.

Why else do you think there's been a decline in population, fans, and hype among the games?

  • 11.27.2012 3:46 PM PDT


Posted by: A Blind Wolf
The only part of the story I didn't like was how John was able to smash a nuke in his hands and be 'saved' by Cortana. I mean come on, how is that even possible? The ending felt anti-climactic, and that's where 343 fell on their face. To me at least.
Hard light. That's the cop out for everything Halo now.

  • 11.27.2012 3:46 PM PDT

So all you have to do is put in 75 buttons to press and CGI and suddenly your game is so much better than the older games in quality?

  • 11.27.2012 3:47 PM PDT

Reporting for duty

Troll obvious troll 0 /10

  • 11.27.2012 3:47 PM PDT

Love your friends, Die laughing.


Posted by: bergXX09
So all you have to do is put in 75 buttons to press and CGI and suddenly your game is so much better than the older games in quality?


Yes, and add some characters like Palmer.

[Edited on 11.27.2012 3:49 PM PST]

  • 11.27.2012 3:49 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Destinypedia - The Wiki for Bungie's Destiny
Posted by: DEATHPIMP72
Anyone but Foman. He smells like cheese.

Where Bungie Failed, 343i Succeeded I assume you're referring to turning Master Chief from a strong silent type to an annoying chatterbox, and Cortana from a sassy fireball to an apologetic whiner?

  • 11.27.2012 3:51 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Exalted Legendary Member

Without The Flood, I wouldn't know what an opinion is.

Posted by: Fegelein
TLDR
Try this.

  • 11.27.2012 3:52 PM PDT


Posted by: x Foman123 x
Where Bungie Failed, 343i Succeeded I assume you're referring to turning Master Chief from a strong silent type to an annoying chatterbox, and Cortana from a sassy fireball to an apologetic whore?

Fix'd

But really, Chief's voice just didn't even sound right toward the end of the game. Rather than a deep voiced but mainly silent badass he sounded like an old hick with a raspy voice and he didn't just seem the way I like him.

  • 11.27.2012 3:53 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE. PRYING OPEN MY THIRD EYE.


Posted by: Chester Duncan

Posted by: A Blind Wolf
The only part of the story I didn't like was how John was able to smash a nuke in his hands and be 'saved' by Cortana. I mean come on, how is that even possible? The ending felt anti-climactic, and that's where 343 fell on their face. To me at least.
Hard light. That's the cop out for everything Halo now.


Unfortunately -_-

  • 11.27.2012 3:54 PM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins

I agree 100%

  • 11.27.2012 3:55 PM PDT
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  • Exalted Mythic Member

I came for Halo, but I heard the Tru7h, fought thru Carnage, and stayed for Bungie.

No one cares how much you know, until they know how much you care.--Teddy Roosevelt

Posted by: bergXX09
But really, Chief's voice just didn't even sound right toward the end of the game. Rather than a deep voiced but mainly silent badass he sounded like an old hick with a raspy voice and he didn't just seem the way I like him.
Steve Downes isn't immortal. His voice grew old along with the rest of him.

  • 11.27.2012 3:56 PM PDT

http://www.halo-forum.com

Posted by: DarkVader9494

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: DarkVader9494
343 didn't learn anything from Reach

While I'd like to hear your opinions, I'd like it if you'd read the content of my post before responding.
I don't consider 343 succeeding with what they've added or kept onto this game. They'll never make a game even close to comparable among Halo CE - 3.

Honestly, it seems to me that is nostalgia speaking. Halo 2 had a great campaign because it massively expanded the scope of Halo's lore, not because it necessarily developed characters. Halo 4 executed many basic "Writing 101" elements far better than any of Bungie's previous games.
It seems as if 90% of those who praise Halo 4 started playing the series a few years after Halo 3's release. They don't understand how great the originals were in their prime, and don't view the games from their time.

Why else do you think there's been a decline in population, fans, and hype among the games?

I really like Halo 4 and I have been playing Halo since CE. I'm afraid to say that you may have a severe case of fanboynostagiaitis. They were great games, that doesn't mean Halo 4 can't be too, and it is.

  • 11.27.2012 3:58 PM PDT

Hi.

Master Chief now has 30 lines instead of 10. He has turned into a chatterbox.

Wut

  • 11.27.2012 3:58 PM PDT


Posted by: CoRaMo
Posted by: bergXX09
But really, Chief's voice just didn't even sound right toward the end of the game. Rather than a deep voiced but mainly silent badass he sounded like an old hick with a raspy voice and he didn't just seem the way I like him.
Steve Downes isn't immortal. His voice grew old along with the rest of him.

His voice sounded fine at the start and the middle when he didn't talk as much though. Near the last missions they have him constantly yelling and talking and shouting and it makes him sound weird.

  • 11.27.2012 3:58 PM PDT