- Doc Bacon
- |
- Senior Mythic Member
Watch this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfTAPN_3q4Q
Posted by: ROBERTO jh
@Doc Bacon
1) To say this, first ask yourself another question: was the death of his parents really worthy going bat--blam!- (heh) crazy and becoming a criminal punching human animal? To logicalloy question this youmust question the validity of the entire character.
Bear in mind that this is Batman we're talking about. He created this personae of the Batman because he was so devestated by the deaths of his parents he felt he needed to rid the city of crime to protect the innocent and those he loved. With the death of Rachel, Bruce Wane failed in his duty to protect his loved ones from crime. He also realized that in order to truly save his loved ones, he'd need to become a killer himself.
He snapped from the double wammy. The first time, his parents, was a huge crack in the wall, but he patched it up with a black cape and some batarangs. Rachel's death brought the whole thing down all over again. He basically had to relive his parents' deaths.
Wayne no longer had anyone left in the world he loved like family except for Alfred. Which brings me to number 2:
2) Alfred left to prove a point that if Wayne continued down the path he was going, he'd lose everything, and not just his own life, but everyone he still cares for. Alfred even says that he will have no part in the slow death of his effective god-son. Imagine the preassure of watching your son grow up to become some controlled-insanity Bat-freak who punches people every night.
The point is not to make a Batman movie. It is to make a character study of Batman/Wayne.
3) Bane being a part of the League was symbolic of how Bruce Wayne was being forced to face his past and overcome it, or fall to it and remain a broken shell of what he was (symbolised when Bane breaks his back and throws him, effectively, down the well that he never truly left). He supported Talia the same way that Alfred supports Bruce, like an uncle or surrogate father in lieu of their real parents.
4) Then you missed the symbolism entirely.
5) Read above, and again "The point is not to make a Batman movie. It is to make a character study of Batman/Wayne."
6) He was to become the new Dark Knight because he cannot die. Robin becoming the Dark Knight proves that Wayne's devotion to himself as an ideal (the entire point of the trilogy) was successful because the ideal--the Caped Crusader--can never die. Batman can die because he is still a man, but not the Dark Knight.
Hence, the Dark Knight Rises.
7) Irrelevant.
8) Never read it so I wouldn't know. But again "The point is not to make a Batman movie. It is to make a character study of Batman/Wayne."
9) Read number 6. This was Blake's initiation, so to speak, proving that he was willing to go above and beyond just another Cop to take a higher responsibility.
10) A very vague opinion, since you give no reason.
11) Your opinion is stupid, but I'm not going to tell you why. It's stupid because I said so.
12) Bruce Wayne survived because of the Batwing's autopilot being fixed. They explain this in the movie. Selina was there because she followed Wayne's example to have a normal life.
13) Selina, again, was there because she followed Wayne's example. I see it as being less to do with them being in love, and more to do with them being friends with a similar backstory.
14) Robin was also Nightwing, which is what he turned into.
15) Doesn't matter. The point is the ideal of the Dark Knight lives on. The skills to be the Dark Kight come later, but the point is another was willing to take up the Mantle.
16) I have no opinion on the fight scenes. What matters is, Batman lost, and then won later.
17) Batman killed the other guy in the truck in Dark Knight after he flipped it over too, and in the comics, he killed people plenty of times if it suited his needs. It was rare, but it happened. For such a comic purist as you so obviously are, I'd have thought you knew ths.
1. There is a significant difference between watching your parents gunned down in front of you in a fearful fit of pointless crime, and knowing your childhood crush died in some explosion.
2. Alfred left Bruce because he didn't agree with his being batman, even though in the first two films he completely supports him. Alfred reasoning that his leaving will save Bruce is obviously false, he knows this.
Your excuse that this film is a study of Bruce Wayne is not true either. For one, we already saw that in Batman Begins, which was the story of Bruce Wayne becoming Batman, growing up and learning discipline to realize his goals. Secondly, Bruce is only in the movie for about fifty percent of it, the entire prison sequence leaves him out of the film for a huge chunk of it. The film itself is about Gotham and how it changes, which is why the working title was "Gotham".
3.Bruce needing to face his past over the league of shadows is pointless, since there was no trauma there, no regrets. It's like saying a Major League Baseball player is haunted because he helped win the world series. There was nothing for him to overcome.
4. The attempted symbolism of the "Dark Knight Rising" as he reclaimed the essence of Batman by making his way out of that pit, proving to everyone and himself that he had what it takes to create change and rise above the poorly established ghosts of his past as Batman. I get it, it was just done terribly. Just because something has symbolism does not make it good.
5. The movie was not to study Batman/Wayne, this was already done. The movie was to watch how an environment (Gotham) robbed of its instituted laws and orders would cause the society to devolve. Like releasing a bunch of criminals in to the streets and watching them go rampant is supposed to be a true showing of human nature. This is also stupid, because no -blam!- you let out convicted murderers without any constraints they will tear society apart. The second purpose of the movie was to make a lot of money by providing fan service to the audience. The third movie was never intended originally, it wasn't until after Dark Knight they decided to make it.
6. The point of the trilogy was not to prove that Batman can never die. The Nolan movies were never supposed to be a trilogy in the first place, so that was obviously not the intended message to span all three. And Batman is dead to the world at the end of the movie, so he kind of does die.
7. It is irrelevant, I just didn't like it. I stated how it was not a real flaw of the film.
8. "The point is not to make a character study, it is to make a batman film". What was the point of the first two then? The Dark Knight trilogy at its core is another representation of a comic book superhero, and should therefore pay mind to its creation. The first two films did this spectacularly, the third did not.
9. Blake didn't need an initiation, he didn't need to be in the movie period. If batman were to retire his life work would live on through the prosperity of Gotham. By making Blake Batman you are just wasting time. There is no need for Batman anymore, Gotham is saved, the end.
10. yeah I just didn't like this.
11. Your rebuttle is stupid
12. Wayne's autopilot may be fixed, but how he cleared a three mile nuclear explosion in five seconds is not explained, nor how he manages to swim back to shore wearing incredibly heavy Batman gear.
13. Regardless if they are lovers or friends, it doesn't explain why Selina ran off with Wayne. She is a thief, and addicted to the rush of it. Note how she and her young friend she watches over take so much enjoyment out of the life they lead. She is in trouble because she got in over her head playing against the law. It's how she operates, it is how Catwoman has been since her creation.
14. Robin can't be nightwing in this universe, since he becomes it after being trained and influenced by Batman and then going off on his own. For Blake to find the cave, then name himself "Nightwing" would make no sense. There is no reason for a NightWing to exist. Plus the fact Levitt's character was named Robin means he would not necessarily become Nightwing since it was Dick Grayson who becomes nightwing. What if Levitt was meant to be more like Tim Drake who becomes Red Robin? Or Jason Todd? There is no relation between Blake or any established Robins, the fact they through in that last scene where they reveal his name was simple fan service. If anything he would just be Batman again.
15. Cool, taking up the mantle, its symbolic. Still practically useless. If in the prison Bruce Wayne sprouted wings from his back and flew out, it would symbolize his rising just the same. Would you accept that? No, you wouldn't, because despite the symbolism, it is a stupid concept. Same with the entire prison scene in the film, same with Blake taking the mantle.
16. Sure, the outcome is important, but the fact that Bruce fights like a high school kid in his first brawl completely demolishes a huge part of his character built in the first films, which is his devotion to studying martial arts, proving his resolve and devotion, and his resourcefullnes with his gadgets and outside the box techniques in hostile situations, showing intelligence. In this movie it was like he forgot everything that made him batman.
17. I am not a comic purist, and Batman stopped killing people since like, the 60s. The Batman in this film is based off of the post Year One and Dark Knight Returns Batman. The way Batman used to be is irrelevant since it is not the same Batman... If the movie was based off of those comics well, it would be really, really bad. Like super worse.
I didn't miss the point of the movie, I loved the first two which deviated from the comics, so me thinking about the comics was not the problem. The bad movie was the problem. It was a disgrace to the trilogy, not the comics.