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This topic has moved here: Subject: Should the Bungie update be done away with?
  • Subject: Should the Bungie update be done away with?

they cant put something about halo 3 in every week because things change, so say one week they tell us something about halo 3 and it sounds amazing, but then when we get and play the game it aint in there. how miffed of are the fans going to be, it be like fable hyped up to be the next best thing since slice bread but wasnt even that good.
yeah people hype things up and bungie are trying to control that to a minimum, when they have something which is set it stone and wont change then they might tell us.i no i would prefere that way, to be told about things that could change, i dont want to know about.

  • 10.11.2006 1:50 AM PDT

exactly :)

  • 10.11.2006 7:15 AM PDT

Tom Achronos
Bungie.net Overlord
twitter: http://twitter.com/Achronos

"I have no words that would do justice to the atrocities you commit to the English language, as well as your continued assaults on the concepts of basic literacy and logical reasoning."


Saying that the updates are not product promotion is sort of silly to me. The entire site is product promotion. Thats its major purpose.


False. This is not a marketing site. Bungie.net has two purposes. One, to be the Internet presence of our game in providing statistics and game integration type services (see "Stats"). This is called post-release support and assumes you've already bought the game. The second purpose is to create a community of users around Bungie games through our forums and our news/feature content. We assume people visiting this site are fans of Bungie, or at least are interested in becoming fans of Bungie, above and beyond fans of just Halo. That is to say, we're not trying to convince you to buy our game here - we have ads that do that. Here, we assume you're already interested in the games we make and the people who make them.

No one logs onto Bungie.net to get information about anything else other than videogames.

Also false. Lots of people come to participate in the community. They've made friends here, it is a social gathering point for fans of Bungie. Don't assume that just because you don't participate in the larger community that others don't. One of the unique things about Bungie is the fan community that we have - the huge influx of people who only know of Halo somewhat diluted that, but the unique community is still there. Pretending it doesn't exist is naive. Guess what - the Weekly Update is for them - it was started during the blackout period for Halo, with the purpose of trying to give our fans what scraps we could. Funny, I don't remember them complaining nearly as much. Maybe they didn't want to look a gift horse in the mouth, so to speak. I guess what I'm really saying is that it sounds as if the updates are not for you. I suggest you stop reading them, because you obviously expect something else out of them than their purpose.

  • 10.11.2006 11:03 AM PDT

Tom Achronos
Bungie.net Overlord
twitter: http://twitter.com/Achronos

"I have no words that would do justice to the atrocities you commit to the English language, as well as your continued assaults on the concepts of basic literacy and logical reasoning."

Way to defeat your own argument there. Think about what you just said for a moment. You stating that people come here because they are fans of Halo, not of Bungie, and that the masses demand Halo information.

Okay... one slight problem with that. It is very easy to see (by way of looking at traffic charts) that said masses aren't visiting bungie.net. The people visiting bungie.net by and large are those people that care about Bungie, not just those who care about Halo. People who aren't Bungie fans generally stay in their own established communities (see IGN, etc.) Those sites report on the weekly update when it has Halo 3 news, and don't otherwise. So... basically, because of this natural tendency for those people who only care about Halo 3 news to not visit bungie.net unless directed to by their other established game communities, then we've already done what you said and only release WUs when we have Halo 3 news - for as far as those "Halo-only" fans are concerned, the Update only happens when we have Halo 3 news.

So, I guess I'm not really sure what the problem is. It sounds as if you need to only visit bungie.net when your gaming community of choice lets you know there is a Halo 3 Update and not read the Bungie Weekly Update, because that's for people who use bungie.net as their gaming community of choice.

Posted by: Rant
Its not up to either of you. its up to the masses. the masses of people who bought Halo 2 and made it have a bigger opening day than any other form of media. The masses... etc.

  • 10.11.2006 11:13 AM PDT
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  • Elder Mythic Member

There's no way you can say that this site hasn't become commercial. Picture of a Zune in the update. What the hell would people want to see that? It's an mp3 player for -blam!-s sake.

The guy who said this site is one big advert. I absolutely agree with you if you're referring to it NOW, but not when I joined (and earlier).

  • 10.11.2006 11:22 AM PDT
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  • Elder Mythic Member

Well howcome he didn't show a Creative Player then Recon?

I'm not in the mood to carry this on, but the guys right. This site 'advertises' its games now, where as just 2 years ago for example, it 'presented' them.

  • 10.11.2006 11:38 AM PDT
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  • Elder Mythic Member

yeah, that one with the zune pretty much reeked of "hey, look at this cool product were (Microsoft) making! it even has a halo theme!"

I still like to read the updates, and much prefer having them over nothing.

  • 10.11.2006 11:44 AM PDT

Sandswept Studios Design Director

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Posted by: Recon Number 54
I flip TV channels when ads come on

For the record, Recon also has ADD.

I think that you can look at everything with at least two perspectives. We could look at H2V updates, as Recon has said, and think of it as a selling technique. However, I too, believe that they do it for more of the reason to show the fans what's going on with it's development. Many fans, such as myself, are interested in that. Maybe they are selling it a bit with some of the updates, but that's only because people interpret it as such.

I was going to say this earlier, but Recon beat me to it. I was completely under the impression that they were showing off the handheld because of it's Halo 3 theme/backgrounds. I still don't plan on getting one of whatever it was.. All I remember is the picture of it.. :P

[Edited on 10/11/2006]

  • 10.11.2006 12:18 PM PDT
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  • Intrepid Mythic Member

For Carnage, Apply Within.

I have returned from the Untamed Lands. MOAP is dead.

Posted by: Rant
Recently alot of people have openly complained about not just the lack of an update or a timely update but also of the content of the updates when they arrive.
And that is why I don't click on the discussion link at the end of updates anymore.

  • 10.11.2006 1:02 PM PDT

Frank O'Connor is a 12-year veteran of the videogame magazine industry and has therefore never worked an honest day in his life.

I would like to add something here. Everyone seems to be bashing him but he brings up a valid point. Bungie keeps stating that the weekly update is about what is going on at bungie. Theres a problem with that, Before halo 2 (june 2004) they started a new format for the weekly update.

Every week they gave news about halo 2. Frankie still did the normal what happened here and what happened there and we are working on something new for you guys look at this picture stuff but he did something else. He talked alot about halo 2. A good 3/4 of the weekly updates were about halo 2. You can find them everywhere so don't disagree. They had everything from development issues to testing to bug fixes to cool features, interviews with lead designers. the weekly updates were worth waiting for. Finally halo 2 came out and they went away for 2 or 3 weeks.

When they came back they were still about halo 2. yes alot of people complained about the new maps and why there was no info but overall the big thing they did was answer questions about halo 2. And they were good updates. Then as Halo 2 maps were finished and halo 2 was out for Bungie (in a sense) they went back to just an update about bungie.

I am sure alot of people didn't care to much for the weekly update. They all knew the new info would come at E3 2006. So the Bungie updates for a good 8 months were general bungie news. And most fans didn't care to much about it. but then came E3 and halo 3 was put out. People came back and the first weekly update was what people wanted. Packed with halo 3 news, questions (that could be answered) answered and overall bungie news about the 90 people working on a game and other things. People wanted it to go on like this. There was promise of lots more to come soon. And all of a sudden boom 6 months of nothing.

Now i am not in charge of marketing or PR or anything so i can't blame them but when you lead people to believe that more info is coming and then give little hints about content it really just makes people angry. And thats all the weekly update has done. Thats why people say it sucks. They want halo 3 news. A majority of bungie fans are halo fans. you can't argue that. they come here for halo news because they are told to by MS and all other sites. This is where you will get your news. But all they get is a half assed weekly update that to the bungie community is great but to some kid that wants halo news it sucks. They post it sucks in the comments and thus it has a negative effect on the community.

I know there is PR teams and stuff that needs to get approved but it seems all the Bungie updates are are still bungie updates. Even when Frankie said they would turn back into real updates. It seems bungie lies sometimes and i think that personally hurts the community. I have seen 3 big lies in the past 7 months from Bungie and it really hurts to see such a good community suffer like that. I hate to list them BUT:

1. Frankie saying the updates will go back to normal (lie)
2. Halo movie news soon (lie)
3. X06 contains juicy info. (lie) (it was juicy but when you have one game focused on in a studio and you make it seem like X06 will be about halo 3 and it isn't some people will be angry)

So in general I think he has a point. You can say it's an update about bungie but when you promise something and you have done something in the past and are expected to do it again you can see where this can happen.

  • 10.11.2006 1:24 PM PDT
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Posted by:Rant
Should the Bungie update be done away with?


Hell. No.

-LF

  • 10.11.2006 1:25 PM PDT

Sandswept Studios Design Director

Visit us and check out our games at Sandswept.net!

~~Pardon Our Dust.~~

How are these lies?

Posted by: Noob A Manjar0
1. Frankie saying the updates will go back to normal (lie)

I'm not sure what you mean by "normal", since they're ever-changing... If you mean "normal", as in, talking about the game, then that'll happen soon. Patience.

Posted by: Noob A Manjar0
2. Halo movie news soon (lie)

Soon hasn't come yet. Just wait. Patience, again. Soon doesn't mean "Within a month".. It could reasonably mean anywhere from tomorrow, to next year.

Posted by: Noob A Manjar0
3. X06 contains juicy info. (lie) (it was juicy but when you have one game focused on in a studio and you make it seem like X06 will be about halo 3 and it isn't some people will be angry)

X06 contained Halo Wars. That was mighty juicy. I was happy, even if you weren't.

Directed to people who think the updates 'suck':
You're all lucky they even bother to give us these awesome updates. I'm ashamed of your inability to accept things people give you, with no obligation on your part. You're also a very small minority, and truly don't understand the purpose and differences of the Weekly What's Up Updates & Weekly Updates. That brings [manly] tears to my eyes.

  • 10.11.2006 1:32 PM PDT

Change is good.

And no, the Updates should not be done away with.

[Edited on 10/11/2006]

  • 10.11.2006 1:45 PM PDT

Frank O'Connor is a 12-year veteran of the videogame magazine industry and has therefore never worked an honest day in his life.

Posted by: SS_Zag1
How are these lies?

I'll tell you
Posted by: SS_Zag1
I'm not sure what you mean by "normal", since they're ever-changing... If you mean "normal", as in, talking about the game, then that'll happen soon. Patience.

This is easy. I will link you to where he said that. Then you go back and read the old halo 2 updates. Tell me what you think of them. I mean he said old updates so that to me meant when they were working on a game that everyone knew about.lazy link
Everyone will be very much happier with the updates soon enough. Even you. I promise. now he quoted someone there. And that person said he missed the old updates. hmm.


Posted by: SS_Zag1
Soon hasn't come yet. Just wait. Patience, again. Soon doesn't mean "Within a month".. It could reasonably mean anywhere from tomorrow, to next year.

so when he said he would have news about the halo movie next week and then big people called it off but it was already and still is posted on Xbox.com about what he was going to post yet still no info about anything. Not even a mention. thats not a lie. I am sorry but if i walked into class and said I would have my homework tomorrow but my printer broke after my sister walked in and turned in the same thing and said printer works fine and then i didn't turn anything in the next day and blamed it on something else is that a lie? i believe it is.


Posted by: SS_Zag1
X06 contained Halo Wars. That was mighty juicy. I was happy, even if you weren't.

there was a problem. They said juicy but no where did they say non halo 3. I think it was an awesome game but when you are expected to show something. tease people by saying something juicy and then after it happened flat out deny ever saying it had to do with halo 3 you are wrong.

Posted by: SS_Zag1
Directed to people who think the updates 'suck':
You're all lucky they even bother to give us these awesome updates. I'm ashamed of your inability to accept things people give you, with no obligation on your part. You're also a very small minority, and truly don't understand the purpose and differences of the Weekly What's Up Updates & Weekly Updates. That brings [manly] tears to my eyes.


[Edited on 10/11/2006]

  • 10.11.2006 1:48 PM PDT
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Wow, this is what happens when you give things to people... They get SPOILED!

The Bungie weekly update is free, we don't pay anything. Don't even try to start the "I've bought the game/XBL/Gnop Source Code/whatever, and because of that they have to maintain a community site with weekly updates" because there's not a single line in any of the games stating so. They promised online stat viewers, and we have that. Other then that, they don't have to give us anything.

And here they come, complaining about something the employees (who they also complain about don't spend enough time posting on the forums) do instead of working on a game. They complain about things the employees do on their spare time, when they're on vacation or off on something that requires their focus on many other things (Like E3).... They complain about something a lot of the fans asked for, some inside information about what's going on inside Bungies offices.

Sigh, maybe they should pull away all the updates and small news. Stop communicating, webcams, posting about what goes on in the community, stop with the Gallery and Polls... And after a while, when people have stopped complaining about that again, they can put it back up so people see how it really is without it.

Bah, you people make me sick. I mean it, I feel disgusted inside. Why else would I write this rant, I get angry and upset by this. I wish you knew how lucky you are, and how spoiled you really are.

  • 10.11.2006 1:52 PM PDT

Sandswept Studios Design Director

Visit us and check out our games at Sandswept.net!

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I'll just answer in line, instead of quoting:

- "Soon enough."
Again, that doesn't mean RIGHT NOW. 5 months? In terms of game development, that's just about right.

- The "big people" called it off. What's so hard to understand? Movies take even longer than games, for the most part. What kind of info do you expect? Just wait. You're in some rush to get Halo movie info? It's only been... Oh, about 5 months again. That's not that bad, considering what we're talking about here.

- Nowhere did they say non-Halo 3. This is correct. However, they also never said it would be Halo 3. I see, your expectations turned out to be set too high. That's your own fault, no fault of Bungie's.

  • 10.11.2006 2:02 PM PDT