Off Topic: The Flood
This topic has moved here: Subject: Identity.
  • Subject: Identity.
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3
Subject: Identity.

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
I consider recognizing that we as individuals are part of something bigger and usually more important than ourselves (such as a community, a nation, a species, etc) is an important part of maturing.
I don't arbitrarily stop at predefined borders. We're all sapient, that's how I see it.(I'm not saying that we're all the same, though)
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
I can't think of any group that actually forces outsiders to comply with their ideologies.
Society seems to be pretty adamant about the whole nationality thing.

  • 12.29.2012 11:39 PM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
I consider recognizing that we as individuals are part of something bigger and usually more important than ourselves (such as a community, a nation, a species, etc) is an important part of maturing.
I don't arbitrarily stop at predefined borders. We're all sapient, that's how I see it.(I'm not saying that we're all the same, though)
I'm not sure what you mean by "stop". It's not as if people that recognize themselves as an American live solely to be an American. If that were the case, then people wouldn't have jobs to support themselves and have a good life because they'd be too busy trying to make America better.

Overall, I'm not sure what the issue is here; it seems like you have an opposition just to have one. And frankly, refusing to recognize that societies and communities actually exist just because you think they're somehow arbitrary and "wrong" just seems naïve. Humanity would certainly not have been successful if everyone had refused to recognize the benefits of community.

[Edited on 12.29.2012 11:47 PM PST]

  • 12.29.2012 11:46 PM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Overall, I'm not sure what the issue is here; it seems like you have an opposition just to have one. And frankly, refusing to recognize that societies and communities actually exist just because you think they're somehow arbitrary and "wrong" just seems naïve. Humanity would certainly not have been successful if everyone had refused to recognize the benefits of community.
I'm not arguing against community. I'm arguing against self-serfdom to a hivemind.

  • 12.29.2012 11:50 PM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Overall, I'm not sure what the issue is here; it seems like you have an opposition just to have one. And frankly, refusing to recognize that societies and communities actually exist just because you think they're somehow arbitrary and "wrong" just seems naïve. Humanity would certainly not have been successful if everyone had refused to recognize the benefits of community.
I'm not arguing against community. I'm arguing against self-serfdom to a hivemind.


Do you have an example? I'm really having trouble grasping what you're talking about.

  • 12.29.2012 11:52 PM PDT

Posted by: Baph117
This is an incredible step forward to being able to cure Downss sybndonre mn humans bineg.s

Are we too post-modern for labels?

  • 12.29.2012 11:53 PM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Do you have an example? I'm really having trouble grasping what you're talking about.
I'm a lunatic because I don't identify with the nationality that's written in my passport. Apparently if I don't pretend to have psychic link with a group of people I'm an immature young adult.

Then I see people getting seriously insulted because someone said something bad about the Irish. Why do they care so much, and why am I the lunatic for being an individual but these people who identify with their great-great-great-great-grand parents aren't?

  • 12.29.2012 11:56 PM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Do you have an example? I'm really having trouble grasping what you're talking about.
I'm a lunatic because I don't identify with the nationality that's written in my passport. Apparently if I don't pretend to have psychic link with a group of people I'm an immature young adult.


Why are you under the impression that nationality grants you a psychic link with everyone else?

  • 12.29.2012 11:58 PM PDT

Posted by: Baph117
This is an incredible step forward to being able to cure Downss sybndonre mn humans bineg.s

Posted by: monitor 16807
I'm a lunatic because I don't identify with the nationality that's written in my passport. Apparently if I don't pretend to have psychic link with a group of people I'm an immature young adult.


p. sure nobody thinks that belonging to a particular nationality gives you supernatural powers to communicate with others who also belong to that nationality.

  • 12.30.2012 12:00 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: Seggi31
Posted by: monitor 16807
I'm a lunatic because I don't identify with the nationality that's written in my passport. Apparently if I don't pretend to have psychic link with a group of people I'm an immature young adult.


p. sure nobody thinks that belonging to a particular nationality gives you supernatural powers to communicate with others who also belong to that nationality.


How sweet would that be though?

  • 12.30.2012 12:01 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Why are you under the impression that nationality grants you a psychic link with everyone else?
I just don't understand why I'm suppose to identify with someone with whom I share rights.

The guy across the border isn't that different, he just grew up somewhere else and has different rights in another place. I'm expected to think that people fit into categories though. As if saying that someone was an American or French actually meant anything.

Edit: Maybe I'm just retarded, though.

[Edited on 12.30.2012 12:03 AM PST]

  • 12.30.2012 12:02 AM PDT

Posted by: Seggi31
Posted by: Doctor Jensen
I've challenged my beliefs. What is the book about?


I find that this is usually untrue. If religious people honestly, diligently and intelligently challenged their beliefs, there would be no religious people.


Posted by: Hunter S7
Op i couldnt agree

  • 12.30.2012 12:02 AM PDT

Posted by: Baph117
This is an incredible step forward to being able to cure Downss sybndonre mn humans bineg.s

Posted by: monitor 16807
I just don't understand why I'm suppose to identify with someone with whom I share rights.


what.

  • 12.30.2012 12:04 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Why are you under the impression that nationality grants you a psychic link with everyone else?
I just don't understand why I'm suppose to identify with someone with whom I share rights.


It just seems reasonable to by able to identify with someone that lives under the same government, similar living conditions, same language, similar lifestyle, etc.

To be honest it sounds like you have a disassociative disorder.

  • 12.30.2012 12:05 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
It just seems reasonable to by able to identify with someone that lives under the same government, similar living conditions, same language, similar lifestyle, etc.
And I completely understand. Look back at my role-play analogy on the first page for my thoughts on it. I'm not against community or identity. I'm against people being irresponisble about it.
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
To be honest it sounds like you have a disassociative disorder.
Is that a convenient way to dismiss my thoughts altogether?

  • 12.30.2012 12:08 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
It just seems reasonable to by able to identify with someone that lives under the same government, similar living conditions, same language, similar lifestyle, etc.
I'm not against community or identity. I'm against people being irresponisble about it.
Can you give an example?
Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
To be honest it sounds like you have a disassociative disorder.
Is that a convenient way to dismiss my thoughts altogether?No.

  • 12.30.2012 12:10 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Legendary Member

Posted by: Ric_Adbur
Posted by: Baph117
Canadian Na­zism is a polite ideology, ok?
"Into the boxcar now... there you go. Oh, watch your head. Here, let me help you... Yep, showers are right through there. No problem at all."

Good thing there's enough people who disagree to keep society together.

  • 12.30.2012 12:11 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.


Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Can you give an example
The Irish thing. People descendant of Irish who feel insulted when someone says something bad about it.(There's double the irrationality for me in there)

I sort of explained it on the first page too. It's about the fact that your identity is your choice. You should be the one responsible of how your identity affect you, not others.

[Edited on 12.30.2012 12:16 AM PST]

  • 12.30.2012 12:14 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: Baph117
Good thing there's enough people who disagree to keep society together.
And why exactly couldn't society be composed of many different kind of individuals? Why should people conform to a hive-mind?

  • 12.30.2012 12:17 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Legendary Member

Posted by: Ric_Adbur
Posted by: Baph117
Canadian Na­zism is a polite ideology, ok?
"Into the boxcar now... there you go. Oh, watch your head. Here, let me help you... Yep, showers are right through there. No problem at all."


Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: Baph117
Good thing there's enough people who disagree to keep society together.
And why exactly couldn't society be composed of many different kind of individuals? Why should people conform to a hive-mind?
In order for a society to survive, it requires an abundance of individuals with a natural compulsion for social cohesion, i.e people who identify with the group.

  • 12.30.2012 12:19 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
The Irish thing. People descendant of Irish who feel insulted when someone says something bad about it.
They feel insulted because they identify with other Irish people because, like I said, they share the same government, living conditions, environment, etc. When someone insults 'the Irish', it feels like a personal insult because the insult is directed at the government, living conditions, environment, etc. and is subsequently an insult to that person.

Neither you nor I can just 'choose' to identify with others at will. I can't choose to identify with people that live in Iraq, because I don't share any experiences with them. I can't choose to identify with women, because I'm not a woman and have no experienced the things that generally give women the loose bond of gender that they share. I can't choose to identify with a tree because I don't have the intellect of a tree. I could earnestly try to learn to identify with all of those things, and I might succeed, but I don't understand why you view the identity that you spend your life establishing to be a negative thing. It's the summation of your experiences that connect people...not some slave-like designation implanted at birth.

Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: Baph117
Good thing there's enough people who disagree to keep society together.
And why exactly couldn't society be composed of many different kind of individuals? Why should people conform to a hive-mind?
Humans are so far incapable of forming a hive-mind because we have no means to communicate that way.

[Edited on 12.30.2012 12:22 AM PST]

  • 12.30.2012 12:21 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: Baph117
Posted by: monitor 16807
Posted by: Baph117
Good thing there's enough people who disagree to keep society together.
And why exactly couldn't society be composed of many different kind of individuals? Why should people conform to a hive-mind?
In order for a society to survive, it requires an abundance of individuals with a natural compulsion for social cohesion, i.e people who identify with the group.
And why can't we all identify as human/sapient? That's how I identify, because that's what I really am.

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip K. Dick

  • 12.30.2012 12:21 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
And why can't we all identify as human/sapient?


I sincerely doubt there are many people who don't identify with others as humans. But why should you identify yourself with humans? Why is nationality arbitrary but genome isn't?

  • 12.30.2012 12:23 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Legendary Member

Posted by: Ric_Adbur
Posted by: Baph117
Canadian Na­zism is a polite ideology, ok?
"Into the boxcar now... there you go. Oh, watch your head. Here, let me help you... Yep, showers are right through there. No problem at all."


Posted by: monitor 16807
And why can't we all identify as human/sapient? That's how I identify, because that's what I really am.
Because there isn't enough of a unifying, external, and global pressure on all humans to overcome the conflicts on a local level between nations or religions, which are the largest cultural identities that exist.

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip K. DickTHat idealism is all when and good, but it doesn't mean anything in the face of mankinds evolved instinctual social instinct.

  • 12.30.2012 12:25 AM PDT

Posted by: Billygoat456
I'll bring the tritium laser cutters if you bring the beer!

Funny story.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
Posted by: monitor 16807
And why can't we all identify as human/sapient?


I sincerely doubt there are many people who don't identify with others as humans. But why should you identify yourself with humans? Why is nationality arbitrary but genome isn't?
That's why I said sapient. It's what we really are, the "ego" I mean. The way we perceive things.

Posted by: theHurtfulTurkey
It's the summation of your experiences that connect people...not some slave-like designation implanted at birth.
I'm not arguing against friendship.

  • 12.30.2012 12:26 AM PDT

**Devil's advocate of the Flood. My posts may or may not represent my personal opinion, I just enjoy disagreeing with people. None of my posts are representative of the official view of the Navy or any government agency.

Non Sibi Sed Patriae
Homework questions? Forget the Flood, join The Academy.
I've got a fan!


Posted by: monitor 16807
That's why I said sapient. It's what we really are, the "ego" I mean. The way we perceive things.


Do you have a hard time identifying with mentally challenged people who may not necessarily be sapient?

(Wow, that kind of sounded like an insult...it was not meant to.)

[Edited on 12.30.2012 12:28 AM PST]

  • 12.30.2012 12:28 AM PDT

  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3