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Subject: The United States is a Hegemonic power, not an imperialist power.
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Posted by: Humble Rose
You could argue trying to set up a government in Iraq is a form of imperialism, but you seem generally correct.


That's because it is. Imperialistic actions =/= Empire.

Just like a Good person who made a bad mistake =/= bad person.

Like that article explained, we are going down that road and it's raising some alarms.

  • 12.29.2012 1:39 PM PDT
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Tom
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Posted by: ZiIch
Posted by: MilitaryTheorist
Posted by: ZiIch
Posted by: MilitaryTheorist
I'm talking about in a modern sense, not a historical one. America's expansionist campaigns stopped long ago. However, I will concede that our states were the subject of imperialism.

We're not the same country we were during those types on conquests, but I'm not sure how you can claim a country is no longer an empire when you freely admit the vast majority of their territory came from imperialistic expansion.


Because those territories, such as Guam and Puerto Rico, have been given ample chances to leave from the Union. That's not a empire, bro, where territories are forced to stay and are subjected to unfair economic and political treatment.

You did not say Guam and Puerto Rico. You clearly said states.


Okay...?

And as I recall, states did try to leave one time.

They did leave, but then they proceeded to fire upon Fort Sumter, igniting a war against the U.S.A.

And secession is illegal.

Unilateral secession is, but a state can still apply for becoming an independent nation.




[Edited on 12.29.2012 1:40 PM PST]

  • 12.29.2012 1:40 PM PDT
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Posted by: ZiIch
Posted by: MilitaryTheorist
Posted by: ZiIch
Posted by: MilitaryTheorist
I'm talking about in a modern sense, not a historical one. America's expansionist campaigns stopped long ago. However, I will concede that our states were the subject of imperialism.

We're not the same country we were during those types on conquests, but I'm not sure how you can claim a country is no longer an empire when you freely admit the vast majority of their territory came from imperialistic expansion.


Because those territories, such as Guam and Puerto Rico, have been given ample chances to leave from the Union. That's not a empire, bro, where territories are forced to stay and are subjected to unfair economic and political treatment.

You did not say Guam and Puerto Rico. You clearly said states.

And as I recall, states did try to leave one time. And secession is illegal.


Territories had and have the right to choose to be in or out of the Union. Guam and Puerto Rico have voted time and time again, that they want to stay territories, in fact recently, Puerto Pico voted to become a state. But if you become a state, it's pretty much a life proposition.

[Edited on 12.29.2012 1:42 PM PST]

  • 12.29.2012 1:41 PM PDT

no you cant have my gamertag

Posted by: MilitaryTheorist
Okay...?

Do you normally bring up evidence irrelevant to the discussion at hand?

They did leave, but then they proceeded to fire upon Fort Sumter, igniting a war against the U.S.A.


Unilateral secession is, but a state can still apply for becoming an independent nation.

And there you contradict yourself.

If unilateral secession is illegal, then any state who seceded to join the CSA did not leave the union. They were, as the Supreme Court eventually ruled, still part of the United States of America, despite their obvious wishes.

So far you've admitted that a large portion of the United States was acquired by imperialistic measures. You've done nothing to show what has changed since then. All you've done is dance in circles to try to avoid what you've already admitted to.

The United States is an empire.

  • 12.29.2012 3:15 PM PDT

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