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  • Subject: Halo 3 Should Consider All Level Ranks in Matchmaking
Subject: Halo 3 Should Consider All Level Ranks in Matchmaking
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In Halo 2 you got matched against a level 35 for instance in team slayer that was only a 22 in team snipers and when playing snipers it matched you against his 22 not his 35, I think Halo 3 should match including an overall rank and not just the current gametype rank. But if they do the matchmaking based on trueskill at least make it understandable on how to rank up or build skills up.

  • 07.07.2006 4:29 AM PDT
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Yeah that is what i was thinking.

  • 07.07.2006 4:42 AM PDT
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Location: Outlaws' Summit.

Posted by: phatoneusa
In Halo 2 you got matched against a level 35 for instance in team slayer that was only a 22 in team snipers and when playing snipers it matched you against his 22 not his 35, I think Halo 3 should match including an overall rank and not just the current gametype rank. But if they do the matchmaking based on trueskill at least make it understandable on how to rank up or build skills up.


not sure if i understand........so what youre saying is lets say im a (hypothetically of course)

22 team slayer
30 BtB ( i wish lol )
23 team snipers
27 double team
20 rumble pit

in H3 MM

so i average about a 25 and i wanna play rumble pit. so instead of matching me with a guy who has a 19 or an 18 in rumble pit, i get matched with a guy who also averages a 25??

if so, it sounds ok to me............even tho rank doesnt necessarily determine raw skill, but may help it so those "inflated" ranks dont think their top tier

  • 07.07.2006 5:12 AM PDT
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Lets say Im a Lvl 39 in Team Slayer but Im only a 20 in Team Snipers because im better with BRs. Why should I have to fight someone with more or less skill than me. Also it is easyer to get ranks in some matchmakeing than it is in other and you would not have even skill level in mtches

  • 07.07.2006 6:16 AM PDT
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If Bungie people are reading this thread - this is the BEST idea ever. I have ALWAYS thought this is the way it should be. It would help increase the number of "real matches" that one could play.

"Real Matches" are those fun matches that are against people of your own skill level, are close to the end, and whether you win or lose, you still have fun.

"Stupid Matches" are, for example, when you're in Team Skirmish (as a 25), and you start playing a team that has level 40 or above in Team Slayer. That game is by definition, not fun. You get slaughtered by people who have no life outside of Halo - they are playing Skirmish because they can no longer win in Slayer, and they just want to pown people who actually have lives (or maybe they (me) just genuinely stink at Halo).

It doesn't have to be actual skill level - maybe an average of all of the game types that you are ranked against. (i.e. 40 Slayer, 20 Skirmish - so you play 30s on a consistent basis)

PLEASE include this in Halo 3 - BEST IDEA EVER! (As Comicbook guy might say).

  • 07.07.2006 6:36 AM PDT
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Halo 3 may actually use the 360's poorly named "True Skill" rank system, and with that, I think you have a communal rank for all games. I'm not sure though. I don't play ranked games anymore anyway.

  • 07.07.2006 6:56 AM PDT

Down, down to hell and say that I sent you there...

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You Are an Idiot

I think each playlist, if they are going with the same online system as Halo 2, should have it's own individual rank like normal. But I think the rank beside your name on the friends list and everywhere else should be an average of all your ranks. You can have one guy who's like a 35 in Team Slayer and sucks in every other playlist. Your rank should be your total accumulated skill, not your best.

  • 07.07.2006 7:11 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ric_Adbur
No one should ever be afraid of looking stupid, so long as they are making a rational effort to expand their understanding.

So if my ranks are as follows, I would be perpetually matched with level 4's? Does this mean that one could climb a single playlist all the way to the top w/o much difficulty?

Rumble Pit 1
Double Team 1
Team Slayer 28
Team Skirmish 1
Team Snipers 1
Team Hardcore 1
BTB Skirmish 1
Rumble Hardcore 1

Furthermore, slayer and objective are different play styles. I blow at objective, and can hold my own in slayer. I have won only 1 16 player match on live since 11/2004, yet can hold my own in 4v4 slayer. An overall rank isn't the answer, because ability in each playlist isn't overall. All it would really do is hold someone down in the playlist they are best at, which would be completely unbalanced for his opponents.

  • 07.07.2006 7:46 AM PDT

or just remove ranks alltogether.

  • 07.07.2006 7:50 AM PDT
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I think Ranks should be an average of a few playlists. Maybe your top three. or just all of them excluding BTB. And then they should match you up like that.
If you are so high in Team SLayer. But you have a low level in Rumble. Then you may not deserve the rank you have in TS. But rather a Average.

I definately think that Matchmaking should look at all their stats.

  • 07.07.2006 7:52 AM PDT
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I like this idea, but only for similar gametypes. Say all team games with over 8 players as 1 rank. This would include BTB kirmish and BTB slayer. in BTB slayer i am a lvl 40 but in BTB skirmish i am a lvl 20. These ranks would not affect my 2v2 and 4v4 rank though, which i may be only an average lvl 15. I think this makes sense. but i'm pretty tired. lol ask if any questions.

  • 07.07.2006 7:58 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ric_Adbur
No one should ever be afraid of looking stupid, so long as they are making a rational effort to expand their understanding.

Posted by: SS Crow
If you are so high in Team SLayer. But you have a low level in Rumble. Then you may not deserve the rank you have in TS. But rather a Average.

So you are looking at ranks as a reward, rather than a representation of ability? That simply isn't the case. I'll say it again, Averaging down your TSlayer rank based on not playing other playlists, or for not playing well in 8v8 or skirmish imbalances the game for people you are playing against in TSlayer. Why? Because your ability is greater than the number that you averaged down. Ranks aren't a reward, or a badge of honor, or anyhing like that. They are a representation of you playing ability.

  • 07.07.2006 7:59 AM PDT

Posted by: MrSpinkleswirth
or just remove ranks alltogether.
Exactly.

Keep the ranks hidden on all playlists (either the TrueSkill, or Halo ranks...whatever bungie decides to use).

You're suppose to have fun playing a game, not worrying about ranks...

Keeping track of stats is fine...I always like to see my average kills per game, number of bomb plants, etc. Basically to see if my game is improving, or if I play drunk too much....

[Edited on 7/7/2006]

  • 07.07.2006 8:01 AM PDT
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Posted by: Darth1Snyder

Furthermore, slayer and objective are different play styles. I blow at objective, and can hold my own in slayer. I have won only 1 16 player match on live since 11/2004, yet can hold my own in 4v4 slayer. An overall rank isn't the answer, because ability in each playlist isn't overall. All it would really do is hold someone down in the playlist they are best at, which would be completely unbalanced for his opponents.


See - isn't that the whole point? If you can only play Slayer, you are by far an inferior Halo player than if you were balanced in all areas. Why shouldn't your real rank of "4" identify your playing skills? But, I think if we were honest, if you have a 28 in Slayer, odds are that you would be higher than a "1" in Skirmish or any other playlist. If you want to climb higher, then you have to climb higher in all ranks.

This would force balanced, equalized play across the board - which is the point. What I get sick of is the level 40 Slayer player coming into Skirmish (or whatever) at a level 15, whooping my tail, and then laughing in my face. I'd rather play people at the same "True Skill" level that I have. I actually would just like to play to have fun - it's just fun - it's not your life.

  • 07.07.2006 8:01 AM PDT
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Or even better...

Slayer - 28
Hardcore - 1
Skirmish - 1
BTB - 1
Etc.

What the system would do would be keep the Slayer 28 and raise all the others to 22 (6 levels down as is done in the current system if a level 1 is playing with a level 28). Then average out the 28 and the 22s and play against people at that level. That allows for a slight increase in skill in one area and a slight decrease in skill in the other playlists. However, if you are playing in Slayer (and that's your highest as a 28), you would still keep your 28. The other playlists would be decreased based on your average level.

What say you?

  • 07.07.2006 8:13 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ric_Adbur
No one should ever be afraid of looking stupid, so long as they are making a rational effort to expand their understanding.

Shadow... this doesn't solve your problem. By my example, a level 28 in TSlayer would be matched in a room full of 4's. How is that any different from a 40 playing with a bunch of 15's? You could cleave your way to 50 with little opposition in TSlayer with your average level "solution". When you say, "want to climb higher" you are making the ranks look like a reward. You can't force people to play all playlists, and this solution would only encourage peope to stick with a single playlist so they can maximize their chances to be better than those they are matched with. Even at level 40 in TS, and never playing the other playlists, the average would be.... 6. Do you not see the problem this solution would create? It would further imbalance gameplay the the current method of rank per plalist.

Posted by: xShad0wFalc0nx
Posted by: Darth1Snyder

Furthermore, slayer and objective are different play styles. I blow at objective, and can hold my own in slayer. I have won only 1 16 player match on live since 11/2004, yet can hold my own in 4v4 slayer. An overall rank isn't the answer, because ability in each playlist isn't overall. All it would really do is hold someone down in the playlist they are best at, which would be completely unbalanced for his opponents.


See - isn't that the whole point? If you can only play Slayer, you are by far an inferior Halo player than if you were balanced in all areas. Why shouldn't your real rank of "4" identify your playing skills? But, I think if we were honest, if you have a 28 in Slayer, odds are that you would be higher than a "1" in Skirmish or any other playlist. If you want to climb higher, then you have to climb higher in all ranks.

This would force balanced, equalized play across the board - which is the point. What I get sick of is the level 40 Slayer player coming into Skirmish (or whatever) at a level 15, whooping my tail, and then laughing in my face. I'd rather play people at the same "True Skill" level that I have. I actually would just like to play to have fun - it's just fun - it's not your life.

  • 07.07.2006 8:21 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ric_Adbur
No one should ever be afraid of looking stupid, so long as they are making a rational effort to expand their understanding.

So you are saying powerleveling in a single playlist would crank up your ranks in other playlists? I don't know about that... See, as I stated before, (keep in mind I am an average gamer, therefore believe I am not the only one like me) I have won only one 8v8 game in 2 years.

One playlist rank raising others would take you out of your league in the other playlists, therfore further inspiring you to never play that playlist. I mean, I could want to figure out the sublteties that separate the men from the boys in BTB, but in this situation I would be subjected to the respawn screen while being regailed about my sukkiness and being accused of boosting my level... In this situation, I would never play any other playlists agian.

Posted by: xShad0wFalc0nx
Or even better...

Slayer - 28
Hardcore - 1
Skirmish - 1
BTB - 1
Etc.

What the system would do would be keep the Slayer 28 and raise all the others to 22 (6 levels down as is done in the current system if a level 1 is playing with a level 28). Then average out the 28 and the 22s and play against people at that level. That allows for a slight increase in skill in one area and a slight decrease in skill in the other playlists. However, if you are playing in Slayer (and that's your highest as a 28), you would still keep your 28. The other playlists would be decreased based on your average level.

What say you?

  • 07.07.2006 8:26 AM PDT
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"So you are saying powerleveling in a single playlist would crank up your ranks in other playlists? I don't know about that... See, as I stated before, (keep in mind I am an average gamer, therefore believe I am not the only one like me) I have won only one 8v8 game in 2 years." - Quote


I guess there would be that unintended result, if you were "powered up" in the other playlists.

The way to solve this issue would be to have your rank a "1" but be considered a "22" just like in the current playlists if a 1 and a 28 are put together. If you win the game, your "1" would considerably be increased to a higher level and so on. That way, instead of playing 50 games to level up from 1 to 22, if you are a level 22 in the first place, you would be ranked up in a few games rather quickly. You'd get to a level 22 without smoking all the 10s, 12s, 14s, and 16s in the way (increasing the number of "Real Matches" or "True Skill" matches).

Additionally, if you're considered a "22," you could actually be matched with a 16 (within 6 ranks). One might say this is unfair, but man, if you're a 28 in Slayer, how bad could you be in objective? Are you seriously going to be a 16? If you're that bad, you probably wouldn't play that particular playlist.

Another side benefit to this type of system would be the fact that it would be incredibly difficult to de-level. You couldn't just trash games in one playlist - you'd have to trash games in all the playlists. That would take an incredibly long time, it would keep most people from doing it, and that would have the benefit of making even more "Real Matches" or "True Skill" matches - you wouldn't have a guy dumping on a game, making it 3 on 4, once every 6 or 7 matches.

What say you?

  • 07.07.2006 9:02 AM PDT

Damn snipers!!!

I have now read the books...

your stupid makes my brain sad

this is a great idea.........it oughta be, i said it like two months ago.....you prob didnt know that though so ill give you props.....most ppl with half a brain noticed this the first week of H2MM

  • 07.07.2006 9:08 AM PDT
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Posted by: Ric_Adbur
No one should ever be afraid of looking stupid, so long as they are making a rational effort to expand their understanding.

Seems complicated... but the idea is on its way to some solution. I have little doubt that the current Halo 2 rank system will be overhauled, or trashed in favor of something more next gen, so something will have to replace it.

  • 07.07.2006 9:25 AM PDT