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Subject: It stops now! Introducing the member/moderator initiativie.
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To all and myself,

Im not a moderator (although i do hope to one day become one). I have no "Ninja" powers or any other tools of enforcement. I say this as an equal, which i believ makes this message more powerful. These great forums are seeing lots of trash. Unprovoked aggression, vulgarity filter dodging with lewdness like the F word. And for what, so you can trash talk fellow members? So much flaming. And for what? Its really disheartening. I dont mean to sound like a "perfect word" pacifist but why the hell is there all of this garbage? To everyone; Why did you join BUNGIE.net?. I'll telll you why, because you love the things that Bungie has created these last few years. Great games like Halo and these forums. You joined because you liked it. Do you think its any different for the people that you flame. No! You joined to have fun on the forums, and now your screwing them up. Nobody wants to here your bickering and flaming, nobody thinks its funny, and everybody wants you gone. You know whats great, when i see "The Great Pretender" participating in a peaceful discussion, which there is alot of. Dont get me wrong, 70% of the time these forums are great thanks to the fantastic performance of our moderators and the conduct of good members like most of us, who just want to have fun. However sometimes the moderators, who are basically just our fellow members, have to do get serious and ban people. I hate seeing that. I hate seeing some idiot make a stupid thread and when i come back five minutes later and it says he blacklisted. Do i hate seeing it? Yes. Did he deserve it? Yes.

So, its time for myself and the many others, as just another fellow "member", to step up to the plate. To all good members reading this, help me. Its going to take more than moderators, its going to take members. Its going to take our shaking heads and our discouragement at the bad members, as well as enforcing powers of the Forum Ninjas to stop the stupidity of flaming and hatred towards each other. We complain about it, we hate it, but yet we do nothing about it. Moderators and members alike will be the team that can make these forums better than they have ever been before. Lets get to it. The forums are fun, the forums are great. But there's just that little bit we can fix it, and I hope we will.

sincerely,
MAC 13720, and hopefully every other "good" member of Bungie.net

PS - and if it helps, I present...the rules


[Edited on 8/14/2006 by BobBQ]

  • 08.14.2006 7:52 PM PDT
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"Whatever exists, whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent. These anonymous creatures may seem little or nothing in the world. Yet the smallest crumb can devour us. Any smallest thing beneath yon rock out of men's knowing. Only nature can enslave man and only when the existence of each last entity is routed out and made to stand naked before him will he be properly suzerain of the earth."

It's going to take a lot more than that. I'm thinking we're going to need to outlaw such behavior in this nation (which means we'd also have to get the rest of the world to outlaw such behavior), find a way to change humanity as we know it, or just kill everyone in existence.

Yes, it's sad. But when you think about it, not everyone here was raised to be good. These people won't stop because some other people they don't care about told them that it wasn't proper behavior. Besides, what does a blacklisting do? It tells the member that what they did was a big no-no, and quite well I might add (provided the person knows they were blacklisted, and why, in the first place). If the person cares, they're going to stop. If the person doesn't, he's just going to wait, or make another account, and cause even more problems.

As members, what we can do is not respond to the people causing the problems, and report them to a moderator. That's the best solution in my book.

  • 08.14.2006 7:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: Telec
Remember kids: when Uncle Delta tells you he has sweeties, he isn't lying.

Now get in the van.


The Black Chapter

You are right, people are to alone, aggressive in the manner and not at all likeable for the worst part. There are good members out there who, like you recognise these forums have fallen into something of a mess with less than 2% of the members contributing to this "mess".
As for your call to discourage flamers; spammers; and others, i believe you are right again. 30 or so people can not possibly hope to defend the forum from hundred, maybe thousands of members attempting to wreck it. It will take all decent members to try to quell this, and with luck it may have an effect.
Some of these members are here just purely to annoy, insult, abuse and wreak havok and they will be difficult to stop.
I hope things work out

  • 08.14.2006 8:01 PM PDT

Ach! Was ist los?

Posted by: impurity
You write funny. *giggles*

And you stink! *giggles more*

Your mom stinks. And you're a disgrace to the clan.

I think Mac is on to something here; we could do with more nice and less napalm in our interactions.

And we need better jokes.

  • 08.14.2006 8:01 PM PDT
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Wasnt Impurity a mod...?

Anyway, alot of the crap we see is also stuff that isnt "blacklist worthy". Moderators cant just go around blacklisting for the slightest transgression. They have to trust us, and we need to be more trustworthy...

[Edited on 8/14/2006]

  • 08.14.2006 8:04 PM PDT
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Posted by: Telec
Remember kids: when Uncle Delta tells you he has sweeties, he isn't lying.

Now get in the van.


The Black Chapter

Posted by: Johnrap
I must be wearing those most warpfully demented rosey colored glasses. Because I don't recall anyone getting flamed on Bungie.net for like...years. Impurity once said something about Mabian wanting to be a politician, but he apologized like 7 minu7es later. Other than that I can't recall any flaming. BNet is like the most flame free internet forum I've ever witnessed.

So, what are we even talking about? The BNet boards are getting stronger and better every day. All is cool. No worries. Enjoy, live long, prosper, whatever gets it done for you.



The fact that you openly choose to deny the problem shows you are part of it.
People on here came here to discuss Halo amongst other things. If you're not planning on taking its issues seriously then i suggest you don't bother returning.
This post is on to something, its interesting and above all its important.
I just hope contributions to this thread are made by more sensible and mature members than yourself.

  • 08.14.2006 8:11 PM PDT
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"Whatever exists, whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent. These anonymous creatures may seem little or nothing in the world. Yet the smallest crumb can devour us. Any smallest thing beneath yon rock out of men's knowing. Only nature can enslave man and only when the existence of each last entity is routed out and made to stand naked before him will he be properly suzerain of the earth."

I am pretty sure MAC was talking about some other forum, where there is most likely going to be flaming. There are always problems in the Halo 3 Forum, New Mombasa, and the Flood...or at least that's what I hear. It's bad stuff from what I hear, but I don't think there's really anything we can do other than helping the mods locate the problem(s).

P.S. He called me worse than that. And I'm sketchy on the details, but I don't think the official apology came until a few days later. I may have missed it though...

  • 08.14.2006 8:13 PM PDT
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Posted by: impurity
I don't mean to totally downplay the topic but I kind of agree with Johnrap. These forums are in damn fine shape right now. Content wise, you won't go to a forum anywhere that will be absent of arguing. It's called debate. That is what a forum is for. I can see some of the bickering and nonsensical attacks (hell, I do it every now and then), but they usually only pertain to the people involved. Those fights should usually be handled amongst the duelers but people forget common sense when they're barely holding onto basic motor skills.

The way I see it is that the forums with specific topics, like New Mombasa and Halo 3, will always have their qualms. Those are where the newcomers are going to be hearded so they can rant and rave about what they love (which happens to be Halo now). After, if they truely care about the "community" or just enjoy the interaction, they'll wise up and move onto more "mature" forums with the rest of us. We sit. We bide our time and nibble the delectable morsels of news Bungie provide until we get a new game to ramble about. If we were smarter, we'd take those little nuggets back to our e-buddies and just discuss it there. People get tired of yammering at the same jerks, though. That may be where some of the "heavier" conflicts arise. All in all, it isn't that bad.

I had a point but now I don't so I'm going to stop talking before I start not making sense. I just started to do it so I'm done. There. edit: i dun mayd a taipo


Are you kidding me? These forums are not fine (meaning there is too much flaming etc.).
They are in crisis. With all the flaming going on, I'm surprised I havn't left (I havn't left because of the great forums, discussions, and staff).

  • 08.14.2006 8:46 PM PDT
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I think a crisis is an overstatement...but we have problems that can and should be fixed.

  • 08.14.2006 9:10 PM PDT
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It is up to us, the greatest gamers of all time, to join as one, and get rid of all things evil. Can we start with Jack Thompson?

  • 08.14.2006 9:28 PM PDT
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As admiral as the topic starters motives may be, it's hopeless. As long as there are internet forums there will always be jerks to ruin them.

I like that Jack Thompson idea though.

  • 08.14.2006 9:48 PM PDT
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I'd like to think otherwise...to many great members on this forum. If enough people think we can pull it off than we will. Notice I say we...

  • 08.14.2006 10:39 PM PDT
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These forums are not bad at all compared to many others. Flaming is a common problem with all forums. I learned to take the forums in a not too serious manner.

  • 08.14.2006 10:46 PM PDT
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Look the very fact that a mod. agreed with what I said shows that theres a problem that needs fixing. And i think us average members are the key to solving it.

[Edited on 8/14/2006]

  • 08.14.2006 10:52 PM PDT

Eh...OK. So what are you asking us to do? Shake our heads so hard that they fly off and hit the flamers in the balls or something?

  • 08.14.2006 11:13 PM PDT
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The Frozen Minority - The most infamous clan borne from the Seventh Column.

I agree with Mac.

Personally, I would love to see a 'love thy neighbour week' or something. Basically, everyone agrees to not flame each other for that week. Just to see who really does want to make a positive impact and who is here to ruin other peoples fun.

Quite frankly, the best thing that could be done is when you see a flamer, do not flame back. Instead, send a PM saying we are trying to make this a better place for members, please use reasoning instead of abuse and obstinance.

There was a thread in the Flood a few days ago - the older members who know the ropes need to start setting a better example, especially in the problem forums - Optimatch, New Mombassa and Halo 3 forums. Post interesting, new topics, refrain from attacking others and offer assistance where necessary.

Problem members rarely flame someone who is offering help rather than a counterattack.

[Edited on 8/14/2006]

  • 08.14.2006 11:14 PM PDT

I agree with the original poster and the mods. There is a problem. The good members know that, and now are more heartily acknowleding it. We as members of the Seventh Column must make it our obligation to be the light to those in the forum by leading by our own example. Respect is a thing far to rare here in these forums. We are all conscious human beings and should treat each other as such. It would be a good idea for someone to come up with a pledge or motto or something for Bungie.net and the Seventh Column to help better the community. Right now it seems that that is specifically it's motto. "Improve the Seventh Column" But by what means. Besides just world domination, is it possible that the Bungie Community could also help foster better relations between fellow human beings?

And this thread would make a good stickie perhaps.

[Edited on 8/14/2006]

  • 08.14.2006 11:39 PM PDT
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5/5 Stars - Kritz.net

I'm with Imp. This forum doesn't need fixing. With such a high user base, there's going to be some problems. I currently regular two other forums, and their communities aren't the greatest, either. One has a userbase of about 1000 people with only 20 who post, the other has a userbase of 10,000+ and is about the same state as this one.

The thing is, you can't change how people act. There will always be jackasses and idiots. Once these forums stop being apart of the best selling video game's website, then we can complain that the forum is in a "crises".

The only forums I ever see that have a completely trashed community is the Halo 3 board and Optimatch. The Flood and The Sept are the same in their own right (Only one has randoms and the other has forum-cops), and outside of the forums (IRC) there's a great bunch of people.

I say we're good as we are. Don't fix what isn't broken. The idiots will get bored as time passes and leave. You know what's going to happen then? A new wave of them will hit and we'll have the same "problem" as before.

I'm sure what I said made no sense, but the pool's got aids. So stay out.

>> Kritz

  • 08.15.2006 1:00 AM PDT
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I still say we burn Jack Thompson.

  • 08.15.2006 1:41 AM PDT
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I would probably have to agree with what the OP said. The amount of flaming, spamming etc in these forums is out of hand, though it doesn't mean we can't counter-attack it so to speak. I just think we need a bit more co-operation between the members and moderators, and like Pezza said, not to flame someone when they do something wrong, but to point them in the right direction.

  • 08.15.2006 1:51 AM PDT
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Posted by: Pezza
I agree with Mac.

Personally, I would love to see a 'love thy neighbour week' or something. Basically, everyone agrees to not flame each other for that week. Just to see who really does want to make a positive impact and who is here to ruin other peoples fun.

Quite frankly, the best thing that could be done is when you see a flamer, do not flame back. Instead, send a PM saying we are trying to make this a better place for members, please use reasoning instead of abuse and obstinance.

There was a thread in the Flood a few days ago - the older members who know the ropes need to start setting a better example, especially in the problem forums - Optimatch, New Mombassa and Halo 3 forums. Post interesting, new topics, refrain from attacking others and offer assistance where necessary.

Problem members rarely flame someone who is offering help rather than a counterattack.


As good as this idea is, I dont think it would work. For the majority it may be fine but you know there will be some smarties that want to "be cool" and mess everything up.

  • 08.15.2006 1:56 AM PDT

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