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  • Subject: Military grade weapons should be prohibited.
Subject: Military grade weapons should be prohibited.

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I thought military grade weapons were prohibited.

But if you mean the Bushmaster that the guy was using, I happen to agree. No sportsman or hunter needs to put 30 rounds downrange in less than a minute.

  • 12.17.2012 10:32 AM PDT

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Posted by: Happy Flowers
Posted by: prometheus25

Posted by: Happy Flowers
The last thing we want is for criminals to start thinking that their victims could be just as dangerous as the police.


Why would that be the last thing we'd want? Why would I want to be seen as vulnerable to someone looking to hurt somebody?


They're just looking to make a quick buck. If they don't feel pressured to shoot you dead right off the bat then society is doing it's job.


So I am supposed to surrender my possessions because someone wants to make a quick buck. He doesn't want to murder me, and that is a "win" to you?

What if they aren't looking to take my money? What if I return from home and my girlfriend is being raped? You list burglary and theft as your leading example, but it is the lowest of situations in which I would want to have my firearm with me. You can't tell me "he doesn't want to kill you, so we're doing things right" in these situations.

In Somalia sometimes armed victims of a crime survive and sometimes they don't, but I guarantee you that they never ever get the first shot off.

We aren't in Somalia. Somalia is not on par economically or socially with the United States, so it is an inappropriate analogue.



I'm not going to sit here and recite the second amendment as my reason for keeping guns. I am an avid firearm enthusiast and owner, and even I hate when people do that, as I think it is antiquated, outdated and taken out of context. I DO think firearm reform is necessary, I DON'T think keeping them out of the hands of law abiding citizens is the answer.

  • 12.17.2012 10:45 AM PDT
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For all questions with answers unknown to you, the proper procedure is to assume the answer is peanut butter.

While that may be true, I'm just going to pretend otherwise.

The "AR" in AR-15 means Armalite Rifle. AR-15s, and similar rifles, are also very popular for hunting because of their accuracy and customizability. They can be tailored to fit most people comfortable quite easily.

Fully-automatics and short-barreled rifles already require a tax stamp that has to be processed by the BATFE, which can take up to a year.

Civilian AR-15s, and most other "scary black rifles," are internally very different from the military versions. They lack the sear and disconnector, and the required milling out of the receiver, that is necessary for fully-automatic fire.

The rounds fired by most of these rifles are, for the most part, ballistically unimpressive, and really only good for small game like coyotes. Popular hunting cartridges (.30-06, 7mm-08, .270, etc.) all have double to triple the range, and exponentially more stopping power.

The media is just brainwashing you and making you paranoid of certain types of firearms just because their aesthetics resemble military rifles. Their actual construction is quite different.

  • 12.17.2012 10:51 AM PDT

Notches:
/// //// // ///


Posted by: prometheus25

Posted by: Happy Flowers
Posted by: prometheus25

Posted by: Happy Flowers
The last thing we want is for criminals to start thinking that their victims could be just as dangerous as the police.


Why would that be the last thing we'd want? Why would I want to be seen as vulnerable to someone looking to hurt somebody?


They're just looking to make a quick buck. If they don't feel pressured to shoot you dead right off the bat then society is doing it's job.


So I am supposed to surrender my possessions because someone wants to make a quick buck. He doesn't want to murder me, and that is a "win" to you?

What if they aren't looking to take my money? What if I return from home and my girlfriend is being raped? You list burglary and theft as your leading example, but it is the lowest of situations in which I would want to have my firearm with me. You can't tell me "he doesn't want to kill you, so we're doing things right" in these situations.

In Somalia sometimes armed victims of a crime survive and sometimes they don't, but I guarantee you that they never ever get the first shot off.

We aren't in Somalia. Somalia is not on par economically or socially with the United States, so it is an inappropriate analogue.



I'm not going to sit here and recite the second amendment as my reason for keeping guns. I am an avid firearm enthusiast and owner, and even I hate when people do that, as I think it is antiquated, outdated and taken out of context. I DO think firearm reform is necessary, I DON'T think keeping them out of the hands of law abiding citizens is the answer.

Whelp you sure are thick. We don't need to legislate anything, we just need to change America's culture of hollow bravado. Shoot as many rapists as you like, eventually, if you're effective they'll just bring guns themselves and maybe helmets too. Maybe in a few generations your children will have the freedom to have RPGs so they can take down rapey kevlar turtle-men.

Whether or not weapons protect people from violence is irrelevant to the second amendment though. You think you deserve guns that's fine, you think you deserve them because you're making society safer then pack your tiny dick up and move to Somalia.

  • 12.17.2012 11:04 AM PDT

There was a Shootingnat the University of Texas years ago. The guy sat in a bell tower and killed 20 or so people I think. I believe he just used a hunting rifle. I could be wrong.

  • 12.17.2012 11:05 AM PDT

I'm guessing someone already corrected OP, but I didn't see it in the first two pages so I'll say it just in case.

AR in AR-15 does NOT stand for assault rifle.

nvm, I see Mayhem already has it covered.

[Edited on 12.17.2012 11:19 AM PST]

  • 12.17.2012 11:17 AM PDT

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Posted by: spartain ken 15

Posted by: Telec
20 children were shot at close range with an assault rifle, and people are arguing that measures that could help prevent another 20 children being shot at close range with an assault rifle shouldn't be pursued.


The gun is not the problem, it is the person holding it that was the problem.

It is nearly impossible to prevent these disasters from happening and if someone wanted to hurt people, they will do it regardless if they have a gun or not. They will find other weapons to use.

Also the children were NOT shot with assault rifles.

There were multiple bullet wounds in them, they were shot by assault rifles.

  • 12.17.2012 11:29 AM PDT

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Posted by: Acres 057
I'll be happy to give up my right to assault rifles when the military and police give up their assault rifles.


You're not military or police, they have specific rights to those weapons, normal civilians should not.

  • 12.17.2012 11:32 AM PDT
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ITT:

Anyone support for ban on weapons for civilian is effectively interpreted as idiot and makes their opinion invalid because they don't know what they are talking about.

FACT: People kill people. Not guns.

Get that to your thick skull, kids. And also, do more research- removing guns =/= lowering crime rate.

[Edited on 12.17.2012 11:36 AM PST]

  • 12.17.2012 11:33 AM PDT

It's not the guns. Anyone with access to the Internet and about $1000 cash could walk into a home depot and be able to get materials for a bomb that could blow up a building.

  • 12.17.2012 11:37 AM PDT

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Posted by: spartain ken 15

Posted by: Big Black Bear
Posted by: spartain ken 15
Does it matter how many people they hurt or kill?
Actually... Yes. Yes, it does.


No, my point was anyone getting hurt is terrible, it doesn't matter how many people are hurt or killed.

People argue a gun can kill more people than a knife attack, so what, people are still getting hurt.

The point is, the weapon is not the one that committed the crime, the person who used it to hurt people did.

Get off the fact that a person did it, WE KNOW. Stop posting the same god damn thing just in a different context everytime you post.

  • 12.17.2012 11:37 AM PDT

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Posted by: raganok99
ITT:

Anyone support for ban on weapons for civilian is effectively interpreted as idiot and makes their opinion invalid because they don't know what they are talking about.

FACT: People kill people. Not guns.

Get that to your thick skull, kids. And also, do more research- removing guns =/= lowering crime rate.

Guns help people kill people.
And I now officially think you're an idiot. And since posting "FACT" after everything you have an OPINION on I'm just gonna say you're a full out idiot.

"FACT"

  • 12.17.2012 11:38 AM PDT
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And add one more thing- we already banned assault rifle (military grade one) in 1990s.

So, maybe you should do little more research before making this thread, hmm?

  • 12.17.2012 11:39 AM PDT

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Posted by: uppercaset
It's not the guns. Anyone with access to the Internet and about $1000 cash could walk into a home depot and be able to get materials for a bomb that could blow up a building.


Well the guns aren't helping buddy. What was it? 12,000 gun deaths in the US in 2011??

  • 12.17.2012 11:40 AM PDT

心の中に弱い風が吹いています。

B-but...I like my AR-15 for recreational shooting at the range. Same reason I'll probably buy a sidearm at some point. Although that's also so I can get my CCW License.

  • 12.17.2012 11:40 AM PDT
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Posted by: Double A

Guns help people kill people.


Guns are a tool. Knifes, etc are also tool. It doesn't change the fact that people kill people.

And I now officially think you're an idiot. And since posting "FACT" after everything you have an OPINION on I'm just gonna say you're a full out idiot.

Uh what? It wasn't opinion. Are you that stupid? Did you not pay attention of what I said? "people kill people" is fact because it is true, derp.

So, how I am being idiot?

  • 12.17.2012 11:41 AM PDT

Posted by: raganok99
Posted by: Double A
Guns help people kill people.


Guns are a tool. Knifes, etc are also tool. It doesn't change the fact that people kill people.

And I now officially think you're an idiot. And since posting "FACT" after everything you have an OPINION on I'm just gonna say you're a full out idiot.

Uh what? It wasn't opinion. Are you that stupid? Did you not pay attention of what I said? "people kill people" is fact because it is true, derp.

So, how I am being idiot?
Because you're doing nothing more than reciting some generic, common sense statement ("People kill people") and acting like it invalidates every other point made in this (otherwise) intelligent discussion.

  • 12.17.2012 11:49 AM PDT

Well...

Theyre called "Assault" rifles and "Battle" rifles for a reason.

  • 12.17.2012 11:51 AM PDT


Posted by: flamedude
Posted by: uppercaset
It's not the guns. Anyone with access to the Internet and about $1000 cash could walk into a home depot and be able to get materials for a bomb that could blow up a building.


Well the guns aren't helping buddy. What was it? 12,000 gun deaths in the US in 2011??


I would call 12,000 a good number... If we just want to go by death toll we should ban cars. Also, there are probably some accidental and non murder deaths in that gun death number.

  • 12.17.2012 11:51 AM PDT

Old school Bungie, born and raised,
In the Septagon is where I spend most of my days.
Relaxin', maxin', posting all cool,
Talking about Halo, life and some school.
Got in one little argument, and the mods got scared,
they said "You're gonna get banned and your member title'll be bare!"


Posted by: Happy Flowers

Posted by: prometheus25

Posted by: Happy Flowers
Posted by: prometheus25

Posted by: Happy Flowers
The last thing we want is for criminals to start thinking that their victims could be just as dangerous as the police.


Why would that be the last thing we'd want? Why would I want to be seen as vulnerable to someone looking to hurt somebody?


They're just looking to make a quick buck. If they don't feel pressured to shoot you dead right off the bat then society is doing it's job.


So I am supposed to surrender my possessions because someone wants to make a quick buck. He doesn't want to murder me, and that is a "win" to you?

What if they aren't looking to take my money? What if I return from home and my girlfriend is being raped? You list burglary and theft as your leading example, but it is the lowest of situations in which I would want to have my firearm with me. You can't tell me "he doesn't want to kill you, so we're doing things right" in these situations.

In Somalia sometimes armed victims of a crime survive and sometimes they don't, but I guarantee you that they never ever get the first shot off.

We aren't in Somalia. Somalia is not on par economically or socially with the United States, so it is an inappropriate analogue.



I'm not going to sit here and recite the second amendment as my reason for keeping guns. I am an avid firearm enthusiast and owner, and even I hate when people do that, as I think it is antiquated, outdated and taken out of context. I DO think firearm reform is necessary, I DON'T think keeping them out of the hands of law abiding citizens is the answer.

Whelp you sure are thick. We don't need to legislate anything, we just need to change America's culture of hollow bravado. Shoot as many rapists as you like, eventually, if you're effective they'll just bring guns themselves and maybe helmets too. Maybe in a few generations your children will have the freedom to have RPGs so they can take down rapey kevlar turtle-men.

Whether or not weapons protect people from violence is irrelevant to the second amendment though. You think you deserve guns that's fine, you think you deserve them because you're making society safer then pack your tiny dick up and move to Somalia.


Please do not degrade this conversation to insults and petty "gtfo" tactics. Not only is it ineffective and rude, but -blam!-ly explicit remarks are against the ToS you agreed to upon you account creation.

I do not wish to be a vigilante as you seem to see. All I want is my fair ability to protect myself from those who wish to violate the social contract that others such as myself follow.

The taking away and banning of firearms will be just as effective of making gun crimes a thing of the past as efforts to remove cocain, methamphetamine, and other drugs off the street are. What WOULD work is getting the help that mentally distressed individuals need when they need it.

If you would like to continue this discussion maturely, I look forward to your post. If you are just going to reference my genitalia and the relocation to various geo-political regions, then I see this as finished.

  • 12.17.2012 11:55 AM PDT

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Posted by: uppercaset

Posted by: flamedude
Posted by: uppercaset
It's not the guns. Anyone with access to the Internet and about $1000 cash could walk into a home depot and be able to get materials for a bomb that could blow up a building.


Well the guns aren't helping buddy. What was it? 12,000 gun deaths in the US in 2011??


I would call 12,000 a good number... If we just want to go by death toll we should ban cars. Also, there are probably some accidental and non murder deaths in that gun death number.

Seriously? 12000 people is not a good number.
The next country with the most shooting has under 200.

  • 12.17.2012 11:58 AM PDT

Old school Bungie, born and raised,
In the Septagon is where I spend most of my days.
Relaxin', maxin', posting all cool,
Talking about Halo, life and some school.
Got in one little argument, and the mods got scared,
they said "You're gonna get banned and your member title'll be bare!"


Posted by: flamedude
Posted by: uppercaset
It's not the guns. Anyone with access to the Internet and about $1000 cash could walk into a home depot and be able to get materials for a bomb that could blow up a building.


Well the guns aren't helping buddy. What was it? 12,000 gun deaths in the US in 2011??


8.5k in 2011 across the US. I'm not saying that there isn't a problem, but removing guns isn't a solution. Anyone willing to commit murder is willing to illegally possess a firearm. In fact, people do. Every day.

Is it worth mentioning that twice as many people are killed every year by alcohol-related car accidents? Of course it's usually one or a few at a time, so that's tolerable, right?

  • 12.17.2012 12:02 PM PDT

Posted by: prometheus25
Is it worth mentioning that twice as many people are killed every year by alcohol-related car accidents? Of course it's usually one or a few at a time, so that's tolerable, right?
And that's also perfectly legal, right?

  • 12.17.2012 12:04 PM PDT

Breaking barriers.

Well it is a good thinkg you think military grade weapons should be prohibited, and they are. This is why we have civilian models.

Notice that civilian model ARs are semi-auto while the military equiv has burst/full auto depending on the weapon. You essentially have nothing to worry about.

  • 12.17.2012 12:05 PM PDT