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Subject: KIlling spiders to save butterflies?
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Poll: A butterfly is caught in a web and the spider is coming... what do ...  [closed]
Free the butterfly, kill the spider:  13%
(4 Votes)
Leave the butterfly to it's fate:  52%
(16 Votes)
Alternative... post below:  35%
(11 Votes)
Total Votes: 31

A lil paradox from Trigun... the spider must eat the butterfly to live, so how can you doom one creature in an attempt to save the other?

btw the Trigun 1st and 2nd Doughnuts rocks!

Tristan ;-)

  • 10.06.2004 5:58 PM PDT
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The situation is, as I see it, one is starving, and another will die anyways.

Don't interfere with nature.

[Edited on 10/6/2004 6:04:33 PM]

  • 10.06.2004 6:03 PM PDT
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It is the butterflies fault, for not being evolved enough to be able to avoid the web, I say give the spider a feast. Also spiders are more helpful then butterflies.

  • 10.06.2004 6:05 PM PDT
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But Vella... everything and everyone is going to die, so you can't really use that as an excuse. The question is a theoretical about the life, you are trying to decide whather one creature's life is worth more than another... it's a paradoxial situation.

Tristan ;-)

  • 10.06.2004 6:09 PM PDT
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KILL THEM BOTH! MUAHAHAHA!!!!

  • 10.06.2004 6:38 PM PDT
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Ah, the spider paradox. Very confusing. The best I can come up with is to not answer. Why? because there are no right or wrong guesses.

In the end, one must die, unless another butterfly comes along to be eaten. It is a sad fact of nature, but one which we see on a daily basis.

  • 10.06.2004 6:38 PM PDT
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Yes I can. Of course, everyone will die, but the only difference is when.

The spider needs to eat, the butterfly needs to be eaten.

No life is worth more than another. The spider was cunning, and got his food.

  • 10.06.2004 6:58 PM PDT
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save the butterfly just cause i hate spiders

  • 10.06.2004 7:03 PM PDT
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Brilliant question, especially since I had a thoughtful experiance with a butterfly today.

I was sitting under a tree in a good friend of mine's garden. We were smoking cigars and making thoughtful conversation. As I sat, butterflies would land on me periodically. It really was neat. ^_^

Anyway, still in my Nietzsche mode, I am going to answer that I would save the butterfly. They will both die. Which life would I value more? The answer is the one I find most beautiful.

  • 10.06.2004 7:07 PM PDT
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save the butterfly and make the spider a sandwich

  • 10.06.2004 7:08 PM PDT
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I say leave the Butterfly to its fate, its mother nature at work, its whats she does best, making things die, and live......circle of life......etc, etc.

  • 10.06.2004 7:09 PM PDT
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*Vash tries to free the butterfly but before he reaches it Knives' hand reaches out and crushes the spider*

Vash: Why? Why did you do that?
Knives: You wanted to save the butterfly didn't you?
Vash: Yes but it didn't have to die...
Knives: But without the butterfly the spider would die anyway.
Vash: Nobody has the right to take the life of anything else... that's what Rem said...

And later Vash decides... "There must be a way to save everyone... I will find it..."

Tristan ;-)

[Edited on 10/6/2004 7:22:44 PM]

  • 10.06.2004 7:18 PM PDT
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Posted by: ObbiQuiet
Brilliant question, especially since I had a thoughtful experiance with a butterfly today.

I was sitting under a tree in a good friend of mine's garden. We were smoking cigars and making thoughtful conversation. As I sat, butterflies would land on me periodically. It really was neat. ^_^

Anyway, still in my Nietzsche mode, I am going to answer that I would save the butterfly. They will both die. Which life would I value more? The answer is the one I find most beautiful.


You can't really say that one is more beautiful than the other, because they both have unique and admirable qualities. One is appreciated for it's delicate physical beauty, while the other spins beautiful webs that look like a string of jewels with the morning dew. Besides, when humans meddle with nature, we tend to -blam!- things up.

EDIT: Wait, I forgot to actually answer the question. I would save neither, and then watch what happened.

[Edited on 10/6/2004 7:36:44 PM]

  • 10.06.2004 7:32 PM PDT
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Posted by: Daisuke
KILL THEM BOTH! MUAHAHAHA!!!!


I was waiting for that!

  • 10.06.2004 7:36 PM PDT
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Posted by: Galaga Junkie
Posted by: ObbiQuiet
Brilliant question, especially since I had a thoughtful experiance with a butterfly today.

I was sitting under a tree in a good friend of mine's garden. We were smoking cigars and making thoughtful conversation. As I sat, butterflies would land on me periodically. It really was neat. ^_^

Anyway, still in my Nietzsche mode, I am going to answer that I would save the butterfly. They will both die. Which life would I value more? The answer is the one I find most beautiful.


You can't really say that one is more beautiful than the other, because they both have unique and admirable qualities. One is appreciated for it's delicate physical beauty, while the other spins beautiful webs that look like a string of jewels with the morning dew. Besides, when humans meddle with nature, we tend to -blam!- things up.

EDIT: Wait, I forgot to actually answer the question. I would save neither, and then watch what happened.


You forgot to take into account it's my decision. It's which one I find more beautiful. Yes, the spider might have beautiful qualities - but what I find most beautiful is a matter of opinion. Contrary to what you say, I can in fact say one is more beautiful than another - because beauty is subjective.

  • 10.06.2004 7:43 PM PDT
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Posted by: ObbiQuiet
Posted by: Galaga Junkie
Posted by: ObbiQuiet
Brilliant question, especially since I had a thoughtful experiance with a butterfly today.

I was sitting under a tree in a good friend of mine's garden. We were smoking cigars and making thoughtful conversation. As I sat, butterflies would land on me periodically. It really was neat. ^_^

Anyway, still in my Nietzsche mode, I am going to answer that I would save the butterfly. They will both die. Which life would I value more? The answer is the one I find most beautiful.


You can't really say that one is more beautiful than the other, because they both have unique and admirable qualities. One is appreciated for it's delicate physical beauty, while the other spins beautiful webs that look like a string of jewels with the morning dew. Besides, when humans meddle with nature, we tend to -blam!- things up.

EDIT: Wait, I forgot to actually answer the question. I would save neither, and then watch what happened.


You forgot to take into account it's my decision. It's which one I find more beautiful. Yes, the spider might have beautiful qualities - but what I find most beautiful is a matter of opinion. Contrary to what you say, I can in fact say one is more beautiful than another - because beauty is subjective.


So you would pass life or death judgement on a creature simply because of how beautiful it is compared to that of another?

  • 10.06.2004 7:51 PM PDT
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Why not? Whether you'd admit it or not, if there were two, you'd save the prettier butterfly.

  • 10.06.2004 7:54 PM PDT
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So you would pass life or death judgement on a creature simply because of how beautiful it is compared to that of another?

Not very familiar with Nietzsche, are you?

  • 10.06.2004 7:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: ObbiQuiet
So you would pass life or death judgement on a creature simply because of how beautiful it is compared to that of another?

Not very familiar with Nietzsche, are you?


Nope, guess not. I'll look it up later though, 'cause I've got homework to do. Goodnight everyone!

  • 10.06.2004 8:04 PM PDT
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Posted by: Galaga Junkie
Posted by: ObbiQuiet
So you would pass life or death judgement on a creature simply because of how beautiful it is compared to that of another?

Not very familiar with Nietzsche, are you?


Nope, guess not. I'll look it up later though, 'cause I've got homework to do. Goodnight everyone!


I advise against it. Nietzsche is not someone you can read lightly. He loved allegory and to write things cryptically. He wanted his works not only to be read, but studied and mused over. If you just 'lightly read' what he has to say you're going to come away with confused and often contradictory impressions.

  • 10.06.2004 8:07 PM PDT
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Posted by: ObbiQuiet
Posted by: Galaga Junkie
Posted by: ObbiQuiet
So you would pass life or death judgement on a creature simply because of how beautiful it is compared to that of another?

Not very familiar with Nietzsche, are you?


Nope, guess not. I'll look it up later though, 'cause I've got homework to do. Goodnight everyone!


I advise against it. Nietzsche is not someone you can read lightly. He loved allegory and to write things cryptically. He wanted his works not only to be read, but studied and mused over. If you just 'lightly read' what he has to say you're going to come away with confused and often contradictory impressions.


Thanks for the advice Obbi.

  • 10.07.2004 6:41 AM PDT
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Posted by: VII Toast
Ah, a riddle from Trigun. Why don't I answer in from a moral in Rurouni Kenshin?

The strong live, the weak die. The weak were put on this Earth for the cause of entertaiment for the strong.


..which was in the end, defeated by that which was considered weak.

As for the butterfly vs spider rule;
What says that the butterfly has to live? or vice versa, the spider?
Also if the butterfly is freed, how do you know it won't get caught again, or not be able to fly because of all the scales that are rubbed off in the transaction?


By:Vella
Why not? Whether you'd admit it or not, if there were two, you'd save the prettier butterfly.

What if the less pretty one is lots bigger? or endangered species?
or going off that what if the Spider was?

any wyas just acouple of things..

[Edited on 10/7/2004 9:02:53 AM]

  • 10.07.2004 8:54 AM PDT
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Posted by: Vella
Don't interfere with nature.


Posted by: Galaga Junkie
Besides, when humans meddle with nature, we tend to -blam!- things up.


look to Australia as a perfect example of human stupidity. when it was first attempted to make the Autralian outback a more desired vacation location, european grass was imported and planted. the idea being that the grass would hold down the trademark red dirt of the outback, which was determined to be a nuisance (it would blow around a lot). not too long after, the grass began to spread and take over, wreaking havoc with the surrounding ecosystem. so in their infinite wisdom, they decided to import rabbits to eat the grass to put it back in check. well, we all know what rabbits do. so soon after, they were looking at a rabbit epidemic. again, in their wisdom, they decided to import the red fox to hunt and kill the rabbits. unfortunately not only did they hunt and kill rabbits, but they hunted and killed nearly everything else available to them. so the moral of the story is, don't -blam!- with nature.

EDIT:
people also seem to be forgetting the whole "food chain" issue. one of the functions of the butterfly is to provide sustenance for other creatures, such as the spider. so leave it to its function.

[Edited on 10/7/2004 9:27:26 AM]

  • 10.07.2004 9:25 AM PDT
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Darwinism... It's there for a reason.

Boom.

  • 10.07.2004 9:33 AM PDT

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