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This topic has moved here: Subject: What do you guys at Bungie thinks of the Halogen shutdown?
  • Subject: What do you guys at Bungie thinks of the Halogen shutdown?
Subject: What do you guys at Bungie thinks of the Halogen shutdown?
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  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

This action by Microsoft is ridiculous. Just because they have the right to shut down a project like this doesn't mean they have to. This project is not doing this mod for profit. If anything this adds to the value of Halo. It is a free advertisement. The existance of this project will not reduce the sales of Halo related merchandise. If anything it will help because of the advertisement aspect. There's no Halo real time strategy game coming out that will be in competition with this community project.

Sadly the only way to do anything about this is to boycott Halo 3, and that will hurt Bungie. So looks like there isn't much we can do. It's alright for RvB to do their thing because they do it for money and pay the Microsoft tax, but whenever somebody wants to do something free and uses their own models, sound, etc they get spit on by Microsoft's legal team. Something seems messed up here.

That kind of sucks though one word can some this up Plagiarism

How is this plagiarism? Nobody is taking credit for thinking up Halo. They are only taking credit for the work they are doing to mod the game. That's quite a bit of independent work.

[Edited on 9/11/2006]

  • 09.11.2006 11:04 AM PDT

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Erepublik: Save the world from oppression!
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Well, Microsoft doesn't have to give us an explaination, and there's nothing we can do to stop them either.... They're like walmart. You can't get enough people to boycott them, and they have a crap load of money to pay people off to prevent legal action.

  • 09.11.2006 12:25 PM PDT
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13/02/2005 (I've been on since then.)
Group RPG's!

DO NOT DO IT! DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT DOING IT! DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT NOT DOING IT!

I fear for Halo Zero as well...

  • 09.11.2006 1:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: xTr1GGeR HaPPYx
Posted by: The Lone Heretic
Anyone mind explaining what exactly 'Halogen' is (or WAS, rather)?

Halogen is basically a mod for an RTS game (Command & Conquer I believe), allowing all the units in the game to look like various characters and vehicles from Halo.


It is sad. I hate corporate and legal issues.

  • 09.11.2006 3:52 PM PDT
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Down with Halogen! Down with all who oppose Bill Gates and Microsoft! Long live the Empire!

  • 09.11.2006 8:23 PM PDT
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I think it perfectly represents the dichotomy of bungie. On the one hand you have the kind of fan involvement and community spirit that would get something like this made, the kind of things bungie likes to portray as being a big part of themselves. On the other you have the fact that Halo is just a product owned by a multi-million dollar corporation which has no recognition of such things. And look which side won out.

  • 09.12.2006 5:15 AM PDT
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Posted by: Quackers
I think it perfectly represents the dichotomy of bungie. On the one hand you have the kind of fan involvement and community spirit that would get something like this made, the kind of things bungie likes to portray as being a big part of themselves. On the other you have the fact that Halo is just a product owned by a multi-million dollar corporation which has no recognition of such things. And look which side won out.


Yes. Bungie has sold out to its fans.

  • 09.12.2006 8:28 AM PDT
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These are my thoughts

Were MS indeed aware of this project, its size and its possible commercial purpose (which as far as i understand there werent)? Are they even obliged to know about every activity where their protected material could be and are used?

I belive that the real answers to these questions can determen whether the guys over at MS are jerks or not. Think about it, what do they have to win by shutting down this project, NOTHING unless someone in the MS corporation has plans on a similar offical project (bungie would most likely know about this, so i highly doubt that such a project will ever take place). They have alot to lose though, fans within the bungie sphere etc. Can it be that MS dont wanna get involved, they are in a way if someone is using their material, with C&C and the studios behind it, maybe.

Fact is that they had every right to shut it down and we cant really blame them for protecting what they legally own, how involved bungie was in the decision or if they even knew can be discussed. Other actions than just shutting it down though, like law suits etc, would indeed in my opinion make them -blam!-s.



[Edited on 9/12/2006]

  • 09.12.2006 9:30 AM PDT
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Fact is that they had every right to shut it down and we cant really blame them for protecting what they legally own, how involved bungie was in the decision or if they even knew can be discussed. Other actions than just shutting it down though, like law suits etc, would indeed in my opinion make them -blam!-s.


It may have been their right, but they didn't have to exercise it. I have the right to do a lot of things. I have the right to let my grass grow waist high but I don't because I'm not an ass. I have the right to set up tacks in the driveway so people won't pull into it to turn around on the road. I don't because it doesn't really hurt me to let people use my driveway. Sure it is my drive way on my property and I have the right to limit use in any way I want. The question still remains why do it?

  • 09.12.2006 11:27 AM PDT

just saying.

i find this artical a little funny
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/g...durham_mod.mspx
they are actuly microsoft is promoting mods

[Edited on 9/12/2006]

  • 09.12.2006 12:58 PM PDT
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An issue associated with Microsoft shutting down a project such as Halogen is that - as it has even been discussed within this own post - future fan creations may quit before they've invested time and effort into a project which may be stopped in the future. Demonstrated through the many examples of fan creation (fan fiction, machinima/video, artwork, etc.) is a form of advertising and promotion reaching out to a universal audience without any funds being exerted. Odd then is their decision to end this project.

Reasoning behind this decision may originate with Halogen reaching out to a new audience: people who are playing Command and Conquer: Generals. When Microsoft viewed ideas within the project which manipulate the Halo universe with new classifications, structures, etc. they might not have wanted to be presented with the idea of maintaining their franchise. This would be an odd move for Microsoft.

Regardless, I agree with past posts stating the team behind Halogen are better off for this development. There is experience and skill gained from such work and they should be able to come up with something great in the future.

My $0.02.

  • 09.12.2006 5:37 PM PDT
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Posted by: The Lone Heretic
Posted by: aku
Posted by: The Lone Heretic
Why would Microsoft shut something like that down? They did ask for permission to use the models..... Right?


From what I read, no, they didn't ask permission. But they were working on it publicly for three years before anything was done.
If they didn't ask, they had it coming.

But after three years? I know things are slow in corporations, but damn.


It is technically not copywrite if you dont make a profit from it, which they werent going to. You can still shut them down, but you cant sue them for copywrite.

Microsoft didnt need to shut them down, especially after 3 years of work. 1 year, maybe, but not 3.

  • 09.12.2006 7:42 PM PDT
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the ninjas should threated to ban mircosoft employes from the forums then the will have to subit to our will hahahaha

  • 09.12.2006 8:09 PM PDT

MY XBOX DIED THAT'S WHY.

Here's some speculation on why they might have shut it down.

Apparently it's all Shiska's fault. :/

It's good trashy gossip, anyway...

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3153524&did=1

  • 09.12.2006 9:01 PM PDT
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Posted by: lady die
Here's some speculation on why they might have shut it down.

Apparently it's all Shiska's fault. :/

It's good trashy gossip, anyway...

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3153524&did=1

Is he the new scape goat now? **Snorts in disgust**

  • 09.12.2006 9:26 PM PDT

I'm sure Bungie is pissed in their own rational way, but it's a deal. Microsoft owns Bungie, therefore all IP assets are now forfeit. Unlike Sony and Insomniac games, it's only a mere contract. Sony has no real control over Insomniac's IP: they could develop Ratchet and Clank for the Xbox 360 if they wanted to!

Bungie should be pissed in their right because they started small just like the Halogen team and built upwards. But then again, the sad sacks at Bungie aren't allowed to do **** because in doing so could cost them their jobs.

Welcome to Capitalism

If you look in the dictionary for the words anti-trust, monopoly, capitalist, and elitist. Each word will have a picture of the Microsoft logo to accompany it.

  • 09.12.2006 11:24 PM PDT

MY XBOX DIED THAT'S WHY.

Posted by: The Lone Heretic
Posted by: lady die
Here's some speculation on why they might have shut it down.

Apparently it's all Shiska's fault. :/

It's good trashy gossip, anyway...

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3153524&did=1

Is he the new scape goat now? **Snorts in disgust**


I don't think he looks anything like a goat! :P

Here's the quote I was refering too.


"I honestly believe that there will probably be a Halo RTS, at this point," Justin told 1UP. Sure, this is just the conjecture of an 18-year-old who had his mod project shut down by Microsoft, but it did take an awfully long time for Microsoft and Bungie to protect their IP -- a move that is well within their right as a company.

In a June episode of Bungie's Weekly Update Community Manager Frank O'Connor indicated that "Halo 3 multiplayer god Max Hoberman" had been working out of his tiny office in Texas "for a month or two now." A month later, another Bungie employee, Shishka, headed to Texas to work out of an office there.

Is there a small Bungie satellite team working in Texas? At least two members are there now working reportedly on Halo 3. This comes on the heels of reports that Bungie is working on a new IP (one that isn't Halo) and another company is working on a title that takes place in the Halo-universe. One company specualated to be working on a Halo-related title is Ensemble Studios. Could Ensemble Studios, the company behind the Age of Empire series (a Microsoft-published RTS series) be working on an RTS taking place in the Halo universe? Ensemble Studios is based in Dallas, Texas, but as we know it's a huge state -- what are the odds that Bungie's Texas-bound staffers are stationed in Dallas?


Meh. Just speculation. Use salt.
:P

  • 09.12.2006 11:37 PM PDT

Sad to see it go, and it's been said. They can work on new projects, it's just unfortunate Microsoft don't see the advantages of this, only the fan's do.

But thats buisness. I think we should support Halogen in whatever they stive for next, im sure it'll be awesome.

  • 09.12.2006 11:52 PM PDT
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Companies have to protect their IP's and trademarks. It's hardly surprising, and it's not the end of the world. Like many have said, Halogen can surely stand on it's own two legs with it's own storyline.

And, to whoever said you need to make a profit off something in order for it to be Copyright, thats wrong. Anything that is published for the general public is automatically copyrighted. If you make a website and type out an article on it, as soon as it's up for the world to see, that article is Copyright belonging to you. So you can put a little (c) after it and make it look all neat and proffessional! =D

  • 09.13.2006 4:57 AM PDT
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So I guess I'm glad I didn't bother starting that Halo-Myth plugin.

-TGP-

  • 09.13.2006 5:27 AM PDT

Umm... let's do the math here.

Illegal changes to copyrighted software... check.
Not asking for permission to use copyrighted characters and trademarks of existing products... check.
Violating several federal laws, regardless of if profit is earned... check.

Well, that's 3/3, which includes a 100% chance of something illegal being shut down. Funny how that works, eh?

  • 09.13.2006 12:29 PM PDT
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Bungie is Microsoft's b1tch. Microsoft basically took it's dick and slapped Bungie in the face with it, and made them get down on their knees and suck it. This shows how "independent" Bungie really is from their parent company, Microsoft. Bungie is like a dog on a leash.

  • 09.13.2006 1:22 PM PDT

Ach! Was ist los?

Posted by: unlucky17
Umm... let's do the math here.

Illegal changes to copyrighted software... check.

Not asking for permission to use copyrighted characters and trademarks of existing products... check.
Violating several federal laws, regardless of if profit is earned... check.

Well, that's 3/3, which includes a 100% chance of something illegal being shut down. Funny how that works, eh?

Funny how on the Internet everyone's an expert, eh?

You apparently haven't heard of a quaint little thing called 'fair use'.

[Edited on 9/13/2006]

  • 09.13.2006 3:30 PM PDT
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Posted by: unlucky17
Umm... let's do the math here.

Illegal changes to copyrighted software... check.
Not asking for permission to use copyrighted characters and trademarks of existing products... check.
Violating several federal laws, regardless of if profit is earned... check.

Well, that's 3/3, which includes a 100% chance of something illegal being shut down. Funny how that works, eh?


Or:

As long as it is non profit you are ok. You can shut down the project if you want, but why would you if it promotes sales of a game you make?

And the sheer concept behind this, they let them work publically for 3 years, then shut them down...

  • 09.13.2006 3:49 PM PDT