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  • Subject: How could we introduce spartans without confusing ppl?
Subject: How could we introduce spartans without confusing ppl?
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Posted by: Zer0 0verRide
They're going to have to breifly explain the events of the first two games at the begining of H3 anyways for the people who have never played them previously


Halo 2 didn't. Why should 3?

  • 07.07.2006 3:41 AM PDT
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if we just leave fred, kelly, linda, bob, and romanski the russian spartan then we wont have to worry lol

just the thought of a spartan in pink sniping ppl will leave about 90% of the ppl who buy this game saying " Wtf???"

  • 07.07.2006 5:27 AM PDT
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All of the Spartans have the exact same green armor.

As for how they end the game, how about this?:

Hundreds of Marines, Grunts, Hunters, and Elites are standing up on a hill (overlooking the Ark) with the Arbiter and the five Spartans at the front. They are surrounded by thousands of Brutes that just destroyed another major city nearby (Nairobi or Voi?) A random Marine shouts:

"Let's go get the bastards!"

They all run screaming down the hill as the five Spartans lead the way.

  • 07.07.2006 6:11 AM PDT
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Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Posted by: jonny 888
They could have a seperate video section in the game, which could use cutscenes to briefly tell the story of the Spartans from creation to where they are now.

*Tears coming out eyes*
Your are genius!!I hope to god bungie sees this thread and sees the idea. I mean why not have a seperate section for video intorducing the spartans? There is no problem with that at all plus saves a lot of time including it in the campgain. We get what we both want.


So effectively, what you are saying is that when you go see a major kick-buttocks motion picture you'd like to spend ten minutes watching a documentary showing why things are the way they are before the movie starts?

What makes Halo strong, and infinitely superior to most other first person shooters is the cinematic sense that is conveyed. In order to include new Spartans existing cinematic techniques would be required.

First, you have to somehow show the audience that they've effectively been lied to and that the Master Chief isn't the last Spartan like the retail box claims. That's a toughie. People don't deal with betrayal well.

I'd imagine a short cut-scene to make the audience say, "What the hell?" Afterwards, fleeting glimpses throughout the game, references, that make you think about the initial cut scene from time to time. Anything to cushion the jarring shock when the Spartans do appear anywhere between half way through the game and the ending.

The same could be said of Ackerson's project. You just can't spring that out of nowhere without creating the foundation otherwise it becomes deus ex machina. It ceases to be an evolution of story and more of "we just put it in because it was damn cool". The audience needs to be prepped for such things.

We'd also have to limit the Spartans appearances. It's bad enough that you fight alongside invincible Miranda Keyes and invincible Johnson. Now you'll have an invincible squad of Spartans fighting alongside you. (As major characters you can't kill any of them except where it's scripted) Tactically speaking, the smart thing to do is hide in a corner and let the invincible Spartans finish the fight. Hence, limited appearances.

  • 07.07.2006 7:40 AM PDT
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Posted by: My Liege
Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Posted by: jonny 888
They could have a seperate video section in the game, which could use cutscenes to briefly tell the story of the Spartans from creation to where they are now.

*Tears coming out eyes*
Your are genius!!I hope to god bungie sees this thread and sees the idea. I mean why not have a seperate section for video intorducing the spartans? There is no problem with that at all plus saves a lot of time including it in the campgain. We get what we both want.


So effectively, what you are saying is that when you go see a major kick-buttocks motion picture you'd like to spend ten minutes watching a documentary showing why things are the way they are before the movie starts?

What makes Halo strong, and infinitely superior to most other first person shooters is the cinematic sense that is conveyed. In order to include new Spartans existing cinematic techniques would be required.

First, you have to somehow show the audience that they've effectively been lied to and that the Master Chief isn't the last Spartan like the retail box claims. That's a toughie. People don't deal with betrayal well.

I'd imagine a short cut-scene to make the audience say, "What the hell?" Afterwards, fleeting glimpses throughout the game, references, that make you think about the initial cut scene from time to time. Anything to cushion the jarring shock when the Spartans do appear anywhere between half way through the game and the ending.

The same could be said of Ackerson's project. You just can't spring that out of nowhere without creating the foundation otherwise it becomes deus ex machina. It ceases to be an evolution of story and more of "we just put it in because it was damn cool". The audience needs to be prepped for such things.

We'd also have to limit the Spartans appearances. It's bad enough that you fight alongside invincible Miranda Keyes and invincible Johnson. Now you'll have an invincible squad of Spartans fighting alongside you. (As major characters you can't kill any of them except where it's scripted) Tactically speaking, the smart thing to do is hide in a corner and let the invincible Spartans finish the fight. Hence, limited appearances.


wow. way to argue

you guys should listen to my leige, he makes a good point ( one ive been trying to make but couldnt put across effectively )

the audience would definitly feel betrayed ( LoL)

"Wtf, the back of the video game box lied to me !!!"

this is what ive been getting at all along: more spartans would cluttter the strory and take away the ' intimacy ' of the original masster chief

  • 07.07.2006 7:48 AM PDT
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Posted by: My Liege
Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Posted by: jonny 888
They could have a seperate video section in the game, which could use cutscenes to briefly tell the story of the Spartans from creation to where they are now.

*Tears coming out eyes*
Your are genius!!I hope to god bungie sees this thread and sees the idea. I mean why not have a seperate section for video intorducing the spartans? There is no problem with that at all plus saves a lot of time including it in the campgain. We get what we both want.


So effectively, what you are saying is that when you go see a major kick-buttocks motion picture you'd like to spend ten minutes watching a documentary showing why things are the way they are before the movie starts?

What makes Halo strong, and infinitely superior to most other first person shooters is the cinematic sense that is conveyed. In order to include new Spartans existing cinematic techniques would be required.

First, you have to somehow show the audience that they've effectively been lied to and that the Master Chief isn't the last Spartan like the retail box claims. That's a toughie. People don't deal with betrayal well.

I'd imagine a short cut-scene to make the audience say, "What the hell?" Afterwards, fleeting glimpses throughout the game, references, that make you think about the initial cut scene from time to time. Anything to cushion the jarring shock when the Spartans do appear anywhere between half way through the game and the ending.

The same could be said of Ackerson's project. You just can't spring that out of nowhere without creating the foundation otherwise it becomes deus ex machina. It ceases to be an evolution of story and more of "we just put it in because it was damn cool". The audience needs to be prepped for such things.

We'd also have to limit the Spartans appearances. It's bad enough that you fight alongside invincible Miranda Keyes and invincible Johnson. Now you'll have an invincible squad of Spartans fighting alongside you. (As major characters you can't kill any of them except where it's scripted) Tactically speaking, the smart thing to do is hide in a corner and let the invincible Spartans finish the fight. Hence, limited appearances.


Ok, I respect your opinion and liked your post, let me say that first and foremost. But I'm sorry, the whole "the back of the box says he's the last one ZOMFG!!!11!" argument really doesn't hold any water, haha. Like you said, it is a cinematic game, and in those kinds of games, it's ok to surprise people.

Say for instance, the back of the Two Towers, the second Lord of the Rings movie, starts off by saying "After Gandalf's death..." Gandalf apparently died in the first movie, but in the second, he comes back. Did the audience feel betrayed? I doubt it. It's a device that writers at times will use.

While I totally agree with some of the other stuff you were saying, the whole "but the back of the box says he's the last!!" Heck, they also thought that the Halo was a weapon at the time. Since at the beginning of the game they thought it was a weapon for the Covenant, and later on you found out its not, did you feel like the game did you a disservice by lying to you at the beginning?

Personally, I'd rather give people more credit. I think a simple cut scene with Spartans can fill them in with all they need to know. As for limited appearances, I think that's totally right. I really strongly feel that if Spartans are in the game, and they have any major role, it should only be in a Co-Op campaign that has its own missions and supports what MC is doing from a different location.


  • 07.07.2006 8:00 AM PDT
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the only concern i have is that more spartans will clutter the story

sure the arby came in ( and a lot of ppl hate him for some reason ) but that was cuz halo 2 was ready to start a fresh story

halo 3 is gonna pick up right where 2 left off. if there were to be more spartans, they should have hinted it at least

theres way too much going on to start sticking in characters that bungie doesnt have time to mold. its just gonna be a mess

( in my opinion of course.........flame suit ON !!)

  • 07.07.2006 8:09 AM PDT
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oh crap.........how will i SURVIVE ???

-shields nuts -

  • 07.07.2006 8:18 AM PDT

Damn snipers!!!

I have now read the books...

your stupid makes my brain sad

there will not be any more spartans....when its annouced, i want all of you to come back in here and take your medicine that day. its a dumb fanboy wet dream. ive said it many times...the books are like star wars expanded universe, authorized, but not part of the original storyline, (ive read niether..what of it). altho some tidbits might get referenced, nothing so huge as a squad of spartans stealing the MCs thunder......its like bungie saying our ideas arent as good as the books so we will be using them as our new storyline....the games are about MC.......period

  • 07.07.2006 8:51 AM PDT
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Allrite heres how you do it without confusing them. Heres the opening cutscene...

Cheif wakes up in the middle of a jungle. He sees a labrador dog running away from him. He gets up and runs after it and emerges on a beach. The forrunner ship has crashed and there is bodys scattered everywhere. For some reason mc is a doctor in halo 3 so he runs to help woulded people. He needs to get a brute away from the ship for some reason. The brute is fat and its name is Herley. "help" mc calls over to the prophet of truth who i lying on the ground. Truth slowley gets up. Its the first time hes walked in 20 years. Thats why hes in that chair thingy. With truths help mc jumps away from the ship with hurley just as one of the..... AIR CONDITINORS explodes for no apparant reason. Then after MC saves everyone the screen goes black. Then 1 eary low note plays as the words HALO 3 start coming forward.

5 levels later...
MC finds the other survivers from the other end of the ship. They are all remaining spartans.

Thats how you explain it without confusing people..... Wait..... GOD NO!!! THATS EVEN MORE -blam!- CONFUSING!!! no... just no.

  • 07.07.2006 8:55 AM PDT
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Nice ideas people. I say we have the spartans but either introduce them in the campgain in a 10 min cutscence or just have them in the extra features of the game and have a clip introducing them.
Plus having more spartans would really make the story inovative rather than confusing and give a good plot twist which no one would expect. Moreover, Bungie are masters at story telling and could easily introduce more spartans and we won't have to play as them. They can do there own missions while the MC does his own and then meet up a the end. So the MC will still have his thunder and we just get more spartans.

  • 07.07.2006 9:08 AM PDT

Damn snipers!!!

I have now read the books...

your stupid makes my brain sad

Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Nice ideas people. I say we have the spartans but either introduce them in the campgain in a 10 min cutscence or just have them in the extra features of the game and have a clip introducing them.
Plus having more spartans would really make the story inovative rather than confusing and give a good plot twist which no one would expect. Moreover, Bungie are masters at story telling and could easily introduce more spartans and we won't have to play as them. They can do there own missions while the MC does his own and then meet up a the end. So the MC will still have his thunder and we just get more spartans.


ok ya they could prob do it and do it well......i just dont see the point

  • 07.07.2006 9:11 AM PDT
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Posted by: ceebee r
Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Nice ideas people. I say we have the spartans but either introduce them in the campgain in a 10 min cutscence or just have them in the extra features of the game and have a clip introducing them.
Plus having more spartans would really make the story inovative rather than confusing and give a good plot twist which no one would expect. Moreover, Bungie are masters at story telling and could easily introduce more spartans and we won't have to play as them. They can do there own missions while the MC does his own and then meet up a the end. So the MC will still have his thunder and we just get more spartans.


ok ya they could prob do it and do it well......i just dont see the point

Yo I see what you meant. What I wanted to say was instead of introducing them in the campgian and taking time from that. We should just put a video in the menue of halo 3 to explain the extra spartans. Sorry for the confusion.

  • 07.07.2006 9:26 AM PDT
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Posted by: Kilwan
A big message appears at the start of the game. It goes something like this:

"THOSE WHO ARE TOO LAZY OR ILLITERATE TO READ THE THREE BOOKS WILL BE HENCEFORTH CONFUSED. SUCKS TO BE YOU.


HAVE A NOICE! DAY!"

^_^
It's not that I'm lazy or illiterate. It's just that I've read much better books out there.

  • 07.07.2006 9:31 AM PDT
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Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
Posted by: Kilwan
A big message appears at the start of the game. It goes something like this:

"THOSE WHO ARE TOO LAZY OR ILLITERATE TO READ THE THREE BOOKS WILL BE HENCEFORTH CONFUSED. SUCKS TO BE YOU.


HAVE A NOICE! DAY!"

^_^
It's not that I'm lazy or illiterate. It's just that I've read much better books out there.


And you call yourself a halo fan tsk tsk. You should be ashamed of yourelf. hehe

  • 07.07.2006 9:39 AM PDT

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Posted by: RhythmKiller
Posted by: The Lone Heretic
MLG, a few others and I talked about this. We came to the conclusion that a long cutscene at the beginning of the game, explaining and introducing.

Sorry, I really don't think twisting, bending and otherwise forcing the story to fit a spartans reunited scenario is worth it, especially when it only serves the purpose of quenching fanboy thirst.
Fan Boy? I care about the stories enough to get the whole deal. You don't read the books...go ahead and stick to multiplayer. Or if you play campaign, don't whine when you get lost.

Do most people go play Halo 2 without reading the books? Yes, sadly.
Do most people go play Halo 2 without playing Halo first? Yes, sadly.

Don't fall into one of those categories, when the "2" is replaced with "3" and "Halo" replaced with "Halo, Halo 2".

  • 07.09.2006 11:29 PM PDT
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Posted by: whiteultraelite8
You know there are tonnes of topics about wheather there will be more spartans or not and people arguing about it like crazy. Why don't we figure a way to introduce them without confusing the people who have not read the books.
Here is my idea and don't flame me its just an idea. Earth saw how successfull the spartan project was with dealing with the covenant and decided to start making spartans of thier own. It would explain how the chief got his new armor and people would not get confused because the spartans were created on earth. Plus then we would not have to deal with introducing the spartans who were in first strike and just leave them in the books.
What are your guys idea on how to introduce new spartans?


erm... The Spartans were made by the UNSC... earth is the homeworld of the UNSC... you really ought to pay attention.... read the books if you haven't.

  • 07.09.2006 11:33 PM PDT
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I don't want to introduce new Spartans. Besides how would we tell them apart?

  • 07.09.2006 11:36 PM PDT

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Posted by: ceebee r
Posted by: whiteultraelite8
Nice ideas people. I say we have the spartans but either introduce them in the campgain in a 10 min cutscence or just have them in the extra features of the game and have a clip introducing them.
Plus having more spartans would really make the story inovative rather than confusing and give a good plot twist which no one would expect. Moreover, Bungie are masters at story telling and could easily introduce more spartans and we won't have to play as them. They can do there own missions while the MC does his own and then meet up a the end. So the MC will still have his thunder and we just get more spartans.


ok ya they could prob do it and do it well......i just dont see the point
The "point" is, that the books and the games are part of the same exact story.

Do you really think that they would clump up 9 Spartans along with the Chief? Hell no! They would spread them apart on the Earth, to defend from the invasion forces. It's called "tactics" buddy.

  • 07.09.2006 11:37 PM PDT
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bungie already hinted more spartans into the game in the "transmissions from space" thingy or w/e it was called.

it has a spartan named cassasndra wriritng to MC, also she mentions other spartans by saying "we all miss you"

and since she says her and the pther are at a healing station(or something like th at) they could be either spartans recovered from reach, or spartans that got really injured before reach happened so they didnt get to participate. but she said she would be "skinned soon" so looks like maybe she will make an appearance.

  • 07.10.2006 12:15 AM PDT
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Posted by: angry0lbgrampa
Posted by: The Lone Heretic
MLG, a few others and I talked about this. We came to the conclusion that a long cutscene at the beginning of the game, explaining and introducing.


i agree with you heretic that would be the best way without more spartans i feel the stprie line will be ruined and fyi any one says books and game don't coincide they do! lisson to chatter and cinematics many things are said about the events within the books
Still doesn't mean I think there will be or want more Spartans.

  • 07.10.2006 1:06 AM PDT