Off Topic: The Flood
This topic has moved here: Subject: Palestine should not be a state. At least not for a while.
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Subject: Palestine should not be a state. At least not for a while.

Door Kickers Inc.


Posted by: FloodPsychologis

Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Chester Duncan
You know what...I'm all for Palestine being a state. Israel needs to learn to -blam!- off.
When Palestinian terrorist organizations "-blam!- off", then we'll talk.


This guy here is pretty boss, studies Arabic and doesn't afraid of anything.
Shokran.

  • 12.03.2012 7:51 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein

The fundamental problem at this point with western perception of Palestine is that too many--including most American politicians--believe that Hamas is a representative of all the Palestinian people. Hamas is simply the only militant organization, and the crimes they commit are always paid by the civilians of the region. To assert that all Palestinians are evil and genocidal is a) generalizing an entire population based on a terrorist group and b) is completely disingenuous considering that, in every conflict between Israel and Palestine, Palestinians always suffer the brunt of the civilian casualties and Israel always insists on expanding its terroritories beyond the fair 1967 borders.

Your OP demonstrates ignorance to the complex issues at play here. This isn't a black and white deal and many factors must be taken into account.

  • 12.03.2012 7:51 PM PDT

Door Kickers Inc.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige
Hamas is simply the only militant organization,
Are you saying that Hamas is the only militant organization in Palestine, or?

  • 12.03.2012 7:52 PM PDT

_____ ____(˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜˜)_∏______
--------____.`=====.-.~:_______\___|==============[oo
|_|||___/___/_/~```|_|_|_|``(o)----------<)
Have Fai7h

My old Halo account: karsttheninja99

That haven't shown any reason to be a state

  • 12.03.2012 7:53 PM PDT

_____ ____(˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜˜)_∏______
--------____.`=====.-.~:_______\___|==============[oo
|_|||___/___/_/~```|_|_|_|``(o)----------<)
Have Fai7h

My old Halo account: karsttheninja99


Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Plasma Prestige
Hamas is simply the only militant organization,
Are you saying that Hamas is the only militant organization in Palestine, or?
of all time

  • 12.03.2012 7:53 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein


Posted by: BrenMan 94
Israel and Palestine will never find peace, because religion.

The second biggest misconception is right here. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is political only based religious pretenses.

  • 12.03.2012 7:54 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein


Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Plasma Prestige
Hamas is simply the only militant organization,
Are you saying that Hamas is the only militant organization in Palestine, or?

They are largely responsible for any of the conflicts' "fighting." Hamas is not only a terrorist organization, but it is a rather stupid organization since its actions harm the Palestinian people. They should know by this point that if they shoot 8 non-explosive rockets into Israel, then Israel will respond completely disproportionately with carpet bombs on civilian centers. What Hamas does is wrong, but what Israel does is not right either.

  • 12.03.2012 7:56 PM PDT

Door Kickers Inc.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Plasma Prestige
Hamas is simply the only militant organization,
Are you saying that Hamas is the only militant organization in Palestine, or?

They are largely responsible for any of the conflicts' "fighting." Hamas is not only a terrorist organization, but it is a rather stupid organization since its actions harm the Palestinian people. They should know by this point that if they shoot 8 non-explosive rockets into Israel, then Israel will respond completely disproportionately with carpet bombs on civilian centers. What Hamas does is wrong, but what Israel does is not right either.
Right. But you didn't answer my original question. I just want to know if you think Hamas is the only terrorist organization in Palestine.

  • 12.03.2012 7:58 PM PDT

Expressing my strong liberal views without shame. Favorite quotes below:

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
"One starts to live when he can live outside himself."

- Albert Einstein


Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: Sgt Mag1

Posted by: Plasma Prestige
Hamas is simply the only militant organization,
Are you saying that Hamas is the only militant organization in Palestine, or?

They are largely responsible for any of the conflicts' "fighting." Hamas is not only a terrorist organization, but it is a rather stupid organization since its actions harm the Palestinian people. They should know by this point that if they shoot 8 non-explosive rockets into Israel, then Israel will respond completely disproportionately with carpet bombs on civilian centers. What Hamas does is wrong, but what Israel does is not right either.
Right. But you didn't answer my original question. I just want to know if you think Hamas is the only terrorist organization in Palestine.

Only one period? Probably not. To my understanding, Hamas is the only major militant terrorist organization that coordinates attacks on Israel. I may be wrong, but what are you getting at?

  • 12.03.2012 8:10 PM PDT

Aside from Hamas, you've got its rival Fatah (spelling?). Although the latter is... less extreme, they both want to "drive the Jews into the ocean".

  • 12.03.2012 8:15 PM PDT
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The world pushes us without mercy and when some of us push back the world points and cries out "Evil".

  • 12.03.2012 8:17 PM PDT

Door Kickers Inc.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige
I may be wrong, but what are you getting at?
You seem to be criticizing people for not fully understanding the complexity of the situation. You seem to think that its Hamas v Israel in this fight.

Israel is surrounded by terrorist organizations, or groups like Fatah who aren't terrorist organizations but still maintain fighters. It's much, much more than just Hamas in the Gaza Strip. You also have Army of Islam, Jund Ansar Allah, Ansar al-Sunnah, Mujahideen Shura Council, Jahafil Al-Tawhid Wal-Jihad fi Filastin, Palestinian Islamic Jihad, Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, and the al-Asqa Martyr's Brigades who all attack Israel. The sad thing is, those are the just the groups on the top of my head, and there are many more militant groups within Gaza and the West Bank.

They all fire rockets into Israel, which you're right about Israel launching disproportional attacks upon Gaza, but it's just not Hamas doing the rocket launching. You're also right about Hamas being the biggest terrorist organization in Gaza, but the point is, they aren't the only ones doing the attacking of Israel. When there are that many organizations deadset on the destruction of Israel, I'd say Israel does, in fact, have the right to protect itself. But, no one is arguing that thus far.

They are arguing whether or not Palestine should be a state, and the answer is no. Palestine, which would be Gaza, West Bank and East Jerusalem, has too many representative parties. While the PLO is the official representatives of the Palestinian people, Hamas is in charge of Gaza and Fatah is in charge of the West Bank. It's sad to say that Fatah and Hamas fight each other, which hurts the process even more. Until the PLO can have complete control over the entire State of Palestine, or if Hamas (and other terrorist organizations) and Fatah agree to peace with Israel, Palestine will not be recognized by either the United States or Israel.

/my rant

  • 12.03.2012 8:22 PM PDT

I gaze upon the stars and see the majesty that is the universe.


EGO mos bulla astrum.


Posted by: Plasma Prestige
The fundamental problem at this point with western perception of Palestine is that too many--including most American politicians--believe that Hamas is a representative of all the Palestinian people. Hamas is simply the only militant organization, and the crimes they commit are always paid by the civilians of the region. To assert that all Palestinians are evil and genocidal is a) generalizing an entire population based on a terrorist group and b) is completely disingenuous considering that, in every conflict between Israel and Palestine, Palestinians always suffer the brunt of the civilian casualties and Israel always insists on expanding its terroritories beyond the fair 1967 borders.

Your OP demonstrates ignorance to the complex issues at play here. This isn't a black and white deal and many factors must be taken into account.
I merely implied civilians which unfortunately is not at all what I meant to say. Obviously the Palestinians are not a terrible people but their statehood would mean little. They would begin a ruined nation as bad as Afghanistan in their intentions and also having a nice next door bully to deal with everyday.

  • 12.03.2012 9:14 PM PDT

"Thoughts are the shadows of feelings; always darker, emptier, and simpler."

Posted by: Plasma Prestige

Posted by: BrenMan 94
Israel and Palestine will never find peace, because religion.

The second biggest misconception is right here. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is political only based religious pretenses.

>Israelis believe they have a right to the land because it was given to them by Abraham.

>Palestinians believe they have a right to the land because it was conquered in the name of Islam, and therefore belongs to the children of Mohammed.

  • 12.03.2012 9:18 PM PDT

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