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Subject: AI Bots in multiplayer?
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An age old question, should there be AI bots in multiplayer? Will bungie make AI bots? What do you guys think?

Personally I am in favor of AI bots. There could be more players with less lag, and players could get to know a map before playing other players on it!

  • 07.16.2006 12:23 PM PDT
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I would kind of like to see it but maybe only for split screen when you have a few friends over but as far as having it used alot on multiplayer I doubt it will ever happen nor do I want it to. Plus I think they are hard pressed about getting halo 3 ready for its launch i doubt they will spend more time working on bot ai but i guess they could use some of the single player so it might not take as long

  • 07.16.2006 12:36 PM PDT
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Yeah... definately not on xbl unless it is a private party not matchmaking....

  • 07.16.2006 12:38 PM PDT
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Posted by: Forever Grunty
Yeah... definately not on xbl unless it is a private party not matchmaking....


Exactly. Bots would be good, if not great, as long as they don't put them in Matchmaking. Having a bots option for custom games and for screwing around offline would be quite entertaining.

  • 07.16.2006 12:41 PM PDT
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  • Exalted Legendary Member

You face an opponent who has never known defeat, who laughs in foreign tongues at your efforts to survive. This is Reply suicide.

"Oh Molly Connoly ruined my life, I thought the world should know."
Say Anything - Every Man Has A Molly

Bots... The Age old question...

Bots, I believe, were first introduced in games like "Perfect Dark" for the N64. They were around in case you didn't want to splurge for another $20 or $30 for a controller, or even have a friend come over to play it with you.

The N64 and other consoles had NO internet connections and you needed other players or bots to even USE the multiplayer aspect of the games.

But since the introduction to Consoles to this wonderful thing we call "The Internet"... You don't need Bots unless you simply suck at the game or can't pay the yearly fee of $50 for XBL.

Let's also be honest, Bots aren't very satisfying to even KILL. On PDZ, they're used to quickly get some of your achievements or to simply fill in a few slots to balance out a team.

Sure, you could make them harder, but all it does is take more ammo to kill them and they get more headshots. They also don't stand still as much and let you shoot them.

And in Halo 2, you don't need Bots or another player to even EXPLORE a map. Just load it up, one player, and you can explore the map to your hearts' content. As long as you want, you don't even have to be online.

Bots are typically VERY stupid and not even worth implementing, unless you've got no friends and no money.

Honestly, I've never seen a bot even come CLOSE to thinking for itself. You play against them long enough, and you've got their coding figured out. You know exactly what they'll do in every situation and even "high traffic" areas for bots. You'll figure out their weapons of choice (most Bots just pick up the strongest weapon they can, then try to kill you with it). They have trouble distinguishing between targets of opportunity as well as priority targets (power weapon whores are priority targets) within a battle. In Capture the Flag, they often ignore a flag carrier, and sometimes even ignore the dropped flag. They stand mindlessly on the flag capture point when they have the flag, and die just as mindlessly there.

I use Bots for nothing more than getting Achievements. They're stupid, useless, and worthless. Unless they implement a feature where I can program behaviors into my OWN Bots for gameplay... They're going to continue to be this way.

Bots don't even try to snipe! Or pin down spawn areas! They don't even attempt to hold an area!

Halo has NEVER needed bots. It's never going to need them, ever. It has enough Bots in the Campaign that it should satisfy you. And if they're not enough... Imagine a dumbed down version of the Campaign AI on a Multiplayer map.

Yeah, you didn't think this through, did you?

  • 07.16.2006 12:50 PM PDT

"Thoughts are the shadows of feelings; always darker, emptier, and simpler."

This may be hard.

Notice that in the campaign as the Arbiter you never killed a human.

Weird.....

  • 07.16.2006 12:53 PM PDT
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i would love the option of bots like marines or something, just to fill in the space. and stuff, or top get in the gunner of the warthog which you have nobody to go in with you, and thinkl about it? If you don't want to play with A.I.s just don't join a game that has them.

  • 07.16.2006 12:57 PM PDT
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Seriously, don't take me seriously.

Underground Pleasure - aren't you a bit curious?

If Perfect Dark can have bots...then so can Halo!

  • 07.16.2006 12:58 PM PDT
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noone does bots right........but if anyone could....it would be bungie so if they did do it...i just want it to be done right and not have halo 3 become time splitters 2

[Edited on 7/16/2006]

  • 07.16.2006 1:00 PM PDT
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I don't think that the bots should be like equals to the mc but more like marines or something, they don't need to go get the flag just run around like retards shooting the enemy.

[Edited on 7/16/2006]

  • 07.16.2006 1:02 PM PDT
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You face an opponent who has never known defeat, who laughs in foreign tongues at your efforts to survive. This is Reply suicide.

"Oh Molly Connoly ruined my life, I thought the world should know."
Say Anything - Every Man Has A Molly

The Bots in Perfect Dark suck.

They sucked in the first one... They suck in the new one. I'd rather play with 7 other players instead of 7 advanced bots.

They only add to gameplay when you don't have XBL or when you don't have friends who can come over and lose.

Trust me, Halo does NOT need them.

All Halo 1 was missing was Xbox Live... All Halo 2 is missing is a perma-ban of cheaters and griefers...

Halo 3 won't need Bots. Halo 1 and Halo 2 didn't need them. Halo 3 isn't going to need them.

I'd rather Bungie spend their time and resources on a good Campaign, some fun Achievements and Gametypes... Some nice Multiplayer maps... Maybe some new enemies and weapons... And nix the Bots for all this cooler and much nicer stuff.

I'd rather they not waste time and diskspace on something that MOST players won't use.

Bots are a fad, they went out with the N64.

  • 07.16.2006 1:04 PM PDT
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no, now that we have Live we dont need computers to play against

  • 07.16.2006 1:06 PM PDT
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well what about those people that still have no access to a dsl connection or anything like high speed internet?

  • 07.16.2006 1:11 PM PDT
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It's just not the same feel ...

  • 07.16.2006 1:12 PM PDT
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You face an opponent who has never known defeat, who laughs in foreign tongues at your efforts to survive. This is Reply suicide.

"Oh Molly Connoly ruined my life, I thought the world should know."
Say Anything - Every Man Has A Molly

For those of you without internet connections up to par with XBL....

Spend $30 or $60 on a couple controllers, and invite some friends over to play with you.

Bots simply take away from the experience. TRUST ME.

  • 07.16.2006 1:16 PM PDT

-Avatar-

I work for the Department of Defense.

Ok, Well in response to the person who talked about all the bots in PD and how they wern't a challenge... I belive their is no comparison. PD is 1998. Halo 3 is 2007-8

You cannot compare AI From '98 to AI from '08

Its NOT possible.

I belive bungie could make AI that really made a difference. And Bots could help people who dont play live much, practice a little bit to bring up their skills.

I dont have live, and i end up having to make 3 controllers with the joy sticks taped to force them to move around while i practice getting headshots to make my SWAT skills better. So, Bots would make my life a lot easier...

I belive there a good idea.

(Edit) Totally realised that i pud PDZ in stead of "PD"

lol

[Edited on 7/16/2006]

  • 07.16.2006 1:19 PM PDT

Posted by: S2K ViP3R
there is not point in saying hey i got a 40- HIGH RANK MEANS NOTHING, it means you either bridged host or cheated...and the skillfull player like myself have 27s cause of cheating.

Gamertag: StlcKs <-- i is an "L"

Posted by: Tai MT
Bots... The Age old question...

Bots, I believe, were first introduced in games like "Perfect Dark" for the N64. They were around in case you didn't want to splurge for another $20 or $30 for a controller, or even have a friend come over to play it with you.

The N64 and other consoles had NO internet connections and you needed other players or bots to even USE the multiplayer aspect of the games.

But since the introduction to Consoles to this wonderful thing we call "The Internet"... You don't need Bots unless you simply suck at the game or can't pay the yearly fee of $50 for XBL.

Let's also be honest, Bots aren't very satisfying to even KILL. On PDZ, they're used to quickly get some of your achievements or to simply fill in a few slots to balance out a team.

Sure, you could make them harder, but all it does is take more ammo to kill them and they get more headshots. They also don't stand still as much and let you shoot them.

And in Halo 2, you don't need Bots or another player to even EXPLORE a map. Just load it up, one player, and you can explore the map to your hearts' content. As long as you want, you don't even have to be online.

Bots are typically VERY stupid and not even worth implementing, unless you've got no friends and no money.

Honestly, I've never seen a bot even come CLOSE to thinking for itself. You play against them long enough, and you've got their coding figured out. You know exactly what they'll do in every situation and even "high traffic" areas for bots. You'll figure out their weapons of choice (most Bots just pick up the strongest weapon they can, then try to kill you with it). They have trouble distinguishing between targets of opportunity as well as priority targets (power weapon whores are priority targets) within a battle. In Capture the Flag, they often ignore a flag carrier, and sometimes even ignore the dropped flag. They stand mindlessly on the flag capture point when they have the flag, and die just as mindlessly there.

I use Bots for nothing more than getting Achievements. They're stupid, useless, and worthless. Unless they implement a feature where I can program behaviors into my OWN Bots for gameplay... They're going to continue to be this way.

Bots don't even try to snipe! Or pin down spawn areas! They don't even attempt to hold an area!

Halo has NEVER needed bots. It's never going to need them, ever. It has enough Bots in the Campaign that it should satisfy you. And if they're not enough... Imagine a dumbed down version of the Campaign AI on a Multiplayer map.

Yeah, you didn't think this through, did you?




But that is the beauty of the 360 dude, one of the big new things in the 360 is its ability to have much smarter AI. If you read bungies updates then you would see that even the bungie guys are talking about the new smarter AI in campaign mode. Even after saying all that, I still don't think their should be bots. Bots makes you think your good then you get owned on Xbox Live.

  • 07.16.2006 1:22 PM PDT
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You face an opponent who has never known defeat, who laughs in foreign tongues at your efforts to survive. This is Reply suicide.

"Oh Molly Connoly ruined my life, I thought the world should know."
Say Anything - Every Man Has A Molly

I'm going to ignore the fact that the Xbox 360 wasn't released in 1998 so there's no way PDZ could have been...

I assume this is simply an oversight by the poster who was a little confused as to what I was actually talking about. Or... who didn't really read any of the posts.



It has been discussed on numerous occasions that those who don't have XBL or are now planning to buy it... What they could do for training, or practice, to get better at the game... Well, our suggestions were to play on Legendary. Play through it with different weapons. Never use a power weapon. Use only power weapons. Go through every level without dying ONCE. This is good training for XBL. It's how many players new to the game got the hang of it, and even got good at it.

There's plenty of practice to be had on the Legendary Difficulty, you don't need Bots in Multiplayer for that.



And yes, I know that the 360 is supposed to be much better at AI script and the like... Which is why I look forward to a good Campaign in Halo 3. But to put bots in Multiplayer, you have to code MUCH different script for the AI. They have to think differently and work differently. And in every game so far, they've ended up being a dumbed down version of the AI in Campaign, or being much too powerful to even consider using for anything but pro players.

Nobody gets Bots right, and I hope they never do. I would much rather play against a real thinking person instead of some Bot. If I want to kill AI driven characters, I'll play Campaign. And if you want to do this as well, you could play Campaign as well.

Problem solved.

  • 07.16.2006 1:36 PM PDT

why not bots are always fun to play with and mess around with

  • 07.16.2006 1:39 PM PDT

Take all of my posts seriously.

Someone above mentioned Time Splitters 2 and yes that did have bots but they were horrible.They would run in lines at you and when on defense they would stand in one spot.
sometimes they were fun to play but they were amazingly stupid.Of course i only played against bots in that game cause XBL was always really laggy for me in that game.

  • 07.16.2006 1:51 PM PDT
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We've been here since you left.
We left before you came.

I seem to remember reading an interview with Jaime Griesemer. He said something about that their were no bots in Halo because each bot would of had to be programmed accordingly depending on which gametype it was and the number of bots and so on. In short, it would have been more time, and Bungie was already rushing as it was with Halo 2.

  • 07.16.2006 1:54 PM PDT

ლ(ಠ_ಠლ),ಠ_ಠ,ʘ_ʘ,ಥ_ಥ,ᶘ ᵒᴥᵒᶅ ,ᶘ ಠᴥಠᶅ,ᶘᵒᴥᵒ ʘ‿ʘᶅʕ·͡ᴥ·ʔ@[393703897340448:]

Only for custom games and that survival mode that ONE ONE SEVEN thought up.

  • 07.16.2006 1:58 PM PDT

"I pledge to punch all switches, to never shoot where I could use grenades, to admit the existence of no level except Total Carnage, to never use caps lock as my "run" key, and to never, ever, leave a single BoB alive."

2B || !2B - Why don't you look Inside the Machine?

Bots would not serve justice to Halo 3...plus there already is a dedicated AI Bot Thread in the "Threads of Interest" sticky...

  • 07.16.2006 1:59 PM PDT
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We've been here since you left.
We left before you came.

But the main reason and the most obvious for their not being any bots is.....*drum roll* Microsoft!! We all know their greedy and as long as they own Bungie, Thier going to make Halo Xbox Live status.

  • 07.16.2006 2:00 PM PDT
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If Bungie wanted to spend the absurd amount of team required to program the bots to do Objective based missions.
Then Whatever.

But I would rather see more time spent in expanding the Multiplayer Gameplay than having the option to play with bots.

*Note, Perfect Dark bots are Terrible, Dumb, Unrealistic, predictable, and Worthless.

  • 07.16.2006 2:16 PM PDT

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